Some things never change
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Life Magazine circa '46[^] New York Times, same era[^] Of course all links point to a neo-con site, so everything is probably fake. Mike "liberals are being driven crazy by the fact that Bush is so popular with Americans, and thus by the realization that anyone to the left of center is utterly marginal." JAMES TRAUB NY Times Loyal member of the vast right wing conspiracy Me "Kerry is a girl's name." Conan O'Brian "I've spoken to many world leaders - they all look at me and say, you've got to win. I just can't tell you who they are." J.F.Kerry
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Life Magazine circa '46[^] New York Times, same era[^] Of course all links point to a neo-con site, so everything is probably fake. Mike "liberals are being driven crazy by the fact that Bush is so popular with Americans, and thus by the realization that anyone to the left of center is utterly marginal." JAMES TRAUB NY Times Loyal member of the vast right wing conspiracy Me "Kerry is a girl's name." Conan O'Brian "I've spoken to many world leaders - they all look at me and say, you've got to win. I just can't tell you who they are." J.F.Kerry
of course Iraq and WWII are identical wars, and we should expect identical outcomes, and therefore any criticism of the post-war (ahem) Iraq situation is as equally invalid as any post-WWII criticism was (in hindsight). for example, remember when we had to pre-emptively attack Japan and Germany to prove to Saudi Arabia that you can't f' with the U.S. of A. ? and remember when, back in 1942, FDR declared "Mission Accomplished" and said all the major fighting was over but soldiers kept right on dying anyway ? and then, remember, we replaced the governments of Japan and Germany with imported hand-puppets ? and remember how FDR's cabinet was getting drunk and giving secrets to Iran ? yeah, it's exactly like that. Software | Cleek
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Life Magazine circa '46[^] New York Times, same era[^] Of course all links point to a neo-con site, so everything is probably fake. Mike "liberals are being driven crazy by the fact that Bush is so popular with Americans, and thus by the realization that anyone to the left of center is utterly marginal." JAMES TRAUB NY Times Loyal member of the vast right wing conspiracy Me "Kerry is a girl's name." Conan O'Brian "I've spoken to many world leaders - they all look at me and say, you've got to win. I just can't tell you who they are." J.F.Kerry
Mike Gaskey wrote: Of course all links point to a neo-con site, so everything is probably fake. If i am wrong,then sorry, otherwise i take it you're being sarcastic with the above statement. First of, if the things that are criticized in those articles where true, then it was right that they be pointed out. Secondly, the war in Europe wasn't a war of choice, so things going wrong in Europe couldn't have been blamed on America to any relevant extent. If Europe has anything for America with regards to WW2, it's appreciation and gratitude. To try and neutralize some real problems in Iraq with some 60yr old article, is quite absurd. Funny how supporters of the war in Iraq have gone from toating WMDs to now citing absurd pointers to keep their heads above water. At this point one can only hope, the new cabinet is up to the task(even though the odds seem stacked against them,but sometimes that's what is needed for success) and something good comes out of that mess. Bottom line is, it doesn't matter what Iraq is, 5yrs from now. The decision to go to war would still be wrong, so hedging the worthiness of the war on the eventual outcome in Iraq , is ridiculous. I am sitting in my flame proof buncker, so don't even bother. by the way, perl stinks.
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of course Iraq and WWII are identical wars, and we should expect identical outcomes, and therefore any criticism of the post-war (ahem) Iraq situation is as equally invalid as any post-WWII criticism was (in hindsight). for example, remember when we had to pre-emptively attack Japan and Germany to prove to Saudi Arabia that you can't f' with the U.S. of A. ? and remember when, back in 1942, FDR declared "Mission Accomplished" and said all the major fighting was over but soldiers kept right on dying anyway ? and then, remember, we replaced the governments of Japan and Germany with imported hand-puppets ? and remember how FDR's cabinet was getting drunk and giving secrets to Iran ? yeah, it's exactly like that. Software | Cleek
You're sounding more and more like kokie. Get a grip. The point, as you well know, is we're hearing the same harping from the same media outlets and the same collection of whiners. I suspect that if I called to your attention similar printed matter regarding Korea at the end of that conflict you'd make the same comments, twisted to the then current circumstances. Mike "liberals are being driven crazy by the fact that Bush is so popular with Americans, and thus by the realization that anyone to the left of center is utterly marginal." JAMES TRAUB NY Times Loyal member of the vast right wing conspiracy Me "Kerry is a girl's name." Conan O'Brian "I've spoken to many world leaders - they all look at me and say, you've got to win. I just can't tell you who they are." J.F.Kerry
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You're sounding more and more like kokie. Get a grip. The point, as you well know, is we're hearing the same harping from the same media outlets and the same collection of whiners. I suspect that if I called to your attention similar printed matter regarding Korea at the end of that conflict you'd make the same comments, twisted to the then current circumstances. Mike "liberals are being driven crazy by the fact that Bush is so popular with Americans, and thus by the realization that anyone to the left of center is utterly marginal." JAMES TRAUB NY Times Loyal member of the vast right wing conspiracy Me "Kerry is a girl's name." Conan O'Brian "I've spoken to many world leaders - they all look at me and say, you've got to win. I just can't tell you who they are." J.F.Kerry
Mike Gaskey wrote: You're sounding more and more like kokie. yes, and you continue to sound like Rush. Mike Gaskey wrote: The point, as you well know, is we're hearing the same harping from the same media outlets and the same collection of whiners. no, the point is it's not the same thing. the fact that people are saying the same thing about this post-war period that they said after WWII is irrelevant because there's nothing about the two wars, not the circumstances leading up to them, not the reasons for fighting them, not the countries involved, not the technology, not the leaders or the soldiers, not the tactics, not the media, not the world situation, not the relative state of the defeated countries' economies nor anything else, that's even remotely similar between the two wars. in fact, the only similarity between Iraq and WWII is the fact that American (and British and Italian) soldiers are dying. it's like looking at a world series from the 30's and saying that because Team X managed a comeback then, despite all those crazy nay-sayers, that anyone who doubts Team X will come back to win a series in the 00's is automatically wrong. but yes, it's nice to look back and say "we had success then. why shouldn't we have it again?" well, maybe we will, but past performance is not a guarantee of future success when the only consistency is the name of the team. Software | Cleek
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You're sounding more and more like kokie. Get a grip. The point, as you well know, is we're hearing the same harping from the same media outlets and the same collection of whiners. I suspect that if I called to your attention similar printed matter regarding Korea at the end of that conflict you'd make the same comments, twisted to the then current circumstances. Mike "liberals are being driven crazy by the fact that Bush is so popular with Americans, and thus by the realization that anyone to the left of center is utterly marginal." JAMES TRAUB NY Times Loyal member of the vast right wing conspiracy Me "Kerry is a girl's name." Conan O'Brian "I've spoken to many world leaders - they all look at me and say, you've got to win. I just can't tell you who they are." J.F.Kerry
Mike Gaskey wrote: You're sounding more and more like kokie. You hold me in too high a regard:). I can guarantee you, no one is taking thier cues from me. I think when you let go of your stuborness and become open to seeing things from a broader perspective, everything will start appearing much differently. You beleive people who speak against the war are simply out to get your very rightoues hero(GWB). The fact is, even i liked bush before 9/11 when his character was a regular fixture on SNL, but when he decided he was going to become serious, that is when things started going south. "There's nothing more dangerous, than a serious fool". A word to many Americans: Willingness to acknowledge ignorance and openess to learn is the greatest virtue. Stop resenting college proffessors / academics/bright people. They're not all leftist liberals out to change your godly way of life. If someone knows better, learn from them, don't stick your fingers in your ear. I am sitting in my flame proof buncker, so don't even bother. by the way, perl stinks.
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of course Iraq and WWII are identical wars, and we should expect identical outcomes, and therefore any criticism of the post-war (ahem) Iraq situation is as equally invalid as any post-WWII criticism was (in hindsight). for example, remember when we had to pre-emptively attack Japan and Germany to prove to Saudi Arabia that you can't f' with the U.S. of A. ? and remember when, back in 1942, FDR declared "Mission Accomplished" and said all the major fighting was over but soldiers kept right on dying anyway ? and then, remember, we replaced the governments of Japan and Germany with imported hand-puppets ? and remember how FDR's cabinet was getting drunk and giving secrets to Iran ? yeah, it's exactly like that. Software | Cleek
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of course Iraq and WWII are identical wars, and we should expect identical outcomes, and therefore any criticism of the post-war (ahem) Iraq situation is as equally invalid as any post-WWII criticism was (in hindsight). for example, remember when we had to pre-emptively attack Japan and Germany to prove to Saudi Arabia that you can't f' with the U.S. of A. ? and remember when, back in 1942, FDR declared "Mission Accomplished" and said all the major fighting was over but soldiers kept right on dying anyway ? and then, remember, we replaced the governments of Japan and Germany with imported hand-puppets ? and remember how FDR's cabinet was getting drunk and giving secrets to Iran ? yeah, it's exactly like that. Software | Cleek
You are just as wrong today as the idiots in 1946 who thought *they* were all-knowing when they whined about the conditions after the war. The only sad thing is that several years down the road when Iraq is peaceful, democratic and wealthy is that you people will be mysteriously silent.
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Mike Gaskey wrote: You're sounding more and more like kokie. yes, and you continue to sound like Rush. Mike Gaskey wrote: The point, as you well know, is we're hearing the same harping from the same media outlets and the same collection of whiners. no, the point is it's not the same thing. the fact that people are saying the same thing about this post-war period that they said after WWII is irrelevant because there's nothing about the two wars, not the circumstances leading up to them, not the reasons for fighting them, not the countries involved, not the technology, not the leaders or the soldiers, not the tactics, not the media, not the world situation, not the relative state of the defeated countries' economies nor anything else, that's even remotely similar between the two wars. in fact, the only similarity between Iraq and WWII is the fact that American (and British and Italian) soldiers are dying. it's like looking at a world series from the 30's and saying that because Team X managed a comeback then, despite all those crazy nay-sayers, that anyone who doubts Team X will come back to win a series in the 00's is automatically wrong. but yes, it's nice to look back and say "we had success then. why shouldn't we have it again?" well, maybe we will, but past performance is not a guarantee of future success when the only consistency is the name of the team. Software | Cleek
Who the fuck modded this a 1? This is *exactly* what I was thinking, and one of the rare times I would have gotten off my butt and posted something in one of these discussions. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned
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You are just as wrong today as the idiots in 1946 who thought *they* were all-knowing when they whined about the conditions after the war. The only sad thing is that several years down the road when Iraq is peaceful, democratic and wealthy is that you people will be mysteriously silent.
//placeholder for witty verbiage
Many years down the road Iraq may very well become a peaceful, democratic and wealthy place. I personally doubt it, but I'd love to be wrong. But that still doesn't change the fact that WWII and the Iraq war were/are very, very different wars under very, very different circumstances. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned
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Who the fuck modded this a 1? This is *exactly* what I was thinking, and one of the rare times I would have gotten off my butt and posted something in one of these discussions. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned
Agreed - but don't tell Chris I said so.:~ I gave it a 5 to bump it out of the grey... Some people think of it as a six-pack; I consider it more of a support group.
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Who the fuck modded this a 1? This is *exactly* what I was thinking, and one of the rare times I would have gotten off my butt and posted something in one of these discussions. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned