Nudity, sin or not?
-
Simple question really: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? Obviously the question is relevant to seeing nudity in moderation. Anything taken to an obsession is harmful. Now currently in society we are still at the stage where there are those of us who do view the nude form but will vehemently deny it, even describe it as "digusting" just to avoid embarrasement, ridicule or stern words from others (who often are just doing what you are doing because it is the done thing.) So if thats you rather not reply to this, or just be honest and tell the truth. And while it would be nice to not bring religion into this, I realise that cannot be done as if your religion says something and you are faithful then that is how you live and think, personal opinion is not an option.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaThere's nothing more pleasurable than looking at the naked body of an attractive woman. Is it wrong? According to most religions yes, but I fail to see why. It does no harm to anyone. It gives you wicked thoughts yes, but as long as they remain thoughts and not actions then it's probably ok.
8
SIMON WALTON
SONORK ID 100.10024 -
Simple question really: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? Obviously the question is relevant to seeing nudity in moderation. Anything taken to an obsession is harmful. Now currently in society we are still at the stage where there are those of us who do view the nude form but will vehemently deny it, even describe it as "digusting" just to avoid embarrasement, ridicule or stern words from others (who often are just doing what you are doing because it is the done thing.) So if thats you rather not reply to this, or just be honest and tell the truth. And while it would be nice to not bring religion into this, I realise that cannot be done as if your religion says something and you are faithful then that is how you live and think, personal opinion is not an option.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaSo, Paul, who caught you looking at porn? ;P Paul Watson wrote: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Buggrit! And i was so hoping to be able to use my arrogant, snobbish opinion. Ah, well... It really does depend on who you are looking at, and what your reasons for doing so are. If, say, you're sneaking around the neighborhood peeking into peoples' windows, that's wrong. I'm also inclined to think that looking at porn - images designed to cause arousal, is degrading, as it trains the mind to focus solely on appearance. But this is also possible without nudity, so again the focus should be on the attitude involved. In truth, i can think of few instances where nudity would not be, at very least, in bad taste. Communal showers would be one, as practical considerations take priority. But overall, our society considers it a norm to be clothed, and so nudity is seen as a deviation, and thus frowned upon.
---------------- Shog9 ---------------- ------- Drink Coca-Cola ------- ---- Use SciTE ----
-
Simple question really: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? Obviously the question is relevant to seeing nudity in moderation. Anything taken to an obsession is harmful. Now currently in society we are still at the stage where there are those of us who do view the nude form but will vehemently deny it, even describe it as "digusting" just to avoid embarrasement, ridicule or stern words from others (who often are just doing what you are doing because it is the done thing.) So if thats you rather not reply to this, or just be honest and tell the truth. And while it would be nice to not bring religion into this, I realise that cannot be done as if your religion says something and you are faithful then that is how you live and think, personal opinion is not an option.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaI think our access to the mind of God is somewhat limited. I don't know of any religious text which mandates uncategorically that "Thou shall not look upon a naked human body or surely thou shalt burn in hell for all eternity". So who knows if it is a sin? The question, however, is whether or not a civilization has the authority to mandate standards and rules of conduct which the members of that society are obliged to adher to even if they might otherwise disagree with them. That is, do we have the authority to make things legal or illegal without regard to God's input on the issue? My answer to that question is "yes we do". If a culture deems nudity inappropriate for whatever reason, than it certainly has the authority to require certain standards of dress and as members of that culture we are duty bound to have some degree of respect for that standard. I'm not a real reverend, I just play one on CP.
-
Simple question really: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? Obviously the question is relevant to seeing nudity in moderation. Anything taken to an obsession is harmful. Now currently in society we are still at the stage where there are those of us who do view the nude form but will vehemently deny it, even describe it as "digusting" just to avoid embarrasement, ridicule or stern words from others (who often are just doing what you are doing because it is the done thing.) So if thats you rather not reply to this, or just be honest and tell the truth. And while it would be nice to not bring religion into this, I realise that cannot be done as if your religion says something and you are faithful then that is how you live and think, personal opinion is not an option.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaNo. There is a line where nudity and perversion are mixed. Strange but after being married several years I have seen my wife nude so often that seeing another woman nude doesn't really excite me. ( That could be age as well ) (No jokes about Viagra please) Also with children it is interesting that we must teach them often that to be seen nude by the other sex is wrong. I think we act differently to nudity because we are so unacusstomed to seeing it for a great part of our lives. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
-
Paul Watson wrote: do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Absolutely not. The human form, after all, is created in God's image and is therefore perfect. Viewing perfection can only lead to inspiration, except in the weak and perverse. One of the greatest evils in all of creation is the sick notion - fabricated solely by Man - that the sight of a naked body is sinful.
Roger Wright wrote: One of the greatest evils in all of creation is the sick notion - fabricated solely by Man - that the sight of a naked body is sinful. Ok, then can I see naked pictures of your wife? ;P I'm sure you get my point. <edit> I agree with you in that it is not a sin, but I wouldn't want someone else seeing my wife in the buff whether they call it art or not. </edit> Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
-
There's nothing more pleasurable than looking at the naked body of an attractive woman. Is it wrong? According to most religions yes, but I fail to see why. It does no harm to anyone. It gives you wicked thoughts yes, but as long as they remain thoughts and not actions then it's probably ok.
8
SIMON WALTON
SONORK ID 100.10024Simon Walton wrote: It does no harm to anyone. It gives you wicked thoughts yes, but as long as they remain thoughts and not actions then it's probably ok. Cool, I'll send you my address so you can send me naked pictures of your mom. :) No harm, no foul right? Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
-
Simon Walton wrote: It does no harm to anyone. It gives you wicked thoughts yes, but as long as they remain thoughts and not actions then it's probably ok. Cool, I'll send you my address so you can send me naked pictures of your mom. :) No harm, no foul right? Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
-
LOL! Not really, it's just a point I'm trying to make. :laugh: Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
-
Paul Watson wrote: do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Yes, i find it wrong/degrading. I think it's given by tradition, upbringing, christian roots of the society. Paul Watson wrote: Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? No, that's a nonsence. I don't mind about nutity in places as art works or movies where it has some meaning. Also I have nothing against commercial erotic, if both sides are doing it volunteerly and in place, where you can anticipate it. Of course it does'nt mean that I don't like to see a nice girl. But I find a fine clothed (or partially unclothed:)) woman 100 percent more erotic than a nude one. Pavel Sonork 100.15206
Pavel Klocek wrote: I don't mind about nutity in places as art works or movies where it has some meaning. As a side note, I believe nudity is nudity period. I can beat off to a painting on a wall or appreciate the photography skills involved in the quality of a playboy centerfold picture. So, what makes one more artsy than the other? Nothing. I mean by art's very definition, a slutty picture depicting sex could be art. People just like to justify their actions to the general public. Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
-
Simple question really: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? Obviously the question is relevant to seeing nudity in moderation. Anything taken to an obsession is harmful. Now currently in society we are still at the stage where there are those of us who do view the nude form but will vehemently deny it, even describe it as "digusting" just to avoid embarrasement, ridicule or stern words from others (who often are just doing what you are doing because it is the done thing.) So if thats you rather not reply to this, or just be honest and tell the truth. And while it would be nice to not bring religion into this, I realise that cannot be done as if your religion says something and you are faithful then that is how you live and think, personal opinion is not an option.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaPaul Watson wrote: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Nope. Do, I say it's art to excuse myself? Nope. Do I usually want to fuck a naked, attractive chick? Yup. Will others admit they're probably the same unless they lost their sex drive? Most won't. Paul Watson wrote: Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? Nope. A rapist is a rapist whether or not he/she sees the other person naked. Personally, I'd convince the chick what an intelligent person she'd be to have sex with me. :) Paul Watson wrote: Now currently in society we are still at the stage where there are those of us who do view the nude form but will vehemently deny it, Well, because of my religious upbringing (some values are hard to drop) and where I'm from, I say I wouldn't want someone like my wife being seen nude by someone else - period. Some chick that I don't care about... Then, I don't care. I think the whole chaste aspect is another way to display commitment and a bond between people in a marriage or serious relationship. It's considered indicative of this in many societies; therefore, IMO I see it as unacceptable in that context. Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
-
Roger Wright wrote: One of the greatest evils in all of creation is the sick notion - fabricated solely by Man - that the sight of a naked body is sinful. Ok, then can I see naked pictures of your wife? ;P I'm sure you get my point. <edit> I agree with you in that it is not a sin, but I wouldn't want someone else seeing my wife in the buff whether they call it art or not. </edit> Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
Jeremy Falcon wrote: I'm sure you get my point. No, I don't. If I had a wife, she would be welcome to share pictures of herself with you if she so chose. There would be no sin involved, merely a personal choice. If you then chose to allow yourself to indulge in thoughts judged sinful by your beliefs, the sin would be yours for the thinking, not hers for the sharing.
-
Jeremy Falcon wrote: I'm sure you get my point. No, I don't. If I had a wife, she would be welcome to share pictures of herself with you if she so chose. There would be no sin involved, merely a personal choice. If you then chose to allow yourself to indulge in thoughts judged sinful by your beliefs, the sin would be yours for the thinking, not hers for the sharing.
I should've stressed the word "I" I reckon. I know people are different, so I made the edit as if to say for me I wouldn't go for it. I can't imagine why someone would, but that's life ya know. Roger Wright wrote: If you then chose to allow yourself to indulge in thoughts judged sinful by your beliefs, the sin would be yours for the thinking, not hers for the sharing. Actually, I agree with this, but I wouldn't want my wife doing that. As per my beliefs, I view the naked body as sacred when in a committed relationship. Am I conservative in this aspect? Yup. :) Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
-
I should've stressed the word "I" I reckon. I know people are different, so I made the edit as if to say for me I wouldn't go for it. I can't imagine why someone would, but that's life ya know. Roger Wright wrote: If you then chose to allow yourself to indulge in thoughts judged sinful by your beliefs, the sin would be yours for the thinking, not hers for the sharing. Actually, I agree with this, but I wouldn't want my wife doing that. As per my beliefs, I view the naked body as sacred when in a committed relationship. Am I conservative in this aspect? Yup. :) Jeremy Falcon Imputek "In fact it is quite simple, men and women both only want one thing - what they can't have!" - phykell
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Am I conservative in this aspect? Yup There's nothing at all wrong with that, so long as your wife will put up with your quirky ways! :-D
-
Simple question really: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? Obviously the question is relevant to seeing nudity in moderation. Anything taken to an obsession is harmful. Now currently in society we are still at the stage where there are those of us who do view the nude form but will vehemently deny it, even describe it as "digusting" just to avoid embarrasement, ridicule or stern words from others (who often are just doing what you are doing because it is the done thing.) So if thats you rather not reply to this, or just be honest and tell the truth. And while it would be nice to not bring religion into this, I realise that cannot be done as if your religion says something and you are faithful then that is how you live and think, personal opinion is not an option.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaWell, I think everyone knows my religious position..... My wife goes walking with a friend from church some mornings at about 5:00 am. I have twice now wandered out in a daze and naked to find she got there and they decided not to go, so they were at the table having coffee ( because my wife often sleeps in my sons bed when he comes into ours, I have no way of knowing if she even went when I wake up, in a daze usually ). From my POV, it's not a big deal. If I was seeking to flash her my bits, or she was trying to get to see them, then there would be a problem related to the attitude one of us had towards the others. However, I don't think the sight of my dangly bits is something that is wrong in and of itself. I don't believe I have anything to inspire abject lust or scientific curiousity, just pretty much what every other fellow has. No big deal in my opinion. Christian Hey, at least Logo had, at it's inception, a mechanical turtle. VB has always lacked even that... - Shog9 04-09-2002 During last 10 years, with invention of VB and similar programming environments, every ill-educated moron became able to develop software. - Alex E. - 12-Sept-2002
-
No. There is a line where nudity and perversion are mixed. Strange but after being married several years I have seen my wife nude so often that seeing another woman nude doesn't really excite me. ( That could be age as well ) (No jokes about Viagra please) Also with children it is interesting that we must teach them often that to be seen nude by the other sex is wrong. I think we act differently to nudity because we are so unacusstomed to seeing it for a great part of our lives. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
Colin^Davies wrote: Also with children it is interesting that we must teach them often that to be seen nude by the other sex is wrong. I really hate it when people tell kids that it's 'dirty' to be naked. No, it's not. It's inappropriate for other people to see parts of your body which are private. I've always taken great care in how that is explained to my daughter. It's harder work to be honest, but I have no doubt you agree that it's the only way to go. Mind you, we had a prayer meeting at my house when Hannah was three, and she was sitting between two old ladies ( why she was up I don't know ). When our eyes opened, she was giving herself a full gyno exam. Now THAT was funny. Christian Hey, at least Logo had, at it's inception, a mechanical turtle. VB has always lacked even that... - Shog9 04-09-2002 During last 10 years, with invention of VB and similar programming environments, every ill-educated moron became able to develop software. - Alex E. - 12-Sept-2002
-
Paul Watson wrote: do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Yes. I don't have any reason for it.Maybe I think it is shameful. Mazy **"If I go crazy then will you still Call me Superman If I’m alive and well, will you be There holding my hand I’ll keep you by my side with My superhuman might Kryptonite"**Kryptonite-3 Doors Down
Mazdak wrote: Maybe I think it is shameful Shameful to who (the naked person or the viewer?), and why? I am by no means the worlds greatest looking guy, but I am not ashamed of my body. It is mine and of my making and to be ashamed of it would simply be undermining to me. It reflects my habits and ways in life, and if there is anything to be ashamed of, it is those habits and ways of life, not the flesh result of them. My girlfriend has a beautiful body and has nothing to be ashamed of. How does another viewing it confer shame to anyone? I am just curious :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
Paul Watson wrote: do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Yes, i find it wrong/degrading. I think it's given by tradition, upbringing, christian roots of the society. Paul Watson wrote: Do you think it leads to harmful thoughts or actions, perversions or other wrongful states? No, that's a nonsence. I don't mind about nutity in places as art works or movies where it has some meaning. Also I have nothing against commercial erotic, if both sides are doing it volunteerly and in place, where you can anticipate it. Of course it does'nt mean that I don't like to see a nice girl. But I find a fine clothed (or partially unclothed:)) woman 100 percent more erotic than a nude one. Pavel Sonork 100.15206
Pavel Klocek wrote: I don't mind about nutity in places as art works or movies where it has some meaning. Also I have nothing against commercial erotic, if both sides are doing it volunteerly and in place, where you can anticipate it. I am confused. What form or situation of nudity do you find, through social norms, degrading then? A topless lady on the beach? A nudist camp? Are those more degrading than commercial work or nudity in art? Aren't the nudist camp and nude beaches even more voluntary than commercial work where a girl maybe having to strip to earn a living?
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
Shog9 wrote: you've really got a thing for the older women, don't you! Great, I know my next question to you guys. And there is nothing wrong with older women IMO. Age is irrelevant, younger or older it means very little (obviously there are limits.)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
So, Paul, who caught you looking at porn? ;P Paul Watson wrote: In your humble opinion do you think it is wrong/sinful/evil/degrading to see another person - a stranger or someone who is not your wife/husband/lover/family - in the nude? Buggrit! And i was so hoping to be able to use my arrogant, snobbish opinion. Ah, well... It really does depend on who you are looking at, and what your reasons for doing so are. If, say, you're sneaking around the neighborhood peeking into peoples' windows, that's wrong. I'm also inclined to think that looking at porn - images designed to cause arousal, is degrading, as it trains the mind to focus solely on appearance. But this is also possible without nudity, so again the focus should be on the attitude involved. In truth, i can think of few instances where nudity would not be, at very least, in bad taste. Communal showers would be one, as practical considerations take priority. But overall, our society considers it a norm to be clothed, and so nudity is seen as a deviation, and thus frowned upon.
---------------- Shog9 ---------------- ------- Drink Coca-Cola ------- ---- Use SciTE ----
Shog9 wrote: So, Paul, who caught you looking at porn? :laugh: Actually I was feeling dead lazy on Saturday night and stayed up to watch the late night movie. It happened to be some cheesy soft-pron flick called Emmanuelle 2000: Sensual Pleasures. Janina had gone to bed and I was sitting there in the dark watching the daftest bunch of actors use any pretense to get naked. But the cop out was it was soft-soft-soft-pron so there was lots of jiggling, moaning and not much else. So it got me to thinking what the point of the movie was. Was it to bring up tough questions on the human form? Or was it just the lamest attempt at trying to arouse me? It turned out to be neither as I found myself switching over to CNN and watching more CNN than the actual movie. Shog9 wrote: If, say, you're sneaking around the neighborhood peeking into peoples' windows, that's wrong Oh for sure that is wrong. Not because of the nude aspect but because you are invading someones privacy. In my question I just made it a given that the nudity involved was a voluntary, consensual thing. As soon as you remove those two things then I think it is wrong, but then so are a lot of things wrong when they are not voluntary and consensual.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa -
I think our access to the mind of God is somewhat limited. I don't know of any religious text which mandates uncategorically that "Thou shall not look upon a naked human body or surely thou shalt burn in hell for all eternity". So who knows if it is a sin? The question, however, is whether or not a civilization has the authority to mandate standards and rules of conduct which the members of that society are obliged to adher to even if they might otherwise disagree with them. That is, do we have the authority to make things legal or illegal without regard to God's input on the issue? My answer to that question is "yes we do". If a culture deems nudity inappropriate for whatever reason, than it certainly has the authority to require certain standards of dress and as members of that culture we are duty bound to have some degree of respect for that standard. I'm not a real reverend, I just play one on CP.
Reverend Stan wrote: I don't know of any religious text which mandates uncategorically that "Thou shall not look upon a naked human body or surely thou shalt burn in hell for all eternity". So then why (and I pick Christianity because it is the religion I am closest to in my daily life) do Christians (preachers, followers etc.) preach that it is so wrong? Where do they get it from? Have they mangled the meaning behind Adam and Eve covering up? Is it just yet another example of Christianity being abused by us?
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South Africa