OK, this pisses me off

brianwelsch

I feel any country has the right to sell weapons it develops. Just like any country has a right to defend itself. BW "We get general information and specific information, but none of the specific information talks about time, place or methods or means..." - Tom Ridge - US Secretary of Homeland Security

Rohit Sinha

I agree, but this is how it is in this part of the world. Developed and developing.
Regards,

Rohit Sinha

Character is like a tree, and reputation like its shadow. The shadow is what we think of it; the tree is the real thing.
- Abraham Lincoln

The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going.
- Anonymous

Rohit Sinha

Thanks Brian, I think so too, but then weapons are weapons, not some normal commercial stuff, and that's why we need to be more careful about what we are exporting and to whom. Rights are OK, but you also need to exercise your judgement properly.
Regards,

Rohit Sinha

Character is like a tree, and reputation like its shadow. The shadow is what we think of it; the tree is the real thing.
- Abraham Lincoln

The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going.
- Anonymous

Rohit Sinha

Marc Clifton wrote: Now, I know there are a lot of Indians on CP, and I don't have any personal issues with them, I realize this is government stuff, just like I'm not personally responsible for the actions of the dickhead in Washington. You didn't need this disclaimer, Marc. This is an international community, and we all keep taking the liberty to take stabs at what we like/dislike about other countries. Nothing personal. Of course everyone understands that it's the government/President/Prime Minister we are talking about, and not the people in general, though that might be the case some of the time. Whatever. Chill man, life is beautiful. :rose:
Regards,

Rohit Sinha

Character is like a tree, and reputation like its shadow. The shadow is what we think of it; the tree is the real thing.
- Abraham Lincoln

The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going.
- Anonymous

ColinDavies

I agree. But where is the line drawn. Weapons and arms trading is done for a variety of reasons: Security. Financial as Belgium does. Sphere of Influence as the USA does. Dependence as the USSR did with Cuba. WMD trading is slightly differnet because these can really alter the balance of power in an area. The real problem that I see is that a lot of micro arms races are going to start to occur. And some countries will attack others because they are afraid they will not be afford to keep up with the military budgets. Regardz Colin J Davies

Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin

I'm guessing the concept of a 2 hour movie showing two guys eating a meal and talking struck them as 'foreign' Rob Manderson wrote:

Kant

Marc Clifton wrote: Oh, great. Developing countries??? So, instead of helping to feed and educate people, India is going to ship missiles to "developing countries". What's wrong. After Cold war is over. US became defacto arms-dealer seller. BTW, Who gave weapons to Iraq and Afganistan and look what happened now. I hope India makes better judgement when they sell :~ the weapons to developing countries. What about US tactics, if any country supports US led war against Iraq, they can get whatever they want. (money, weapons,...) Remember few years back in Clinton adminstration, US Govt blocked F-16's sale to Pakistan. (which was well before Nuclear tests) Look what happened after 9/11, immediately US lifted the embargo on those F-16s. From last 10 years or so India sending majority of their satellites using domestic technology with very less help from outside. This saved India millions of dollars. Previously India used France/US/USSR help in sending satellites. After successfully launching satellites, now it became threat to France's satellite launch business. India To Offer Cheaper Taxi Rides Into Space With Polar Launcher[^] You should commend India that atleast it's making baby steps in becoming a developed country. Follow live World Cup Cricket scores here[^]

brianwelsch

Rohit Sinha wrote: Rights are OK, but you also need to exercise your judgement properly. Precisely. ;) BW "We get general information and specific information, but none of the specific information talks about time, place or methods or means..." - Tom Ridge - US Secretary of Homeland Security

Jorgen Sigvardsson

I'm with you all the way man. This is just sick. It's like handing out guns to homeless people instead of giving them clothes and a job. But maybe that's the strategy? To let the poor countries kill eachother, so that we, the rich countries, can reap the resources these poorer countries have. It's probably cheaper to hand out missiles than it is to actually help. Capatilism in all its glory, but this is one aspect of capitalism I will never like - to gain wealth no matter what. -- Yeeeeehaaaaawwwwd!

Chris Austin

[dramatic quote]

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction; while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
--WB Yeats

[/dramatic quote] "Veni, Vidi, Booyah!" - Ceasar

Chris Austin

Well put Rohit. I pray that others have learned from the mistakes made by the US rather than setting aside good judgement for the sake of profit and gain of influence. "Veni, Vidi, Booyah!" - Ceasar

brianwelsch

It would be great if we didn't need weapons at all, and we could focus on improving everyones life, but unfortunately thats not the reality we live in. So countries that have the product, in this case weapons, sell them to improve their own lot. BW "We get general information and specific information, but none of the specific information talks about time, place or methods or means..." - Tom Ridge - US Secretary of Homeland Security

Rohit Sinha

Yes, I don't understand people crying foul over India doing it, when everyone who can do it has been doing it and is still doing it. And everyone knows that they will continue doing it too. For years we had been buying used guns from Russia. Now that we can make our own stuff, people want us not to sell them. Yeah right, so that your country can do it. It's not that those "developing" countries will not get weapons at all if we don't sell it to them. So why not us? But Kant, the world has started sitting up and noticing us. :cool: Not just in the weapons area too. Have you heard about Param Padam? It's the world's third most powerful super computer. Guess who made it? Yeah, that's right, we did. :cool: It makes me feel so proud. In the nineties the US stopped giving super computers to India. But now we have made our own. Although the most powerful one, Japan's is 36 TFP, USA's is 13TFP and ours is a mere 1 TFP. And then the link that you posted. And then the nuclear research. Although when one says the word "nuclear", people think "warheads". But I'm talking about power generation, medical science and fuel. Comeon India, kar lo duniya muthhi mein!
Regards,

Rohit Sinha

Character is like a tree, and reputation like its shadow. The shadow is what we think of it; the tree is the real thing.
- Abraham Lincoln

The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going.
- Anonymous

Jorgen Sigvardsson

brianwelsch wrote: So countries that have the product, in this case weapons, sell them to improve their own lot. Yeah but the logic is flawed! I mean, why give out weapons to poorer countries? Sooner or later, you as a wealthy country is doomed to piss on them (intentionally or unintentionally) sooner or later. That's when they shoot back. Nah, it's just like homeless people. Don't give them just food and money. Clean em up and give them a job. They'll thank you later. :) -- Yeeeeehaaaaawwwwd!

Rohit Sinha

Colin Davies wrote: The real problem that I see is that a lot of micro arms races are going to start to occur. And some countries will attack others because they are afraid they will not be afford to keep up with the military budgets. Colin! You forgot to start the second sentence on a line of its own! What is this? Old age? :omg:
Regards,

Rohit Sinha

Character is like a tree, and reputation like its shadow. The shadow is what we think of it; the tree is the real thing.
- Abraham Lincoln

The whole world steps aside for the man who knows where he is going.
- Anonymous

Lost User

yeah, you're right - actually America should be third world (if ANY world) because America was discovered way after some of the other countries like in Europe that had been around FAR longer - they should cut the _x_world thing Paul ;)

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Lost User

yeah, i mean some of the things said would be pretty scary if they were being said about individuals ("Lynching party!!!" style...) :~ sorry, sometimes i get carried away :-O Paul ;)

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Lost User

Isn't that also a rather selfish point of view from the rich country's side too? I mean selling weapons for their profit to poor (and mostly irresponsible with weapons) people is (i think) almost like asking for wars between "developing" ( :suss: ) countries. Paul ;)

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Bilal Naveed

Kant wrote: Look what happened after 9/11, immediately US lifted the embargo on those F-16s. I'm fairly certain this hasn't happened. I could be Rip Van Winkle :zzz: Bilal

KaRl

That's exactly why I stopped to work for Defence industries. Even if basically the goal is to produce weapons to defend the homeland, it's impossible to know who will actually buy them. These industries are capitalist too, they want to make money and are not embarrassed by moral considerations, whatever the country.

Angels banished from heaven have no choice but to become demons Cowboy Bebop

brianwelsch

Of course its selfish. The purpose of a government in its basic form is selfish isn't it? If my governments primary focus was not on my welfare, I'd have problems. Also, being selfish is very much human nature. And humans are making these decisions.;) BW "We get general information and specific information, but none of the specific information talks about time, place or methods or means..." - Tom Ridge - US Secretary of Homeland Security