First 'anti-stab' knife to go on sale in Britain
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Gosh, I wonder how hard it is to saw off the end of the knife? Or, wait, guns are illegal, but readily available? Will proper knive suddenly disappear? Still, better ban sticks and bricks and fists, they can be deadly too! What about cars and horses, thousands die every year. Doors, Tea Cosys, Ropes hmm what else could possibly kill someone that we should ban? Water, yes ban water except for those with a license to operate it! Get a grip!
------------------------------------ "When Belly Full, Chin Hit Chest" Confucius 502BC
Swimming pools are the number one cause of death for kinds under the age of 12 in the US. About a thousand times more deadly to kids than guns.
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
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Swimming pools are the number one cause of death for kinds under the age of 12 in the US. About a thousand times more deadly to kids than guns.
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
Very Dangerous, they should be banned!
------------------------------------ "When Belly Full, Chin Hit Chest" Confucius 502BC
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Oakman wrote:
You might be surprised and dismayed to realize how much damage can be done with a slashing attack.
I've seen a few knife fights, and none of them really got a good stab in. However, you get sliced up pretty damn fast which is at least as bad.
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
BoneSoft wrote:
I've seen a few knife fights, and none of them really got a good stab in. However, you get sliced up pretty damn fast which is at least as bad.
I few days after highschool graduation, a kid from my class, drunk at the time, decided that I'd "dissed" him (that word didn't exist at the time of course) as I walked into a grocery store because I hadn’t returned his "Hi" loudly enough. When I came out, he jumped me and came close to putting one of my eyes out with a razor-blade. No stabbing point is needed to do severe harm to another person using an edged blade.
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A couple of tendon cuts in the forearms and you are defenseless. A slash at the ankle can permanently disable someone, immediately.
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
A knife rendered useless for stabbing but still effective for slashing is not really relevant. The perception by most people is it's a "safe" knife, and if labor were not in so much trouble over there they probably would make it a law that this would be the only knife allowed, for the common good (2 cents). Someone even selling a knife like that, or perceiving a need for it I find quite odd by it's self.
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Very Dangerous, they should be banned!
------------------------------------ "When Belly Full, Chin Hit Chest" Confucius 502BC
Dalek Dave wrote:
Very Dangerous, they should be banned!
Maybe there's a middle ground like with the knife - we could simply tie their hands behind their back - then they couldn't swim which of course would mean they would never drown. . .
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
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John Carson wrote:
That assumes an intent to murder.
No, it assumes that you won't know whether or not the thug with the knife knows how to cut your throat or not.
John Carson wrote:
Cutting a very specific target on a person not already disabled takes a skill that not every knife-yielding thug will possess
And if one is threatening you, are you going to ask him if he knows how? You might be surprised and dismayed to realize how much damage can be done with a slashing attack. The concept of not being able to cut your opponent's throat until he's disabled is best labeled, 'simply a matter of time,' even for an amateur.
John Carson wrote:
My prediction: 5 years hence, all kitchen knives sold in Britain will look like this (assuming it really does make stabbing with the "point" non-lethal).
Naww - Australia, maybe. The Chinese may order it so. ;)
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
Oakman wrote:
No, it assumes that you won't know whether or not the thug with the knife knows how to cut your throat or not.
I don't follow. My point is that if you cut someone's carotid artery, then they die (unless they get very speedy and effective medical attention). Thus attempting to cut it signifies an intent to murder.
Oakman wrote:
And if one is threatening you, are you going to ask him if he knows how?
You seem to be analysing this from the standpoint of the person threatened with a knife, as in: "Should I shoot this person before he attacks me with a knife". In a British context, that is almost never the question since very few people have guns. In a British context, the question is more likely to be: if one or more parties to a fight has a knife, what can we do to make the fight less lethal? Blunting the point is a suggested answer.
Oakman wrote:
You might be surprised and dismayed to realize how much damage can be done with a slashing attack. The concept of not being able to cut your opponent's throat until he's disabled is best labeled, 'simply a matter of time,' even for an amateur.
This is not one of my areas of expertise, but I would think that a would-be killer would generally prefer to have a knife with a sharp point so as to increase the killing options. Taken over the whole range of knife attacks/fights (skilled and unskilled, those with murderous intent and those only wishing to harm, those interrupted and those allowed to proceed to their conclusion...), I would tend to expect less fatalities if knives lacked a sharp point.
John Carson
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Oakman wrote:
No, it assumes that you won't know whether or not the thug with the knife knows how to cut your throat or not.
I don't follow. My point is that if you cut someone's carotid artery, then they die (unless they get very speedy and effective medical attention). Thus attempting to cut it signifies an intent to murder.
Oakman wrote:
And if one is threatening you, are you going to ask him if he knows how?
You seem to be analysing this from the standpoint of the person threatened with a knife, as in: "Should I shoot this person before he attacks me with a knife". In a British context, that is almost never the question since very few people have guns. In a British context, the question is more likely to be: if one or more parties to a fight has a knife, what can we do to make the fight less lethal? Blunting the point is a suggested answer.
Oakman wrote:
You might be surprised and dismayed to realize how much damage can be done with a slashing attack. The concept of not being able to cut your opponent's throat until he's disabled is best labeled, 'simply a matter of time,' even for an amateur.
This is not one of my areas of expertise, but I would think that a would-be killer would generally prefer to have a knife with a sharp point so as to increase the killing options. Taken over the whole range of knife attacks/fights (skilled and unskilled, those with murderous intent and those only wishing to harm, those interrupted and those allowed to proceed to their conclusion...), I would tend to expect less fatalities if knives lacked a sharp point.
John Carson
John Carson wrote:
Thus attempting to cut it signifies an intent to murder.
Whereas just slashing away doesn't??? Blunting the point does not make a butcher knife any less of a deadly weapon.
John Carson wrote:
You seem to be analysing this from the standpoint of the person threatened with a knife,
Well, it's real easy to analyse it from the point of view of someone planning on threatening someone with a knife. It goes something like, "Where's a grinding wheel?"
John Carson wrote:
I would think that a would-be killer would generally prefer to have a knife with a sharp point so as to increase the killing options.
Some people think that an epee is preferable to a saber. I know which I'd rather have and which I'd rather defend against.
John Carson wrote:
if knives lacked a sharp point
To make them really safe, shouldn't they have their edge blunted, too?
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
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John Carson wrote:
Thus attempting to cut it signifies an intent to murder.
Whereas just slashing away doesn't??? Blunting the point does not make a butcher knife any less of a deadly weapon.
John Carson wrote:
You seem to be analysing this from the standpoint of the person threatened with a knife,
Well, it's real easy to analyse it from the point of view of someone planning on threatening someone with a knife. It goes something like, "Where's a grinding wheel?"
John Carson wrote:
I would think that a would-be killer would generally prefer to have a knife with a sharp point so as to increase the killing options.
Some people think that an epee is preferable to a saber. I know which I'd rather have and which I'd rather defend against.
John Carson wrote:
if knives lacked a sharp point
To make them really safe, shouldn't they have their edge blunted, too?
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
Oakman wrote:
To make them really safe, shouldn't they have their edge blunted, too?
Yes, but that would rather inhibit their function as kitchen implements, whereas blunting the point would have minimal effect in that regard.
John Carson
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Absurd. They try to turn their citizens into brainwashed defenseless drones. They will be the first to get chipped with an RFID.
Obloga Obama Blog[^] Diet, injections, and injunctions will combine, from a very early age to produce the sort of character and sort of beliefs that authorities consider desirable. Any serious criticism of the powers that be will become psychologically impossible.
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Oakman wrote:
To make them really safe, shouldn't they have their edge blunted, too?
Yes, but that would rather inhibit their function as kitchen implements, whereas blunting the point would have minimal effect in that regard.
John Carson
To just what extent do you believe society should go to protect everyone from everyone? We could eiliminate fire making tools (matches, lighters, flints) to protect against arsonists because: 1) out door fires are largely illegal, save BBQs, 2) an awful lot if BBQers use gas grills with electronic ignitions, 3) a significant number of people cook indoors on electric stoves or on gas stoves with electronic ignitions. We could eliminate the sharp end of needles and force little old ladies to simply push blunted needles through whatever cloth they're sewing. We could eliminate pencil sharpeners bacause if you fall with a sharp pencil in your shirt pocket you could poke a hole in a nipple. We could outlaw bicycles because sometimes people fall and hurt themselves. We could eliminate unchewed food, move to pure pureeed veggies and such, because I've heard that people sometimes choke on unchewed food. We could eliminate mentos and/or coca cola because dropping mentos into cola products causes and explosive result. We could eliminate snaps on bras because I once almost put an eye out when I was showing how I could remove a bra only using my teeth. Waddya think?
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
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To just what extent do you believe society should go to protect everyone from everyone? We could eiliminate fire making tools (matches, lighters, flints) to protect against arsonists because: 1) out door fires are largely illegal, save BBQs, 2) an awful lot if BBQers use gas grills with electronic ignitions, 3) a significant number of people cook indoors on electric stoves or on gas stoves with electronic ignitions. We could eliminate the sharp end of needles and force little old ladies to simply push blunted needles through whatever cloth they're sewing. We could eliminate pencil sharpeners bacause if you fall with a sharp pencil in your shirt pocket you could poke a hole in a nipple. We could outlaw bicycles because sometimes people fall and hurt themselves. We could eliminate unchewed food, move to pure pureeed veggies and such, because I've heard that people sometimes choke on unchewed food. We could eliminate mentos and/or coca cola because dropping mentos into cola products causes and explosive result. We could eliminate snaps on bras because I once almost put an eye out when I was showing how I could remove a bra only using my teeth. Waddya think?
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
Mike Gaskey wrote:
We could outlaw bicycles because sometimes people fall and hurt themselves.
I noticed. Add gravelly hills to that list. Every path should be tarmacked over, regardless of location, for grip. If any environmentalists are on the path, then add an extra layer - bumps are very annoying ;P
Between the idea And the reality Between the motion And the act Falls the Shadow
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To just what extent do you believe society should go to protect everyone from everyone? We could eiliminate fire making tools (matches, lighters, flints) to protect against arsonists because: 1) out door fires are largely illegal, save BBQs, 2) an awful lot if BBQers use gas grills with electronic ignitions, 3) a significant number of people cook indoors on electric stoves or on gas stoves with electronic ignitions. We could eliminate the sharp end of needles and force little old ladies to simply push blunted needles through whatever cloth they're sewing. We could eliminate pencil sharpeners bacause if you fall with a sharp pencil in your shirt pocket you could poke a hole in a nipple. We could outlaw bicycles because sometimes people fall and hurt themselves. We could eliminate unchewed food, move to pure pureeed veggies and such, because I've heard that people sometimes choke on unchewed food. We could eliminate mentos and/or coca cola because dropping mentos into cola products causes and explosive result. We could eliminate snaps on bras because I once almost put an eye out when I was showing how I could remove a bra only using my teeth. Waddya think?
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
I once got a scratched cornea when a young lady's pubic bone slammed upwards into my eye, while I was wearing hard contacts, due to my oscular dexiterity. What do you think we should ban in such cases? I know what Stan thinks should be banned, of course. :laugh:
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
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Oakman wrote:
You might be surprised and dismayed to realize how much damage can be done with a slashing attack.
I've seen a few knife fights, and none of them really got a good stab in. However, you get sliced up pretty damn fast which is at least as bad.
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
Yep. I studied Eskrima[^] for a couple of years and the knife fighting was chilling.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --Ralph Charell
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Oakman wrote:
No, it assumes that you won't know whether or not the thug with the knife knows how to cut your throat or not.
I don't follow. My point is that if you cut someone's carotid artery, then they die (unless they get very speedy and effective medical attention). Thus attempting to cut it signifies an intent to murder.
Oakman wrote:
And if one is threatening you, are you going to ask him if he knows how?
You seem to be analysing this from the standpoint of the person threatened with a knife, as in: "Should I shoot this person before he attacks me with a knife". In a British context, that is almost never the question since very few people have guns. In a British context, the question is more likely to be: if one or more parties to a fight has a knife, what can we do to make the fight less lethal? Blunting the point is a suggested answer.
Oakman wrote:
You might be surprised and dismayed to realize how much damage can be done with a slashing attack. The concept of not being able to cut your opponent's throat until he's disabled is best labeled, 'simply a matter of time,' even for an amateur.
This is not one of my areas of expertise, but I would think that a would-be killer would generally prefer to have a knife with a sharp point so as to increase the killing options. Taken over the whole range of knife attacks/fights (skilled and unskilled, those with murderous intent and those only wishing to harm, those interrupted and those allowed to proceed to their conclusion...), I would tend to expect less fatalities if knives lacked a sharp point.
John Carson
John Carson wrote:
This is not one of my areas of expertise, but I would think that a would-be killer would generally prefer to have a knife with a sharp point so as to increase the killing options.
I don't know John, I've studied martial arts all my life and in knife fighting I'd say that using the point is only a small portion of the techniques I've learned. The common thug my well have no clue or the ability parry and slash. But, there is nothing to stop the criminally motivated from making a simple shiv or shank.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --Ralph Charell
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John Carson wrote:
This is not one of my areas of expertise, but I would think that a would-be killer would generally prefer to have a knife with a sharp point so as to increase the killing options.
I don't know John, I've studied martial arts all my life and in knife fighting I'd say that using the point is only a small portion of the techniques I've learned. The common thug my well have no clue or the ability parry and slash. But, there is nothing to stop the criminally motivated from making a simple shiv or shank.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --Ralph Charell
Chris Austin wrote:
there is nothing to stop the criminally motivated from making a simple shiv or shank.
. . .and they will have a fine steel knife with a good edge to that only needs a point, to work with But, in case of a home invasion, it certainly takes away the average housewife's last line of defense. That should be of some comfort to the bad guys.
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
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Isn't that a bit like anti fire matches ?
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. "! i don't exactly like or do programming and it only gives me a headache." - spotted in VB forums. I can do things with my brain that I can't even google. I can flex the front part of my brain instantly anytime I want. It can be exhausting and it even causes me vision problems for some reason. - CaptainSeeSharp
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I once got a scratched cornea when a young lady's pubic bone slammed upwards into my eye, while I was wearing hard contacts, due to my oscular dexiterity. What do you think we should ban in such cases? I know what Stan thinks should be banned, of course. :laugh:
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
Oakman wrote:
What do you think we should ban in such cases?
Certainly not the young lady or any part thereof, but now I really wonder what they mean by, "protected sex".
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
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Yep. I studied Eskrima[^] for a couple of years and the knife fighting was chilling.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --Ralph Charell
Yeah, I've watched some eskrima and that's one martial art that don't screw around with the "martial" part. It would probably be pretty handy to learn now days.
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain "Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' until you can find a rock." - Mark Twain "If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." - Groucho Marx
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Oakman wrote:
What do you think we should ban in such cases?
Certainly not the young lady or any part thereof, but now I really wonder what they mean by, "protected sex".
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
Mike Gaskey wrote:
now I really wonder what they mean by, "protected sex".
or "wear a helmet?"
Jon Soap Box 1.0: the first, the original, reborn troll-less
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To just what extent do you believe society should go to protect everyone from everyone? We could eiliminate fire making tools (matches, lighters, flints) to protect against arsonists because: 1) out door fires are largely illegal, save BBQs, 2) an awful lot if BBQers use gas grills with electronic ignitions, 3) a significant number of people cook indoors on electric stoves or on gas stoves with electronic ignitions. We could eliminate the sharp end of needles and force little old ladies to simply push blunted needles through whatever cloth they're sewing. We could eliminate pencil sharpeners bacause if you fall with a sharp pencil in your shirt pocket you could poke a hole in a nipple. We could outlaw bicycles because sometimes people fall and hurt themselves. We could eliminate unchewed food, move to pure pureeed veggies and such, because I've heard that people sometimes choke on unchewed food. We could eliminate mentos and/or coca cola because dropping mentos into cola products causes and explosive result. We could eliminate snaps on bras because I once almost put an eye out when I was showing how I could remove a bra only using my teeth. Waddya think?
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
Mike Gaskey wrote:
To just what extent do you believe society should go to protect everyone from everyone?
I don't find any of your suggestions appealing. The basic questions are: 1. What is the benign use of the object in question? 2. To what extent would that benign use be compromised by the proposed safety measure? 3. What safety benefits might be expected to flow from that safety measure? There is a very wide range of violent offenders, from the professional killer through to the bumbling incompetent who is just temporarily in a bad mood. Nothing stops the professional killer, but some other types of offenders may be discouraged some of the time. Depending on the answers to the above three questions, safety measures may be justified.
John Carson