dumb religious nonsense
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You really are a piece of work... You know that?
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Those without spiritual awakening generally cannot differentiate the difference between good and evil
The problem isn't differentiating between good and evil. The problem is oversimplifying and redefining them. There's no such thing as ABSOLUTE good or ABSOLUTE evil. Everything is a shade of gray, some darker and some lighter. Killing someone? Well, you might consider it evil, but what if someone is pointing an assault rifle at a bunch of innocents, and you put a bullet in his head? Is that still evil? Maybe it's the lesser of two evils, in which case you have to logically conclude that there are varying degrees of evil. Likewise, some "good" things are better than others, so there must also be varying degrees of good. Put them together, and there's your sliding scale. Now, you think only religious people can figure out where things lie on that scale? Personally, I think religions are the WORST at that particular task. The extremist Muslim sects are the popular targets these days, with their jihads on the western world. They think killing thousands of people is "good," kind of like the church thought the Crusaders were "good." To religion, good and evil are a matter of skin color and timing. How about atheists? Well, sure there are some immoral people among us, just like every other group, but being atheist doesn't make one incapable of recognizing "good" and "bad." It's called the golden rule. Do unto others, and all that... Don't need religion to follow that one. Just simple logic. So if you want to preach to us non-religious folks about morals, you better find a higher horse to sit on, because spirituality isn't going to win this argument.
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in?
Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels)Ian Shlasko wrote:
There's no such thing as ABSOLUTE good or ABSOLUTE evil. Everything is a shade of gray, some darker and some lighter. Killing someone? Well, you might consider it evil, but what if someone is pointing an assault rifle at a bunch of innocents, and you put a bullet in his head? Is that still evil? Maybe it's the lesser of two evils, in which case you have to logically conclude that there are varying degrees of evil. Likewise, some "good" things are better than others, so there must also be varying degrees of good. Put them together, and there's your sliding scale.
That's the kind of argument I hear for people who want to torture or hold people indefinitely. It's one or the other. Doing bad things doesn't absolve you of the consequences to your mind. Getting the okay from your society to kill people of another society doesn't make it okay, it just removes the punishment from your society. That's supposed to make it okay, but it doesn't. I can accept that I did something wrong, accept the consequences of it both personally and from society. There is of course a difference between breaking the law and what is moral and just. The law is not a substitute for morality or justice. Laws just provide a way for society to punish people for breaking societal rules. They don't have to be mine or yours for the action to be good or bad. There of course is a rub between society and the individual.
Ian Shlasko wrote:
So if you want to preach to us non-religious folks about morals, you better find a higher horse to sit on, because spirituality isn't going to win this argument.
His morals are based on what he can get from other people. The points of view he subscribes to are just his ways to justify his taking of what he perceives he's earned. It's a lot of complaining for not a whole lot of earning. He talks a lot about how we all need to wake up about the elitists and the conspiracies that abound in his view of the world, but not a single time does he pause for doubt and humility before telling us off. Some how he must posses some form of intellect that we don't for why else would we just not get it. If anyone here thinks he's better than anyone it is CSS.
That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Those without spiritual awakening generally cannot differentiate the difference between good and evil, and that is the major flaw that enables society to degenerate into hell on earth, and enables those who are willing and capable to commit crimes against humanity.
Funny, the religious people seem more tied up about gays and abortion than anything else, and there is far worse than either in this world.
Well, those are relevant topics. It is considered immoral to kill a baby. The majority of homosexuals are not born, they make the choice to be sexually deviant. If you look at the facts most homosexuals tend to have STDs, support corrupt government. This is immoral. A real homosexual is born with hormonal imbalances that make the body feel as if it is of the opposite sex, and therfore naturally that person becomes attracted to what the body and mind feels is the opposite sex when in fact it is the same sex. This is not immoral.
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no, I was just pointing out that what you should have said was "without the ability to differentiate between good and evil**,** slavery will remain a problem, and become an even bigger problem." And I wasn't trying to counter your argument because I didn't really care what you were saying. I just assumed it was nonsense and not worth a response. You do realize that in the Old Testament, the Jews had slaves. They had been provided with the 10 commandments from God and therefore knew the difference between good and evil and still had enslaved entire ethnic and religious groups. Being able to differentiate between good and evil does not remove slavery from society. Nor does the fact that you think you are currently enslaved mean that you actually are.
William Winner wrote:
You do realize that in the Old Testament, the Jews had slaves. They had been provided with the 10 commandments from God and therefore knew the difference between good and evil and still had enslaved entire ethnic and religious groups.
Stop! Blasphemer! :laugh:
That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Why was the person pointing the gun? What did the sniper know about the person and the people that person was pointing the gun at? Absolute full details are required to make proper judgment.
You just proved my point. Thanks.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
People claim to be religious because they go to some church or read a bible. That doesn't mean the person is spiritually awakened. A strong sense of morality and a strong connection with the creator and the greater universe might mean you are spiritually awakened. It is a channel of consciousness that cannot be described with words, it can only be experienced. You will never understand what it means to be spiritually awakened and that is something to be pittied.
That's a specious argument. If you can't define this "channel of consciousness," you can't actually determine whether someone has experienced it. For all you know, I HAVE experienced it, without any sort of theistic belief. And if you define the experience itself as belief in a higher power, then it's circular reasoning and equally invalid. If I was formerly religious and "lost my faith," as they call it, you would have just argued that i wasn't really spiritual in the first place. If you want to convince a programmer, try a logical argument instead of an unfalsifiable statement.
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in?
Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels)Ian Shlasko wrote:
If you can't define this "channel of consciousness," you can't actually determine whether someone has experienced it.
You know if you have experienced it. You can't miss it, and you will remember it, and if you exercise it you will continue to experience it. I find it when I take a long walk in the large natural forest and spend time with nature, alone. I also find it when I look up at the stars and study the universe. You really can't do either in New York, the light pollution drowns out all the stars and there are no forests near by. Take a trip to a national forest and walk the trails alone, or go somewhere where you can see all of the stars in the sky and just sit there looking up at the sky for a few hours. Have you ever seen the sky full of stars? I doubt you have, the entire sky is bright with stars, millions of them.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Why was the person pointing the gun? What did the sniper know about the person and the people that person was pointing the gun at? Absolute full details are required to make proper judgment.
You just proved my point. Thanks.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
People claim to be religious because they go to some church or read a bible. That doesn't mean the person is spiritually awakened. A strong sense of morality and a strong connection with the creator and the greater universe might mean you are spiritually awakened. It is a channel of consciousness that cannot be described with words, it can only be experienced. You will never understand what it means to be spiritually awakened and that is something to be pittied.
That's a specious argument. If you can't define this "channel of consciousness," you can't actually determine whether someone has experienced it. For all you know, I HAVE experienced it, without any sort of theistic belief. And if you define the experience itself as belief in a higher power, then it's circular reasoning and equally invalid. If I was formerly religious and "lost my faith," as they call it, you would have just argued that i wasn't really spiritual in the first place. If you want to convince a programmer, try a logical argument instead of an unfalsifiable statement.
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in?
Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels)Ian Shlasko wrote:
That's a specious argument. If you can't define this "channel of consciousness," you can't actually determine whether someone has experienced it.
Unless you've gotten high I doubt this is possible for anyone. :laugh:
That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_
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no, I was just pointing out that what you should have said was "without the ability to differentiate between good and evil**,** slavery will remain a problem, and become an even bigger problem." And I wasn't trying to counter your argument because I didn't really care what you were saying. I just assumed it was nonsense and not worth a response. You do realize that in the Old Testament, the Jews had slaves. They had been provided with the 10 commandments from God and therefore knew the difference between good and evil and still had enslaved entire ethnic and religious groups. Being able to differentiate between good and evil does not remove slavery from society. Nor does the fact that you think you are currently enslaved mean that you actually are.
William Winner wrote:
You do realize that in the Old Testament, the Jews had slaves. They had been provided with the 10 commandments from God and therefore knew the difference between good and evil and still had enslaved entire ethnic and religious groups.
Again, you don't find spiritual awakening for a damn book. The bibles of the world are irrelevent to this discussion. You can't learn right from wrong by being told or taught, it comes from within.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
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Ian Shlasko wrote:
That's a specious argument. If you can't define this "channel of consciousness," you can't actually determine whether someone has experienced it.
Unless you've gotten high I doubt this is possible for anyone. :laugh:
That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_
:laugh:
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in?
Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels) -
Ian Shlasko wrote:
If you can't define this "channel of consciousness," you can't actually determine whether someone has experienced it.
You know if you have experienced it. You can't miss it, and you will remember it, and if you exercise it you will continue to experience it. I find it when I take a long walk in the large natural forest and spend time with nature, alone. I also find it when I look up at the stars and study the universe. You really can't do either in New York, the light pollution drowns out all the stars and there are no forests near by. Take a trip to a national forest and walk the trails alone, or go somewhere where you can see all of the stars in the sky and just sit there looking up at the sky for a few hours. Have you ever seen the sky full of stars? I doubt you have, the entire sky is bright with stars, millions of them.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You know if you have experienced it. You can't miss it, and you will remember it, and if you exercise it you will continue to experience it.
How do you know I haven't experienced it?
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Take a trip to a national forest and walk the trails alone, or go somewhere where you can see all of the stars in the sky and just sit there looking up at the sky for a few hours. Have you ever seen the sky full of stars? I doubt you have, the entire sky is bright with stars, millions of them.
Save your doubts, pizza boy. Living in NYC doesn't mean I've spent my entire life here. Hell, I didn't even grow up in the city. Anyway, you want a sky full of stars, take a trip way up north, say to Alaska... Get out of the major cities, pitch a tent by a lake, and look up. Millions of stars, the faint white blur of the milky way drawing a stripe across the sky, and if you go up at the right time, a colorful glow on the horizon from the aurora borealis. Yes, it's breathtaking, but it has nothing to do with spirituality. Then again, that was nothing compared to what I felt when I finished my first novel. That's a feeling I haven't been able to duplicate since, such a rush that I don't think any amount of sex, drugs, or rock 'n roll could even come close to simulating it. Again, nothing to do with spirituality. So like I said... Get off your high horse and try a sensible argument, because this isn't going to cut it.
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in?
Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels) -
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You know if you have experienced it. You can't miss it, and you will remember it, and if you exercise it you will continue to experience it.
How do you know I haven't experienced it?
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Take a trip to a national forest and walk the trails alone, or go somewhere where you can see all of the stars in the sky and just sit there looking up at the sky for a few hours. Have you ever seen the sky full of stars? I doubt you have, the entire sky is bright with stars, millions of them.
Save your doubts, pizza boy. Living in NYC doesn't mean I've spent my entire life here. Hell, I didn't even grow up in the city. Anyway, you want a sky full of stars, take a trip way up north, say to Alaska... Get out of the major cities, pitch a tent by a lake, and look up. Millions of stars, the faint white blur of the milky way drawing a stripe across the sky, and if you go up at the right time, a colorful glow on the horizon from the aurora borealis. Yes, it's breathtaking, but it has nothing to do with spirituality. Then again, that was nothing compared to what I felt when I finished my first novel. That's a feeling I haven't been able to duplicate since, such a rush that I don't think any amount of sex, drugs, or rock 'n roll could even come close to simulating it. Again, nothing to do with spirituality. So like I said... Get off your high horse and try a sensible argument, because this isn't going to cut it.
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in?
Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels)Rushes and highs do not compensate for a spiritual awakening. I suppose you will never experience that, I pity you.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Religion is a necessity, those without religion we are incomplete.
As someone who's never paid attention to much of anything for much more than a month(with two exceptions) I have to say you're full of it. I'll admit, at one point I thought I might be missing out on something, so I looked into the lot of those religions people follow, and some no one does anymore, all I found were a bunch of hokey old myths and the odd decent idea I hadn't bothered to consider. Nothing worth worshiping by any means. Since reaching that I've actually been quite content, far more than when I was mewling along with something I didn't believe just to belong. I have to say, I think humanity may be out growing religion. At this point we've defeated most of the obstacle which religion was useful in causing us to avoid, and now it's simply holding us back with the weight of tradition and familiarity. I've found common decency to be far more effective than spirituality.
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Rushes and highs do not compensate for a spiritual awakening. I suppose you will never experience that, I pity you.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
Again, how do you know I haven't experienced such an "awakening?" You can't possibly know, unless you define it as the belief in a higher power, in which case, as I said, it's circular reasoning and completely irrelevant.
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in?
Author of the Guardians Saga (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novels) -
clickety[^] As a planet we really have a long way to go. I can't imagine any sufficiently advanced race from another planet would be religious. Stupid stuff like this would get in the way of getting here. Any society that spends this much time worrying about things this vapid don't generally go far. This isn't the first article, but come on. I'm not picking on Islam either. The Catholic church needs to get with it too, especially with crap like the pedophile priests, and excommunicating people who disagree with them. end rant
That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_
wolfbinary wrote:
I can't imagine any sufficiently advanced race from another planet would be religious.
I saw a bumper sticker the other day that said 'religious feeling is a mental disease'. I love all these examples of how closed minded and biggoted extreme athiests are.
wolfbinary wrote:
Stupid stuff like this would get in the way of getting here.
Yeah, if the chicks on that planet can't wear tight pants, how will the space ships work ?
wolfbinary wrote:
Any society that spends this much time worrying about things this vapid don't generally go far.
Well, I do tend to agree that the link is stupid, and that Islam in particular flies in the face of everything that God is about ( free will for a start ).
wolfbinary wrote:
The Catholic church needs to get with it too, especially with crap like the pedophile priests, and excommunicating people who disagree with them.
The pedo priests are perhaps an example of how totally wrong the Catholic church is, not because they condone it, but because they protect their power structure before they protect their flock. The basic issue you have is that you're not talking about God, or religion, you're talking about humans who are doing stupid or wrong things. None of these people prove there is no God by their own stupidity.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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wolfbinary wrote:
The Catholic church needs to get with it too, especially with crap like the pedophile priests, and excommunicating people who disagree with them.
How about Australia and the US not allowing the money we give to Africa as aid to be spent on condoms?
Are we jumping on that bandwagon, too ? I thought we had more sense than that.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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They aren't going to fucking use condoms. Use your brain for a minute.
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Not if they don't have any, obviously.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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Not if they don't have any, obviously.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
You forgot CG, these are usually black people, and as CSS has said before, they are barely above animals and not god's chosen race. Typing that made me feel dirty.
If I have accidentally said something witty, smart, or correct, it is purely by mistake and I apologize for it.
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Well, those are relevant topics. It is considered immoral to kill a baby. The majority of homosexuals are not born, they make the choice to be sexually deviant. If you look at the facts most homosexuals tend to have STDs, support corrupt government. This is immoral. A real homosexual is born with hormonal imbalances that make the body feel as if it is of the opposite sex, and therfore naturally that person becomes attracted to what the body and mind feels is the opposite sex when in fact it is the same sex. This is not immoral.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Well, those are relevant topics. It is considered immoral to kill a baby.
And also immoral to use a condom so that you never had to kill the baby or have it get a disease, or have it born into a situation where you can't afford it. I guess using a condom if you are on welfare is still evil even if you know having a baby would be a drain and you could not afford it.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
The majority of homosexuals are not born, they make the choice to be sexually deviant. If you look at the facts most homosexuals tend to have STDs, support corrupt government. This is immoral.
How many people make a choice to be hated by people, not allowed to share the same things with the people they love, etc... So STDs somehow make you immoral. Darn. I know a few women that had normal sex that are apparently immoral. A few became immoral with their husands. I like adding the corrupt government in there. As if somehow this has anything to do with anything.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
A real homosexual is born with hormonal imbalances that make the body feel as if it is of the opposite sex, and therfore naturally that person becomes attracted to what the body and mind feels is the opposite sex when in fact it is the same sex. This is not immoral.
And how can you tell the difference between the previous category and this one?
If I have accidentally said something witty, smart, or correct, it is purely by mistake and I apologize for it.
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William Winner wrote:
You do realize that in the Old Testament, the Jews had slaves. They had been provided with the 10 commandments from God and therefore knew the difference between good and evil and still had enslaved entire ethnic and religious groups.
Again, you don't find spiritual awakening for a damn book. The bibles of the world are irrelevent to this discussion. You can't learn right from wrong by being told or taught, it comes from within.
Invisible Empire: A New World Order Defined (High Quality 2:14:01)[^] Watch the Fall of the Republic (High Quality 2:24:19)[^] The Truthbox[^]
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You can't learn right from wrong by being told or taught, it comes from within.
Which means you aren't even talking about spirituality, you are talking about an innate moral compass. Which most people have, regardless of religion, race, sexual preference, or nationality. It's the people without one of these that can't tell the difference. Most of us call them psychopaths. So why are you bringing spirituality into this at all as if it was important? An innate connection to a higher being means nothing to whether or not you give a flying eff if you are being "evil."
If I have accidentally said something witty, smart, or correct, it is purely by mistake and I apologize for it.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You can't learn right from wrong by being told or taught, it comes from within.
Which means you aren't even talking about spirituality, you are talking about an innate moral compass. Which most people have, regardless of religion, race, sexual preference, or nationality. It's the people without one of these that can't tell the difference. Most of us call them psychopaths. So why are you bringing spirituality into this at all as if it was important? An innate connection to a higher being means nothing to whether or not you give a flying eff if you are being "evil."
If I have accidentally said something witty, smart, or correct, it is purely by mistake and I apologize for it.
ragnaroknrol wrote:
Which means you aren't even talking about spirituality, you are talking about an innate moral compass. Which most people have, regardless of religion, race, sexual preference, or nationality.
I"m astounded how many people think otherwise. Someone recently told me that God must have given Adam and Eve the 10 commandments b/c otherwise how was it wrong for Cain to kill Abel ? Well, there is no society on earth that does not say murder is wrong.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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You forgot CG, these are usually black people, and as CSS has said before, they are barely above animals and not god's chosen race. Typing that made me feel dirty.
If I have accidentally said something witty, smart, or correct, it is purely by mistake and I apologize for it.
Yeah, I forgot all about that. Stupid me.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
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Josh Gray wrote:
How about Australia and the US not allowing the money we give to Africa as aid to be spent on condoms?
Well they're not very filling or nutricious Josh.
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004