Update on the Obama citizen / not a citizen lawsuit
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even though Ed G's computer can't get to the site, the plaintiff has an update.[^]
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
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even though Ed G's computer can't get to the site, the plaintiff has an update.[^]
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
He is not just an illegal alien he is a Reptilian Humanoid[^]. Now, where did I put that tinfoil hat?
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even though Ed G's computer can't get to the site, the plaintiff has an update.[^]
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
You might like to have a look at the document on Obama team's request for a protective order on the site. DiscoveryDocument.pdf[^] In particular
On September 15, 2008, plaintiff Berg served on Senator Obama’s office a request for production of seventeen different categories of documents, including copies of all of the Senator’s college and law school applications, requests for financial aid, college and law school papers, and “a copy of your entire presidential file pertaining to being vetted.” Plaintiff also served 56 requests for admission on Senator Obama. On that same date, plaintiff served on the DNC 27 requests for admission and requests for production of five categories of documents, including all documents in the possession of the DNC relating to Senator Obama.
Accordingly, there is nothing surprising about the Obama camp's lack of enthusiasm for co-operating with the request. (You can find more detail regarding the requested information at the end of the PDF file, but that part has been scanned and so I can't copy it readily.) It is far from the case that just presenting Obama's birth certificate and a couple of other documents will bring the issue to an end. The reluctance to cooperate is all the more understandable when it is realised that this legal action is being launched by a nutter who thinks that the US government was behind the attacks on 9/11.
John Carson
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You might like to have a look at the document on Obama team's request for a protective order on the site. DiscoveryDocument.pdf[^] In particular
On September 15, 2008, plaintiff Berg served on Senator Obama’s office a request for production of seventeen different categories of documents, including copies of all of the Senator’s college and law school applications, requests for financial aid, college and law school papers, and “a copy of your entire presidential file pertaining to being vetted.” Plaintiff also served 56 requests for admission on Senator Obama. On that same date, plaintiff served on the DNC 27 requests for admission and requests for production of five categories of documents, including all documents in the possession of the DNC relating to Senator Obama.
Accordingly, there is nothing surprising about the Obama camp's lack of enthusiasm for co-operating with the request. (You can find more detail regarding the requested information at the end of the PDF file, but that part has been scanned and so I can't copy it readily.) It is far from the case that just presenting Obama's birth certificate and a couple of other documents will bring the issue to an end. The reluctance to cooperate is all the more understandable when it is realised that this legal action is being launched by a nutter who thinks that the US government was behind the attacks on 9/11.
John Carson
John Carson wrote:
It is far from the case that just presenting Obama's birth certificate and a couple of other documents will bring the issue to an end.
John, the point is that the judge would throw the case out if they did. Okay, that's an opinion but I don't see it any other way.
John Carson wrote:
The reluctance to cooperate is all the more understandable when it is realised that this legal action is being launched by a nutter who thinks that the US government was behind the attacks on 9/11.
That doesn't in any way effect the case and the judge's apparent reluctance to kill the lawsuit. Realistically it should provide incentive for him to do so.
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
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John Carson wrote:
It is far from the case that just presenting Obama's birth certificate and a couple of other documents will bring the issue to an end.
John, the point is that the judge would throw the case out if they did. Okay, that's an opinion but I don't see it any other way.
John Carson wrote:
The reluctance to cooperate is all the more understandable when it is realised that this legal action is being launched by a nutter who thinks that the US government was behind the attacks on 9/11.
That doesn't in any way effect the case and the judge's apparent reluctance to kill the lawsuit. Realistically it should provide incentive for him to do so.
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
Mike Gaskey wrote:
John, the point is that the judge would throw the case out if they did. Okay, that's an opinion but I don't see it any other way.
I think that is rather naive. In the first place, once there has been a motion for discovery, it is not normally possible for one side to say "we'll supply a small fraction of what we were asked for and get the judge to rule on that". Legal cases are more legalistic than that. In the second place, Berg wishes to argue that Obama became an Indonesian citizen and lost his American citizenship. He wants to support this with school records, passport records and much else besides. If the judge is prepared to take seriously the claim that Obama was not born in Hawaii, why would he not be prepared to take seriously the claim that Obama became an Indonesian citizen?
Mike Gaskey wrote:
That doesn't in any way effect the case and the judge's apparent reluctance to kill the lawsuit.
What it means is that Obama is facing a litigious conspiracy nut who will not be put off merely by providing proof that his claims are false. The judge can stop him, of course, but the legal system doesn't make it easy to get free of a determined litigant. Accordingly, it is entirely reasonable for the Obama legal team to make things difficult for this litigant. The fact that the judge is not in a hurry to dismiss the lawsuit is not surprising. It has only been going since August, as far as I know. Lots of cases without merit drag on for years.
John Carson
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Mike Gaskey wrote:
John, the point is that the judge would throw the case out if they did. Okay, that's an opinion but I don't see it any other way.
I think that is rather naive. In the first place, once there has been a motion for discovery, it is not normally possible for one side to say "we'll supply a small fraction of what we were asked for and get the judge to rule on that". Legal cases are more legalistic than that. In the second place, Berg wishes to argue that Obama became an Indonesian citizen and lost his American citizenship. He wants to support this with school records, passport records and much else besides. If the judge is prepared to take seriously the claim that Obama was not born in Hawaii, why would he not be prepared to take seriously the claim that Obama became an Indonesian citizen?
Mike Gaskey wrote:
That doesn't in any way effect the case and the judge's apparent reluctance to kill the lawsuit.
What it means is that Obama is facing a litigious conspiracy nut who will not be put off merely by providing proof that his claims are false. The judge can stop him, of course, but the legal system doesn't make it easy to get free of a determined litigant. Accordingly, it is entirely reasonable for the Obama legal team to make things difficult for this litigant. The fact that the judge is not in a hurry to dismiss the lawsuit is not surprising. It has only been going since August, as far as I know. Lots of cases without merit drag on for years.
John Carson
John Carson wrote:
What it means is that Obama is facing a litigious conspiracy nut who will not be put off merely by providing proof that his claims are false.
You can always opt to do the opposite and bury him in paper. Send him 14 semi-tractor trailer load of a copy of every speech Obama ever gave, all his travel schedule, all the transcripts of all interview he ever done to comply with "requests for production of five categories of documents, including all documents in the possession of the DNC relating to Senator Obama". By the time he sort through that and realize that he hasn't gotten any of the documents he really wants, it would be time for re-election in 2012.
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Mike Gaskey wrote:
John, the point is that the judge would throw the case out if they did. Okay, that's an opinion but I don't see it any other way.
I think that is rather naive. In the first place, once there has been a motion for discovery, it is not normally possible for one side to say "we'll supply a small fraction of what we were asked for and get the judge to rule on that". Legal cases are more legalistic than that. In the second place, Berg wishes to argue that Obama became an Indonesian citizen and lost his American citizenship. He wants to support this with school records, passport records and much else besides. If the judge is prepared to take seriously the claim that Obama was not born in Hawaii, why would he not be prepared to take seriously the claim that Obama became an Indonesian citizen?
Mike Gaskey wrote:
That doesn't in any way effect the case and the judge's apparent reluctance to kill the lawsuit.
What it means is that Obama is facing a litigious conspiracy nut who will not be put off merely by providing proof that his claims are false. The judge can stop him, of course, but the legal system doesn't make it easy to get free of a determined litigant. Accordingly, it is entirely reasonable for the Obama legal team to make things difficult for this litigant. The fact that the judge is not in a hurry to dismiss the lawsuit is not surprising. It has only been going since August, as far as I know. Lots of cases without merit drag on for years.
John Carson
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even though Ed G's computer can't get to the site, the plaintiff has an update.[^]
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
F.R.C.P. 26(d)(1) A party may not seek discovery from any source before the parties have conferred as required by Rule 26(f), except in a proceeding exempted from initial disclosure under Rule 26(a)(1)(B), or when authorized by these rules, by stipulation, or by court order.
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I was just finding out about this Berg suit and your posts added a very valuable perspective to this story. Thanks John
led mike
Thanks. :-O
John Carson
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even though Ed G's computer can't get to the site, the plaintiff has an update.[^]
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
Mike Gaskey wrote:
even though Ed G's computer can't get to the site, the plaintiff has an update.[^]
I couldn't get to it either, got the same error message as he did. But, at the same time, as I'd said, I've known about these speculations and assertions and about that specific lawsuit for some time.
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even though Ed G's computer can't get to the site, the plaintiff has an update.[^]
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
First, notice in this calendar of 1961[^], that August 4 is a Friday and August 8 is the following Tuesday. Doesn't it seem odd that ... especially if Obama was born at hospital, as is claimed ... his birth was not registered until four days after he was born? Sure, he was born in the evening on Friday ... or so it's stated on the document he is asserting is proof that he was born in the US ... so that could well explain a lack of registry until Monday. But his birth was registered on Tuesday. Now, look at this point/statement/claim from the page you linked[^]:
38. Defendant Obama claims he was born in Honolulu, Hawaii on August 4, 1961 and it is uncertain in which hospital he claims to have been born. Obama’s grandmother on his father’s side, his half-brother and half-sister all claim Obama was born not in Hawaii but in Kenya. Reports reflect that Obama’s mother traveled to Kenya during her pregnancy; however, she was prevented from boarding a flight from Kenya to Hawaii at her late stage of pregnancy (which, apparently, was a normal restriction, to avoid births during a flight). By these reports, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama gave birth to Obama in Kenya, after which she flew home and registered Obama’s birth. There are records of a “registry of birth” for Obama, on or about August 8, 1961 in the public records office in Hawaii.
Now, consider: Obama's "registry of birth" document is but the record of the registration of a live birth. It doesn't necessarily prove where the birth occurred, it proves that the live birth was registered in Hawaii.