So you think your life is sucky...
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This pretty decent guy who works with us has run into some bad luck of late. His wife is pregnant and due in December. He just told me they are no longer living together. He was supposed to come into work on Saturday to finish some stuff up. He arrived late and explained his car had been stolen on Friday evening. He then arranged to come in on Sunday to finish up, but phones me on Sunday and tells me that his motorbike, which he just bought, has siezed up. And you know what? He actually said "Paul I am sorry I could not get the work done, I tried but..." I wanted to shake him and yell "For fucks sake man I understand! Don't worry, we are not going to fire you because of a few missed hours because your life is upside down. Go, go sort things out and if you need us we are here for you!" Plus while he is a bit grim when no one is looking, he smiles and is trying his damndest to sort things out. What a trooper. While I really should not complain... here I am, just 23 years old, trying to fulfill the wild promises of our salesmen and trying to counsel a 28 year old who looks up to me as his boss. The next time any developer bitches about managers not doing anything and being worthless I can easily retort that you have no leg to stand on, we do a lot that you never see and thou shalt be grateful for it. So that was my Sunday evening sermo... rant. :-D
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Thank you Uncle Paul! :cool: Seriously though: I absolutely don't know him, but is there a remote chance he's on alcohol? Please don't get me wrong. I know I'm oversensitive on this topic. Just I know this "I'll do that I promise!" / "I couldn't 'cause lightning struck" sequence all to well. :rose: Peter
skulls don't kiss for an explanation - wait for the vacation photos! [sighist]
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Sounds like you guys are in need of a VPN :-D Life changing for all concerned.
I knew it would end badly when I first met Chris in a Canberra alleyway and he said 'try some - it won't hurt you'..... - Christian Graus on Code Project outages
Megan Forbes wrote: Sounds like you guys are in need of a VPN As in Virtual Private Network?
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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Michael A. Barnhart wrote: Yes it really does not take that much effort to find some much worse off than your typically petty problems. Yeah, I did not mean to say our problems are not worthless or petty. I guess perspective is fine up to a point, once you get to dying AIDs orphans enough is enough, life is relative. I actually just wanted to rant :-D Michael A. Barnhart wrote: I definitely will not bitch about my manager. (Yes 10 years younger than me) but he knows how to get the right attention when there is a problem and quickly learns the quirks of his people. Which he then handles with out asking most of the time. A great man (Thanks Russ C.) I need a "So you have no clue how to be a loved manager then? Right, read this" book :) I just want to be fair, let everyone have fun, get the job done and see to it that we all get rewarded. I have so much to learn! Michael A. Barnhart wrote: Now man may be able to make it for a while (tomorrow morning) but wife and daughter do not like the idea. LOL, it takes a big man not to scream out "Well if you are so bloody smart, fix it yourself!" and then go hit the bottle. One day, when I have a wife and kids and a house with bad plumbing, I will be sure to remember to sympathise with your story :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: actually just wanted to rant Understood. It is much better than some alternatives. "I will find a new sig someday."
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Michael A. Barnhart wrote: Yes it really does not take that much effort to find some much worse off than your typically petty problems. Yeah, I did not mean to say our problems are not worthless or petty. I guess perspective is fine up to a point, once you get to dying AIDs orphans enough is enough, life is relative. I actually just wanted to rant :-D Michael A. Barnhart wrote: I definitely will not bitch about my manager. (Yes 10 years younger than me) but he knows how to get the right attention when there is a problem and quickly learns the quirks of his people. Which he then handles with out asking most of the time. A great man (Thanks Russ C.) I need a "So you have no clue how to be a loved manager then? Right, read this" book :) I just want to be fair, let everyone have fun, get the job done and see to it that we all get rewarded. I have so much to learn! Michael A. Barnhart wrote: Now man may be able to make it for a while (tomorrow morning) but wife and daughter do not like the idea. LOL, it takes a big man not to scream out "Well if you are so bloody smart, fix it yourself!" and then go hit the bottle. One day, when I have a wife and kids and a house with bad plumbing, I will be sure to remember to sympathise with your story :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: I need a "So you have no clue how to be a loved manager then? Right, read this" book Well, here in the states many instructional firms have a one day class that groups can go and take together (at your companies location.) The course is about personality types. The one I went to (not in my group but wish it had been.) was called "How to work with the impossible person." I would highly recommend the effort if you can for any team of people. By the way, YOU are the impossible person. As for books one good one was "Herding Cats". "I will find a new sig someday."
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Thank you Uncle Paul! :cool: Seriously though: I absolutely don't know him, but is there a remote chance he's on alcohol? Please don't get me wrong. I know I'm oversensitive on this topic. Just I know this "I'll do that I promise!" / "I couldn't 'cause lightning struck" sequence all to well. :rose: Peter
skulls don't kiss for an explanation - wait for the vacation photos! [sighist]
peterchen wrote: but is there a remote chance he's on alcohol? Naaah, he is a decent guy. He does not beat his wife or come to work drunk. He is taking it all on the chin like a real man, a good guy :) peterchen wrote: Just I know this "I'll do that I promise!" / "I couldn't 'cause lightning struck" sequence all to well. If I understand you right then I totally agree. We are not running, nor can afford to be, a charity. So if someone is not pulling their weight they go, part of the deal. We used to have a girl working for us who was perpetually sick, depressed and "unfairly treated by life." For awhile we were very supportive, went out of our way to help her and accomodate her. Eventually though we, and she, realised she brought it all on herself and that she needed time out to sort her life out. I am a firm believer of "you cause most of your own ills." Controversial or not I have experienced enough to think it is true. I hope to god this new guy is not in the same boat. I don't think so, time will tell though. Sometimes I wish I could just run a damned charity, but really it won't be helping anyone, it would just be solving the effect, not the cause.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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Paul Watson wrote: actually just wanted to rant Understood. It is much better than some alternatives. "I will find a new sig someday."
Michael A. Barnhart wrote: It is much better than some alternatives. Yeah, you should really not take things out on your toilet Michael... ;) Seriously though a good "get it off your chest" session is very beneficial. We all have those "voices" screaming blue murder in our heads that need to be let out, so preferably a few kb of text and some good guys (you guys) time, rather than the bottle or taking it out on wife and kids.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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Yes it really does not take that much effort to find some much worse off than your typically petty problems. I definitely will not bitch about my manager. (Yes 10 years younger than me) but he knows how to get the right attention when there is a problem and quickly learns the quirks of his people. Which he then handles with out asking most of the time. A great man (Thanks Russ C.) I almost posted my Friday which although trivial was definitely frustrating at the time. I will now share so we can have a laugh. Thursday night my wife flushes a lid from an aerosol can down the bowl. It gets past the trap but hangs up at the seal on the floor. OK no big deal, un bolt the bowl from the floor lift it all up, clean it out and put a new wax ring down (right) Well the pluming was not placed right. So when I put the new ring down I used one with a guard molded in. Well that 1/8 inch was to mush so when the bowl was placed back on the floor the tank hit the wall to hard and broke the seal between it and bowl (but I did not realize it then.) Second trip to the hardware store and get a different seal. Pull it up, put the seal in and reinstall. First flush and water is pouring from the back. Back to the hardware store, get a third wax seal and a kit for the tank. Now just guess, if you had done this job in the first place you probably did not check the hardware you used for the tank and bowl right:mad::mad:!) Well they used some cheap cast metal wing nuts that have very much corroded. With just my hand the wings break off. I now have to hack saw them off on both sides. With the location restricting my access to only allow about a 1/4 inch travel for each stoke. Finally reinstall the bowl, next put the tank on. (Remember it hitting the wall?) Well the original installation was jury-rigged to bolt the tank on so it was at an angle. With the stock kit the tank is flush and will not seat right. Next flush water out the back again. Back to the hardware store (a different one) and yes they have extra thick seals for the tank (oh goody) get it and reinstall that tank. Well that angle that the tank has to be at to mount on the bowl is to much even for the extra thick seal (it is 1.125 inches thick and the one removed is 1.75! and no longer made.) Water still out the back. It has now been over 6 hours and no usable water closet (is that proper English?) Now man may be able to make it for a while (tomorrow morning) but wife and daughter do not like the idea. A plus here is they both let me be in a very grumpy moo
LOL!!! Been there, done that, and the t-shirt is soaked! I recall spending an entire weekend adding an upstairs bathroom the wife absolutely had to have. Not a minor challenge in a 40-year old house... After building the wall, plumbing out the whole wall for the fixtures, and dragging the one-piece tub/shower unit up two filghts of stairs and installing it, I finally had everything ready to test. When the water came on I'd swear that every single joint leaked! If you've ever had the pleasure of trying to tighten an installed set of pipes (the old-fashioned steel kind) in the wall while on hands and knees in cold water on a snowy day you know what the joy of DIY plumbing is all about! The next time the thing leaks, replace the whole thing - it will save hours of misery!:-D "When in danger, fear, or doubt, run in circles, scream and shout!" - Lorelei and Lapis Lazuli Long
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Paul Watson wrote: I need a "So you have no clue how to be a loved manager then? Right, read this" book Well, here in the states many instructional firms have a one day class that groups can go and take together (at your companies location.) The course is about personality types. The one I went to (not in my group but wish it had been.) was called "How to work with the impossible person." I would highly recommend the effort if you can for any team of people. By the way, YOU are the impossible person. As for books one good one was "Herding Cats". "I will find a new sig someday."
Michael A. Barnhart wrote: By the way, YOU are the impossible person. LOL I read that wrong the first time (I hope so... lol) Thanks for the recommendations though :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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Christian Graus wrote: Maybe the Sat/Sun work is why his wife is moving out ? Probably. Any job theat requires 5-7 days a week work puts to much strain on a relationship. My wife always complains that I work to much and I'm virtually unemployed or working from home. (subtle difference) Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
Colin Davies wrote: Probably. Any job theat requires 5-7 days a week work puts to much strain on a relationship. As I said to Christian I try my damndest not to give my guys more than is reasonable. If they however don't focus and end up at the end of the day with work left to do then they need to stay in and get it done. All part of the deal they agreed to. We even let them set the deadlines and expectations, so there are no excuses if they come up short. Being an experienced man, Colin, you must have some good tips on the art of balancing work against resources. While having a jol and being a great boss is nice and all we also need to remember there is a job to do.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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Megan Forbes wrote: Sounds like you guys are in need of a VPN As in Virtual Private Network?
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Yeah, I love it, work from home, check work email from home, etc, etc :cool:
I knew it would end badly when I first met Chris in a Canberra alleyway and he said 'try some - it won't hurt you'..... - Christian Graus on Code Project outages
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Michael A. Barnhart wrote: By the way, YOU are the impossible person. LOL I read that wrong the first time (I hope so... lol) Thanks for the recommendations though :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
It was not you Paul, It was YOU the class attendee:) "I will find a new sig someday."
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Yeah, I love it, work from home, check work email from home, etc, etc :cool:
I knew it would end badly when I first met Chris in a Canberra alleyway and he said 'try some - it won't hurt you'..... - Christian Graus on Code Project outages
Megan Forbes wrote: Yeah, I love it, work from home, check work email from home, etc, etc I can just imagine trying to setup VPNs to employees houses over Telkom lines. Endless excuse fodder as to why work was not done :-D Plus I think the whole team comraderie, company spirit is enhanced when we are all crammed into a tiny loft in 40 degree weather with no aircon... :-D
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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Colin Davies wrote: Probably. Any job theat requires 5-7 days a week work puts to much strain on a relationship. As I said to Christian I try my damndest not to give my guys more than is reasonable. If they however don't focus and end up at the end of the day with work left to do then they need to stay in and get it done. All part of the deal they agreed to. We even let them set the deadlines and expectations, so there are no excuses if they come up short. Being an experienced man, Colin, you must have some good tips on the art of balancing work against resources. While having a jol and being a great boss is nice and all we also need to remember there is a job to do.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: If they however don't focus and end up at the end of the day with work left to do then they need to stay in and get it done. Paul Watson wrote: While having a jol and being a great boss is nice and all we also need to remember there is a job to do. I agree with all of this, but often our better halves do not see it that way. My wife is thankfully very understanding, but even she goes a bit feral when I need to work on a weekend for no extra pay. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 Hey, at least Logo had, at it's inception, a mechanical turtle. VB has always lacked even that... - Shog9 04-09-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
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Christian Graus wrote: Maybe the Sat/Sun work is why his wife is moving out ? Well she kicked him out and things were sticky before he started working here. But I am always careful to set the right amount of work to ensure he can get it done within working hours. Just with all his problems he often has to say late to get what he should have had done by close of day, done. I don't mind working all hours and slogging through insane deadlines, but I don't expect it of guys I give work to. If they ask for more or want in on it like I have, then they can have more than they can handle. I think he and she though will get back together, it is mainly a case of them having gotten married way too young and needing some breathing room. I am sure when you had your first child you were a bit nervous and harried :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: Just with all his problems he often has to say late to get what he should have had done by close of day, done. I'm not suggesting you should do otherwise, your job as a manager is to manage, his job as a dev is to get the code written so that it is of an acceptable quality, within a given timeframe. However, as I said above, our partners often don't get that. That is not your problem, nor should you let a project run out late because of it, but it's the way things can be. Note to Megan, Lauren, etc: do you find it the same with your partners ? I presume it's a non-IT worker thing, not a chick thing. Paul Watson wrote: I am sure when you had your first child you were a bit nervous and harried I guess really the problem is that some have the child to 'fix' their relationship. A child ATTACKS your relationship, it needs to be rock solid in order to stand the shock. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 Hey, at least Logo had, at it's inception, a mechanical turtle. VB has always lacked even that... - Shog9 04-09-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
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Sounds like you guys are in need of a VPN :-D Life changing for all concerned.
I knew it would end badly when I first met Chris in a Canberra alleyway and he said 'try some - it won't hurt you'..... - Christian Graus on Code Project outages
Working from home is WORSE IMO, because you're there, and they expect you to be at their beck and call, as if you were not working at all. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 Hey, at least Logo had, at it's inception, a mechanical turtle. VB has always lacked even that... - Shog9 04-09-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
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Yes it really does not take that much effort to find some much worse off than your typically petty problems. I definitely will not bitch about my manager. (Yes 10 years younger than me) but he knows how to get the right attention when there is a problem and quickly learns the quirks of his people. Which he then handles with out asking most of the time. A great man (Thanks Russ C.) I almost posted my Friday which although trivial was definitely frustrating at the time. I will now share so we can have a laugh. Thursday night my wife flushes a lid from an aerosol can down the bowl. It gets past the trap but hangs up at the seal on the floor. OK no big deal, un bolt the bowl from the floor lift it all up, clean it out and put a new wax ring down (right) Well the pluming was not placed right. So when I put the new ring down I used one with a guard molded in. Well that 1/8 inch was to mush so when the bowl was placed back on the floor the tank hit the wall to hard and broke the seal between it and bowl (but I did not realize it then.) Second trip to the hardware store and get a different seal. Pull it up, put the seal in and reinstall. First flush and water is pouring from the back. Back to the hardware store, get a third wax seal and a kit for the tank. Now just guess, if you had done this job in the first place you probably did not check the hardware you used for the tank and bowl right:mad::mad:!) Well they used some cheap cast metal wing nuts that have very much corroded. With just my hand the wings break off. I now have to hack saw them off on both sides. With the location restricting my access to only allow about a 1/4 inch travel for each stoke. Finally reinstall the bowl, next put the tank on. (Remember it hitting the wall?) Well the original installation was jury-rigged to bolt the tank on so it was at an angle. With the stock kit the tank is flush and will not seat right. Next flush water out the back again. Back to the hardware store (a different one) and yes they have extra thick seals for the tank (oh goody) get it and reinstall that tank. Well that angle that the tank has to be at to mount on the bowl is to much even for the extra thick seal (it is 1.125 inches thick and the one removed is 1.75! and no longer made.) Water still out the back. It has now been over 6 hours and no usable water closet (is that proper English?) Now man may be able to make it for a while (tomorrow morning) but wife and daughter do not like the idea. A plus here is they both let me be in a very grumpy moo
Michael A. Barnhart wrote: and no usable water closet (is that proper English?) I never hear anyone call it that. I hear loo, dunny, even porcelain palace, but never 'water closet'. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 Hey, at least Logo had, at it's inception, a mechanical turtle. VB has always lacked even that... - Shog9 04-09-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
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Christian Graus wrote: Maybe the Sat/Sun work is why his wife is moving out ? Probably. Any job theat requires 5-7 days a week work puts to much strain on a relationship. My wife always complains that I work to much and I'm virtually unemployed or working from home. (subtle difference) Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
Colin Davies wrote: I'm virtually unemployed or working from home. Yikes, how do you manage to work from home? I'd find it very difficult to relax at night if my workplace was also my home.
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
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This pretty decent guy who works with us has run into some bad luck of late. His wife is pregnant and due in December. He just told me they are no longer living together. He was supposed to come into work on Saturday to finish some stuff up. He arrived late and explained his car had been stolen on Friday evening. He then arranged to come in on Sunday to finish up, but phones me on Sunday and tells me that his motorbike, which he just bought, has siezed up. And you know what? He actually said "Paul I am sorry I could not get the work done, I tried but..." I wanted to shake him and yell "For fucks sake man I understand! Don't worry, we are not going to fire you because of a few missed hours because your life is upside down. Go, go sort things out and if you need us we are here for you!" Plus while he is a bit grim when no one is looking, he smiles and is trying his damndest to sort things out. What a trooper. While I really should not complain... here I am, just 23 years old, trying to fulfill the wild promises of our salesmen and trying to counsel a 28 year old who looks up to me as his boss. The next time any developer bitches about managers not doing anything and being worthless I can easily retort that you have no leg to stand on, we do a lot that you never see and thou shalt be grateful for it. So that was my Sunday evening sermo... rant. :-D
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: The next time any developer bitches about managers not doing anything and being worthless I can easily retort that you have no leg to stand on, we do a lot that you never see and thou shalt be grateful for it. Ummmmm.... maybe you do, but my manager is worthless!! ;P ;P Mike Mullikin :beer:
Well, I'm sure I'd feel much worse if I weren't under such heavy sedation. - David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
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peterchen wrote: but is there a remote chance he's on alcohol? Naaah, he is a decent guy. He does not beat his wife or come to work drunk. He is taking it all on the chin like a real man, a good guy :) peterchen wrote: Just I know this "I'll do that I promise!" / "I couldn't 'cause lightning struck" sequence all to well. If I understand you right then I totally agree. We are not running, nor can afford to be, a charity. So if someone is not pulling their weight they go, part of the deal. We used to have a girl working for us who was perpetually sick, depressed and "unfairly treated by life." For awhile we were very supportive, went out of our way to help her and accomodate her. Eventually though we, and she, realised she brought it all on herself and that she needed time out to sort her life out. I am a firm believer of "you cause most of your own ills." Controversial or not I have experienced enough to think it is true. I hope to god this new guy is not in the same boat. I don't think so, time will tell though. Sometimes I wish I could just run a damned charity, but really it won't be helping anyone, it would just be solving the effect, not the cause.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: He does not beat his wife or come to work drunk. people can be on the bottle for years without anyone noticing. But I don't want to press it on or talk you into something - just keep an eye open for me, will ya? ;) Paul Watson wrote: you cause most of your own ills Mostly yes - and I fully agree in the sense that it's how you handle your ills. Too much outside support is as bad as no support at all. When life gets rough, character grows - but with everybody paving the road for you, you get nowhere. "Challenged" people need to live up to the same (relative) standard as others. Many tend to use their challenge as a protective shield, and many show a little bit too much understanding. Straight white males with house, wife, and 11/2 childs have to get up monday morning too. Which reminds me - time to go to bed ;)
skulls don't kiss for an explanation - wait for the vacation photos! [sighist]
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Colin Davies wrote: Probably. Any job theat requires 5-7 days a week work puts to much strain on a relationship. As I said to Christian I try my damndest not to give my guys more than is reasonable. If they however don't focus and end up at the end of the day with work left to do then they need to stay in and get it done. All part of the deal they agreed to. We even let them set the deadlines and expectations, so there are no excuses if they come up short. Being an experienced man, Colin, you must have some good tips on the art of balancing work against resources. While having a jol and being a great boss is nice and all we also need to remember there is a job to do.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul, my comment wasn't directed striaght at P Watson or Blue Grass, but at the industry. Paul Watson wrote: Being an experienced man, Colin, you must have some good tips on the art of balancing work against resources. Thats impossible Paul. (let me explain) The factors required are constantly changing. It's simply a fact that the software development industry needs people to work more than the standard number of hours per week. Could you oneday monitor your employees to see how many real hours work they put in. I'd be surprised if they could manage a 50% rate of productive work per hour. If you could figure out how to make people more productive for each hour spent working, you'd be onto a good thing. Some factors that can help this, are improved working environment and larger monitors. But there are limitations. Forced breaks in the workplace can also relieve stress thus enhancing productivity. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.