The first thing I’d do as President is sign the Freedom of Choice Act. That’s the first thing I’d do

wolfbinary

Oakman wrote:

12 or 13 year old

Do you have any citation for this? I've never actually heard or read any factual thing about that.

Oakman

wolfbinary wrote:

Do you have any citation for this? I've never actually heard or read any factual thing about that.

FOCA will bar any level of government from making any law regulating abortion-on-demand. That's clear from the act, from the websites that support it, and from any other reading I have done. There's certainly no reason for you to take my word for it, or for anything. However, I wonder if you have read the act? Read anything that supports the measure or anything, other than the OP's link, that opposes it. Have you read Wikipedia?

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

hairy_hats

Well in the UK doctors don't need to tell parents when performing an abortion on a daughter despite requiring arental permission on all other medical procedures.

wolfbinary

I was referring to 12 and 13 year olds getting an abortion today and needing them with or without parental consent. What I'm asking is if there is any reported basis for this. I've heard this before without anything behind it. No I haven't read the act, just a bit on the website. I wasn't leveling a side or a position at this point, just a fact or information gathering desire. I'm playing devil's advocate at this point. If this did pass, what then?

modified on Thursday, January 29, 2009 9:52 AM

wolfbinary

So has your world come to an end yet? What is the goal of the law? What are you guys going to do about it if it passes and becomes law? What can be done about the law or bill with a petition? Let the flaming begin.

KaRl

As often, it's somebody that will never ever have to carry a child who has a firm opinion on that subject.

There are two things that one must get used to or one will find life unendurable: the damages of time and injustices of men Fold with us! ¤ flickr

KaRl

And it's a good thing.

Anyone who is not a misanthropist at 40 never loved men at any time Fold with us! ¤ flickr

hairy_hats

No. It's a medical procedure so it should also require permission. If you exempt abortion then you should be able to exempt other procedures too and the principle of parental consent goes out the window.

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

And it's a good thing.

Are you a parent?

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

KaRl

This is a theorical position that does not take into account what happens in the real life. If communication between the parents and the daughter is so low that the daughter is unable to talk about the pregnancy with them, then it's better to deal with it rather than creating a crisis that could be dangerous for the daughter.

When they kick at your front door How you gonna come? With your hands on your head Or on the trigger of your gun?

Fold with us! ¤ flickr

KaRl

Are you from the police?

Anyone who is not a misanthropist at 40 never loved men at any time Fold with us! ¤ flickr

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

Are you from the police?

Nope, but I have relatives that work for the DoJ. Does that count?

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

If communication between the parents and the daughter is so low that the daughter is unable to talk about the pregnancy with them

Oh yeah. Communication between 12 - 15 year-olds and their parents is almost always at the highest it will ever be. :rolleyes:

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

As often, it's somebody that will never ever have to carry a child who has a firm opinion on that subject.

Or someone who has never raised a child who has a firm opinion on how best a government should regulate the relationship of parent and child?

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

KaRl

Are you a woman?

When they kick at your front door How you gonna come? With your hands on your head Or on the trigger of your gun?

Fold with us! ¤ flickr

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

Are you a woman?

I'm a parent. I guess you're afraid to admit that you aren't.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

Oakman

wolfbinary wrote:

What are you guys going to do about it if it passes and becomes law?

You don't understand. Most doctors oppose this law because of what could happen to them if parents discovered their child had been operated on without their consent.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

KaRl

Oakman wrote:

I'm a parent.

So I guess you're not, but you have nonetheless a firm opinion of what they can do with their own body. Very contistent.

Oakman wrote:

I guess you're afraid to admit that you aren't.

If you think I care about what you believe or not, you're misguided.

Society is composed of two great classes, those that have more dinners than appetite, and those who have more appetite than dinners Fold with us! ¤ flickr

Oakman

Ka?l wrote:

So I guess you're not, but you have nonetheless a firm opinion of what they can do with their own body.

Yopu need to take remdial reading. Nowhere in this entire discussion have I said anything about what an adult woman can otr should do about aborting.

Ka?l wrote:

If you think I care about what you believe or not, you're misguided.

Oh, it's not a belief. I know you aren't. You are an opinionated kid with so little experience of the real world that you don't even know what you don't know.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Algoraphobia: An exaggerated fear of the outside world rooted in the belief that one might spontaneously combust due to global warming.

Synaptrik

So, you are saying that parents don't have a right to know their young child is being operated on, let alone require consent? Why such a special case to abortion? If a child breaks their arm at school, why notify the parents and get a consent form signed? Another point, is the child aware of the rights they sign away when they have to sign forms at the hospital excusing mistakes? We had to sign one of those for my wife's hysterectomy. I support free choice. But in this case in my opinion it has to be with the parents consent and knowledge. That is just wrong.

This statement is false