Re: It's the Demography Stupid
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Stan Shannon wrote:
That amazes me. We are awash in a tidal wave of sensationalism about US christian fundamentalism, Globla warming, Bush the idiot, Bush the Hun, etc, etc. But let some guy rather brilliantly point out a far more significant, far less reported, and far more supportable crisis facing the west and only then do you become concerned about sensationalism.
Sure, but it's sensationalism that is most easily dismissed and ignored. Rational and well-thought out arguments are the most difficult to dismiss. More of that is needed.
Stan Shannon wrote:
The population numbers he cites are irrefutable. A population that is halving every generation or so is not long for this world. One that is doubling every generation or so is one that will displace the other. And when that population goes, the odds are that its most cherised culturally artifacts will go with it. To not accept that obvious conclusion in order to fixate on the perils of christian fundamentalism is utter insanity.
I'm not sure where you're getting your statistics, but population growth rates (discounting immigration) are not negative to the extent of a 50% decrease over a generation. If population so concerns you, you should worry about China and India, not the Arab countries.
thealj wrote:
I'm not sure where you're getting your statistics, but population growth rates (discounting immigration) are not negative to the extent of a 50% decrease over a generation
Close enough for government work?[^]
thealj wrote:
If population so concerns you, you should worry about China and India, not the Arab countries.
Typically, as the article points out, any observation of these numbers is twisted as some sort of validation of 'conservative racism'. It isn't the population displacement itself which is the concern (we've already lost that battle). It is the cultural displacement that we should be worried about. All the cultural concerns that the left is so defensive about, along with virtually every other cultural aspect of the west, good or bad, is in extreme peril of being lost forever over the course of the next century. Culture follows populations, it always has and it always will. The left is allowing western civilization to die becaue it has painted itself into an intellectual corner that it cannot get out of and is taking the rest of us along with it. "If anything, the West is awash in an epidemic of self-hate crimes." "a civilization that feels guilty for everything it is and does will lack the energy and conviction to defend itself"
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Are you saying that by dint of islam already covering a large geographic area for several hundreds of years is justification, of itself, to islamisize the whole planet?
turning the other cheek just gets you slapped twice
legalAlien wrote:
Are you saying that by dint of islam already covering a large geographic area for several hundreds of years is justification, of itself, to islamisize the whole planet?
No, he is saying that if you want to estimate the likelihood of mass killings if Islam were to cover the whole planet, then you have the past record of Muslims to look to. [just clarifying, not taking sides.] John Carson "To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." Thomas Paine
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thealj wrote:
I'm not sure where you're getting your statistics, but population growth rates (discounting immigration) are not negative to the extent of a 50% decrease over a generation
Close enough for government work?[^]
thealj wrote:
If population so concerns you, you should worry about China and India, not the Arab countries.
Typically, as the article points out, any observation of these numbers is twisted as some sort of validation of 'conservative racism'. It isn't the population displacement itself which is the concern (we've already lost that battle). It is the cultural displacement that we should be worried about. All the cultural concerns that the left is so defensive about, along with virtually every other cultural aspect of the west, good or bad, is in extreme peril of being lost forever over the course of the next century. Culture follows populations, it always has and it always will. The left is allowing western civilization to die becaue it has painted itself into an intellectual corner that it cannot get out of and is taking the rest of us along with it. "If anything, the West is awash in an epidemic of self-hate crimes." "a civilization that feels guilty for everything it is and does will lack the energy and conviction to defend itself"
Your statistics are fine. I fail to see any negative growth rates among the West that would suggest elimination to the extent of a 50% decrease over a generation...In fact, for the Western countries, immigration rates are less than naturalized birth rates...
Stan Shannon wrote:
It is the cultural displacement that we should be worried about. All the cultural concerns that the left is so defensive about, along with virtually every other cultural aspect of the west, good or bad, is in extreme peril of being lost forever over the course of the next century. Culture follows populations, it always has and it always will. The left is allowing western civilization to die becaue it has painted itself into an intellectual corner that it cannot get out of and is taking the rest of us along with it.
I don't know. I've lived in Canada, England and Switzerland with frequent trips to major cities of Europe (London, Paris, France, Prague, Zurich, Geneva etc..., etc...) and I neither see nor sense the extinction of the "West". While cultures may be traversing boundaries, I don't see any evidence of "cultural smothering" so to speak. What I do see, however, are rising costs as China and other nations become increasingly open. Shipping rates have skyrocketed from below $23,000 a day for hiring a cargo ship to upwards of $75,000 a day. There aren't enough ships to move the worlds cargo and Mitsubishi Heavy Industries is back-logged for periods of 3 years or more with orders of new cargo ships. I see markets setting increasingly higher prices for commodities and rapidly increasing demand. The only severe crisis I see looming on the horizon are surges in the cost of living as demand begins to outstrip supply. You need look no further than the oil markets. Don't think it won't happen with electricity, cereal products and then raw materials like metals and agriculturals. The real problem is whether or not the production capacity of the world markets can keep up with the rising demand...
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thealj wrote:
I'm not sure where you're getting your statistics, but population growth rates (discounting immigration) are not negative to the extent of a 50% decrease over a generation
Close enough for government work?[^]
thealj wrote:
If population so concerns you, you should worry about China and India, not the Arab countries.
Typically, as the article points out, any observation of these numbers is twisted as some sort of validation of 'conservative racism'. It isn't the population displacement itself which is the concern (we've already lost that battle). It is the cultural displacement that we should be worried about. All the cultural concerns that the left is so defensive about, along with virtually every other cultural aspect of the west, good or bad, is in extreme peril of being lost forever over the course of the next century. Culture follows populations, it always has and it always will. The left is allowing western civilization to die becaue it has painted itself into an intellectual corner that it cannot get out of and is taking the rest of us along with it. "If anything, the West is awash in an epidemic of self-hate crimes." "a civilization that feels guilty for everything it is and does will lack the energy and conviction to defend itself"
Stan Shannon wrote:
The left is allowing western civilization to die becaue it has painted itself into an intellectual corner that it cannot get out of and is taking the rest of us along with it.
There is some merit to this statement but going beyond that arguement I'd say that the right isn't going to survive by breaking the West into "them and us." You can't fight the left and the terrorists and hope to win. "Western civilization" is the same for the the right and the left. The problem there is that the left doesn't fully grasp the realities of what they propose to tolerate while the right is too conservative. The left like their iPods and lattes and tofu but don't realise how much of it they will have to give up if their proposals come to fruition. The right like their independence and tradition but don't get they can't have their own way at the expense of others forever. Going further there is a lot in western culture we would do well to let die. regards, Paul Watson Ireland Feed Henry! K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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peterchen wrote:
YES
Hmm! Perhaps it's preferrence for what's homegrown; Or you are blond :-D
I object to the notion "this can't happen to us, it's a typical german thing". Not because I prefer the austrian whacko, but because this attitude is very dangerous.
Some of us walk the memory lane, others plummet into a rabbit hole
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