White German Shepherds

[Paul Riley]

Okay guys, I'm frustrated by this and someone here usually manages to help out when I can't solve a problem; though this one is slightly out of the ordinary, let's give it a go... I'm hunting desperately for a White German Shephard puppy in the UK. A few years ago I met a group at a local fair who bred them but I lost the phone number by the time I was ready to consider buying. I've been doing some research for about 6 months now. As I understand it, the white tone is a recessive genetic thing and often impure (most White GSDs grow up to develop a slight biscuit colour - this is of no interest to me, I'll take it pure white or otherwise). Rumour has it that if a white one pops up in a litter of "normal" GSDs, a disreputable dealer will often have them put down quietly and a good breeder will sell them on privately without registering them with the kennel clubs (both preserving their reputation as a breeder and removing the white from the breeding gene pool). In other words, they are generally considered runts, but I believe that there are groups worldwide who are lobbying to have white GSDs recognised as a seperate breed and thus available for shows and competitions. Unfortunately, many of the white GSD breeders that I hear about are as harsh with trying to breed a pure white as other GSD breeders are trying to remove white from the gene pool. I've completely run out of places to look for more information and for a reputable breeder that has a white GSD puppy. I don't want one from the RSPCA - colour me immoral but it's really important to me to get a dog with a breeding history, even if it has no kennel club papers. So I'm wondering if anyone here has the faintest idea where to go next? I'm willing to travel anywhere in the UK but I'm not willing to put a dog through quarantine, so breeders abroad are no use (though information from abroad would be great). Paul Pleasently caving in, I come undone - Queens of the Stone Age, No One Knows

[Chris Austin]

Hey Paul, On the weekends here I volunteer with a local Doberman rescue organization. I have also picked up a few ideas and concerns from seeing a vet almost weekly. First, are these White German Shephards white because of the gentic defect Albinism? If so, I would suggest you steer entirely clear of these poor animals if you intend to breed. I have worked with an Albino dog here and she was constantly ill. The vets around here tell me that dogs born with these defects suffer many health problems and typically die quite young. I don't know about the UK, but im many states here in the US intentional breeding of these animals is illegal. Fill me with your knowledge, your wisdom, your coffee.

[Megan Forbes]

This[^] is rather concerning, although one person's bad experience might not mean much. Unfortunately people are more likely to post about bad than good, so there may be loads of happy white german shepard owners out there who haven't said anything on the web. In nature however being albino is usually a weakness, despite looking very nice to us. We spotted a white leopard on our farm once, but never again. Hunting in white can't be easy, and I doubt it survived long. :( Still, if you do find one, good luck :rose:

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A pack of geeks, pale and skinny, feeling a bit pumped and macho after a morning of strenuous mouse clicking and dragging, arriving en masse at the gym. They carefully reset the machines to the lowest settings, offer to spot for each other on the 5 lb dumbells, and rediscover the art of macrame while attempting to jump rope. -Roger Wright on my colleagues and I going to gym each day at lunch

[Paul Riley]

Sorry guys, I should have explained. White GSDs are not Albino, they're actually no different from black and tan GSDs but with white/biscuit fur. They've crossbred much like humans with different hair and as with humans the ones with the regressive gene (blond in humans, white in GSDs) have become much less common but they keep appearing where two parents with the gene regressed meet. Thanks for your comment though, Chris. Good advice. Paul Pleasently caving in, I come undone - Queens of the Stone Age, No One Knows

[Paul Riley]

Megan Forbes wrote: This[^] is rather concerning I see what you mean and I've seen other comments to that effect. But I've seen five times as many comments saying what lovely pets they make. I still have some scars from meeting an overly aggressive black and tan GSD as a child, but I grew up with a black and tan myself and he wouldn't hurt anyone beyond grabbing their arm and holding on if he felt they were a threat to any of us. Dogs are dogs and big dogs are dangerous, you have to be careful of the breeder. Some breed for obedience, some as worker dogs... buy either of these and don't give them the aggressive outlet they need and you're in trouble. Go to a breeder who breeds for personality and health and you're likely to end up with a damn good pet. This is exactly why I refuse to go to the RSPCA, even though I respect everything they do. For a spaniel maybe, for a GSD never. Unfortunately, all I can find is people who have tried to breed for pure whiteness and that's too much of a risk for me. To be honest, the main reason I originally wanted a White GSD is because there's less agressive stigma attached. I want my dog to be able to run free on a public park, but I remember the looks I used to get letting my old b/t GSD off its leash. That's why the impure biscuit colour is unimportant to me. I may have to give in and take a black and tan in the end though; there is a breeder 5 miles from me who breeds for personality and health. I would have given in a couple of months ago but for the rough treatment white GSDs seem to get - I may seem like a heartless bastard sometimes but I like animals more than people :-D Megan Forbes wrote: We spotted a white leopard on our farm once, but never again. Hunting in white can't be easy, and I doubt it survived long Hunting in white in the snow is probably a bonus, at least until your bladder gets the better of you :-D. Paul Pleasently caving in, I come undone - Queens of the Stone Age, No One Knows

[Megan Forbes]

Paul Riley wrote: Hunting in white in the snow is probably a bonus, at least until your bladder gets the better of you Lol - true, but in South Africa it could lead to trouble! We once spotted an albino springbok in the Kalahari as well - on that orange sand it really stuck out like a sore thumb! I wonder if it reached adulthood poor thing.

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A pack of geeks, pale and skinny, feeling a bit pumped and macho after a morning of strenuous mouse clicking and dragging, arriving en masse at the gym. They carefully reset the machines to the lowest settings, offer to spot for each other on the 5 lb dumbells, and rediscover the art of macrame while attempting to jump rope. -Roger Wright on my colleagues and I going to gym each day at lunch

[Paul Riley]

Megan Forbes wrote: Lol - true, but in South Africa it could lead to trouble! Point taken. Not a whole lot of snow to hide against, is there? :laugh: Megan Forbes wrote: We once spotted an albino springbok in the Kalahari as well - on that orange sand it really stuck out like a sore thumb! I wonder if it reached adulthood poor thing. Awww, can't help visualising that. I'll bet it had to become real tough real quick, that's for sure. Paul Pleasently caving in, I come undone - Queens of the Stone Age, No One Knows

[Fredrik Skog]

Paul Riley wrote: To be honest, the main reason I originally wanted a White GSD is because there's less agressive stigma attached. I want my dog to be able to run free on a public park, but I remember the looks I used to get letting my old b/t GSD off its leash. That's why the impure biscuit colour is unimportant to me. I think this is the wrong reason to get a white one. Going for one with the normal colour is much better, since you would have much more to choose from, and can then easily find a mentally stable branch. It can also make all the difference how you train/raise your dog. If you let it know you are the leader of the herd, then there are almost never any problems. Problems arise when weak-minded people let the dogs take control. Cheers, Fredrik
"Felix qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas."

[Paul Riley]

Fredrik Skog wrote: I think this is the wrong reason to get a white one. Going for one with the normal colour is much better, since you would have much more to choose from, and can then easily find a mentally stable branch. Interesting predicament when you think about it, huh? Get a white one and increase the likelyhood of ending up with a psychotic dog or buy a black and tan and have everyone assume that it's psychotic regardless :rolleyes: Fredrik Skog wrote: It can also make all the difference how you train/raise your dog. Oh yes, absolutely. Even a well-bred dog not trained well is going to be a problem. I would agree with you strongly there. But a working dog can be completely untrainable as a pet. Paul Pleasently caving in, I come undone - Queens of the Stone Age, No One Knows