Incredible Karyn, part deux
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David Wulff wrote: Could it work? <Taking the piss> Yeah and then once they saw some money trickle in we can manipulate them in to upgrading to the Supremo Deluxo El Money Grando options. Obviously they could not afford it initially so we would offer them special loans and credit options with the thought that in the future they could pay off the debt... </Taking the piss> ;P To be honest though I don't think encouraging people to solve their debt problems by donations is a good idea. They got into debt on their own and should get out of it on their own, part of growing up. A Beating Debt Habits website would be a good idea though.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: To be honest though I don't think encouraging people to solve their debt problems by donations is a good idea. <joke> I wasn't thinking so much about helping other people solve their debt problems, I was thinking more along the lines of using them to solve mine... (not that I currently have any mind you). I mean these guys are going go bankrupt anywayy, so you might as well get something off them while you can. </joke> Paul Watson wrote: A Beating Debt Habits website would be a good idea though If people can't see the logic behind not spending money they don't have, they'll never learn.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
"Life, as well as software, has bugs." - Roger Wright
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Paul Watson wrote: To be honest though I don't think encouraging people to solve their debt problems by donations is a good idea. <joke> I wasn't thinking so much about helping other people solve their debt problems, I was thinking more along the lines of using them to solve mine... (not that I currently have any mind you). I mean these guys are going go bankrupt anywayy, so you might as well get something off them while you can. </joke> Paul Watson wrote: A Beating Debt Habits website would be a good idea though If people can't see the logic behind not spending money they don't have, they'll never learn.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
"Life, as well as software, has bugs." - Roger Wright
David Wulff wrote: If people can't see the logic behind not spending money they don't have, they'll never learn. Come on David that is crap. I started getting into debt without really thinking much about it. Suddenly I realised with help from my mum where I was headed and did a big clamp down. Still have to be careful. And so much of our western culture is based on spending money we don't have. Consumerism is so powerful. All those adverts, the peer pressure, the picket fences and fancy cars. Not saying people are not to blame for their debt... just saying that a: it can be turned around a b: it is not just a fools trap.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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David Wulff wrote: If people can't see the logic behind not spending money they don't have, they'll never learn. Come on David that is crap. I started getting into debt without really thinking much about it. Suddenly I realised with help from my mum where I was headed and did a big clamp down. Still have to be careful. And so much of our western culture is based on spending money we don't have. Consumerism is so powerful. All those adverts, the peer pressure, the picket fences and fancy cars. Not saying people are not to blame for their debt... just saying that a: it can be turned around a b: it is not just a fools trap.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: just saying that a: it can be turned around a b: it is not just a fools trap. But even you needed help in recognizing your problem. If that is accomplished, then there is hope. Paul Watson wrote: And so much of our western culture is based on spending money we don't have. Ah, well... spending money anyway. Ideally, you don't want customers actually spending money they don't have and won't get; at worst, you'll try and get a chunk of each paycheck, but you don't want to drive them under either - parasites that kill their hosts have a harder time than those that don't. Shog9 ------
Rather hammer futiley at the locked door than just sit and ignore it. Obviously finding a way to get through the locked door would be even better though. - Paul Watson, My Ignorance
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David Wulff wrote: Could it work? <Taking the piss> Yeah and then once they saw some money trickle in we can manipulate them in to upgrading to the Supremo Deluxo El Money Grando options. Obviously they could not afford it initially so we would offer them special loans and credit options with the thought that in the future they could pay off the debt... </Taking the piss> ;P To be honest though I don't think encouraging people to solve their debt problems by donations is a good idea. They got into debt on their own and should get out of it on their own, part of growing up. A Beating Debt Habits website would be a good idea though.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Paul Watson wrote: To be honest though I don't think encouraging people to solve their debt problems by donations is a good idea. They got into debt on their own and should get out of it on their own, part of growing up. but surely that is exactly what charities such as Oxfam and the like do for Africa? It's only a question of scale. Michael Life’s not a song. Life isn’t bliss. Life is just this. It’s living. -- Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Once more, with feeling
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How about setting up a web site where people in debt can have their own page to put their pleas accross, and which provides all the standard doohickies like chat boards, secure payment methods, progress meters, etc? You'd take a small percentage of any donations of course to pay fo the site and to make a small profit. So long as it had some kind of vetting procedure to ensure the people taking part in the plea making were geniune cases (i.e. they had to provide faxes of bank documents, credit card cancellation confirmation documents, etc.), it could be quite effective. Could it work?
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
"Life, as well as software, has bugs." - Roger Wright
I don't know. There would almost certainly be people who'd take advantage of it. One of my housemates at uni used to go out drinking every night, all night, and thus never had any money whatsoever. He went to the university wellfare department, pleaded with them that he was too poor to pay his rent and buy food, and they effectively said "oh, you poor thing" (*not* maybe it's because you spend so much money on drink) and gave him a couple of hundred pounds. Which he promptly spent on a new graphics card for his PC! :omg: -- Help me! I'm turning into a grapefruit!
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Paul Watson wrote: To be honest though I don't think encouraging people to solve their debt problems by donations is a good idea. <joke> I wasn't thinking so much about helping other people solve their debt problems, I was thinking more along the lines of using them to solve mine... (not that I currently have any mind you). I mean these guys are going go bankrupt anywayy, so you might as well get something off them while you can. </joke> Paul Watson wrote: A Beating Debt Habits website would be a good idea though If people can't see the logic behind not spending money they don't have, they'll never learn.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
"Life, as well as software, has bugs." - Roger Wright
What's worse is being charged for spending money you don't have (overdrafts and credit cards) when you do have it (locked away in non-instant access high intrest savings accounts) It's rediculous. I'm probably going to have to ask my bank to extend my overdraft so I can buy stuff for christmas, even though there's plenty of money in my savings, I just can't get at it for 3 months -- Help me! I'm turning into a grapefruit!
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Paul Watson wrote: To be honest though I don't think encouraging people to solve their debt problems by donations is a good idea. They got into debt on their own and should get out of it on their own, part of growing up. but surely that is exactly what charities such as Oxfam and the like do for Africa? It's only a question of scale. Michael Life’s not a song. Life isn’t bliss. Life is just this. It’s living. -- Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Once more, with feeling
Michael P Butler wrote: but surely that is exactly what charities such as Oxfam and the like do for Africa? It's only a question of scale. I totally agree and it is why I am against all this foreign monetary aid. We need skills and management, not money. We are not learning anything from the billions sent to us.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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David Wulff wrote: If people can't see the logic behind not spending money they don't have, they'll never learn. Come on David that is crap. I started getting into debt without really thinking much about it. Suddenly I realised with help from my mum where I was headed and did a big clamp down. Still have to be careful. And so much of our western culture is based on spending money we don't have. Consumerism is so powerful. All those adverts, the peer pressure, the picket fences and fancy cars. Not saying people are not to blame for their debt... just saying that a: it can be turned around a b: it is not just a fools trap.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
Come with me ona tour round the suberbs of Tivvy this fine afternoon, and I'll point out the houses, cars and children due to be repossessed during the next, say, month. We have constant information bombarded through our letter box from debt-reduction agencies, the CAB (Citizens Advice Buero if I could spell it :-O). We've even had a target campaign stating "You are in debt act now!". And yet what do you read about every week in the local paper? "Family struggle to repay debts", "Ex-poutry worker fights off creditors", etc. People seem to find it very hard to make that initial connection that "oh look, maybe I can't really afford to pay off another £50 a month" like it seems you did. That requires common sense, and we all know how common that is. :(( That argument about peer pressure only applies to those that are fooled by it. Even since I have been earning I still haven't bought a games console, I don't upgrade my PC unless I notice it lagging behind an acceptable level, I don't have a flash BMW (not that I'd ever buy one anyway mind you), I don't have a monthly billed mobile phone account, instead opting for the pre-paid approach, I don't have the latest Air Max trainers (sneakers to any Yanks). In fact, to this date I have yet to aquire anything on credit that has not been paid for immeadiately and in full . I just can't see the logic behind spending money you wont have for another six months. What happens if you loose you job? You loose, unless you cna make the difference up somehow. I spend my money on things I need: food, clothing, alcohol, and the basic bills like telephone and electric. I don't need to pay rent, but I'll usually chip in there too if mum and dad want to do something special and need their own money. This girl (Karyn) didn't get into debt paying off a mortgage or death duties, she got into debt through unecessary habit and spending. The only time I would ever put myself into debt deliberately was if it was absolutely necessary, such as for purchasing a house, and then at least the debt it secured in your property not your other assets should you be faced with difficulties.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
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Come with me ona tour round the suberbs of Tivvy this fine afternoon, and I'll point out the houses, cars and children due to be repossessed during the next, say, month. We have constant information bombarded through our letter box from debt-reduction agencies, the CAB (Citizens Advice Buero if I could spell it :-O). We've even had a target campaign stating "You are in debt act now!". And yet what do you read about every week in the local paper? "Family struggle to repay debts", "Ex-poutry worker fights off creditors", etc. People seem to find it very hard to make that initial connection that "oh look, maybe I can't really afford to pay off another £50 a month" like it seems you did. That requires common sense, and we all know how common that is. :(( That argument about peer pressure only applies to those that are fooled by it. Even since I have been earning I still haven't bought a games console, I don't upgrade my PC unless I notice it lagging behind an acceptable level, I don't have a flash BMW (not that I'd ever buy one anyway mind you), I don't have a monthly billed mobile phone account, instead opting for the pre-paid approach, I don't have the latest Air Max trainers (sneakers to any Yanks). In fact, to this date I have yet to aquire anything on credit that has not been paid for immeadiately and in full . I just can't see the logic behind spending money you wont have for another six months. What happens if you loose you job? You loose, unless you cna make the difference up somehow. I spend my money on things I need: food, clothing, alcohol, and the basic bills like telephone and electric. I don't need to pay rent, but I'll usually chip in there too if mum and dad want to do something special and need their own money. This girl (Karyn) didn't get into debt paying off a mortgage or death duties, she got into debt through unecessary habit and spending. The only time I would ever put myself into debt deliberately was if it was absolutely necessary, such as for purchasing a house, and then at least the debt it secured in your property not your other assets should you be faced with difficulties.
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
"L
I hear all of what you are saying. The only thing I want to say is that debt can be turned around no matter who you are but that the way is not how Karyn did it. She as you pointed out did not solve the cause, she simply covered the effect. She will be back in debt over and over until one day she breaks her bad habits. And all those pamphlets and stuff... that is not where we need to be teaching money management. Most of that stuff is spam anyway, I delete about 5 Consolodate Debt/Reduce Debt/No More Debt emails a day. We need to teach this stuff in schools as part of Life Skills. p.s. I have a car which I could never have paid off in full right off the bat. Some debt you have to get into before you can start making money even. Jsut be careful though of course :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaColin Davies wrote: ...can you imagine a John Simmons stalker !
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How about setting up a web site where people in debt can have their own page to put their pleas accross, and which provides all the standard doohickies like chat boards, secure payment methods, progress meters, etc? You'd take a small percentage of any donations of course to pay fo the site and to make a small profit. So long as it had some kind of vetting procedure to ensure the people taking part in the plea making were geniune cases (i.e. they had to provide faxes of bank documents, credit card cancellation confirmation documents, etc.), it could be quite effective. Could it work?
David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk
"Life, as well as software, has bugs." - Roger Wright