If torture works....
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Here is the perfect "ticking time-bomb" scenario on which to test it. This man holds information that, if obtained, will save lives. Should he be tortured to obtain that information?
The man charged with murdering a high-profile abortion doctor claimed from his jail cell that similar violence was planned around the nation for as long as the procedure remained legal, a threat that comes days after a federal investigation launched into his possible accomplices.[^]
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Here is the perfect "ticking time-bomb" scenario on which to test it. This man holds information that, if obtained, will save lives. Should he be tortured to obtain that information?
The man charged with murdering a high-profile abortion doctor claimed from his jail cell that similar violence was planned around the nation for as long as the procedure remained legal, a threat that comes days after a federal investigation launched into his possible accomplices.[^]
Ed Gadziemski wrote:
Should he be tortured to obtain that information?
Fine by me.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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Here is the perfect "ticking time-bomb" scenario on which to test it. This man holds information that, if obtained, will save lives. Should he be tortured to obtain that information?
The man charged with murdering a high-profile abortion doctor claimed from his jail cell that similar violence was planned around the nation for as long as the procedure remained legal, a threat that comes days after a federal investigation launched into his possible accomplices.[^]
The problem with torture lovers is that they really, REALLY love to torture. They won't object to this at all.
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The problem with torture lovers is that they really, REALLY love to torture. They won't object to this at all.
:rolleyes: Give us some more insight into the mind of a torturer, oh great one. :zzz: But it appears that you were right that he is a terrorist who is part of an organization, or at least loosely tied to one.
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
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Here is the perfect "ticking time-bomb" scenario on which to test it. This man holds information that, if obtained, will save lives. Should he be tortured to obtain that information?
The man charged with murdering a high-profile abortion doctor claimed from his jail cell that similar violence was planned around the nation for as long as the procedure remained legal, a threat that comes days after a federal investigation launched into his possible accomplices.[^]
I dunno... Can you really call it a "ticking time bomb" when there's no ticking and no time set? And probably not even a payload? However, the appointment books of abortionists are REAL ticking time bombs. Who can we torture to get that problem fixed?
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
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The problem with torture lovers is that they really, REALLY love to torture. They won't object to this at all.
oilFactotum wrote:
The problem with torture lovers is that they really, REALLY love to torture. They won't object to this at all.
The problem with abortion lovers is that they really, REALLY love to crush the skulls of living babies. They never object to abortion at all.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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I dunno... Can you really call it a "ticking time bomb" when there's no ticking and no time set? And probably not even a payload? However, the appointment books of abortionists are REAL ticking time bombs. Who can we torture to get that problem fixed?
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
BoneSoft wrote:
However, the appointment books of abortionists are REAL ticking time bombs. Who can we torture to get that problem fixed?
Churches that say no to birth control?
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Here is the perfect "ticking time-bomb" scenario on which to test it. This man holds information that, if obtained, will save lives. Should he be tortured to obtain that information?
The man charged with murdering a high-profile abortion doctor claimed from his jail cell that similar violence was planned around the nation for as long as the procedure remained legal, a threat that comes days after a federal investigation launched into his possible accomplices.[^]
He's a murderer. However, I doubt he has information that would save lives. But then again, how many lives are we talking about? A couple hundred, potentially, maybe? I don't suggest we do this, any more than I support your absurd idea, but just to play devil's advocate... If you REALLY wanted to save lives, and I'm talking six to seven figures here, then instead of torturing him for information he likely doesn't have, we could give him a box of ammo and let him go. Now, I know many of you are now frothing at the mouth and chomping at the bit screaming murder sympathizer. But calm down, breathe deep, count to ten slowly, pop an Asprin if need be to avoid a cradiological catastrophe... I don't support that, condone it, or think it's productive in any way. Murder is bad, and should be punished wherever it occurs. So don't try to tell me I believe otherwise. I'm just saying, if you REALLY care about lives, Tiller exterminated 60,000 of them. Have you ever taken one of those morality tests, that basically consists of questions about various scenarios where killing a small number of people or allowing them to die could result in saving a large number of lives? The largest variation in the questions is allowing them to die versus actively causing their deaths, the means of death, the proportions of saved versus killed, and the settings. Considering the whole set of questions, I realized that I could consider allowing a smaller number of people to die to save a larger number, but that actively killing people, by any means, in any proportions was something I don't think I could do. But I also had to wonder, why is it always the larger number that's assumed to be best? I mean, if you're somebody like Sotomayor, you'd probably rather kill 30 or 40 old white guys to save a couple of Puerto Rican women. Or if you're somebody like Peloci, you might think that 50 or 60 people were an acceptable sacrifice for 5 or 6 wetland frogs. And Al Gore might choose the billions of dollars he'll gain from Cap'n Trade over the 6.7 billion lives it will hurt. But I'm getting off track here. The point is, why are you SO worked up about one murder? There's only one possible answer: It serves your political purposes. I don't want abortion doctors thrown in jail (necessarily... for the most part... Tiller definitely should have been thrown in jail but, special case). I don't want women seeking abortions thrown in jail. I want programs that help avoid unwanted pregnancies. I want people to realize that killing the
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BoneSoft wrote:
However, the appointment books of abortionists are REAL ticking time bombs. Who can we torture to get that problem fixed?
Churches that say no to birth control?
Yeah, that's one. Who else? Schools that show you where to stick it. Who else?
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
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The problem with torture lovers is that they really, REALLY love to torture. They won't object to this at all.
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Yeah, that's one. Who else? Schools that show you where to stick it. Who else?
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
BoneSoft wrote:
Schools that show you where to stick it.
I think most teenagers know where to stick it without a class, that's the problem. Just because you couldn't figure it out without a diagram says more about you than the general population.
"Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work and then they get elected and prove it." -- P.J. O'Rourke
I'm a proud denizen of the Real Soapbox[^]
ACCEPT NO SUBSTITUTES!!! -
BoneSoft wrote:
Schools that show you where to stick it.
I think most teenagers know where to stick it without a class, that's the problem. Just because you couldn't figure it out without a diagram says more about you than the general population.
"Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work and then they get elected and prove it." -- P.J. O'Rourke
I'm a proud denizen of the Real Soapbox[^]
ACCEPT NO SUBSTITUTES!!!Was that you Pot, bitching about the hostility in here? Or was that Kettle.
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx