Real Transparancy in government [modified]

ToddHileHoffer

Thain probably called Obama to get the decorator's number. Republicans and Democrats are in on it together. The politicians and their corporate talking heads on talk radio and cnn use issues like abortion, gun control, torture etc... to keep the people divided. Meanwhile they are busy making sure that all greedy bankers stay rich. Our government has turned into Corporate Feudalism. Democracy is a myth.

I didn't get any requirements for the signature

Doctor Nick

Wow. Let me get my foil hat... Seriously though, getting elected takes money and the only ones with money are rich corporations so they have to do what those people say to get elected. Until Joe down the street(not the plumber) can setup a website to answer questions about his record and (here's the big part) people actually care enough to read up about him it's always going to be the rich running things. Just remember we outnumber them in a fight :)

------------------------------------- Do not do what has already been done. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.. but it ROCKS absolutely, too.

MrPlankton · modified on Friday, January 23, 2009 9:44 AM

ToddHileHoffer wrote:

I wonder what 500 companies received the most money from the tarp program and how much did each one get?

Based on FreddiMac and FannyMay; I would have to say the following; Depends; how much did each contribute to the political parties?

MrPlankton

Mexican boy: Viene la tormenta! Sarah Connor: What did he just say? Gas Station Attendant: He said there's a storm coming Sarah Connor: [sighs] I know.

peterchen

Because they are capitalists! And the woman on welfare is a commie! Or something like that.

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Ray Cassick

Oakman wrote:

redo the oval office

This is one thing that I think is really ridiculous. Why redecorate it when the guard changes? What the hell did Bush junior do to the place that it needs to be redecorated? Personally I think Obama should start here and be the first president in recent history to NOT do it.

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thrakazog

True, but don't gloss over the fact that there could be thousands and thousands of such people collecting welfare for months or years at a time. Neither of those options excite me. Both are a huge drain on resources. However, the money given in the big bailouts is supposed to be a loan that will be collected on with interest. So there is at least a slim chance some of that money will come back.

David Crow

Ray Cassick wrote:

Why redecorate it when the guard changes?

This is akin to a developer taking over a project and deciding the best course of action would be to retool it rather than fix it. Then he has to give credit to no one but himself. Now if he wanted to spend some of his own $400,000 to do it, then I don't think it matters.

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BoneSoft

ToddHileHoffer wrote:

The funny thing is how Republicans get so mad about a woman on welfare who gets a $150 per week from the government.

Because welfare does them no service, it prolongs the problem. Lefties love to claim to be all for the poor, but their used as a tool. You want them poor, you need them poor. We'd like to see them succeed, which they can only do for themselves. You want them dependant on you forever.

ToddHileHoffer wrote:

But giving billions to already rich executives is not a problem.

Did you forget who voted for the bailouts, or did you just not ever know?

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BoneSoft

You're not really THAT simple... Are you? :sigh:

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peterchen

Oh. My. God. It is a low day when I have to use an irony tag. And "Or something like that" isn't enough. :sigh: indeed.

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BoneSoft

The fact that anybody voted you down for that proves there are plenty of irrational people here who can't be taken seriously. I evened it out as best I could. ;)

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ToddHileHoffer

BoneSoft wrote:

Did you forget who voted for the bailouts, or did you just not ever know?

It was not a party line vote. Both McSames flew back to Washington to vote for it. I have a republican congressman who I called and emailed to vote against the bailout. He did initially but caved and voted for it in round 2. Also, I'm not a Democrat. I'm a proud member of the Libertarian Party even though we never win.

I didn't get any requirements for the signature

BoneSoft

Irony huh...

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BoneSoft

ToddHileHoffer wrote:

It was not a party line vote.

I never claimed it was. That's where we differ.

ToddHileHoffer wrote:

I have a republican congressman who I called and emailed to vote against the bailout.

We all do. Congress is corrupt as hell. I read at the time that somewhere in the neighborhood of at least 70% of Americans were against the bailouts. And 98% of those who contacted congressmen said don't do it. And they didn't listen. I also read that there were something like 92 Republican freshmen in congress, every single one of which voted against it, both times. The fact of the matter is, plenty on both sides voted for the bailouts. But it was a significant majority of Democrats that voted for it. Don't you remember the first vote, where Peloci chastized all things red-statish for not voting for it? But everybody insists on pointing out that it was Bush's (read Hank Paulson's) plan, so by some dishonest stretch of imagination it all rests on his party. It wouldn't have been there to be voted on if it weren't for Bush (read Hank Paulson), so it's all Republican's fault. However, those same people dislike that logic when applied to the meltdown that led to the bailouts. Carter and Clinton set up a flawed socialist program (as if there's another kind), Democrats fought against it's reform, and here we are. But it's all Bush's fault because he was at the helm for the last 8 years. Because he didn't do enough to fix it. It couldn't have possibly been the fault of the idiots who set the whole situation up in the first place. Get your cake, eat it too, whatever as long as you can hang it around a Republican's neck. Seems to be the prevailing philosophy these days.

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Ray Cassick

DavidCrow wrote:

Now if he wanted to spend some of his own $400,000 to do it, then I don't think it matters.

I would not have a problem with that either. I have a feeling that the White House admins may choke on that. i bet they have no system to deal with it :)

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peterchen

Well, maybe sarcasm :rolleyes:

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ToddHileHoffer

I don't think our opinions differ that much. The Congress is clearly corrupt. Barney Frank is probably the worst. He is most responsible for the collapse of Fannie and Freddie. It is ridiculous how each party blames the other. It is the same with budget deficit. Our leaders are mostly dishonest morons who are good at politicking (lying).

I didn't get any requirements for the signature

BoneSoft

ToddHileHoffer wrote:

mostly dishonest morons who are good at politicking (lying).

Apparently that's the most effective way to actually get into office. Unfortunate for all of us. They're mostly all opportunistic sons of Blagojaviches.

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Oakman

BoneSoft wrote:

Carter and Clinton set up a flawed socialist program

Nixon set up wage and price controls even though it was peacetime, and took us off the gold standard. While the former was reversed, it set a dangerous precedent and the latter gave the Feds of both parties the power to tinker with the value of our money on a whim. All the the troubles that Carter-Reagan-Bush-Clinton-Bush created and exacerbated were simply the logical consequences of Nixon's actions.

BoneSoft wrote:

But it's all Bush's fault because he was at the helm for the last 8 years. Because he didn't do enough to fix it.

He made it worse. It was his appointees that removed some of the last regulations that might have kept the insanity in check. (At least for a little while longer. I'm convinced that the snowball turned into an avalanche a while back. The only question was when it was going to hit.)

BoneSoft wrote:

Get your cake, eat it too, whatever as long as you can hang it around a Republican's neck.

Trying to exculpate Bush is as disingenuous as trying to scapegoat him. Far as I'm concerned any hanging based on what has happened in the last few months, should have all of the presidents that have served in the the last 50 years as the centerpiece(s).

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BoneSoft

My point is that it's completely asinine and dishonest for people to keep claiming that the economic problems are all Bush's fault and therefore all Republican's fault. And it's equally, if not more so, asinine and dishonest to blaim the bailouts on the soley right. And I hear them both constantly. I'm not claiming anybody is blameless, but I will post this same message over and over again every stinking time somebody calls it the Republican bailout, or that Republican "deregulation" was the only thing that mattered in bringing a faulty and flawed socialist program to it's knees. Especially when Democrats had a larger, even if only slightly, hand in both. I'm not the one puting all the blame on one side, that's all I'm arguing against.

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