Follow up to Pete's thread below
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The petrol station in question has now reduced[^] their prices after coming under heavy criticism. Although I still get the impression that they feel they did no wrong... any CPians live near Devon and have a large supply of rotten eggs to hand?
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
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The petrol station in question has now reduced[^] their prices after coming under heavy criticism. Although I still get the impression that they feel they did no wrong... any CPians live near Devon and have a large supply of rotten eggs to hand?
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
Phannon wrote:
Although I still get the impression that they feel they did no wrong ...
They *didn't* do anything wrong. What they did was the right thing to do: not only in a "facts on the ground" way, but also morally. And, the critics are wrong: not only in a "facts on the ground" way, but also morally. The fact that neither you nor any other critic can offer a rational criticism of their decision *ought* to clue you in that your criticisms don't really have a leg to stand on. But, hell! Surely it's far better -- and more "moral" -- to have NO gasoline at 1.55 (*) than to have SOME (and actually, plenty) at 1.99! (*) "1.55" is just a number I pulled out of the air; I have no idea what you folks imagine is the "morally correct" price of gasoline.
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Phannon wrote:
Although I still get the impression that they feel they did no wrong ...
They *didn't* do anything wrong. What they did was the right thing to do: not only in a "facts on the ground" way, but also morally. And, the critics are wrong: not only in a "facts on the ground" way, but also morally. The fact that neither you nor any other critic can offer a rational criticism of their decision *ought* to clue you in that your criticisms don't really have a leg to stand on. But, hell! Surely it's far better -- and more "moral" -- to have NO gasoline at 1.55 (*) than to have SOME (and actually, plenty) at 1.99! (*) "1.55" is just a number I pulled out of the air; I have no idea what you folks imagine is the "morally correct" price of gasoline.
Your post would suggest the following: Only those who can afford to buy the petrol at those prices, should do so, everyone else who needs the petrol yet can't afford it, must suffer. And yes, there are people who need it, not everyone has a viable alternative method of travel to work. Do you think it morally acceptable to price people off the road? With that kind of thinking, you should be a Labour MP!
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
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Your post would suggest the following: Only those who can afford to buy the petrol at those prices, should do so, everyone else who needs the petrol yet can't afford it, must suffer. And yes, there are people who need it, not everyone has a viable alternative method of travel to work. Do you think it morally acceptable to price people off the road? With that kind of thinking, you should be a Labour MP!
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
Phannon, look at your signature: "He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man" Now, look at your emotional and anti-rational and moralistic (though, note, not *actually* properly morally grounded) response to what I'd said:
Phannon wrote:
Your post would suggest the following: Only those who can afford to buy the petrol at those prices, should do so, everyone else who needs the petrol yet can't afford it, must suffer. And yes, there are people who need it, not everyone has a viable alternative method of travel to work. Do you think it morally acceptable to price people off the road? With that kind of thinking, you should be a Labour MP!
"With that kind of thinking, you should be a Labour MP!" Please! Let's not trade insults so soon upon meeting.
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Phannon, look at your signature: "He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man" Now, look at your emotional and anti-rational and moralistic (though, note, not *actually* properly morally grounded) response to what I'd said:
Phannon wrote:
Your post would suggest the following: Only those who can afford to buy the petrol at those prices, should do so, everyone else who needs the petrol yet can't afford it, must suffer. And yes, there are people who need it, not everyone has a viable alternative method of travel to work. Do you think it morally acceptable to price people off the road? With that kind of thinking, you should be a Labour MP!
"With that kind of thinking, you should be a Labour MP!" Please! Let's not trade insults so soon upon meeting.
My sig has nothing to do with this, if you must know it's a quote from a song of my favourite band. If you can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion, please don't bother posting.
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
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The petrol station in question has now reduced[^] their prices after coming under heavy criticism. Although I still get the impression that they feel they did no wrong... any CPians live near Devon and have a large supply of rotten eggs to hand?
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
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My sig has nothing to do with this, if you must know it's a quote from a song of my favourite band. If you can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion, please don't bother posting.
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
Phannon wrote:
My sig has nothing to do with this, if you must know it's a quote from a song of my favourite band. If you can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion, please don't bother posting.
:laugh: Listen to you! All emotion, no reason. The first article[^] backs up what I've said. But, you, and those who "think" like you, don't want to *see* reality as it really is; don't want to deal with what *is,* as opposed to what you collectively imagine *ought* to be. MOREOVER, you're actually hypocritical in your "arguments." For instance, we both know that there are many companies which need your programming expertise (or whatever other skill you are selling), but they simply cannot afford to pay the price you are demanding for your time/effort. CLEARLY, this state of affaires is "immoral" :rolleyes: and you should be compelled to offer your services at a price these poor companies can afford. edit:
Phannon wrote:
If you can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion, please don't bother posting.
AND, the whole point of what I've said is to try to bring into your awareness the fact that *you* "can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion."
modified on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 7:59 AM
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Phannon wrote:
My sig has nothing to do with this, if you must know it's a quote from a song of my favourite band. If you can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion, please don't bother posting.
:laugh: Listen to you! All emotion, no reason. The first article[^] backs up what I've said. But, you, and those who "think" like you, don't want to *see* reality as it really is; don't want to deal with what *is,* as opposed to what you collectively imagine *ought* to be. MOREOVER, you're actually hypocritical in your "arguments." For instance, we both know that there are many companies which need your programming expertise (or whatever other skill you are selling), but they simply cannot afford to pay the price you are demanding for your time/effort. CLEARLY, this state of affaires is "immoral" :rolleyes: and you should be compelled to offer your services at a price these poor companies can afford. edit:
Phannon wrote:
If you can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion, please don't bother posting.
AND, the whole point of what I've said is to try to bring into your awareness the fact that *you* "can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion."
modified on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 7:59 AM
[Message Deleted]
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The petrol station in question has now reduced[^] their prices after coming under heavy criticism. Although I still get the impression that they feel they did no wrong... any CPians live near Devon and have a large supply of rotten eggs to hand?
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
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Phannon wrote:
My sig has nothing to do with this, if you must know it's a quote from a song of my favourite band. If you can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion, please don't bother posting.
:laugh: Listen to you! All emotion, no reason. The first article[^] backs up what I've said. But, you, and those who "think" like you, don't want to *see* reality as it really is; don't want to deal with what *is,* as opposed to what you collectively imagine *ought* to be. MOREOVER, you're actually hypocritical in your "arguments." For instance, we both know that there are many companies which need your programming expertise (or whatever other skill you are selling), but they simply cannot afford to pay the price you are demanding for your time/effort. CLEARLY, this state of affaires is "immoral" :rolleyes: and you should be compelled to offer your services at a price these poor companies can afford. edit:
Phannon wrote:
If you can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion, please don't bother posting.
AND, the whole point of what I've said is to try to bring into your awareness the fact that *you* "can't back up your arguments from the topic of discussion."
modified on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 7:59 AM
Ilíon wrote:
we both know that there are many companies which need your programming expertise (or whatever other skill you are selling), but they simply cannot afford to pay the price you are demanding for your time/effort. CLEARLY, this state of affaires is "immoral" [Roll eyes] and you should be compelled to offer your services at a price these poor companies can afford.
You're comparing apples and oranges, and if you can't see what's wrong with your statement then there's something wrong with you.
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
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Your post would suggest the following: Only those who can afford to buy the petrol at those prices, should do so, everyone else who needs the petrol yet can't afford it, must suffer. And yes, there are people who need it, not everyone has a viable alternative method of travel to work. Do you think it morally acceptable to price people off the road? With that kind of thinking, you should be a Labour MP!
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
Phannon wrote:
Only those who can afford to buy the petrol at those prices, should do so, everyone else who needs the petrol yet can't afford it, must suffer.
Sure. That's called capitalism, you know. And the neoliberals are constantly and very successfully fighting against any sort of mitigation of the suffering.
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable, let's prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
Douglas Adams, "Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency" -
[Message Deleted]
Gold
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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Your post would suggest the following: Only those who can afford to buy the petrol at those prices, should do so, everyone else who needs the petrol yet can't afford it, must suffer. And yes, there are people who need it, not everyone has a viable alternative method of travel to work. Do you think it morally acceptable to price people off the road? With that kind of thinking, you should be a Labour MP!
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
Here's the thing. Petrol WILL be 2 pounds eventually. It's $1.70 at home, it was $1.50 when I left 2 weeks ago. So, the question becomes: To what degree are petrol station owners not allowed to price their goods at the rate they want to sell it at. In other words, do we want to let supply and demand deal with pricing, or do we want the government to regulate it, and thus close a lot of petrol stations ? The sad fact is, a lot of people are hurting, but the price is not going down any time soon.
Phannon wrote:
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
Love this EVERY time I see it.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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Phannon wrote:
Only those who can afford to buy the petrol at those prices, should do so, everyone else who needs the petrol yet can't afford it, must suffer.
Sure. That's called capitalism, you know. And the neoliberals are constantly and very successfully fighting against any sort of mitigation of the suffering.
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable, let's prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
Douglas Adams, "Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency"jhwurmbach wrote:
And the neoliberals are constantly and very successfully fighting against any sort of mitigation of the suffering.
But, if it COSTS this much now to produce gas, how is making it cheaper a long term solution ? It's not. We bleed tax dollars to push gas prices back down, people keep using it like crazy, we run out sooner ( b/c we WILL run out, even if the naysayers are wrong and it's not for some time yet ), and the economy is falsely propped up, which is never good in the long term.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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Gold
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
Wow - I got a 1 within a couple of minutes. I feel special.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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I'm fully aware of "Supply and Demand", but how does this explain other petrol stations keeping their prices relatively in line?
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
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Wow - I got a 1 within a couple of minutes. I feel special.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
[Message Deleted]
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I'm fully aware of "Supply and Demand", but how does this explain other petrol stations keeping their prices relatively in line?
He who makes a beast out of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
Phannon wrote:
I'm fully aware of "Supply and Demand", but how does this explain other petrol stations keeping their prices relatively in line?
What does "keeping their prices relatively in line" even *mean*? And of what use at all is "keeping their prices relatively in line" (whatever that means) when the first three blokes in line have bought up all the available gas ... even though they didn't need all they bought ... leaving NONE AT ALL for the other twenty behind them?
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jhwurmbach wrote:
And the neoliberals are constantly and very successfully fighting against any sort of mitigation of the suffering.
But, if it COSTS this much now to produce gas, how is making it cheaper a long term solution ? It's not. We bleed tax dollars to push gas prices back down, people keep using it like crazy, we run out sooner ( b/c we WILL run out, even if the naysayers are wrong and it's not for some time yet ), and the economy is falsely propped up, which is never good in the long term.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
Christian Graus wrote:
But, if it COSTS this much now to produce gas,
COSTS are most insinificant for the current primary energy prices. Dwindling value of the Dollar is about one third of it. Speculation is part of it. Rising demand elsewhere is part of it. And how would making energy cheaper, so that no one would dy from cold in the winters *not* help peaople to survive, until the State manages to concince the people to set their air conditions to sane values. And to build houses which keep the warmth in states with cold winters and to allow good air circulation in states with warm summers. Santa Fe with its adobe houses is quite good. Las Vegas with its greenhouse-like hotels is ridicoulous.
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable, let's prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
Douglas Adams, "Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency"