Palestinians
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They are without doubt the worst lead and most mislead people in the world right now. Suffering within a totally fatalistic religion in which death seems to be the highest goal and lead by greedy power hungry types who are quite happy to sacrifice their own people for leverage. How things have got to this point is complex, many of the worst leaders have been propped up by the USA and Israel for political reasons and others by Saudi and Egypt for other political reasons, but even more difficult is how it's ever going to be resolved. Not by politics I think. Not by a war of anihilation I hope.
Mike Gaskey wrote:
the concept fictionalized in, "Lord of the Flies".
which is known as original sin, applies equally to everyone descended from Adam and for ample proof no one need go further than end of their nose.
Nothing is exactly what it seems but everything with seems can be unpicked.
Quote: which is known as original sin, applies equally to everyone descended from Adam and for ample proof no one need go further than end of their nose. No, sin was put here by the Flying Spaghetti Monster to test people's faith in him. For ample proof you need to go farther than the end of your nose. :rolleyes:
The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity. - John Adams
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Bullshit. I lose little love for Israel and could care less if a Jewish state exists or not, but if Jewish occupation, legal or not, of a small strip of land in a vast desert is sufficient to engender the kind of mindless savagery emerging from modern Islam, than clearly Islam is a dangerously flawed and dysfunctional mechanism for civil society under any conditions, Jews or no Jews. I don't know what it is that is being born in the middle east, but I sure as hell wish somebody would kill it.
Pardon Libby!
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Arsalan Malik wrote:
They have occupied the land of Palestine illegally
who is that, Hamas or Fatah? or are these just social clubs for morons with death wishes? worse than the two are the idiotic people who support them. I really enjoyed the news conference I just watched with some fuck head holding a green flag while speaking into the microphone while wearing a mask. what a buch of lame dumb asses.
Mike The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
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Matthew Faithfull wrote:
It is the point of view, or theory if you like, that says that sin, a tendency to evil, is a fundamental part of human nature. Chirstian theology explains this as a result of the fall of man as described in Genesis Ch3.
If sin as a fundamental part of human nature is the result of the fall of man, then what was the cause of the fall of man if not his sinful nature? Sorry, I'll only be back tomorrow, so this is probably my last input.
For this you really need to read the opening chapters of Genesis but the short answer is.- A bad choice made by Adam using the free will he was given following on from a similar bad choice made by Eve to believe the lies of the serpant (the devil), over the information and commands previously given them by God. The slightly longer answer might be:- By choosing the devil over God they gave the devil authority over them and over everything in which they had authority (the natural world) and brought the sin of the devil and death as its consequence into their natures and the fundamental nature of the universe. They had a completely free and unbiased choice in this instance between good and evil, subsequently it has been in all our natures to choose evil. Our free will remains, our responsibility for our actions remains but we are biased towards evil, especially in its manifestations of pride and self centeredness so that only divine intervention can change our nature back to something like what it was before the fall. In order to do this God must take back authority/ownership over us from the devil. He does this by paying the just penalty (under his own law) for all the wrong that we have done which gives the devil authority over us, therebye freeing us from the devil's ownership and restoring us to a state where we can have a relationship with God, who, being holy, cannot be in relationship with the unholy/sinful. There's a lot of theology in there I'm afraid. It isn't easy to explain it in any less words or simpler terms than the Genesis account.
Nothing is exactly what it seems but everything with seems can be unpicked.
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Quote: which is known as original sin, applies equally to everyone descended from Adam and for ample proof no one need go further than end of their nose. No, sin was put here by the Flying Spaghetti Monster to test people's faith in him. For ample proof you need to go farther than the end of your nose. :rolleyes:
The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity. - John Adams
No, it applies to the inbred clique of everyone descended from Adam.
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For this you really need to read the opening chapters of Genesis but the short answer is.- A bad choice made by Adam using the free will he was given following on from a similar bad choice made by Eve to believe the lies of the serpant (the devil), over the information and commands previously given them by God. The slightly longer answer might be:- By choosing the devil over God they gave the devil authority over them and over everything in which they had authority (the natural world) and brought the sin of the devil and death as its consequence into their natures and the fundamental nature of the universe. They had a completely free and unbiased choice in this instance between good and evil, subsequently it has been in all our natures to choose evil. Our free will remains, our responsibility for our actions remains but we are biased towards evil, especially in its manifestations of pride and self centeredness so that only divine intervention can change our nature back to something like what it was before the fall. In order to do this God must take back authority/ownership over us from the devil. He does this by paying the just penalty (under his own law) for all the wrong that we have done which gives the devil authority over us, therebye freeing us from the devil's ownership and restoring us to a state where we can have a relationship with God, who, being holy, cannot be in relationship with the unholy/sinful. There's a lot of theology in there I'm afraid. It isn't easy to explain it in any less words or simpler terms than the Genesis account.
Nothing is exactly what it seems but everything with seems can be unpicked.
Matthew Faithfull wrote:
There's a lot of theology in there I'm afraid. It isn't easy to explain it in any less words or simpler terms than the Genesis account.
I know the Genesis account quite well, and know that as punishment for the original sin, all descendants of Adam were destined to suffer, you seem to project your view of yourself as inherently evil onto everyone on Earth, of course in error.
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Matthew Faithfull wrote:
There's a lot of theology in there I'm afraid. It isn't easy to explain it in any less words or simpler terms than the Genesis account.
I know the Genesis account quite well, and know that as punishment for the original sin, all descendants of Adam were destined to suffer, you seem to project your view of yourself as inherently evil onto everyone on Earth, of course in error.
Brady Kelly wrote:
I know the Genesis account quite well
Good, I'm glad to hear it.
Brady Kelly wrote:
and know that as punishment for the original sin, all descendants of Adam were destined to suffer
Indeed they were cast out of the garden and we all have to suffer the consequences of that and of the sin that is in us as a result of the fall.
Brady Kelly wrote:
you seem to project your view of yourself as inherently evil onto everyone on Earth, of course in error.
I don't think there's any projecting going on here. It's nothing to do with my view, the fall was universal as you must know. "All have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God". I'm sure you are not unfamiliar with this quote. Why then say "of course in error" as if it was obvious that the world is full of sinless people. There has only ever been one, Jesus, the second Adam, who's sinless life and atoning death are the answer to original sin.
Nothing is exactly what it seems but everything with seems can be unpicked.
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Brady Kelly wrote:
I know the Genesis account quite well
Good, I'm glad to hear it.
Brady Kelly wrote:
and know that as punishment for the original sin, all descendants of Adam were destined to suffer
Indeed they were cast out of the garden and we all have to suffer the consequences of that and of the sin that is in us as a result of the fall.
Brady Kelly wrote:
you seem to project your view of yourself as inherently evil onto everyone on Earth, of course in error.
I don't think there's any projecting going on here. It's nothing to do with my view, the fall was universal as you must know. "All have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God". I'm sure you are not unfamiliar with this quote. Why then say "of course in error" as if it was obvious that the world is full of sinless people. There has only ever been one, Jesus, the second Adam, who's sinless life and atoning death are the answer to original sin.
Nothing is exactly what it seems but everything with seems can be unpicked.
Matthew Faithfull wrote:
say "of course in error" as if it was obvious that the world is full of sinless people.
Because that makes as much sense as your projecting your sinfulness onto every other human. If it is possible that "all have sinned" because Adam and Eve sinned, then it is equally possible that "none have sinned" because blame is not assessed against all for the sins of the few.
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Matthew Faithfull wrote:
say "of course in error" as if it was obvious that the world is full of sinless people.
Because that makes as much sense as your projecting your sinfulness onto every other human. If it is possible that "all have sinned" because Adam and Eve sinned, then it is equally possible that "none have sinned" because blame is not assessed against all for the sins of the few.
Please allow me to clarify. It is not a case of, 'all are counted as having sinned because Adam and Eve sinned'. No, rather "All have sinned", each on their own account because they have inherited a corrupted nature. Not a possibility, a statement of fact. There's no projecting going on here. I'm not claiming anything on my own authority merely reporting what has been said on God's authority. I would not presume to assert that anyone had sinned because I think so or by my judgement. I am simply reporting and trying to explain what Jesus said. He spoke with the authority of the Father.
Nothing is exactly what it seems but everything with seems can be unpicked.
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As a Jew, I was one who was upset over Israel pulling out of the Gaza Strip and the West Bank because I expected something like this to happen. When faced with a crisis Christians pull together whether Catholic, Lutheran, Methodist, etc. Jews pull together whether Orthodox, Conservative or Reform. Muslims just seem hell-bent on killing each other until they are no more. I realize that there are some who do want peace within their religion and where they live. But when you have the idiots who use the words 'infidel' and 'jihad' as common as we use 'work' and 'car' you can't get anything done. The Jews read the commandment as "Thou Shall Not Murder" (where some Christian texts say 'Thou Shall Not Kill'). I am starting to wonder if the IDF kills these terrorists now if that would be murder or not. If it is the later, go to work boys and girls.
______________________ stuff + cats = awesome
lekey - an excellant post, but it appears it contained too much honesty.
Mike The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
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[Message Deleted]
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lekey - an excellant post, but it appears it contained too much honesty.
Mike The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.