'Honor killings' on rise in Europe
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http://www.boston.com/news/world/europe/articles/2006/01/16/for_muslim_women_a_deadly_defiance/?page=full [Edit]I think someone thinks the one votes will discredit the story...or even me???:laugh:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: How about try to make a point, if you can form one.[/Edit] My mom told me once that "while we all don't speak the same language, everyone in the world undestands an asskicking" Adnan Siddiqi wrote: don`t try to be clever ass wid me while you can`t.. -- modified at 17:19 Monday 16th January, 2006
I wonder how the stats of muslim honor killings stand up against non-muslim killings. Why these killings are called "honor killing" is beyond me. If a non-muslim does something like this, it's just a "regular" killing. :shrug:
I lived on the same street as someone, who is as non-muslim as you can be, who shot his ex-wife in the face with a shotgun, just to prove a point: you're not allowed to date other men. 6 kids, half of them which he beat regularly, because they were not his own offspring. Lovely chap. I hope he got an enlarged rectum shortly after his arrival to jail. (It freaks me out when I think of the time when I and a friend sneaked into their garden one evening to pick a few apples from his apple trees. He came out and ran after us with a huge wrench in is hands, screaming something like "wait until I get my hands on you!". In retrospect, I'm really glad we were a lot faster than him!)
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Stan Shannon wrote:
What? When have I ever said any such thing?
You said that all investigations of child abuse should be abandonded, I believe followed up with the point that the people would eventually kill themselves all off and no more problems. Unfortunately that is about as bad a situation as a government entity given free run without judicial or jury over-view. Although most reports of abuse do not have sufficient evidence of continued review (2,800,000 annual reports), still 800,000 to 1,200,000 do check out. Most have to be dropped for funding, so ignoring it simply increases problems rather than investigation. _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
You said that all investigations of child abuse should be abandonded, I believe followed up with the point that the people would eventually kill themselves all off and no more problems.
I've never even come close to making any such point. You need to quit hearing what you want to hear instead of what some one is actually saying. I simply do not believe that there is some epidemic of child abuse, or abuse of women for that matter, that plagues our society. In my entire life I have witnessed very few excessive or unwarrented acts of violence against women or children. I'm not saying they don't occur, only that they are uncommon. If someone has actually evidence that it is occuring it should be investigated to the full extent of the law, and I trust local authorities to be fully empowered to deal with it if and when it occurs. My only objection is of those, such as yourself, who start with the premise that it is pervasive in society because you have an innately biased attitude towards religion and those who practice it. And then launch unjustified social reengineering campaigns to root out an evil that exists only in your own mind. To rely upon that prejudice to equate our society to that of the honor killings of the middle east and elsewhere is just pathetic. "If anything, the West is awash in an epidemic of self-hate crimes." "a civilization that feels guilty for everything it is and does will lack the energy and conviction to defend itself"
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I admit there are some crazy Christians, and every once in a while one of them kills people. But it seems that Christians have no problem denouncing these people. I have have never heard a pastor telling people to kill Muslims. But I'm sure there are some in the far reaches of the country. The problem is, these are the exceptions, It's still may be the exception in Islam, but it is fast becoming the rule. I'm not out to get Islam, I just wish they could accept other people and keep their radicals from: 1) Killing other people because they are infidels. 2) Killing other Muslims because the associate with infidels. 3) Killing their own children. 4) Blowing themselves up in crowds. 5) Blowing up other people in crowds. 6) Trying to take over Israel. My mom told me once that "while we all don't speak the same language, everyone in the world undestands an asskicking" Adnan Siddiqi wrote: don`t try to be clever ass wid me while you can`t..
kgaddy wrote:
I'm not out to get Islam, I just wish they could accept other people and keep their radicals from:
I would have wished the IRA had done the same, but in the end the only way was to talk with and negotiate with the IRA to prevent future events while simultaneously trying those who did the worst events, and mediating lesser sentances for those who had gotten involved but not committed the most henious crimes. Just because the IRA isn't killing people today does not mean that Islam is the only group that has ever done these types of crimes. Islamic extremists may be the current worry, I am concerned as much over who will follow after, and then after them. The group split into the provisional IRA which became the more politically motivated (non-terrorist) group and the Real IRA which continues the terrorism activities though is substantially weaker. It is important to separate those who are politically motivated from those who are violence motivated. When you cast them all in the same bucket you get a much larger and more difficult enemy to fight. So far this split has managed to weaken the RIRA faction such that their activities have weakened. There are those who question if anyone should have have separated the two factions, just killed them all. Which brings us to today with multiple groups vying for political power in other regions. Do we fight them for a hundred years or try to separate the extremist portions from the rest? _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
You said that all investigations of child abuse should be abandonded, I believe followed up with the point that the people would eventually kill themselves all off and no more problems.
I've never even come close to making any such point. You need to quit hearing what you want to hear instead of what some one is actually saying. I simply do not believe that there is some epidemic of child abuse, or abuse of women for that matter, that plagues our society. In my entire life I have witnessed very few excessive or unwarrented acts of violence against women or children. I'm not saying they don't occur, only that they are uncommon. If someone has actually evidence that it is occuring it should be investigated to the full extent of the law, and I trust local authorities to be fully empowered to deal with it if and when it occurs. My only objection is of those, such as yourself, who start with the premise that it is pervasive in society because you have an innately biased attitude towards religion and those who practice it. And then launch unjustified social reengineering campaigns to root out an evil that exists only in your own mind. To rely upon that prejudice to equate our society to that of the honor killings of the middle east and elsewhere is just pathetic. "If anything, the West is awash in an epidemic of self-hate crimes." "a civilization that feels guilty for everything it is and does will lack the energy and conviction to defend itself"
Stan Shannon wrote:
I simply do not believe that there is some epidemic of child abuse, or abuse of women for that matter, that plagues our society.
It is nice to know that 1.2 million anually does not a plague make. Oh wait, I forgot to include women. 3.6 million. I do not justify killing anywhere, I say we need to crack down on the problem here AND there rather than denying any problems here while blaming all of our problems on them. Somewhere in the middle is the answer. _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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You should see Office Space, it rocks. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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I wonder how the stats of muslim honor killings stand up against non-muslim killings. Why these killings are called "honor killing" is beyond me. If a non-muslim does something like this, it's just a "regular" killing. :shrug:
I lived on the same street as someone, who is as non-muslim as you can be, who shot his ex-wife in the face with a shotgun, just to prove a point: you're not allowed to date other men. 6 kids, half of them which he beat regularly, because they were not his own offspring. Lovely chap. I hope he got an enlarged rectum shortly after his arrival to jail. (It freaks me out when I think of the time when I and a friend sneaked into their garden one evening to pick a few apples from his apple trees. He came out and ran after us with a huge wrench in is hands, screaming something like "wait until I get my hands on you!". In retrospect, I'm really glad we were a lot faster than him!)
Back in the good old days, if something like this was known about someone, the locals would get together and beat the crap out of him. My father in law was a cop, and he got together a group of off duty officers and visited a bloke who was beating on his wife. That's the way to handle people like that, IMO. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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Stan Shannon wrote:
I simply do not believe that there is some epidemic of child abuse, or abuse of women for that matter, that plagues our society.
It is nice to know that 1.2 million anually does not a plague make. Oh wait, I forgot to include women. 3.6 million. I do not justify killing anywhere, I say we need to crack down on the problem here AND there rather than denying any problems here while blaming all of our problems on them. Somewhere in the middle is the answer. _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
I say we need to crack down on the problem here AND there rather than denying any problems here while blaming all of our problems on them.
And I maintain that the more freedom a society tolerates the probability of some kind of abuse occuring somewhere increases proportionally. Abuse based on the occasional random individual choseing to harm another is an entirely different species of problem than one in which the abuse is a result of accepted societal traditions. Understanding that some level of abuse is to be expected in a free society does not mean that it should be tolerated. However, it should be obvious that if our goal is to reduce such abuse to zero than we had better be willing to accept a much less free society. The only way to be assured that it never occurs can only be gained with a far more draconian form of loss of privacy rights than anything envisioned by the Patriot Act. "If anything, the West is awash in an epidemic of self-hate crimes." "a civilization that feels guilty for everything it is and does will lack the energy and conviction to defend itself" -- modified at 6:00 Tuesday 17th January, 2006
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kgaddy wrote:
I'm not out to get Islam, I just wish they could accept other people and keep their radicals from:
I would have wished the IRA had done the same, but in the end the only way was to talk with and negotiate with the IRA to prevent future events while simultaneously trying those who did the worst events, and mediating lesser sentances for those who had gotten involved but not committed the most henious crimes. Just because the IRA isn't killing people today does not mean that Islam is the only group that has ever done these types of crimes. Islamic extremists may be the current worry, I am concerned as much over who will follow after, and then after them. The group split into the provisional IRA which became the more politically motivated (non-terrorist) group and the Real IRA which continues the terrorism activities though is substantially weaker. It is important to separate those who are politically motivated from those who are violence motivated. When you cast them all in the same bucket you get a much larger and more difficult enemy to fight. So far this split has managed to weaken the RIRA faction such that their activities have weakened. There are those who question if anyone should have have separated the two factions, just killed them all. Which brings us to today with multiple groups vying for political power in other regions. Do we fight them for a hundred years or try to separate the extremist portions from the rest? _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
Jeffry J. Brickley wrote:
I would have wished the IRA had done the same, but in the end the only way was to talk with and negotiate with the IRA to prevent future events while simultaneously trying those who did the worst events, and mediating lesser sentances for those who had gotten involved but not committed the most henious crimes.
If the IRA had possessed the ability to wreak the kind of death and destruction Islamic fundamentalists are capable of you would have seen far less negotiation and much more direct and immediate military intervention into Ireland. The reason IRA terrorism has declined has less to do with negotiation than because the people of Irleand finally refused to any longer tolerate it in their society and gave it less and less support. Which is precisely what we need to demand of the Islamic world. "If anything, the West is awash in an epidemic of self-hate crimes." "a civilization that feels guilty for everything it is and does will lack the energy and conviction to defend itself"
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Back in the good old days, if something like this was known about someone, the locals would get together and beat the crap out of him. My father in law was a cop, and he got together a group of off duty officers and visited a bloke who was beating on his wife. That's the way to handle people like that, IMO. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
Christian Graus wrote:
My father in law was a cop, and he got together a group of off duty officers and visited a bloke who was beating on his wife.
Sounds like a good man. My mom told me once that "while we all don't speak the same language, everyone in the world undestands an asskicking"
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You should see Office Space, it rocks. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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http://www.boston.com/news/world/europe/articles/2006/01/16/for_muslim_women_a_deadly_defiance/?page=full [Edit]I think someone thinks the one votes will discredit the story...or even me???:laugh:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: How about try to make a point, if you can form one.[/Edit] My mom told me once that "while we all don't speak the same language, everyone in the world undestands an asskicking" Adnan Siddiqi wrote: don`t try to be clever ass wid me while you can`t.. -- modified at 17:19 Monday 16th January, 2006
Nice sig - the second part. :) Cheers, Vikram.
"When I read in books about a "base class", I figured this was the class that was at the bottom of the inheritence tree. It's the "base", right? Like the base of a pyramid." - Marc Clifton.
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http://www.boston.com/news/world/europe/articles/2006/01/16/for_muslim_women_a_deadly_defiance/?page=full [Edit]I think someone thinks the one votes will discredit the story...or even me???:laugh:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: How about try to make a point, if you can form one.[/Edit] My mom told me once that "while we all don't speak the same language, everyone in the world undestands an asskicking" Adnan Siddiqi wrote: don`t try to be clever ass wid me while you can`t.. -- modified at 17:19 Monday 16th January, 2006
???? you are a born bull$hit,what point are you trying to make? before that you cme up with a story and linked up with shariah now this crap!its stupiduty to argue with a person who can`t carry on conversation sensibily
http://weblogs.com.pk/kadnan | kadnan.blogspot.com | AJAX based Contact Form for Blogger or any other website
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kgaddy wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I’m sensing you post is meant to show that this is not isolated to Islam.
And if you read your own post about sharia, you would see the two are orthogonal. Relevant parts quoted below.
kgaddy wrote:
Yes, this happens in the US, Europe and everywhere else in the world.
Probably in far greater numbers.
kgaddy wrote:
In Muslim countries, they still punish men if they rape their daughters.
Good! If this ever does happen the person should get the ultimate punishment. "Honor killings" are, in the Western world, often erroneously identified as part of Islamic teaching, though they are in fact a cultural practice which is neither exclusive to, nor universal within, the Islamic world. Such killings take place within the Muslim communities around the Mediterranean as well as in the Punjab, India,[8] non-Muslim parts of West Africa, and in Central America; while in Indonesia, the world's largest Islamic country, the status of the practice is unknown. The stated reason for honor killings is the belief that the woman had caused the clan or family to lose honor by her alleged sexual activity and therefore deserved to be killed. Islamic teaching holds that life is given by Allah and should not be taken lightly
Quran Lectures (updated 1/3/06) "They are MUSLIM. It does not matter how you split it up: all msulims (so they say) see every other muslim as a brother, regardless of origin or nationality." -legalAlien. Alhamdullah for the blessing of Islam
Salam Bro he`s like that ,don`t you know that,this dumbass man just google the most anti-islamic site then he reads the title and runs to make a post on CP against islam,he never bothers to read the entire content. what yo quouted here,i had read that too,but i consider tht its pathetic for me to argue for something which don`t exist and even mentioned in article.
http://weblogs.com.pk/kadnan | kadnan.blogspot.com | AJAX based Contact Form for Blogger or any other website
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I believe this happens in Muslim society more because of the way women are treated. I do not believe every Muslim condones this practice. It seems to be increasing in Europe among the Muslim population. Maybe you, as a Muslim, have some incite as to why this is happening? Do Muslims that do not believe in these practices talk about this? My mom told me once that "while we all don't speak the same language, everyone in the world undestands an asskicking"
i thnk you were here to dicuss thoughts of author of article NOT yours?keep your crappy preachings to yourself
http://weblogs.com.pk/kadnan | kadnan.blogspot.com | AJAX based Contact Form for Blogger or any other website
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Nice sig - the second part. :) Cheers, Vikram.
"When I read in books about a "base class", I figured this was the class that was at the bottom of the inheritence tree. It's the "base", right? Like the base of a pyramid." - Marc Clifton.
Sender: Vikram Shannon good,atlast you have found your real daddy!
http://weblogs.com.pk/kadnan | kadnan.blogspot.com | AJAX based Contact Form for Blogger or any other website
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???? you are a born bull$hit,what point are you trying to make? before that you cme up with a story and linked up with shariah now this crap!its stupiduty to argue with a person who can`t carry on conversation sensibily
http://weblogs.com.pk/kadnan | kadnan.blogspot.com | AJAX based Contact Form for Blogger or any other website
There's a swedish saying that goes something like this: "Do not throw rock if you live in a glass house". :)
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???? you are a born bull$hit,what point are you trying to make? before that you cme up with a story and linked up with shariah now this crap!its stupiduty to argue with a person who can`t carry on conversation sensibily
http://weblogs.com.pk/kadnan | kadnan.blogspot.com | AJAX based Contact Form for Blogger or any other website
Adnan Siddiqi wrote:
you are a born bull$hit,what point are you trying to make? before that you cme up with a story and linked up with shariah now this crap!its stupiduty to argue with a person who can`t carry on conversation sensibily
You should be happy. Getting one of your quotes into somebody's sig is a great ego trip. There's no such thing as bad publicity :-D Michael CP Blog [^] Development Blog [^]
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Sender: Vikram Shannon good,atlast you have found your real daddy!
http://weblogs.com.pk/kadnan | kadnan.blogspot.com | AJAX based Contact Form for Blogger or any other website
Thanks to you, Adnan, yes. :) But I thought Stan was supposed to be my mommy. :~ Cheers, Vikram.
"When I read in books about a "base class", I figured this was the class that was at the bottom of the inheritence tree. It's the "base", right? Like the base of a pyramid." - Marc Clifton.
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Adnan Siddiqi wrote:
you are a born bull$hit,what point are you trying to make? before that you cme up with a story and linked up with shariah now this crap!its stupiduty to argue with a person who can`t carry on conversation sensibily
You should be happy. Getting one of your quotes into somebody's sig is a great ego trip. There's no such thing as bad publicity :-D Michael CP Blog [^] Development Blog [^]
Michael P Butler wrote:
You should be happy. Getting one of your quotes into somebody's sig is a great ego trip. There's no such thing as bad publicity
While I believe you should be able to quote anybody freely, Adnan's quote only shows people how stupid he is, so I can imagine why he's pi$$ed. I completely agree that getting into somebody's sig is a major ego boost (normally). :cool: Cheers, Vikram.
"When I read in books about a "base class", I figured this was the class that was at the bottom of the inheritence tree. It's the "base", right? Like the base of a pyramid." - Marc Clifton.
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Sender: Vikram Shannon good,atlast you have found your real daddy!
http://weblogs.com.pk/kadnan | kadnan.blogspot.com | AJAX based Contact Form for Blogger or any other website
what the hell is your problem? My simple advice, if you dont like somebody's opinion, counter argue it. Give your point of view instead of abusing them. I have been watching your post for past 2 weeks, and there is a pattern.If you dont like anybody, you are abusing them and if somebody supports them, you lose your mind. cheers, Super ------------------------------------------ Too much of good is bad,mix some evil in it -- modified at 5:41 Tuesday 17th January, 2006