CD anti-copying technology
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David Wulff wrote: people have had to return their entire computers to Apple just because they had the nerve to try to listen to their CDs. Well Apple users should be shot anyway. Wasn't a guy going around doing that in Washington recently ? :-) Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
Colin Davies wrote: Wasn't a guy going around doing that in Washington recently ? They finally found out what all those victims had in common, eh? The perps were probably ex-helpdesk operators... "When in danger, fear, or doubt, run in circles, scream and shout!" - Lorelei and Lapis Lazuli Long
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David Wulff wrote: Do you have the enhanced version, or the standard album? Enhanced. Plus it comes with a separate DVD w/ the videos, etc. A good value, i must say - this is an *excellent* example of the sort of "value-added" merchandise music companies should be moving to. David Wulff wrote: They always state their CDs are 100% compatible with the Red Book standard, yet they clearly are not. Well, here's another interesting thing - one of the tricks used for copy protection is to include multiple audio TOCs, relying on Red Book-compatible players reading only the first, while computer (and DVD, and, actually, more and more normal players...) reading the last written one (since this allows for enhanced CD capabilities, or DATA + music). This should actually be one of the easier protection schemes to circumvent once it becomes profitable to do so... David Wulff wrote: it is about my own personal pride in upholding my belief that if I want something I have to work for it. I can't imagine climbing onto my high horse and expecting people to pay me for my own work if I turn around and steal theirs. Well, i understand your moral objection, and really hate to contradict this statement at all... ...but it's not quite correct. Stealing and copywrite violation are both generally illegal, and thus should be avoided. But they are not the same. Example: A friend of mine recently had his entire CD collection stolen. Years of collecting, poof! Gone. This is theft - the thief not only gained the ability to listen to the music, but also deprived my friend of that ability. Tonight, this friend is over here, burning CDs from my collection to replace the ones he lost. This is clearly *not* theft - even though he will regain his ability to listen to certain CDs, he is not depriving me of that ability in the process. Though it is *possible* he is breaking copywrite law. To present a more flakey situation, i rarely buy music i've not heard. In certain situations, where a band has been highly recommended, or i've liked much of their work in the past, i will take a chance, but for new releases it rarely occurs. Either i listen to a track on the radio, or i borrow a CD, or i download a track - somehow, i need to convince myself that it is worthwhile prior to putting money on the line. Once that is done, i can purchase the CD, and all is well, but if i do not like it, i won't pay for it. Is this stealing? NO!
Shog9 wrote: Stealing and copywrite violation are both generally illegal, and thus should be avoided. But they are not the same. I think the point David is making is that you steal from the *artist*, not the person who owned the original CD. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 Hey, at least Logo had, at it's inception, a mechanical turtle. VB has always lacked even that... - Shog9 04-09-2002 During last 10 years, with invention of VB and similar programming environments, every ill-educated moron became able to develop software. - Alex E. - 12-Sept-2002
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"This CD includes anti-copying technology that is intended to prevent unlawful copying of the CD with a PC. This may affect playability of the CD on certain computer devices such as PCs and gaming platforms." http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00006OA4X[^] I have ordered the CD, but seriously doubt I will be able to rip it to my media library as I found with a previous similarly protected CD, in which case I need some help finding all the tracks on one of these p2p network thingies everyone is talking about. Although I have an old hi-fi that will play CD's, it couldn't play the other protected one and I do not use it purely because I cannot play the tracks as part of a custom playlist and CDs get damaged very quickly if they are constantly being shuffled about. How fucked up is that? I have to steal the music I am paying for in order to be able to listen to it while the CD rots on my shelf! :mad: :mad: :mad: Why the hell did they choose to do this to this particular release? None of the label's other recent releases have been polluted like this as far as I can see. Go figure. The sad thing is that by buying the CD I am telling the companies involved that this protection works, which is the last bloody thing I want, but then I need the album in order to legally listen to the music; and my stance on the latter will not change. As Macbeth knows, murder leads to murder, and I don't want to step onto that ladder. Does anyone want to take my bet that the RIAA is ultimately responsible for this shit? :| My poppy's real pissed off.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
Rememberance knows no boundaries. Wear a poppy and uphold the silence: 10/11-Nov-2002
David Wulff wrote: The sad thing is that by buying the CD I am telling the companies involved that this protection works, which is the last bloody thing I want Dont buy the CD, download the songs and send whatever the CD cost with a little note telling why to the record company. Mayby not entirely legal but at least you dont contribute to the sell of one more copy protected CD. /Magnus
- I don't necessarily agree with everything I say
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Shog9 wrote: Stealing and copywrite violation are both generally illegal, and thus should be avoided. But they are not the same. I think the point David is making is that you steal from the *artist*, not the person who owned the original CD. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 Hey, at least Logo had, at it's inception, a mechanical turtle. VB has always lacked even that... - Shog9 04-09-2002 During last 10 years, with invention of VB and similar programming environments, every ill-educated moron became able to develop software. - Alex E. - 12-Sept-2002
It's a very hazy area. I've seen studys that "show" that the current decline in CD sales is directly attributable to the closing of Napster (I.e. when people could listen to all sorts of music for free, they'd go out and buy more CDs because of it) The biggest problem with copy protected CDs is that they're instantly calling everyone a pirate. Wanting to have your music in mp3 format isn't illegal - it's giving the mp3s to people who don't have the right to them that is. I have no idea where the law would stand in the case of making a copy when your original has been lost or stolen, but "you're allowed to make a single copy for backup purposes" is a fairly standard clause in smallprint of media. -- Help me! I'm turning into a grapefruit!
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David, if you don't want it don't buy it or get it. Also I'm surprised this idea really works ? I'm sure you could make a physical player that could rip it. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
All it takes with current copy protection is for someone to produce a hacked flash image for the CD-ROM drive which ignores the false errors generated.... Then its just like flashing your DVD-ROM drive to remove region protection (not that I would suggest anyone do this ;P ) Would you like to meet my teddy bear ?
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"This CD includes anti-copying technology that is intended to prevent unlawful copying of the CD with a PC. This may affect playability of the CD on certain computer devices such as PCs and gaming platforms." http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00006OA4X[^] I have ordered the CD, but seriously doubt I will be able to rip it to my media library as I found with a previous similarly protected CD, in which case I need some help finding all the tracks on one of these p2p network thingies everyone is talking about. Although I have an old hi-fi that will play CD's, it couldn't play the other protected one and I do not use it purely because I cannot play the tracks as part of a custom playlist and CDs get damaged very quickly if they are constantly being shuffled about. How fucked up is that? I have to steal the music I am paying for in order to be able to listen to it while the CD rots on my shelf! :mad: :mad: :mad: Why the hell did they choose to do this to this particular release? None of the label's other recent releases have been polluted like this as far as I can see. Go figure. The sad thing is that by buying the CD I am telling the companies involved that this protection works, which is the last bloody thing I want, but then I need the album in order to legally listen to the music; and my stance on the latter will not change. As Macbeth knows, murder leads to murder, and I don't want to step onto that ladder. Does anyone want to take my bet that the RIAA is ultimately responsible for this shit? :| My poppy's real pissed off.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
Rememberance knows no boundaries. Wear a poppy and uphold the silence: 10/11-Nov-2002
I'm confused. I have this album (excellent by the way) and I can play it just fine on my PC.
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
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I'm confused. I have this album (excellent by the way) and I can play it just fine on my PC.
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
Apparently there are three versions floaiting round the stores in the UK: 1) Normal uninfected CDs 2) Infected but still working CDs 3) Infected and crippled CDs You have either got (1) or else (2) and your CD ROM drive is lucky enough to be able to play it.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
Rememberance knows no boundaries. Wear a poppy and uphold the silence: 10/11-Nov-2002
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Apparently there are three versions floaiting round the stores in the UK: 1) Normal uninfected CDs 2) Infected but still working CDs 3) Infected and crippled CDs You have either got (1) or else (2) and your CD ROM drive is lucky enough to be able to play it.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
Rememberance knows no boundaries. Wear a poppy and uphold the silence: 10/11-Nov-2002
My version was purchased from 101cd.com if you are interested in it - it cost me 8 quid which is excellent. Both the CD and DVD work fine in my 2 year old HP drive.
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
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Apparently there are three versions floaiting round the stores in the UK: 1) Normal uninfected CDs 2) Infected but still working CDs 3) Infected and crippled CDs You have either got (1) or else (2) and your CD ROM drive is lucky enough to be able to play it.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
Rememberance knows no boundaries. Wear a poppy and uphold the silence: 10/11-Nov-2002
David Wulff wrote: You have either got (1) or else (2) and your CD ROM drive is lucky enough to be able to play it Have you tried the magic marker trick David?
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaRay Cassick wrote:
Well I am not female, not gay and I am not Paul Watson -
"This CD includes anti-copying technology that is intended to prevent unlawful copying of the CD with a PC. This may affect playability of the CD on certain computer devices such as PCs and gaming platforms." http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00006OA4X[^] I have ordered the CD, but seriously doubt I will be able to rip it to my media library as I found with a previous similarly protected CD, in which case I need some help finding all the tracks on one of these p2p network thingies everyone is talking about. Although I have an old hi-fi that will play CD's, it couldn't play the other protected one and I do not use it purely because I cannot play the tracks as part of a custom playlist and CDs get damaged very quickly if they are constantly being shuffled about. How fucked up is that? I have to steal the music I am paying for in order to be able to listen to it while the CD rots on my shelf! :mad: :mad: :mad: Why the hell did they choose to do this to this particular release? None of the label's other recent releases have been polluted like this as far as I can see. Go figure. The sad thing is that by buying the CD I am telling the companies involved that this protection works, which is the last bloody thing I want, but then I need the album in order to legally listen to the music; and my stance on the latter will not change. As Macbeth knows, murder leads to murder, and I don't want to step onto that ladder. Does anyone want to take my bet that the RIAA is ultimately responsible for this shit? :| My poppy's real pissed off.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
Rememberance knows no boundaries. Wear a poppy and uphold the silence: 10/11-Nov-2002
David, Can you play the CD on your computer or not? If you can, then you should be able to rip it by recording straight from your "System Mixer". I use MusicMatch[^] to do that. Another way is by hooking up your stereo to your sound card's Line Input and recording from that. MusicMatch can do that too. Regards, Alvaro
Well done is better than well said. -- Benjamin Franklin
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"This CD includes anti-copying technology that is intended to prevent unlawful copying of the CD with a PC. This may affect playability of the CD on certain computer devices such as PCs and gaming platforms." http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00006OA4X[^] I have ordered the CD, but seriously doubt I will be able to rip it to my media library as I found with a previous similarly protected CD, in which case I need some help finding all the tracks on one of these p2p network thingies everyone is talking about. Although I have an old hi-fi that will play CD's, it couldn't play the other protected one and I do not use it purely because I cannot play the tracks as part of a custom playlist and CDs get damaged very quickly if they are constantly being shuffled about. How fucked up is that? I have to steal the music I am paying for in order to be able to listen to it while the CD rots on my shelf! :mad: :mad: :mad: Why the hell did they choose to do this to this particular release? None of the label's other recent releases have been polluted like this as far as I can see. Go figure. The sad thing is that by buying the CD I am telling the companies involved that this protection works, which is the last bloody thing I want, but then I need the album in order to legally listen to the music; and my stance on the latter will not change. As Macbeth knows, murder leads to murder, and I don't want to step onto that ladder. Does anyone want to take my bet that the RIAA is ultimately responsible for this shit? :| My poppy's real pissed off.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
Rememberance knows no boundaries. Wear a poppy and uphold the silence: 10/11-Nov-2002
The whole thing is a massive can of worms. My wife works for Sony UK and this sort of thing generates lots of calls from confused/disgruntled users. Things are not helped by the fact that on the one hand Sony are promoting consumer products that allow you to rip CDs, whereas their publishing arm want to discourage it! Personally I'd take the CD back and demand a refund - only consumerism can combat this form of "protection".
When I am king, you will be first against the wall.
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Colin Davies wrote: David, if you don't want it don't buy it or get it. But I do want it - I have heard some of those tracks on the radio and liked them enough to fork out another nine quid for the album. I'm not going to sacrifice good music purely because some CEO's sat roudna table at a board meeting thought they could cripple illegal ripping. Figures have since shown an increase in sales of... wait for it... zero percent, yet they still insist on doing this? If it will rip in WMP9 then it doesn't matter to me either how, I don't care if it puts restrictions on it, just so long as I can get it on a playlist. Colin Davies wrote: Also I'm surprised this idea really works ? They add artificial digital noise to the "ripable" music that supposedly can't be heard by human ears, but it sucessfull on seriously fucking up Apples Macs - some people have had to return their entire computers to Apple just because they had the nerve to try to listen to their CDs. :omg: That's assuming your CD player / CD-ROM drive will even read the CD - lots wont recognise it. Colin Davies wrote: I'm sure you could make a physical player that could rip it. Sadly out of reach to people like me. I can barely add two and two to make five four. More to the point - why should I need to?
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
Rememberance knows no boundaries. Wear a poppy and uphold the silence: 10/11-Nov-2002