Four Fallacies of Smart People
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Christian Graus wrote:
I also pointed out that money gives me more freedom than a gun gives you. You had no reply.
Well people who can afford it drop a grand or two for a well made firearm.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Well people who can afford it drop a grand or two for a well made firearm.
So what ? I have indeed got the freedom to do that if I wanted to. The point is still, the freedom I have comes from money, and it's far greater than the freedom you get from owning a gun.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Well people who can afford it drop a grand or two for a well made firearm.
So what ? I have indeed got the freedom to do that if I wanted to. The point is still, the freedom I have comes from money, and it's far greater than the freedom you get from owning a gun.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
You don't get freedom from owning a gun. I have the freedom to own a gun, you don't. You are defenseless.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
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You don't get freedom from owning a gun. I have the freedom to own a gun, you don't. You are defenseless.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You don't get freedom from owning a gun.
OK, so you're saying you have no point at all ?
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
I have the freedom to own a gun, you don't.
As I am a farmer, that's actually not true. I have land and could get a gun if I wanted to.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You are defenseless.
You are a moron. I'll explain it to you again. If I was in my hotel in the US and it was invaded, I would have to assume the robbers had guns. Here, I would assume they do not. As such, here, I would happily defend myself with a block buster, or a piece of wood, or any of the other tools that I have around the property and the house. In the US, I would assume that I would get shot if I didn't hand over my wallet. In fact, most expert advice says that trying to use your gun in self defence is an excellent way to get killed. Therefore, I would be more defenceless in the US than I am here.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You don't get freedom from owning a gun.
OK, so you're saying you have no point at all ?
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
I have the freedom to own a gun, you don't.
As I am a farmer, that's actually not true. I have land and could get a gun if I wanted to.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You are defenseless.
You are a moron. I'll explain it to you again. If I was in my hotel in the US and it was invaded, I would have to assume the robbers had guns. Here, I would assume they do not. As such, here, I would happily defend myself with a block buster, or a piece of wood, or any of the other tools that I have around the property and the house. In the US, I would assume that I would get shot if I didn't hand over my wallet. In fact, most expert advice says that trying to use your gun in self defence is an excellent way to get killed. Therefore, I would be more defenceless in the US than I am here.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
Oh I get it. You know how to use a piece of wood or a brick, but not a gun. If someone invaded your home, what if they have a piece of wood or a brick? Man oh man, you just don't make any sense. Lets put it this way. You wouldn't try to rob a cop or something because he is well armed. Same goes for any other person. If you know someone is armed, you don't fuck with that person because chances are you will get shot real quick.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
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Oh I get it. You know how to use a piece of wood or a brick, but not a gun. If someone invaded your home, what if they have a piece of wood or a brick? Man oh man, you just don't make any sense. Lets put it this way. You wouldn't try to rob a cop or something because he is well armed. Same goes for any other person. If you know someone is armed, you don't fuck with that person because chances are you will get shot real quick.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You know how to use a piece of wood or a brick, but not a gun
It's not really the point. The point is, if I had a gun, and they had a gun, there would be a gunfight. Statistically, that's a good way to die of gun shot wounds.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
If someone invaded your home, what if they have a piece of wood or a brick?
I don't care. Sure, I might get hurt, but a guy with a gun, can kill me in an instant. A guy with a stick, chances are if I come out fighting, he'll just run for it, and if he doesn't, it's still probable that the fight, by virtue of how long it would take, would attract attention, and be stopped by the police. All I'd have to do, is hold him off and make noise.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You wouldn't try to rob a cop or something because he is well armed.
No, I wouldn't try to rob anyone.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
If you know someone is armed, you don't f*** with that person because chances are you will get shot real quick.
Exactly. So, if I get robbed in the US, I know he is probably armed, and I would follow your logic, and not mess with them. Even if I had a gun. A gun fight is just over too quickly to risk it. you've made my point. Thank you.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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1. The Egocentrism Fallacy: thinking that the world revolves, or at least should revolve, around you. Acting in ways that benefit your, regardless of how that behavior affects others. 2. The Omniscience Fallacy: believing that you know all there is to know and therefore do not have to listen to the advice and counsel of others 3. The Omnipotence Fallacy: believing that your intelligence and education somehow make you all-powerful. 4. The Invulnerability Fallacy: believing that you can do whatever you want and that others will never be able to hurt you or expose you. Yeah, Christan Graus thinks he is so superior with his money and perceived intellect. Next time he calls for forced sterilization of Africans and people that aren't moneyed think of the four fallacies of "smart" people. http://sayitbetter.typepad.com/say_it_better/2008/12/why-smart-people-can-be-so-stupid.html[^]
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You know how to use a piece of wood or a brick, but not a gun
It's not really the point. The point is, if I had a gun, and they had a gun, there would be a gunfight. Statistically, that's a good way to die of gun shot wounds.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
If someone invaded your home, what if they have a piece of wood or a brick?
I don't care. Sure, I might get hurt, but a guy with a gun, can kill me in an instant. A guy with a stick, chances are if I come out fighting, he'll just run for it, and if he doesn't, it's still probable that the fight, by virtue of how long it would take, would attract attention, and be stopped by the police. All I'd have to do, is hold him off and make noise.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You wouldn't try to rob a cop or something because he is well armed.
No, I wouldn't try to rob anyone.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
If you know someone is armed, you don't f*** with that person because chances are you will get shot real quick.
Exactly. So, if I get robbed in the US, I know he is probably armed, and I would follow your logic, and not mess with them. Even if I had a gun. A gun fight is just over too quickly to risk it. you've made my point. Thank you.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
Christian Graus wrote:
I don't care. Sure, I might get hurt, but a guy with a gun, can kill me in an instant. A guy with a stick, chances are if I come out fighting, he'll just run for it, and if he doesn't, it's still probable that the fight, by virtue of how long it would take, would attract attention, and be stopped by the police. All I'd have to do, is hold him off and make noise.
Did you hear about that family in Sydney that was bashed to death recently? The neighbours didn't hear anything.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You know how to use a piece of wood or a brick, but not a gun
It's not really the point. The point is, if I had a gun, and they had a gun, there would be a gunfight. Statistically, that's a good way to die of gun shot wounds.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
If someone invaded your home, what if they have a piece of wood or a brick?
I don't care. Sure, I might get hurt, but a guy with a gun, can kill me in an instant. A guy with a stick, chances are if I come out fighting, he'll just run for it, and if he doesn't, it's still probable that the fight, by virtue of how long it would take, would attract attention, and be stopped by the police. All I'd have to do, is hold him off and make noise.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You wouldn't try to rob a cop or something because he is well armed.
No, I wouldn't try to rob anyone.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
If you know someone is armed, you don't f*** with that person because chances are you will get shot real quick.
Exactly. So, if I get robbed in the US, I know he is probably armed, and I would follow your logic, and not mess with them. Even if I had a gun. A gun fight is just over too quickly to risk it. you've made my point. Thank you.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
Christian Graus wrote:
It's not really the point. The point is, if I had a gun, and they had a gun, there would be a gunfight. Statistically, that's a good way to die of gun shot wounds.
It only takes one shot to kill. Hypothetically you are out in your home during the economic collapse and some hungry ex-welfare recipients break into your home to take whatever they can. Well, you can protect your children and your food from a distance without being seen with a simple tool called a firearm. You need one. I don't think you have ever been in a situation where you feel helpless and in immediate danger. I think that will catalyze you more than anything else.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
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1. The Egocentrism Fallacy: thinking that the world revolves, or at least should revolve, around you. Acting in ways that benefit your, regardless of how that behavior affects others. 2. The Omniscience Fallacy: believing that you know all there is to know and therefore do not have to listen to the advice and counsel of others 3. The Omnipotence Fallacy: believing that your intelligence and education somehow make you all-powerful. 4. The Invulnerability Fallacy: believing that you can do whatever you want and that others will never be able to hurt you or expose you. Yeah, Christan Graus thinks he is so superior with his money and perceived intellect. Next time he calls for forced sterilization of Africans and people that aren't moneyed think of the four fallacies of "smart" people. http://sayitbetter.typepad.com/say_it_better/2008/12/why-smart-people-can-be-so-stupid.html[^]
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
Wrong - smart people tend to be more aware of their limitations. A fallacy of dumb people is the belief that they understand the minds of smart people.
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Christian Graus wrote:
I don't care. Sure, I might get hurt, but a guy with a gun, can kill me in an instant. A guy with a stick, chances are if I come out fighting, he'll just run for it, and if he doesn't, it's still probable that the fight, by virtue of how long it would take, would attract attention, and be stopped by the police. All I'd have to do, is hold him off and make noise.
Did you hear about that family in Sydney that was bashed to death recently? The neighbours didn't hear anything.
Ravel H. Joyce wrote:
Did you hear about that family in Sydney that was bashed to death recently? The neighbours didn't hear anything.
Right on, its necessary to have the capability to protect yourself and your family with the proper tools.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
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Christian Graus wrote:
It's not really the point. The point is, if I had a gun, and they had a gun, there would be a gunfight. Statistically, that's a good way to die of gun shot wounds.
It only takes one shot to kill. Hypothetically you are out in your home during the economic collapse and some hungry ex-welfare recipients break into your home to take whatever they can. Well, you can protect your children and your food from a distance without being seen with a simple tool called a firearm. You need one. I don't think you have ever been in a situation where you feel helpless and in immediate danger. I think that will catalyze you more than anything else.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
It only takes one shot to kill.
Precisely my point. So, better to be in a country where I can take someone on who does not have a gun, right ?
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Hypothetically you are out in your home during the economic collapse and some hungry ex-welfare recipients break into your home to take whatever they can.
See, there's no such thing as ex-welfare recipients here, either.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Well, you can protect your children and your food from a distance without being seen with a simple tool called a firearm. You need one.
Assuming I want to spend my days and nights looking at the window for intruders, yes. This is all a bizarre fantasy, it has no bearing on real life.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
I don't think you have ever been in a situation where you feel helpless and in immediate danger.
You'd be very wrong.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
I think that will catalyze you more than anything else.
No, it would not change the fact that I know that I am safer being attacked by a guy without a gun, than by a guy with a gun. Ergo, I am safer here in Australia, and better able to defend myself. As usual, you've ignored the points I've raised and meandered off on your own tangent.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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Wrong - smart people tend to be more aware of their limitations. A fallacy of dumb people is the belief that they understand the minds of smart people.
Ravel H. Joyce wrote:
Wrong - smart people tend to be more aware of their limitations.
What are yours?
Ravel H. Joyce wrote:
A fallacy of dumb people is the belief that they understand the minds of smart people.
Well, I'm smart so I know what I'm talking about.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
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Christian Graus wrote:
I don't care. Sure, I might get hurt, but a guy with a gun, can kill me in an instant. A guy with a stick, chances are if I come out fighting, he'll just run for it, and if he doesn't, it's still probable that the fight, by virtue of how long it would take, would attract attention, and be stopped by the police. All I'd have to do, is hold him off and make noise.
Did you hear about that family in Sydney that was bashed to death recently? The neighbours didn't hear anything.
Yes, I did. I'm not saying that sort of thing cannot or does not happen. I am saying that in situations like that, where you are taken by surprise, you're still better off if someone is trying to bash you, than shoot you, and you would be no better off from owning a gun. In any case, I thought they were thinking that it was a murder/suicide, or that a family member was somehow involved ? The ability of a disgruntled teen to kill their family and themselves, as often happens in the US with guns, and I've never heard of happening here, is one more reason not to own a gun. Would you like to be CSS's dad and have a gun in the house ? Didn't think so.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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Ravel H. Joyce wrote:
Did you hear about that family in Sydney that was bashed to death recently? The neighbours didn't hear anything.
Right on, its necessary to have the capability to protect yourself and your family with the proper tools.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
You can jerk off and fantasize about this all you want, but you are completely out of touch with reality. Guns in the home do not make you safer. On aggregate, they make you more likely to be killed by a family member, and being in a gun toting society makes you more likely to die in a home invasion or robbery attempt.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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Ravel H. Joyce wrote:
Wrong - smart people tend to be more aware of their limitations.
What are yours?
Ravel H. Joyce wrote:
A fallacy of dumb people is the belief that they understand the minds of smart people.
Well, I'm smart so I know what I'm talking about.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
So you are the one your post was referring to ? You're the one who is smart and ergo has the 'four fallacies of smart people' ?
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
It only takes one shot to kill.
Precisely my point. So, better to be in a country where I can take someone on who does not have a gun, right ?
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Hypothetically you are out in your home during the economic collapse and some hungry ex-welfare recipients break into your home to take whatever they can.
See, there's no such thing as ex-welfare recipients here, either.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Well, you can protect your children and your food from a distance without being seen with a simple tool called a firearm. You need one.
Assuming I want to spend my days and nights looking at the window for intruders, yes. This is all a bizarre fantasy, it has no bearing on real life.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
I don't think you have ever been in a situation where you feel helpless and in immediate danger.
You'd be very wrong.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
I think that will catalyze you more than anything else.
No, it would not change the fact that I know that I am safer being attacked by a guy without a gun, than by a guy with a gun. Ergo, I am safer here in Australia, and better able to defend myself. As usual, you've ignored the points I've raised and meandered off on your own tangent.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
I know I know... Less is more, weakness is strength, you live in a liberal socialist utopia.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
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Ravel H. Joyce wrote:
Wrong - smart people tend to be more aware of their limitations.
What are yours?
Ravel H. Joyce wrote:
A fallacy of dumb people is the belief that they understand the minds of smart people.
Well, I'm smart so I know what I'm talking about.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
What are yours?
I'm obviously not going to tell you that.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Well, I'm smart so I know what I'm talking about.
:laugh:
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I know I know... Less is more, weakness is strength, you live in a liberal socialist utopia.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
See how you keep repeating the same crap every time you realise you can't possibly debate your position with me ? This is the third time today we've run a thread to exhaustion because I answer your false accusations, and you have no come back.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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You can jerk off and fantasize about this all you want, but you are completely out of touch with reality. Guns in the home do not make you safer. On aggregate, they make you more likely to be killed by a family member, and being in a gun toting society makes you more likely to die in a home invasion or robbery attempt.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
Christian Graus wrote:
but you are completely out of touch with reality.
You are the one completely out of touch with reality. I am just glad some American's are holding on to the constitution and a free liberated natural normal independent self-sufficient self-empowered way of life ( now called terrorists ).
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949
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See how you keep repeating the same crap every time you realise you can't possibly debate your position with me ? This is the third time today we've run a thread to exhaustion because I answer your false accusations, and you have no come back.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
Christian Graus wrote:
and you have no come back.
Thats because you get into that weird false reality BS.
"The task of saving the earth's environment must and will become the central organizing principle of the post-Cold War world." Senator Al Gore Putting People First 1992 ------ "The sacrifice of personal existence is necessary to secure the preservation of the species." Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1923 ------ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." O'Brien to Winston George Orwell 1984 1949