You were right, I was wasting my breath asking Muslems what they found more offensive.
-
I do not understand why not one Muslem answered my question. It was not leading, and was meant in good faith. And, I hoped the answers might clarify the position a Muslem takes regarding terrorist acts. But since you have'nt got the guts to come out of the veil of silence and answer my question honestly one can only assume that you all support terrorism. In which case you are fucked, because, having read the bible and the koran, you are committing the truest form of balsphemy; That of using the name of god in vain. Nunc est bibendum
-
I do not understand why not one Muslem answered my question. It was not leading, and was meant in good faith. And, I hoped the answers might clarify the position a Muslem takes regarding terrorist acts. But since you have'nt got the guts to come out of the veil of silence and answer my question honestly one can only assume that you all support terrorism. In which case you are fucked, because, having read the bible and the koran, you are committing the truest form of balsphemy; That of using the name of god in vain. Nunc est bibendum
You're still wasting your breath. They're paying you no attention. It goes to show that you can't hold "peace" talks with a group of people who consider anything less than an unconditional surrender a defeat. We are wasting our time if we think that there can be rapprochement between muslims and anybody else at all. It will, sadly, never happen. Appeasing them is seen as a sign of weakness. You don't see the protests or nonsense stopping because the police take pictures, do you? They need to get in there and bang heads, hard.
turning the other cheek just gets you slapped twice
-
You're still wasting your breath. They're paying you no attention. It goes to show that you can't hold "peace" talks with a group of people who consider anything less than an unconditional surrender a defeat. We are wasting our time if we think that there can be rapprochement between muslims and anybody else at all. It will, sadly, never happen. Appeasing them is seen as a sign of weakness. You don't see the protests or nonsense stopping because the police take pictures, do you? They need to get in there and bang heads, hard.
turning the other cheek just gets you slapped twice
I really had hoped that we might get the views of the Muslems who frequent this site. That we might get a broad view of their feelings. It sadens ne that not one of them has come forwards. I even tried to indicate the tome of my request by using a phrase from the Koran, one that states that the people of the book must not fight amongs themselvs, ie, jew, christain, and muslem, but still none answered. Perhaps you are right, perhaps they will never come clean and take a stance. Perhaps they are just gutless and weak. And that is why their reputation is being destroyed by terrorists that they havent got the guts to stand up to. BTW, the police HSOULD wade in hard. They did when the 80 year old POWs protested the Japs coming to London a few years back. And this double standard by the police just reinforces my poor opinion of them. Nunc est bibendum
-
I really had hoped that we might get the views of the Muslems who frequent this site. That we might get a broad view of their feelings. It sadens ne that not one of them has come forwards. I even tried to indicate the tome of my request by using a phrase from the Koran, one that states that the people of the book must not fight amongs themselvs, ie, jew, christain, and muslem, but still none answered. Perhaps you are right, perhaps they will never come clean and take a stance. Perhaps they are just gutless and weak. And that is why their reputation is being destroyed by terrorists that they havent got the guts to stand up to. BTW, the police HSOULD wade in hard. They did when the 80 year old POWs protested the Japs coming to London a few years back. And this double standard by the police just reinforces my poor opinion of them. Nunc est bibendum
fat_boy wrote:
And this double standard by the police just reinforces my poor opinion of them.
It is nothing to do with the police - blame their PC political masters, not the coppers "on the ground". I'm sure the Home Secretary had made sure that Muslim protesters are handled with kid gloves.
-
fat_boy wrote:
And this double standard by the police just reinforces my poor opinion of them.
It is nothing to do with the police - blame their PC political masters, not the coppers "on the ground". I'm sure the Home Secretary had made sure that Muslim protesters are handled with kid gloves.
It is still the police, whether it is the cheif constable of the bobby. And if jack the twat straw, who is a toni croni if ever i saw one, hasnt got the balls then he should be sacked. In fact, we should sack the blairites. THe conservative guy looks pretty strong to me, he'll be in power soon enough. Nunc est bibendum
-
I do not understand why not one Muslem answered my question. It was not leading, and was meant in good faith. And, I hoped the answers might clarify the position a Muslem takes regarding terrorist acts. But since you have'nt got the guts to come out of the veil of silence and answer my question honestly one can only assume that you all support terrorism. In which case you are fucked, because, having read the bible and the koran, you are committing the truest form of balsphemy; That of using the name of god in vain. Nunc est bibendum
And the nonsense continues. Muslims constitute aprox. 20% of humanity (some 1.2 billion people) yet you fools are happy to judge the lot, forgetting that each one of them is an individual human being. Maybe you actually think you are also entitled to speak for us all.
-
It is still the police, whether it is the cheif constable of the bobby. And if jack the twat straw, who is a toni croni if ever i saw one, hasnt got the balls then he should be sacked. In fact, we should sack the blairites. THe conservative guy looks pretty strong to me, he'll be in power soon enough. Nunc est bibendum
fat_boy wrote:
It is still the police, whether it is the cheif constable of the bobby.
The chief is a New Labour cronie, apointed by the government. If he says "don't arrest Muslim protesters" then the coppers on the ground have their hands tied. And the Chief does whatever the Home Sec. tells him - he's just a puppet (and not very popular with the force by all accounts).
fat_boy wrote:
And if jack the twat straw, who is a toni croni if ever i saw one, hasnt got the balls then he should be sacked.
He's not the Home Secretary - Charles Clarke is now. Jack Straw is a total cock though - how I laughed when his teenage son got caught dealing drugs.
fat_boy wrote:
THe conservative guy looks pretty strong to me, he'll be in power soon enough.
He still has to prove he's not all style over substance, but I reckon he's given the Tories their best chance of a sniff at power for nearly 10 years. It's a long time till the next election though...
-
And the nonsense continues. Muslims constitute aprox. 20% of humanity (some 1.2 billion people) yet you fools are happy to judge the lot, forgetting that each one of them is an individual human being. Maybe you actually think you are also entitled to speak for us all.
You should search my provious posts to see how much I am prepared to defend Islam as a religion with a lot of merit. I had hoped from my earlier post to get the opinion of moderate, intelligent Muslems that use this site. None responded, and that is sad. And by their inaction, force us to judge them all by the only visibility we have of them,, namely, that on the TV. If some HAD answered my question, then we would not HAVE to judge them by what we see on TV. And, I think this inaction is indicative of their inability to police their radical members. ie, they just keep their heads down hoping it will blow away, while in the mean time their reputation is being degraded by the actions of the few. If they stood up as a mass and did somethig about their extreme elements, then the west would have a far better relationship with Islam. And right now, that relationship is going down the pan, and the situation is very likely to blow up into something really big. And by the way, do not underestimate the strength of the right wing neo-faschists in europe. And at an institutional level too. Europe is no way near as PC as the US and UK. Heck, Le Pen, fo the French National Front came SECOND to Chirac in the run offs for the president of France 3 years ago. If the Muslems situation kicks up much more he stands a good chance of getting in power, and then you will see the shit hit the fan in Europe. Nunc est bibendum
-
fat_boy wrote:
It is still the police, whether it is the cheif constable of the bobby.
The chief is a New Labour cronie, apointed by the government. If he says "don't arrest Muslim protesters" then the coppers on the ground have their hands tied. And the Chief does whatever the Home Sec. tells him - he's just a puppet (and not very popular with the force by all accounts).
fat_boy wrote:
And if jack the twat straw, who is a toni croni if ever i saw one, hasnt got the balls then he should be sacked.
He's not the Home Secretary - Charles Clarke is now. Jack Straw is a total cock though - how I laughed when his teenage son got caught dealing drugs.
fat_boy wrote:
THe conservative guy looks pretty strong to me, he'll be in power soon enough.
He still has to prove he's not all style over substance, but I reckon he's given the Tories their best chance of a sniff at power for nearly 10 years. It's a long time till the next election though...
-
You should search my provious posts to see how much I am prepared to defend Islam as a religion with a lot of merit. I had hoped from my earlier post to get the opinion of moderate, intelligent Muslems that use this site. None responded, and that is sad. And by their inaction, force us to judge them all by the only visibility we have of them,, namely, that on the TV. If some HAD answered my question, then we would not HAVE to judge them by what we see on TV. And, I think this inaction is indicative of their inability to police their radical members. ie, they just keep their heads down hoping it will blow away, while in the mean time their reputation is being degraded by the actions of the few. If they stood up as a mass and did somethig about their extreme elements, then the west would have a far better relationship with Islam. And right now, that relationship is going down the pan, and the situation is very likely to blow up into something really big. And by the way, do not underestimate the strength of the right wing neo-faschists in europe. And at an institutional level too. Europe is no way near as PC as the US and UK. Heck, Le Pen, fo the French National Front came SECOND to Chirac in the run offs for the president of France 3 years ago. If the Muslems situation kicks up much more he stands a good chance of getting in power, and then you will see the shit hit the fan in Europe. Nunc est bibendum
fat_boy wrote:
You should search my provious posts to see how much I am prepared to defend Islam as a religion with a lot of merit.
Not the issue.
fat_boy wrote:
I had hoped from my earlier post to get the opinion of moderate, intelligent Muslems that use this site.
And they apparently chose to ignore you. So what? Are they at your beck and call?
fat_boy wrote:
None responded, and that is sad. And by their inaction, force us to judge them all by the only visibility we have of them,, namely, that on the TV.
This IS the issue and, boy, how phenomenally absurd your reasoning. It is in the "force to judge them all" (whatever your sources), that you err. It is foolish to emit a judgement value about 1.2 billion individual human beings and believe that it is anything but a farce.
fat_boy wrote:
If some HAD answered my question, then we would not HAVE to judge them by what we see on TV.
Your lack of sources does not logically imply that your generalizations are accurate. They could never be accurate by virtue of the fact that you are talking about 1.2 billion individual human beings. One more thing, that you consider TV a qualified source of "knowledge" does not imply either that it is so for the rest of us.
fat_boy wrote:
And, I think this inaction is indicative of their inability to police their radical members.
Did the TV say that about each and every one of those 1.2 billion muslims that read your questions but felt "unable" to respond? Please.
fat_boy wrote:
ie, they just keep their heads down hoping it will blow away, while in the mean time their reputation is being degraded by the actions of the few.
Again, does your TV say that?
fat_boy wrote:
If they stood up as a mass and did somethig about their extreme elements, then the west would have a far better relationship with Islam.
Now you are speaking for the "west"? Be sure to understand that you are not.
fat_boy wrote:
And right now, that relationship is going down the pan, and the situation is very likely to blow up into something really big.
-
fat_boy wrote:
You should search my provious posts to see how much I am prepared to defend Islam as a religion with a lot of merit.
Not the issue.
fat_boy wrote:
I had hoped from my earlier post to get the opinion of moderate, intelligent Muslems that use this site.
And they apparently chose to ignore you. So what? Are they at your beck and call?
fat_boy wrote:
None responded, and that is sad. And by their inaction, force us to judge them all by the only visibility we have of them,, namely, that on the TV.
This IS the issue and, boy, how phenomenally absurd your reasoning. It is in the "force to judge them all" (whatever your sources), that you err. It is foolish to emit a judgement value about 1.2 billion individual human beings and believe that it is anything but a farce.
fat_boy wrote:
If some HAD answered my question, then we would not HAVE to judge them by what we see on TV.
Your lack of sources does not logically imply that your generalizations are accurate. They could never be accurate by virtue of the fact that you are talking about 1.2 billion individual human beings. One more thing, that you consider TV a qualified source of "knowledge" does not imply either that it is so for the rest of us.
fat_boy wrote:
And, I think this inaction is indicative of their inability to police their radical members.
Did the TV say that about each and every one of those 1.2 billion muslims that read your questions but felt "unable" to respond? Please.
fat_boy wrote:
ie, they just keep their heads down hoping it will blow away, while in the mean time their reputation is being degraded by the actions of the few.
Again, does your TV say that?
fat_boy wrote:
If they stood up as a mass and did somethig about their extreme elements, then the west would have a far better relationship with Islam.
Now you are speaking for the "west"? Be sure to understand that you are not.
fat_boy wrote:
And right now, that relationship is going down the pan, and the situation is very likely to blow up into something really big.
Dont make the mistake of assuming everyone is as inteligent as you are. I do not condemn 1.2 million Muslems on the actions of the few, I am indicating what public opinion is likely to be. Dont forget we have a democracy, and the ignorant are as capable of voting, and marching, and breaking skulls as we are. And it is THEIR perception of Muslems that is being degraded, and THEIR perception that can form national opinion. And if you disagree then I remind you that Hitler was voted into power, and Le Pen nearly got voted in 3 years ago. And if the Islamic world continues to allow the degradation of their image in the West because of the actions of the few then they are making a mistake that will push them into a ituation they dont want nor deserve. Nunc est bibendum
-
And the nonsense continues. Muslims constitute aprox. 20% of humanity (some 1.2 billion people) yet you fools are happy to judge the lot, forgetting that each one of them is an individual human being. Maybe you actually think you are also entitled to speak for us all.
I've been reading fat_boy's posts for a while and he certainly isn't on the "Kill all Muslims" bandwagon. Cheers, Vikram.
"When I read in books about a "base class", I figured this was the class that was at the bottom of the inheritence tree. It's the "base", right? Like the base of a pyramid." - Marc Clifton.
-
And the nonsense continues. Muslims constitute aprox. 20% of humanity (some 1.2 billion people) yet you fools are happy to judge the lot, forgetting that each one of them is an individual human being. Maybe you actually think you are also entitled to speak for us all.
Wow, that kinda sounds like the muslamics thinking all non-Muslims are infidels and out to exterminate all muslims... Fools all around, if you ask me... This message is brought to you by Pot-Kettle-Black, LLC (tm). Nobody - absolutely NOBODY - points fingers until we do. ------- sig starts "I've heard some drivers saying, 'We're going too fast here...'. If you're not here to race, go the hell home - don't come here and grumble about going too fast. Why don't you tie a kerosene rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001
-
Dont make the mistake of assuming everyone is as inteligent as you are. I do not condemn 1.2 million Muslems on the actions of the few, I am indicating what public opinion is likely to be. Dont forget we have a democracy, and the ignorant are as capable of voting, and marching, and breaking skulls as we are. And it is THEIR perception of Muslems that is being degraded, and THEIR perception that can form national opinion. And if you disagree then I remind you that Hitler was voted into power, and Le Pen nearly got voted in 3 years ago. And if the Islamic world continues to allow the degradation of their image in the West because of the actions of the few then they are making a mistake that will push them into a ituation they dont want nor deserve. Nunc est bibendum
fat_boy wrote:
Dont make the mistake of assuming everyone is as inteligent as you are.
Neither yours nor my intelligence is the issue. However, do exercise yours and avoid generalization. It is clear that you understand the concept.
fat_boy wrote:
I do not condemn 1.2 million Muslems on the actions of the few, I am indicating what public opinion is likely to be.
Your opinion of what public opinion is (or is not), is your opinion of an opinion. What's the worth of that?
fat_boy wrote:
Dont forget we have a democracy, and the ignorant are as capable of voting, and marching, and breaking skulls as we are.
Well, since you are a smart fellow, please help "them" understand that generalizing of this kind is inherently meaningless.
fat_boy wrote:
And it is THEIR perception of Muslems that is being degraded, and THEIR perception that can form national opinion
Who is, in your opinion, degrading such a thing? Those that generalize, perhaps?
fat_boy wrote:
And if you disagree then I remind you that Hitler was voted into power, and Le Pen nearly got voted in 3 years ago.
Not the issue beyond the fact that generalization is one of the tools that politicians use. Have they fooled you too?
fat_boy wrote:
And if the Islamic world continues to allow the degradation of their image in the West because of the actions of the few then they are making a mistake that will push them into a ituation they dont want nor deserve.
It is not the responsibility of the "islamic world" to convince you of anything. You are responsible for your own opinions. Exercise that responsibility.
-
fat_boy wrote:
Dont make the mistake of assuming everyone is as inteligent as you are.
Neither yours nor my intelligence is the issue. However, do exercise yours and avoid generalization. It is clear that you understand the concept.
fat_boy wrote:
I do not condemn 1.2 million Muslems on the actions of the few, I am indicating what public opinion is likely to be.
Your opinion of what public opinion is (or is not), is your opinion of an opinion. What's the worth of that?
fat_boy wrote:
Dont forget we have a democracy, and the ignorant are as capable of voting, and marching, and breaking skulls as we are.
Well, since you are a smart fellow, please help "them" understand that generalizing of this kind is inherently meaningless.
fat_boy wrote:
And it is THEIR perception of Muslems that is being degraded, and THEIR perception that can form national opinion
Who is, in your opinion, degrading such a thing? Those that generalize, perhaps?
fat_boy wrote:
And if you disagree then I remind you that Hitler was voted into power, and Le Pen nearly got voted in 3 years ago.
Not the issue beyond the fact that generalization is one of the tools that politicians use. Have they fooled you too?
fat_boy wrote:
And if the Islamic world continues to allow the degradation of their image in the West because of the actions of the few then they are making a mistake that will push them into a ituation they dont want nor deserve.
It is not the responsibility of the "islamic world" to convince you of anything. You are responsible for your own opinions. Exercise that responsibility.
If the Islamic world does not police its extreme ellements, publicly, and present to the west a more reasonable face then people in the west will perceive Islam as a threat, and respond. We will see attacks on Muslems increase in the UK because of their demonstration in London this week. That is not my opinion, that is fact, it is how people are. it os how they work. See a threat, and respond by attacking it. And if that perceived threat increases then the response will be stronger. The current situation has all the ellements to explode into something really unpleasant. And the Islamic world will be to blame for this. Nunc est bibendum
