Evolution works in mysterious ways

soap brain

Matthew Faithfull wrote:

Would be slightly confusing considering Darwin changed his mind and admitted his theory was wrong during his lifetime.

Uh, no he didn't. That's a very transparent lie. Did you get this information from something like this?[^] It's a worthless document, I'll have you know. It is just wrong, wrong, wrong. Even I can see that. Interesting note: Charles Darwin was a devout Christian before he came up with Natural Selection. He was a highly intelligent man, and he saw through Christianity. He decided that it was just wasn't good enough.

Drawing on my fine command of language, I said nothing.

73Zeppelin

I'll give that answer 10/10.

Matthew Faithfull

Thomas George wrote:

You are advocating teaching Christian beliefs to everyone as fact

Because they are.

Thomas George wrote:

Yet, you feel that you respect others' right to hold their own beliefs and not be forced to accept another.

No, where did I say that. No one has any right to believe something that is not true. It can never be a right to be wrong.

Thomas George wrote:

Are you sure that you are treating others as well as yourself?

Yes. The truth is true for everyone just the same.

Thomas George wrote:

What if a Buddhist wants to teach his beliefs as fact?

He has no right, because his beliefs are wrong. The false assumption that his beliefs are equal to mine is possibly part of your belief system but has no basis in reality.

Thomas George wrote:

What if a Muslim wants to teach his beliefs as fact?

The same applies, his beliefs are wrong so he has no inherrent right to promulgate them.

Thomas George wrote:

you are entitled to that right yourself.

Only because my beliefs are right, not merely because I have beliefs. Remember that it is neither you nor your belief system nor society which gives me the right or entitles me, it is God himself. He is the judge of what is right.

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage." Thucydides (B.C. 460-400)

Lost User

Actually suchi, sashhimi etc is very nice. The texsture of raw fish with the ginger and wasabi and rice is a sublime combination. And healthy (except for the worms you might get)

Morality is indistinguishable from social proscription

Matthew Faithfull

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

Uh, no he didn't. That's a very transparent lie.

Not what I've heard, read a decent biography and find out.

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

Charles Darwin was a devout Christian

It is impossible for you or I to know whether he was even a Christian. He certainly wasn't devout in any normal usage of the word.

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

He was a highly intelligent man

He certainly was although he may have been diagnosed as mentally I'll in our somewhat differently enlightened times.

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

and he saw through Christianity.

Now that really is a transparent lie :laugh:

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

He decided that it was just wasn't good enough.

:doh: :laugh: I don't know which radical evolutionist believers you've been getting your information from. If it's the put Darwin on a pedastal and make him our deity crowd, then have nothing to do with them, they are as insane the Egregious Proffesor for the Public Misunderstanding of Science and his DNA worship, woof bark donkey X|:mad: :wtf: doesn't even begin.

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage." Thucydides (B.C. 460-400)

Brady Kelly

I eat sushi (raw fish in general) often, sometimes once a week, and have never had any problems. That I know of. Neither has anyone else I know, and there are lots of 'cheap' sushi places, i.e. they don't uphold the normally very strict standards of sushi cuisine.

Pits fall into Chuck Norris.

soap brain

Matthew Faithfull wrote:

Not what I've heard, read a decent biography and find out.

I can't find him ever saying that. What he did say, however, was that he didn't know the mechanism behind it, ie GENETICS, which was later discovered and found to agree with his theory.

Matthew Faithfull wrote:

It is impossible for you or I to know whether he was even a Christian. He certainly wasn't devout in any normal usage of the word.

Well, he studied theology for a time, and was known to use the Bible as absolute moral reference (until his daughter died)...

Matthew Faithfull wrote:

He certainly was although he may have been diagnosed as mentally I'll in our somewhat differently enlightened times.

:confused: Why do you say that? :confused:

Matthew Faithfull wrote:

Now that really is a transparent lie [Laugh]

:confused:

Matthew Faithfull wrote:

[D'Oh!] [Laugh] I don't know which radical evolutionist believers you've been getting your information from. If it's the put Darwin on a pedastal and make him our deity crowd, then have nothing to do with them, they are as insane the Egregious Proffesor for the Public Misunderstanding of Science and his DNA worship, woof bark donkey [Dead] [Mad] [WTF] doesn't even begin.

Biologists. People who actually understand evolution. People who don't grossly underestimate how academic it is, people who don't assume from the get-go that they're already right. Like you. I don't 'worship' Charles Darwin, not any more than I 'worship' Shroedinger, Heisenberg, Einstein, Bohr, Euler, Pythagoras, Newton, da Vinci, Mendeleev, Planck, etc. They're all brilliant people.

Drawing on my fine command of language, I said nothing.

soap brain

2 Kings 2:23 "And he went up from thence to Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, little boys came out of the city and mocked him, saying: Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And looking back, he saw them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord: and there came forth two bears out of the forest, and tore of them two and forty boys." Luke 19:26 "But I say to you, that to every one that hath shall be given, and he shall abound: and from him that hath not, even that which he hath, shall be taken from him. But as for those my enemies, who would not have me reign over them, bring them hither, and kill them before me." Matthew 10:34 "Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And as a man’s enemies shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me, is not worthy of me; and he that loveth son or daughter more than me, is not worthy of me."

Drawing on my fine command of language, I said nothing.

Lost User

Now that you clarified your position, it is certain that your position cannot be reconciled in a real world democracy without everyone becoming a Christian. I guess all *one and only God* religions have the same problem. They are, by definition, condescending. Nice talking to you.

soap brain

Matthew Faithfull wrote:

He has no right, because his beliefs are wrong. The false assumption that his beliefs are equal to mine is possibly part of your belief system but has no basis in reality.

I suppose you can prove that your beliefs are right and that theirs are wrong?

Drawing on my fine command of language, I said nothing.

Lost User

The Bible is his proof. There is no point discussing further.

soap brain

I know, I know... :sigh:

Drawing on my fine command of language, I said nothing.

Lost User

The worms dont come from bad hygenie but from the animals in the wild.

Morality is indistinguishable from social proscription

Matthew Faithfull

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

ie GENETICS, which was later discovered and found to agree with his theory.

Which in fact made his theory a) impossible and b)obselete which he undoubtedly would have recognised.

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

Well, he studied theology for a time,

He did more than that, he trainer to be a Vicar, doesn't necessarily make him a Christian though.

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

Biologists.

Good, nice woolly edged kind of spongy people on the whole, not given to aggressive tendencies or ranting. Very reluctant to throw out stuff that isn't useful anymore but hey I've only met a few. :)

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

who actually understand evolution.

Hmm, not so useful. Those who value the understanding of failed old theories would probably be best calling themselves historians and staying clear of making scintific claims, ether physics anyone? On the other hand there is probably more value in reviewing the historical track of 19th and 20th century science than most scientists will admit. Physics could benefit hugely by going back and correcting the errors in some of its founding papers instead of alternately ignoring them and denying them, or so I'm told.

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

I don't 'worship' Charles Darwin

Good, I didn't think you did, just be wary of the handful of nutters who do and the equally dangerous loons who worship their own DNA.

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage." Thucydides (B.C. 460-400)

Matthew Faithfull

Ravel H. Joyce wrote:

I suppose you can prove that your beliefs are right and that theirs are wrong?

What?, with reference to your belief system, I doubt it as your belief system, which I take to be modern pseudo science, espouses proof while relying on derivations from the assumption that proof itself is not possible. Within such a contradictory system you may percieve any result you wish, that being the purpose of the contradiction in the first place, and can therefore dismiss any 'proof' presented as not proof without being demonstrably wrong. Even any accepted proof within such a belief system would have no value. Never the less back in the world of the real history will ultimately show which beliefs are right.

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage." Thucydides (B.C. 460-400)

Matthew Faithfull

Thomas George wrote:

They are, by definition, condescending.

Indeed perhaps the condescention of God is all that stands between each one of us and eternal torment. It was a very good discussion in which you have demonstrated your clear and unsinting reason. Thank you.

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage." Thucydides (B.C. 460-400)

Matthew Faithfull

Good, so you can quote scripture, even the Devil can do that. Do you understand anything from it or intend any point by your selection of quotes?

"The secret of happiness is freedom, and the secret of freedom, courage." Thucydides (B.C. 460-400)

Brady Kelly

I'm not worried about hygiene, that's normally fine, but the quality of fish. Chain shops that push large quantities of anonymous salmon seem, to me, to carry more risk than proper Japanese shops that hand select quality fish. Hell, even my local coffee shop, with an Italian ambience, serves sushi.

Pits fall into Chuck Norris.

Ilion

Paul Watson wrote:

Ilíon, please don't think that because I am an aethist that I am part of some greater movement or that ... And I am not "you people" just as you are not "you people." ...

I really do make a consious effort to see and react to each person as a unique individual (quite apart from my use of "you people") ... but really! you have to admit that it is sometimes exceeding difficult to keep always before one's mind the truth that 'atheists' are not pod-people or ants of an ant-hill (watch this thread[^]).

Ilion

Paul Watson wrote:

Ilíon, please don't think that because I am an aethist that ...

Hell, I can even overlook this history[^] (and, as The Dip informs us, you're just trying to be civil)