Do you think US policies are anti-Muslim?
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You are absolutely right. This is one of the primary reasons for Muslims' disliking of US. Other reasons include : - The US's imposed wars on Muslim countries like Afghanistan and Iraq. - Killing of hundreds of thousands of innocent people there without the discrimination of age or gender. - Their not so good foreign policies towards Muslim countries especially about the disputed regions like Chechnya, Kashmir, Cyprus etc. And a lot of others which are secondary... Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles
I think a lot of the problem with US foreign policy is simplistic and arrogant thinking. A kind of wild west, black and white mentality that leads them to make wrong decisions. I am sure they do not intend to happen what often does happen, but they cant seem to help judging other cultures by their standards, and assuming that other cultures automatically want to be like the US. So they wade in with money and overconfidence, totally fail to understand the subtle reasons behind an issue, try to impose a US model democracy, and wonder why it all goes to shit! Nunc est bibendum!
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kgaddy wrote: Well we now know why some countries rejected it from the oil for food scandal. Looks like france and russia was making a pretting good amount of money from saddam at the expense of the iraqi people. Just because some countries reject a policy does not mean it is for good reasons. The same is being thinked by people in those countries, that america invaded iraq for oil. I don't know saddam has how many american dollars but I know that france and russia are not individuals who can be wrong. they are free democratic nations, and their people don't think americans intension good enough to support them. http://www.priyank.in/
Priyank Bolia wrote: The same is being thinked by people in those countries, that america invaded iraq for oil. The peoblem with that is proof. How much oil has America taken??? none. There is proof that france, russia and to some extent germany profited from the oil for food programe. Priyank Bolia wrote: but I know that france and russia are not individuals who can be wrong. You know this??? they can never be wrong??? wow. Priyank Bolia wrote: they are free democratic nations umm so is America, more so actually. France is a socialist nation. Priyank Bolia wrote: and their people don't think americans intension good enough to support them. Funny, thats what Americans think about France and Russia.
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kgaddy wrote: Well we now know why some countries rejected it from the oil for food scandal. Looks like france and russia was making a pretting good amount of money from saddam at the expense of the iraqi people. Just because some countries reject a policy does not mean it is for good reasons. The same is being thinked by people in those countries, that america invaded iraq for oil. I don't know saddam has how many american dollars but I know that france and russia are not individuals who can be wrong. they are free democratic nations, and their people don't think americans intension good enough to support them. http://www.priyank.in/
You appear to be very anti-US. You accept France and Russia' exploitation of the food-for-oil program as OK, while denouncing the US for attacking Iraq for oil. There is no prrof that the US went into Iraq for oil. I appreciate you comments, but looking through your posts in this thread, you seem to confuse the issues with non-related facts to each of your arguements. Why do you feel so confidently that the US is in Iraq because of oil?
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You are absolutely right. This is one of the primary reasons for Muslims' disliking of US. Other reasons include : - The US's imposed wars on Muslim countries like Afghanistan and Iraq. - Killing of hundreds of thousands of innocent people there without the discrimination of age or gender. - Their not so good foreign policies towards Muslim countries especially about the disputed regions like Chechnya, Kashmir, Cyprus etc. And a lot of others which are secondary... Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles
Aamir Butt wrote: The US's imposed wars on Muslim countries like Afghanistan and Iraq. For their support of terrorism (even though we now know that was not true of Iraq, that was the reason). Aamir Butt wrote: Killing of hundreds of thousands of innocent people there without the discrimination of age or gender. Show me where you come up with that information. Deaths by US attacks minimize bystanders. Aamir Butt wrote: Their not so good foreign policies towards Muslim countries especially about the disputed regions like Chechnya, Kashmir, Cyprus etc. What specifically is your complaint and what would make you happy?
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Pete Madden wrote: If a group of people think the war in Afganistan was wrong then I pity those morons I think the other way. IMO, if a group of people think the war in Afghanistan was right than i pity those morons. How would you justify a war in which hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians were killed by carpet bombing just to find a group of people who in the KILLER's opinion were responsible for 9/11 assault. And if for a moment I suppose that KILLERS were right in their opinion, then according to their own sources, the alleged person hid himself somewhere in Afghanistan. Is that a reason good enough to bomb a whole country. If you say yes, then we have got a huge number of such people who to us are equally killable as OBL is to u and Who did seek successfule asylums in European countries and US. e.g., Salman Rushdi (If you know about him). Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles
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Aamir Butt wrote: hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians were killed by carpet bombing just to find a group of people Can you cite anything to back up this claim?
Bob Flynn wrote: Can you cite anything to back up this claim? I can give you a good number of web resources to back up my claim but obviously you would not believe it and will consider it to be fake. The point to think is that why Muslims are so much against US and their power. The only logical reason that comes to mind is that they have been harmed badly by their power and hence find themselves in a state where they can do nothing except mourning over their losses. I live in Pakistan and I know a good number of Afghan refugees (btw, Pakistan had the greatest share of refugees from Afghanistan). These Afghan refugees are/were in the worst shape you could imagine. They were homeless, shelterless, clothless and what not. I have worked in the refugee camps and I have got a first-hand knowledge of whatever has been happening there. That's why I believe all the stuff on the internet which shows deaths in Afghanistan and their massacare by US. Dont get me wrong though, I am strongly against any kind of terrorism, be it 9/11 or 7/7 but I feel that Muslim world is not in a great economic state and they need some help rather than what US has been doing against them in Iraq and Afghanistan. Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles
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Bob Flynn wrote: Can you cite anything to back up this claim? I can give you a good number of web resources to back up my claim but obviously you would not believe it and will consider it to be fake. The point to think is that why Muslims are so much against US and their power. The only logical reason that comes to mind is that they have been harmed badly by their power and hence find themselves in a state where they can do nothing except mourning over their losses. I live in Pakistan and I know a good number of Afghan refugees (btw, Pakistan had the greatest share of refugees from Afghanistan). These Afghan refugees are/were in the worst shape you could imagine. They were homeless, shelterless, clothless and what not. I have worked in the refugee camps and I have got a first-hand knowledge of whatever has been happening there. That's why I believe all the stuff on the internet which shows deaths in Afghanistan and their massacare by US. Dont get me wrong though, I am strongly against any kind of terrorism, be it 9/11 or 7/7 but I feel that Muslim world is not in a great economic state and they need some help rather than what US has been doing against them in Iraq and Afghanistan. Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles
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Aamir Butt wrote: but obviously you would not believe it and will consider it to be fake. Why do you say that? Provide the links and let me see what leads you to your conclusions.
OK here is the first[^] I am collecting links right now, I will post those here very soon. This is the one I found on a quick google. Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles
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Aamir Butt wrote: but obviously you would not believe it and will consider it to be fake. Why do you say that? Provide the links and let me see what leads you to your conclusions.
Following are some of the links which I could come up with just by searching those on google and similar search engines. http://freedomfiles.org/war/atrocity.htm [^] http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/jul2002/afgh-j22.shtml[^] http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/jul2002/afgh-j03.shtml[^] http://archive.salon.com/news/feature/2002/06/15/massacre/index_np.html[^] http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/jun2002/maz-j21.shtml[^] http://www.robert-fisk.com/the_evidence.htm[^] http://www.vialls.com/torture/criminals1.html[^] Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles
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Following are some of the links which I could come up with just by searching those on google and similar search engines. http://freedomfiles.org/war/atrocity.htm [^] http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/jul2002/afgh-j22.shtml[^] http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/jul2002/afgh-j03.shtml[^] http://archive.salon.com/news/feature/2002/06/15/massacre/index_np.html[^] http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/jun2002/maz-j21.shtml[^] http://www.robert-fisk.com/the_evidence.htm[^] http://www.vialls.com/torture/criminals1.html[^] Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles
I guess with news sources like that your mind is made up. I can tell you as someone who has been in the Army for 16 years and been deployed to Iraq, I would not have tolerated the things US soldiers are accused of nor do I know of anyone that would. The prisoner situation was an anomally that was reported by soldiers to our chain of command, so do not try to use that as a point of arguement. The images in those sites are horrible and quite frankly I am upset about them too. The questions that remain are: 1) who caused those injuries 2) where is the reputable reporting of them (definitely not the sites that you show) 3) As in Abu Graib, if US soldiers are guilty of inappropriate actions, they deserve punishment. Interesting though: You celebrate 9/11 yet you denounce Abu Graib. What does that say about you?
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I guess with news sources like that your mind is made up. I can tell you as someone who has been in the Army for 16 years and been deployed to Iraq, I would not have tolerated the things US soldiers are accused of nor do I know of anyone that would. The prisoner situation was an anomally that was reported by soldiers to our chain of command, so do not try to use that as a point of arguement. The images in those sites are horrible and quite frankly I am upset about them too. The questions that remain are: 1) who caused those injuries 2) where is the reputable reporting of them (definitely not the sites that you show) 3) As in Abu Graib, if US soldiers are guilty of inappropriate actions, they deserve punishment. Interesting though: You celebrate 9/11 yet you denounce Abu Graib. What does that say about you?
Bob Flynn wrote: I guess with news sources like that your mind is made up. OK, only if you say so but what about those first-hand experiences of Afghanis whom I saw in refugee camps. What I have heard and read is that the operation in Afghanistan by US was mainly with Air Aid, this means that they showered a lot of bombs and things like that. Do you think that a bomb has an intellisense of hitting the correct person. I dont think so, bombs always create havoc in a large area, be it civilian area or whatever even if those were bombs with very high technological correctness. Bob Flynn wrote: Interesting though: You celebrate 9/11 yet you denounce Abu Graib. What does that say about you? I never said that I celebrate 9/11 or 7/7, in fact I strongly condemn any brutal act aimed at civilians. And yes, arent we going off-topic a bit. You still have to give me a solid proof that 9/11 was engineered by Taliban or had any connection with Afghanistan whatsoever. And yes, dont tell me that this was by OBL. Even if it was by him and he was hiding in Afghanistan, this is not a valid enough reason to bomb a whole country to death. As I have already said we have many such wanted people seeking successful asylums in European countries and US, who are equally killable by us as OBL was by you. So, does it make a valid reason for Islamic countries to attack US. I think NO and I think that you think the same, then please justify the attack of Afghanistan. Steve Mayfield: "Coding in VB is like riding a tricycle...once you figured out how to peddle, its really hard to fall off." My Articles