MSNBC: EU Bailout is a robbery
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I have a radical proposal for you. It's called research. Watching a video and believing everything they say, is one thing, but understanding what they are saying and forming your own opinions is another. Browse around the web, visit news websites from other countries, listen to other view points. Then, and only then are you able to come on here and post your own opinions (without quoting or linking[unless backing your arguments]) without total ridicule and dismissal. As for banking, I highly doubt you understand enough about the process (I'm not claiming to either) to be able to say that the "bailout" (which the US housing market collapse is a big element of) is robbery. There are people far smarter on this forum that know and understand far more about the process, you are not one of them and you can't back up anything you say with your own point of view.
I've done a lot of research on this. I post this video as a small primer for you guys, hoping you will snap out of your smugness and do some research of you own.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
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I've done a lot of research on this. I post this video as a small primer for you guys, hoping you will snap out of your smugness and do some research of you own.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
Back it up then moron! I'm fine with name calling all day, but what about that video other than the overly dramatic host hamming it up actually says that this is robbery. The interviewees (both against and for) give more information on the fact than the fool host. The sub-prime mortgage crisis in this country put a lot of strain on investors the world over. Now, I don't think Greece is a big contributor, but they're in trouble, and the European union is setup to work as an umbrella corporation and protect it's members. As the video states, 40% of the WORLDS trade is between the US and Europe. It's in Americas (and therefore Americans) best interests to support their trade partners. Let them fail, see what happens on main street then. I'm not going to get involved in any lengthy discussions with you on here. You have shown time and time again that once your knowledge is exhausted, once your website searches come up with nothing new that you're completely unable to support your opinions with anything of substance. You don't enter into debate, you enter into attacks that ultimately turn into childish nonsense. If you've done so much research, use what intelligence you have to post something that is actually from your own point of view! I can deal with being called an idiot, I wasn't pretending to know more than I stated, my only goal is to actually encourage some debate and discussion from you that actually might be quite entertaining.
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I've done a lot of research on this. I post this video as a small primer for you guys, hoping you will snap out of your smugness and do some research of you own.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
Actually, what is your viewpoint here? All I really got out of what you've said on this is that Greece wore a bandana over its face, rode its horse alongside the EU train tracks, hopped on board and held them up with a six-shooter for bailout money. You've done alot of research, so... what've we got?
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Back it up then moron! I'm fine with name calling all day, but what about that video other than the overly dramatic host hamming it up actually says that this is robbery. The interviewees (both against and for) give more information on the fact than the fool host. The sub-prime mortgage crisis in this country put a lot of strain on investors the world over. Now, I don't think Greece is a big contributor, but they're in trouble, and the European union is setup to work as an umbrella corporation and protect it's members. As the video states, 40% of the WORLDS trade is between the US and Europe. It's in Americas (and therefore Americans) best interests to support their trade partners. Let them fail, see what happens on main street then. I'm not going to get involved in any lengthy discussions with you on here. You have shown time and time again that once your knowledge is exhausted, once your website searches come up with nothing new that you're completely unable to support your opinions with anything of substance. You don't enter into debate, you enter into attacks that ultimately turn into childish nonsense. If you've done so much research, use what intelligence you have to post something that is actually from your own point of view! I can deal with being called an idiot, I wasn't pretending to know more than I stated, my only goal is to actually encourage some debate and discussion from you that actually might be quite entertaining.
hammerstein05 wrote:
Let them fail, see what happens on main street then.
They hold us hostage, the same people supposedly "fixing" the economy are the ones that destroyed it. It's like setting the world on fire and then saying you can put it out if the world gives you trillions of dollars, but if they don't the world burns.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
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hammerstein05 wrote:
Let them fail, see what happens on main street then.
They hold us hostage, the same people supposedly "fixing" the economy are the ones that destroyed it. It's like setting the world on fire and then saying you can put it out if the world gives you trillions of dollars, but if they don't the world burns.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
I see the holding hostage argument. These banks are racking up debts they can't cover and then sitting back and watching governments fix it for them. It's not right that anybody is holding anybody hostage. But, take a look at what Fannie Mae revealed yesterday, same thing is still happening on our own shores. It's why certain a certain President, of whom you don't appear to be a fan, wants to regulate in this country and why other countries DO regulate. Quoting the video almost word for word is not going to help your argument, you're just showing that you can regurgitate. This is my final dignified response unless you come out with something like a reasonable argument of your own. Even though I started with the childish attack today, come on, throw your best at us. Show us you actually did research and understand this.
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I see the holding hostage argument. These banks are racking up debts they can't cover and then sitting back and watching governments fix it for them. It's not right that anybody is holding anybody hostage. But, take a look at what Fannie Mae revealed yesterday, same thing is still happening on our own shores. It's why certain a certain President, of whom you don't appear to be a fan, wants to regulate in this country and why other countries DO regulate. Quoting the video almost word for word is not going to help your argument, you're just showing that you can regurgitate. This is my final dignified response unless you come out with something like a reasonable argument of your own. Even though I started with the childish attack today, come on, throw your best at us. Show us you actually did research and understand this.
The central banks need to be regulated out of existence, and the other perpetrators such as Goldman, Fannie, and all the other corporations that feed off of the public through the federal reserve need to be convicted of fraud. The Wall Street bankers that paid for Obama and his cronies need to go to prison. Now we are bailing out other countries, What the fuck. This is just ridiculous, it is indefensible.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
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The central banks need to be regulated out of existence, and the other perpetrators such as Goldman, Fannie, and all the other corporations that feed off of the public through the federal reserve need to be convicted of fraud. The Wall Street bankers that paid for Obama and his cronies need to go to prison. Now we are bailing out other countries, What the fuck. This is just ridiculous, it is indefensible.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
So it's gerbils?
If I have accidentally said something witty, smart, or correct, it is purely by mistake and I apologize for it.
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Link[^] See, even MSNBC is reporting some truth. Wake up.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
That is not reporting, it is a rant. There is no analysis, it is totally superficial. The IMF is involved in this because that is what its job is, turning banana republics into fiscally responsible states. It has a record of forcing austerity and responsibility upon its 'clients', and of getting its money back[^]. (The link also supports Mr Chaka Fattah's claims that this is existing IMF money. Apparently they were stashing the cash - over and above immediate requirements - a year ago.) Had the USA a strong economy, it would not be taking any of these measures, but it is broke. So, if Greece fails, and the rest of the PIIGS, UK, ... follow suit, the economy of the USA will have to take that walk through the Market's full body scanner, and its financial impotence, too, will be revealed. Perhaps asking the IMF to put the USA's banana republic in order would be a smart, if embarrassing, move.
Bob Emmett CSS: I don't intend to be a technical writing, I intend to be a software engineer.
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I've done a lot of research on this. I post this video as a small primer for you guys, hoping you will snap out of your smugness and do some research of you own.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
Go read up on what is acceptable sources in any formal disitation. Youtube it is not.
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. or "Drink. Get drunk. Fall over." - P O'H
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Actually, what is your viewpoint here? All I really got out of what you've said on this is that Greece wore a bandana over its face, rode its horse alongside the EU train tracks, hopped on board and held them up with a six-shooter for bailout money. You've done alot of research, so... what've we got?
drothe wrote:
You've done alot of research, so... what've we got?
'We' have got bored, Sock Cooker has got caloused hands.
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. or "Drink. Get drunk. Fall over." - P O'H
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Link[^] See, even MSNBC is reporting some truth. Wake up.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
Okay nob-head, the only sorces I have on this are not quotable due to the statements being made under 'Chatham House' rules. But what i can tell you is the the ECB and IMF have already discounted the facilty [please check up what that means, it is not a bailout] based on the risk of default. The perceived chance is obviously increased by the amount that will be drawn down. If Greece draws down it's entire facility, which is highly unlikely considering it's more than 10x what was considered the maximum they would need, the chance of default is around 30%. Yup, every euro becomes 70 cents. But those figures, which come from a lot more reliable source then you could dream of having, actually reflect how low the risks are. The huge favilities that have been provided are there so that they won't need to borrow. I know it's confusing for your little drug-addled mind, but the larger the facility the less likely they are to need to use it. If you've borrowed $100 from me and I find out you're only making 50 bucks a week, I'd be worried that you couldn't pay me back in a month as promissed, so I'd put pressure on you and you'd end up paying me early and finding you couldn't pay your crack dealer or something. Now imagine your Mom came to me and said she has $1,000 dollars and should you need some you can borrow it, do you think I would be as worried about getting my mney back?
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. or "Drink. Get drunk. Fall over." - P O'H
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That is not reporting, it is a rant. There is no analysis, it is totally superficial. The IMF is involved in this because that is what its job is, turning banana republics into fiscally responsible states. It has a record of forcing austerity and responsibility upon its 'clients', and of getting its money back[^]. (The link also supports Mr Chaka Fattah's claims that this is existing IMF money. Apparently they were stashing the cash - over and above immediate requirements - a year ago.) Had the USA a strong economy, it would not be taking any of these measures, but it is broke. So, if Greece fails, and the rest of the PIIGS, UK, ... follow suit, the economy of the USA will have to take that walk through the Market's full body scanner, and its financial impotence, too, will be revealed. Perhaps asking the IMF to put the USA's banana republic in order would be a smart, if embarrassing, move.
Bob Emmett CSS: I don't intend to be a technical writing, I intend to be a software engineer.
The IMF funds are a facility, see below.
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. or "Drink. Get drunk. Fall over." - P O'H
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When it supports your viewpoint, it's "truth." When it opposes your viewpoint, it's media propaganda and government lies. Funny how that works, isn't it?
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in?
Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels)So whats new? Thats how almost the whole of humanity work, especially governments, who are the creatoprs of propaganda and spin. If you think peoplke and society is about anything other than power and money and doing almost anything toi get it then you are naieve.
Morality is indistinguishable from social proscription
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So whats new? Thats how almost the whole of humanity work, especially governments, who are the creatoprs of propaganda and spin. If you think peoplke and society is about anything other than power and money and doing almost anything toi get it then you are naieve.
Morality is indistinguishable from social proscription
fat_boy wrote:
If you think peoplke and society is about anything other than power and money and doing almost anything toi get it then you are naieve.
Huh, and here I figured it was more about survival, as we're not exactly top flight predators on our own.
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So whats new? Thats how almost the whole of humanity work, especially governments, who are the creatoprs of propaganda and spin. If you think peoplke and society is about anything other than power and money and doing almost anything toi get it then you are naieve.
Morality is indistinguishable from social proscription
fat_boy wrote:
If you think peoplke and society is about anything other than power and money and doing almost anything toi get it then you are naieve.
Damn! Why didn't I take Sociopathology 101?
Bob Emmett Immorality is indistinguishable from social prescription
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That is not reporting, it is a rant. There is no analysis, it is totally superficial. The IMF is involved in this because that is what its job is, turning banana republics into fiscally responsible states. It has a record of forcing austerity and responsibility upon its 'clients', and of getting its money back[^]. (The link also supports Mr Chaka Fattah's claims that this is existing IMF money. Apparently they were stashing the cash - over and above immediate requirements - a year ago.) Had the USA a strong economy, it would not be taking any of these measures, but it is broke. So, if Greece fails, and the rest of the PIIGS, UK, ... follow suit, the economy of the USA will have to take that walk through the Market's full body scanner, and its financial impotence, too, will be revealed. Perhaps asking the IMF to put the USA's banana republic in order would be a smart, if embarrassing, move.
Bob Emmett CSS: I don't intend to be a technical writing, I intend to be a software engineer.
Bob Emmett wrote:
So, if Greece fails, and the rest of the PIIGS, UK, ... follow suit, the economy of the USA will have to take that walk through the Market's full body scanner, and its financial impotence, too, will be revealed.
I get a kick out of economic illiterates who desperately argue that somehow, the EU is important to the U.S.'s economy. Take a walk down to your local dog pound. Check to see how many tails are wagging how many dogs. Or, to put it another way, when the U.S. catches a cold, the EU dies of pneumonia. When the EU comes down with the bubonic plague, the U.S. takes a couple of Tylenol. The only question worth asking about the IMF/Fed bailout of Europe is why, after an entire century of Europe needing the U.S. to clean up their mess, is Obama actually doing it. Those who will not learn from history are, I guess, doomed to repeat it.
I don't dial 911, I dial .357
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Bob Emmett wrote:
So, if Greece fails, and the rest of the PIIGS, UK, ... follow suit, the economy of the USA will have to take that walk through the Market's full body scanner, and its financial impotence, too, will be revealed.
I get a kick out of economic illiterates who desperately argue that somehow, the EU is important to the U.S.'s economy. Take a walk down to your local dog pound. Check to see how many tails are wagging how many dogs. Or, to put it another way, when the U.S. catches a cold, the EU dies of pneumonia. When the EU comes down with the bubonic plague, the U.S. takes a couple of Tylenol. The only question worth asking about the IMF/Fed bailout of Europe is why, after an entire century of Europe needing the U.S. to clean up their mess, is Obama actually doing it. Those who will not learn from history are, I guess, doomed to repeat it.
I don't dial 911, I dial .357
Oakman wrote:
I get a kick out of economic illiterates who desperately argue that somehow, the EU is important to the U.S.'s economy.
Good for you, at our age we got to get our jollies wherever we can. However, I believe that my sequence started with the tip of the tail before working up to the dog. Speculators love politicians who ignore the fundamental weaknesses of their economies and shout 'bring it on'. The speculators play on those weaknesses, and always win (well, so far). I have every expectation that the Euro zone bailout will fail[^], and that the rest of the EU will follow, because nobody is addressing the real problem of debt. Nobody is addressing it in the US either. Why bother? We're recovering aren't we? The worst is over. Well, O.K., maybe a couple of years with high unemployment before the recovery really kicks in, and then, Up, Up, and Awaay. I hope so, but I fear not.
Oakman wrote:
why, after an entire century of Europe needing the U.S. to clean up their mess, is Obama actually doing it.
Because the Federal Reserve has told him to, because they have less confidence in the US economy than you do? Who knows? Audit the Fed. Mark to market. The reason may become apparent. BTW: 'Needing' is too strong. If you hadn't 'cleaned up our mess', things would have resolved themselves differently, that's all.
Oakman wrote:
Those who will not learn from history are, I guess, doomed to repeat it.
As are those who eat garlic.
Bob Emmett Proud to be an economic illiterate - when I look at where the literate have got us.
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Oakman wrote:
I get a kick out of economic illiterates who desperately argue that somehow, the EU is important to the U.S.'s economy.
Good for you, at our age we got to get our jollies wherever we can. However, I believe that my sequence started with the tip of the tail before working up to the dog. Speculators love politicians who ignore the fundamental weaknesses of their economies and shout 'bring it on'. The speculators play on those weaknesses, and always win (well, so far). I have every expectation that the Euro zone bailout will fail[^], and that the rest of the EU will follow, because nobody is addressing the real problem of debt. Nobody is addressing it in the US either. Why bother? We're recovering aren't we? The worst is over. Well, O.K., maybe a couple of years with high unemployment before the recovery really kicks in, and then, Up, Up, and Awaay. I hope so, but I fear not.
Oakman wrote:
why, after an entire century of Europe needing the U.S. to clean up their mess, is Obama actually doing it.
Because the Federal Reserve has told him to, because they have less confidence in the US economy than you do? Who knows? Audit the Fed. Mark to market. The reason may become apparent. BTW: 'Needing' is too strong. If you hadn't 'cleaned up our mess', things would have resolved themselves differently, that's all.
Oakman wrote:
Those who will not learn from history are, I guess, doomed to repeat it.
As are those who eat garlic.
Bob Emmett Proud to be an economic illiterate - when I look at where the literate have got us.
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Okay nob-head, the only sorces I have on this are not quotable due to the statements being made under 'Chatham House' rules. But what i can tell you is the the ECB and IMF have already discounted the facilty [please check up what that means, it is not a bailout] based on the risk of default. The perceived chance is obviously increased by the amount that will be drawn down. If Greece draws down it's entire facility, which is highly unlikely considering it's more than 10x what was considered the maximum they would need, the chance of default is around 30%. Yup, every euro becomes 70 cents. But those figures, which come from a lot more reliable source then you could dream of having, actually reflect how low the risks are. The huge favilities that have been provided are there so that they won't need to borrow. I know it's confusing for your little drug-addled mind, but the larger the facility the less likely they are to need to use it. If you've borrowed $100 from me and I find out you're only making 50 bucks a week, I'd be worried that you couldn't pay me back in a month as promissed, so I'd put pressure on you and you'd end up paying me early and finding you couldn't pay your crack dealer or something. Now imagine your Mom came to me and said she has $1,000 dollars and should you need some you can borrow it, do you think I would be as worried about getting my mney back?
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. or "Drink. Get drunk. Fall over." - P O'H
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Nagy Vilmos wrote:
'Chatham House' rules
I understand what you are trying to say, but even CSS can make that same claim. If he understands it (issues with google...).
Opacity, the new Transparency.
RichardM1 wrote:
but even CSS can make that same claim.
Yes, but he doesn't go to Chatham House...
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. or "Drink. Get drunk. Fall over." - P O'H