Interesting turn of events
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Interesting to see that Joe Average Iraqi may be getting more fed up with the foreign fighters than the US. Not an end to the conflict but a possible turn for the better http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6229305/[^] Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
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Interesting to see that Joe Average Iraqi may be getting more fed up with the foreign fighters than the US. Not an end to the conflict but a possible turn for the better http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6229305/[^] Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
There probably is a flip side to that. The US will now have more problems in any negotiations. Regardz Colin J Davies Attention: It's finally arrived, The worlds first DSP.
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Interesting to see that Joe Average Iraqi may be getting more fed up with the foreign fighters than the US. Not an end to the conflict but a possible turn for the better http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6229305/[^] Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
"[Abu Musab Zarqawi] is mentally deranged, has distorted the image of the resistance and defamed it. I believe his end is near," Abu Abdalla Dulaimy, military commander of the First Army of Mohammad, said recently." It reminds me the story of Lenny Murphy, the leader of the Shankill Butchers[^]. He was finally assassinated by the IRA[^], but it seems with the help of the UVF[^]. There's a time when the worst bastards have to pay for their actions. It's reassuring.
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
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There probably is a flip side to that. The US will now have more problems in any negotiations. Regardz Colin J Davies Attention: It's finally arrived, The worlds first DSP.
The nogotiaions so far haven't really worked, when the marines pulled ou from Fallujah the foreigners kept fighting. The idea that the local citizens might take matters into their own hands concerning the foreigners is good thing. Even if they just point out the foreigners so that the Iraqi and US forces can destroy them that would be an excellent development. Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
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"[Abu Musab Zarqawi] is mentally deranged, has distorted the image of the resistance and defamed it. I believe his end is near," Abu Abdalla Dulaimy, military commander of the First Army of Mohammad, said recently." It reminds me the story of Lenny Murphy, the leader of the Shankill Butchers[^]. He was finally assassinated by the IRA[^], but it seems with the help of the UVF[^]. There's a time when the worst bastards have to pay for their actions. It's reassuring.
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
Even in a prison there is a sort of hierarchy that looks down on certain classes of criminals. People like Al Sadr who may wish to eventually work within the system must be terribly uncomfortabl with someone like Zarqawi who kills fellow Muslims. Hopefully people like Al Sadr can be made to see that working with the US to help his own people is preferable to being associated with a butcher like Zarqawi. Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
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Interesting to see that Joe Average Iraqi may be getting more fed up with the foreign fighters than the US. Not an end to the conflict but a possible turn for the better http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6229305/[^] Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
There are three main fighting factions in Iraq: The al Sadir militia that most Iraqis consider to be thugs, the foreign fighters that most consider uninvited guests, and al Sistani's militia that has the backing of the Shi'a majority.
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There are three main fighting factions in Iraq: The al Sadir militia that most Iraqis consider to be thugs, the foreign fighters that most consider uninvited guests, and al Sistani's militia that has the backing of the Shi'a majority.
You miss at least one group, the Sunni militias. AFAIK neither Al Sadr's not Al Sistani's militias are involved in the fighting around Fallujah, aren't they?
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
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Even in a prison there is a sort of hierarchy that looks down on certain classes of criminals. People like Al Sadr who may wish to eventually work within the system must be terribly uncomfortabl with someone like Zarqawi who kills fellow Muslims. Hopefully people like Al Sadr can be made to see that working with the US to help his own people is preferable to being associated with a butcher like Zarqawi. Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
AFAIK, Al Sadr has nothing to do with Fallujah. Al Sadr is a Shia cleric when Falluja is a Sunni stronghold. I'm not even sure both tendencies are in good terms, and fear some kind of civil war in the next months. Anyway, Allawi and the US will have to talk with the Sunni guerilla(s ?), maybe even negociate some kind of truce. And for that the crimes committed by the "foreign arabs" may help. It's good to see how a terror policy can backlash.
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
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"[Abu Musab Zarqawi] is mentally deranged, has distorted the image of the resistance and defamed it. I believe his end is near," Abu Abdalla Dulaimy, military commander of the First Army of Mohammad, said recently." It reminds me the story of Lenny Murphy, the leader of the Shankill Butchers[^]. He was finally assassinated by the IRA[^], but it seems with the help of the UVF[^]. There's a time when the worst bastards have to pay for their actions. It's reassuring.
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
Quite frankly, I believe simply allowing Zarqawi to leave is not enough. I'd personally rather see him eliminated. Jeremy Falcon
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AFAIK, Al Sadr has nothing to do with Fallujah. Al Sadr is a Shia cleric when Falluja is a Sunni stronghold. I'm not even sure both tendencies are in good terms, and fear some kind of civil war in the next months. Anyway, Allawi and the US will have to talk with the Sunni guerilla(s ?), maybe even negociate some kind of truce. And for that the crimes committed by the "foreign arabs" may help. It's good to see how a terror policy can backlash.
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
K(arl) wrote: AFAIK, Al Sadr has nothing to do with Fallujah I meant to imply that we were gaining ground based on the fact that seperate factions of the so called resistance were fracturing. If Al Sadr's militia is actually attempting to turn in their heavy weapons as Al Sadr attempts to enter the political process and Al Sistani is telling the population that they should participate in elections, it bodes well for the possibility of eventual peace. The idea of Fallujah's resident turning against foreign fighters is encouraging as the Iraqis may be starting to see themselves as a seperate entity. Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
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You miss at least one group, the Sunni militias. AFAIK neither Al Sadr's not Al Sistani's militias are involved in the fighting around Fallujah, aren't they?
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
There are lots of militia groups - the Kurdish militia etc. These are the ones that are causing trouble, as part of planting the flag so to speak for future power struggles in Iraq if/when American power wanes. This is not just Fallujah - you're right. The point is that there are lots of different groups that Iraqis have differing opinions of. I think it is safe to say that none of them trust the Americans as they have seen evidence of American indifference and arrogance towards them. Not to say that they are not happy to see Saddam gone - just that they consider the Americans to be a different type of evil. It is freer - yes, but they now consider it is a corrupt puppet government mainly concerned with exploiting them and the oil wealth. This is what I have gleened by reading English speaking Iraqi blogs and ignoring mainstream media. ------------------------------------------ Being lectured by the president on fiscal responsibility is a little bit like Tony Soprano talking to me about law and order in this country. John Kerry
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Quite frankly, I believe simply allowing Zarqawi to leave is not enough. I'd personally rather see him eliminated. Jeremy Falcon
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Quite frankly, I believe simply allowing Zarqawi to leave is not enough. I'd personally rather see him eliminated He needs to have a terrible accident..... So do most of the hard core Al Quada leaders that we are confronting. I see a purpose in bringing domeone like Saddam to justice, but a cold blooded murderer needs to be "shot while trying to escape". Much simpler and cleaner. Personnally I would chip in for a package of pork chops to bury him with ....... Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
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K(arl) wrote: AFAIK, Al Sadr has nothing to do with Fallujah I meant to imply that we were gaining ground based on the fact that seperate factions of the so called resistance were fracturing. If Al Sadr's militia is actually attempting to turn in their heavy weapons as Al Sadr attempts to enter the political process and Al Sistani is telling the population that they should participate in elections, it bodes well for the possibility of eventual peace. The idea of Fallujah's resident turning against foreign fighters is encouraging as the Iraqis may be starting to see themselves as a seperate entity. Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
Doug Goulden wrote: If Al Sadr's militia is actually attempting to turn in their heavy weapons as Al Sadr attempts to enter the political process and Al Sistani is telling the population that they should participate in elections, it bodes well for the possibility of eventual peace Shias have everything to win with the fall of SH and the incoming of democracy, it's logical they will favor elections. Al Sadr behaviour is IMHO a try to gain a political influence by opposing the US occupation, not because he opposes fundamentally occupation but because occupation is unpopular, he's a kind of violent demagogue, he's preparing his future in Iraqi political games. I don't think he's the "real" problem. Doug Goulden wrote: The idea of Fallujah's resident turning against foreign fighters is encouraging as the Iraqis may be starting to see themselves as a seperate entity. AFAIK, The "Sunni triangle" is mostly constitued by tribes, with a strong tribal spirit. That's why I'm not sure rejection of the foreign troops means it's the beginning of the creation of an Iraqi national spirit. After all, Iraq is a totally artificial creation made from the outside, so I'm not sure there is or will be such a national spirit one day. For example, I doubt Kurds will consider themselves as Iraqi.
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
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Quite frankly, I believe simply allowing Zarqawi to leave is not enough. I'd personally rather see him eliminated. Jeremy Falcon
Jeremy Falcon wrote: I believe simply allowing Zarqawi to leave is not enough Unless there are some snipers in the neighborhood... I would rather see him in a front of a Court, judged for his crimes and have to live the rest of his life in a cell, but if he is "eliminated", I won't object.
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."
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There are lots of militia groups - the Kurdish militia etc. These are the ones that are causing trouble, as part of planting the flag so to speak for future power struggles in Iraq if/when American power wanes. This is not just Fallujah - you're right. The point is that there are lots of different groups that Iraqis have differing opinions of. I think it is safe to say that none of them trust the Americans as they have seen evidence of American indifference and arrogance towards them. Not to say that they are not happy to see Saddam gone - just that they consider the Americans to be a different type of evil. It is freer - yes, but they now consider it is a corrupt puppet government mainly concerned with exploiting them and the oil wealth. This is what I have gleened by reading English speaking Iraqi blogs and ignoring mainstream media. ------------------------------------------ Being lectured by the president on fiscal responsibility is a little bit like Tony Soprano talking to me about law and order in this country. John Kerry
Agreed. Jeff Bogan wrote: This is what I have gleened by reading English speaking Iraqi blogs Do you have some links to share? Jeff Bogan wrote: ignoring mainstream media IMHO, some articles are good. This one[^], for example.
Fold With Us! "I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."