FAAAAARK!!!!!
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Finally got my first interview yesterday for a Senior Consultant role after nearly 4 months. It wasn't a pure development role and I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway. I had most of the requested skills and was put forward to the interview. Skills found below- Required C++ - Yes Transact SQL - Yes Architecture Solutions - Yes Leading/Mentoring - Yes Evaluating Emerging Tech. - Yes Data Migration Experience - Yes Excellent Presentation - Yes Excellent Communications - Yes Unix Shell Scripting - Minimal Would Like Java - No e-Solution - No Now they knew all of this before I had the interview. I was only asked about skills with a Yes next to them. Went on for 1.5 hours, got a really good vibe from them. All the "What do you want in a..." type questions I answered truthfully and as it turned out was what they were providing. I got no questions that tested my technical knowledge of anything, I just had to justify anything I had said in my résumé or explain how I would do something like migrate data from one DB to another and how would I verify it. They were going to call the agent yesterday afternoon and she would then call me. I didn't get the call till this morning. They had spent well into the evening debating whether to take me on. Eventually this morning they ring the agent with a "He is a perfect fit for the team, but we feel we need someone who can hit the ground running as we are a small organisation". After probing the agent to determine what that meant as I thought maybe I had given a bad impression or hadn't gotten across to them my abilities in C++, SQL, Data migration, technical solutions etc. I get told, "No, they were impressed with what you had done and your performance in the interview. But when entering everything in the matrix you came up short. They wanted to find another position for you but none existed.". Still not satisfied I probe further (Cartman anal probe style) and finally get told they "Feel my lack of Java, Unix Shell and e-Solution skills would stop me from getting up to speed quick enough.". My problem with this is that they knew I had minimal Unix Shell but wanted to interview me anyway. The Java/e-Solution shit was a nice to have but fuck it we will teach you this and we are porting from C++ to Java in the near future. FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK,
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Finally got my first interview yesterday for a Senior Consultant role after nearly 4 months. It wasn't a pure development role and I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway. I had most of the requested skills and was put forward to the interview. Skills found below- Required C++ - Yes Transact SQL - Yes Architecture Solutions - Yes Leading/Mentoring - Yes Evaluating Emerging Tech. - Yes Data Migration Experience - Yes Excellent Presentation - Yes Excellent Communications - Yes Unix Shell Scripting - Minimal Would Like Java - No e-Solution - No Now they knew all of this before I had the interview. I was only asked about skills with a Yes next to them. Went on for 1.5 hours, got a really good vibe from them. All the "What do you want in a..." type questions I answered truthfully and as it turned out was what they were providing. I got no questions that tested my technical knowledge of anything, I just had to justify anything I had said in my résumé or explain how I would do something like migrate data from one DB to another and how would I verify it. They were going to call the agent yesterday afternoon and she would then call me. I didn't get the call till this morning. They had spent well into the evening debating whether to take me on. Eventually this morning they ring the agent with a "He is a perfect fit for the team, but we feel we need someone who can hit the ground running as we are a small organisation". After probing the agent to determine what that meant as I thought maybe I had given a bad impression or hadn't gotten across to them my abilities in C++, SQL, Data migration, technical solutions etc. I get told, "No, they were impressed with what you had done and your performance in the interview. But when entering everything in the matrix you came up short. They wanted to find another position for you but none existed.". Still not satisfied I probe further (Cartman anal probe style) and finally get told they "Feel my lack of Java, Unix Shell and e-Solution skills would stop me from getting up to speed quick enough.". My problem with this is that they knew I had minimal Unix Shell but wanted to interview me anyway. The Java/e-Solution shit was a nice to have but fuck it we will teach you this and we are porting from C++ to Java in the near future. FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK,
Yes we hear you. With all of the talk of millions of unemployed IT workers it is amazing how many think they can find someone who has experience in everything is under 30 and will work for minimum wage. PS I did hear one manager at a company that I was visting last week state the above to be true. Take care:suss: Good ideas are not adopted automatically. They must be driven into practice with courageous patients. -Admiral Rickover. ...
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Finally got my first interview yesterday for a Senior Consultant role after nearly 4 months. It wasn't a pure development role and I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway. I had most of the requested skills and was put forward to the interview. Skills found below- Required C++ - Yes Transact SQL - Yes Architecture Solutions - Yes Leading/Mentoring - Yes Evaluating Emerging Tech. - Yes Data Migration Experience - Yes Excellent Presentation - Yes Excellent Communications - Yes Unix Shell Scripting - Minimal Would Like Java - No e-Solution - No Now they knew all of this before I had the interview. I was only asked about skills with a Yes next to them. Went on for 1.5 hours, got a really good vibe from them. All the "What do you want in a..." type questions I answered truthfully and as it turned out was what they were providing. I got no questions that tested my technical knowledge of anything, I just had to justify anything I had said in my résumé or explain how I would do something like migrate data from one DB to another and how would I verify it. They were going to call the agent yesterday afternoon and she would then call me. I didn't get the call till this morning. They had spent well into the evening debating whether to take me on. Eventually this morning they ring the agent with a "He is a perfect fit for the team, but we feel we need someone who can hit the ground running as we are a small organisation". After probing the agent to determine what that meant as I thought maybe I had given a bad impression or hadn't gotten across to them my abilities in C++, SQL, Data migration, technical solutions etc. I get told, "No, they were impressed with what you had done and your performance in the interview. But when entering everything in the matrix you came up short. They wanted to find another position for you but none existed.". Still not satisfied I probe further (Cartman anal probe style) and finally get told they "Feel my lack of Java, Unix Shell and e-Solution skills would stop me from getting up to speed quick enough.". My problem with this is that they knew I had minimal Unix Shell but wanted to interview me anyway. The Java/e-Solution shit was a nice to have but fuck it we will teach you this and we are porting from C++ to Java in the near future. FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK,
Michael, I understand your pain, but let me give you an employer's take on this. When you're paying a placement firm 30% of the salary you're going to pay the hire, often $30,000+, you get pretty friggin picky about who you get. Had you appeared on their doorstep w/o the middleman, likely they would have said "wow, this guy is fantastic" but with the big ticket price, they're going to be a great deal more picky about the little stuff. I'd encourage devs who really want a particular type of placement to just call the firms they want to work for and skip the headhunters, they don't do anything except help introverted people find jobs. David http://www.dundas.com
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Michael, I understand your pain, but let me give you an employer's take on this. When you're paying a placement firm 30% of the salary you're going to pay the hire, often $30,000+, you get pretty friggin picky about who you get. Had you appeared on their doorstep w/o the middleman, likely they would have said "wow, this guy is fantastic" but with the big ticket price, they're going to be a great deal more picky about the little stuff. I'd encourage devs who really want a particular type of placement to just call the firms they want to work for and skip the headhunters, they don't do anything except help introverted people find jobs. David http://www.dundas.com
David Cunningham wrote: I'd encourage devs who really want a particular type of placement to just call the firms they want to work for and skip the headhunters, they don't do anything except help introverted people find jobs. I wish things were that easy David. I mean I dont even know where to send my resume to :-( Nish [Signature temporarily down]
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Finally got my first interview yesterday for a Senior Consultant role after nearly 4 months. It wasn't a pure development role and I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway. I had most of the requested skills and was put forward to the interview. Skills found below- Required C++ - Yes Transact SQL - Yes Architecture Solutions - Yes Leading/Mentoring - Yes Evaluating Emerging Tech. - Yes Data Migration Experience - Yes Excellent Presentation - Yes Excellent Communications - Yes Unix Shell Scripting - Minimal Would Like Java - No e-Solution - No Now they knew all of this before I had the interview. I was only asked about skills with a Yes next to them. Went on for 1.5 hours, got a really good vibe from them. All the "What do you want in a..." type questions I answered truthfully and as it turned out was what they were providing. I got no questions that tested my technical knowledge of anything, I just had to justify anything I had said in my résumé or explain how I would do something like migrate data from one DB to another and how would I verify it. They were going to call the agent yesterday afternoon and she would then call me. I didn't get the call till this morning. They had spent well into the evening debating whether to take me on. Eventually this morning they ring the agent with a "He is a perfect fit for the team, but we feel we need someone who can hit the ground running as we are a small organisation". After probing the agent to determine what that meant as I thought maybe I had given a bad impression or hadn't gotten across to them my abilities in C++, SQL, Data migration, technical solutions etc. I get told, "No, they were impressed with what you had done and your performance in the interview. But when entering everything in the matrix you came up short. They wanted to find another position for you but none existed.". Still not satisfied I probe further (Cartman anal probe style) and finally get told they "Feel my lack of Java, Unix Shell and e-Solution skills would stop me from getting up to speed quick enough.". My problem with this is that they knew I had minimal Unix Shell but wanted to interview me anyway. The Java/e-Solution shit was a nice to have but fuck it we will teach you this and we are porting from C++ to Java in the near future. FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK,
Sorry to hear it....They should to sent on a holiday to Afghanistan...to a cave near us*m* f**k*n wastebin laden... Atul Don't they know that Java is slow.
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Yes we hear you. With all of the talk of millions of unemployed IT workers it is amazing how many think they can find someone who has experience in everything is under 30 and will work for minimum wage. PS I did hear one manager at a company that I was visting last week state the above to be true. Take care:suss: Good ideas are not adopted automatically. They must be driven into practice with courageous patients. -Admiral Rickover. ...
Michael A. Barnhart wrote: With all of the talk of millions of unemployed IT workers it is amazing how many think they can find someone who has experience in everything is under 30 and will work for minimum wage. I know this to be true after trolling through so many jobs adverts in the last four months. I have been turned down before interview for most for trivial reasons. What I think pissed me off the most is the reason I have been given for not getting the job more so than not getting the job itself. They knew I had no Java/e-Solution skills, they themselves said they didn't expect people to have this with the other stuff. It would be nice and if needed it would be taught. They also knew I didn't have much Unix Shell scripting, they obviously did as they didn't question me on any of this. So all I can really see is that they didn't believe I had the skills I claimed or at least not to the standards they want. If this is the case do one of the following
- Test me. During the interview or formally if you wish.
- Tell me I failed as I wasn't up to scratch. Don't tell me about matrices or hint about not having the skills that were Nice to have.
I'm a big boy, I have been in the workforce for 15 years, 12 of that programming. I can handle hearing not so nice things about me or my skills. If I don't get the truth as to why I didn't get the job how am I to improve? By this I mean improve my
- Interviewing technique
- Ability to express skills/achievements
- Selection of job to go for
Still fucking frustrated. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
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Michael, I understand your pain, but let me give you an employer's take on this. When you're paying a placement firm 30% of the salary you're going to pay the hire, often $30,000+, you get pretty friggin picky about who you get. Had you appeared on their doorstep w/o the middleman, likely they would have said "wow, this guy is fantastic" but with the big ticket price, they're going to be a great deal more picky about the little stuff. I'd encourage devs who really want a particular type of placement to just call the firms they want to work for and skip the headhunters, they don't do anything except help introverted people find jobs. David http://www.dundas.com
David Cunningham wrote: I understand your pain, but let me give you an employer's take on this. When you're paying a placement firm 30% of the salary you're going to pay the hire, often $30,000+, you get pretty friggin picky about who you get. David, I appreciate this from the employers perspective, really I do. But to me it seems that I was rejected because I didn't have the skills they knew I didn't have before the interview. So why waste their time and interview me in the first place. If I failed because of something else then I think they need to tell me so I can get on with life and also improve my interview or job selection technique. They wasted their time and mine. David Cunningham wrote: Had you appeared on their doorstep w/o the middleman, likely they would have said "wow, this guy is fantastic" but with the big ticket price, they're going to be a great deal more picky about the little stuff. True, but how do I know they have a job available in the first place? Believe it or not the majority of companies in Australia seem to want to use Agencies as they have no time to prune down résumé to a short list and in a lot of cases don't have staff with the skill to do this. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
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Sorry to hear it....They should to sent on a holiday to Afghanistan...to a cave near us*m* f**k*n wastebin laden... Atul Don't they know that Java is slow.
Atul Dharne wrote: Sorry to hear it....They should to sent on a holiday to Afghanistan...to a cave near us*m* f**k*n wastebin laden... Atul, thanks for the sympathy. As I have said in previous replies it is not so much that I didn't get the job but that they (or maybe the agent) haven't truthfully told me why I missed out. They point to my deficiency in skills they knew I didn't have before the interview not to something they found out in the interview. Atul Dharne wrote: Don't they know that Java is slow. Not sure, but I wouldn't have complained about learning it. The number of jobs being advertised for Java, VB, ASP is huge compared to the C++. Or at least a lot of the C++ also want other skills that I don't have. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
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Atul Dharne wrote: Sorry to hear it....They should to sent on a holiday to Afghanistan...to a cave near us*m* f**k*n wastebin laden... Atul, thanks for the sympathy. As I have said in previous replies it is not so much that I didn't get the job but that they (or maybe the agent) haven't truthfully told me why I missed out. They point to my deficiency in skills they knew I didn't have before the interview not to something they found out in the interview. Atul Dharne wrote: Don't they know that Java is slow. Not sure, but I wouldn't have complained about learning it. The number of jobs being advertised for Java, VB, ASP is huge compared to the C++. Or at least a lot of the C++ also want other skills that I don't have. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
Michael Maybe what you should do infuture is to make sure that you are going to be interviewed by a company that actually does its major work in areas where you are good at. I mean if I saw an Ad for a JSP programmer I would not even go for the interview. Once I go I'd really have to take whatever shit they give me. Anyway cheer up. You are still a lot better off than most of us :-) Nish [Signature temporarily down]
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Atul Dharne wrote: Sorry to hear it....They should to sent on a holiday to Afghanistan...to a cave near us*m* f**k*n wastebin laden... Atul, thanks for the sympathy. As I have said in previous replies it is not so much that I didn't get the job but that they (or maybe the agent) haven't truthfully told me why I missed out. They point to my deficiency in skills they knew I didn't have before the interview not to something they found out in the interview. Atul Dharne wrote: Don't they know that Java is slow. Not sure, but I wouldn't have complained about learning it. The number of jobs being advertised for Java, VB, ASP is huge compared to the C++. Or at least a lot of the C++ also want other skills that I don't have. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
Michael Martin wrote: They point to my deficiency in skills they knew I didn't have before the interview not to something they found out in the interview. That is the exact point which means that they are either m*rons or they are interviewing as their job as an interviewer is at stake. Here in India we get a lot of ads for jobs which do not materialize / or are not existing but are made up by the HR dept. just to be in the news for some god forsaken reason. These are difficult to weed out. Michael Martin wrote: The number of jobs being advertised for Java, VB, ASP is huge compared to the C++. Yup this is true. Atul Don't they know that java is slow.
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Finally got my first interview yesterday for a Senior Consultant role after nearly 4 months. It wasn't a pure development role and I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway. I had most of the requested skills and was put forward to the interview. Skills found below- Required C++ - Yes Transact SQL - Yes Architecture Solutions - Yes Leading/Mentoring - Yes Evaluating Emerging Tech. - Yes Data Migration Experience - Yes Excellent Presentation - Yes Excellent Communications - Yes Unix Shell Scripting - Minimal Would Like Java - No e-Solution - No Now they knew all of this before I had the interview. I was only asked about skills with a Yes next to them. Went on for 1.5 hours, got a really good vibe from them. All the "What do you want in a..." type questions I answered truthfully and as it turned out was what they were providing. I got no questions that tested my technical knowledge of anything, I just had to justify anything I had said in my résumé or explain how I would do something like migrate data from one DB to another and how would I verify it. They were going to call the agent yesterday afternoon and she would then call me. I didn't get the call till this morning. They had spent well into the evening debating whether to take me on. Eventually this morning they ring the agent with a "He is a perfect fit for the team, but we feel we need someone who can hit the ground running as we are a small organisation". After probing the agent to determine what that meant as I thought maybe I had given a bad impression or hadn't gotten across to them my abilities in C++, SQL, Data migration, technical solutions etc. I get told, "No, they were impressed with what you had done and your performance in the interview. But when entering everything in the matrix you came up short. They wanted to find another position for you but none existed.". Still not satisfied I probe further (Cartman anal probe style) and finally get told they "Feel my lack of Java, Unix Shell and e-Solution skills would stop me from getting up to speed quick enough.". My problem with this is that they knew I had minimal Unix Shell but wanted to interview me anyway. The Java/e-Solution shit was a nice to have but fuck it we will teach you this and we are porting from C++ to Java in the near future. FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK,
I'm sorry, I feel bad for you! :( Michael Martin wrote: I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway But with all that experience, and knowing everything you know, why don't you try starting you own company?? I know it will be hard at the beginning and requiere a lot more time, but once you get it going, I'm sure the benefits will be several times better!! Anyway, in anything we can help, don't wait to tell us! -- LuisR ────────────── Luis Alonso Ramos Chihuahua, Mexico www.luisalonsoramos.com CPUA: 0xC0DE - No Sonork yet MiniPutt best: 23 "Do not worry about your difficulties in mathematics, I assure you that mine are greater." -- Albert Einstein
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Finally got my first interview yesterday for a Senior Consultant role after nearly 4 months. It wasn't a pure development role and I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway. I had most of the requested skills and was put forward to the interview. Skills found below- Required C++ - Yes Transact SQL - Yes Architecture Solutions - Yes Leading/Mentoring - Yes Evaluating Emerging Tech. - Yes Data Migration Experience - Yes Excellent Presentation - Yes Excellent Communications - Yes Unix Shell Scripting - Minimal Would Like Java - No e-Solution - No Now they knew all of this before I had the interview. I was only asked about skills with a Yes next to them. Went on for 1.5 hours, got a really good vibe from them. All the "What do you want in a..." type questions I answered truthfully and as it turned out was what they were providing. I got no questions that tested my technical knowledge of anything, I just had to justify anything I had said in my résumé or explain how I would do something like migrate data from one DB to another and how would I verify it. They were going to call the agent yesterday afternoon and she would then call me. I didn't get the call till this morning. They had spent well into the evening debating whether to take me on. Eventually this morning they ring the agent with a "He is a perfect fit for the team, but we feel we need someone who can hit the ground running as we are a small organisation". After probing the agent to determine what that meant as I thought maybe I had given a bad impression or hadn't gotten across to them my abilities in C++, SQL, Data migration, technical solutions etc. I get told, "No, they were impressed with what you had done and your performance in the interview. But when entering everything in the matrix you came up short. They wanted to find another position for you but none existed.". Still not satisfied I probe further (Cartman anal probe style) and finally get told they "Feel my lack of Java, Unix Shell and e-Solution skills would stop me from getting up to speed quick enough.". My problem with this is that they knew I had minimal Unix Shell but wanted to interview me anyway. The Java/e-Solution shit was a nice to have but fuck it we will teach you this and we are porting from C++ to Java in the near future. FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK,
They're going to end up with someone who lies their ass off and says Yes to everything.**
Todd Smith
CPUA 0x007 ... shaken not stirred
**
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Michael A. Barnhart wrote: With all of the talk of millions of unemployed IT workers it is amazing how many think they can find someone who has experience in everything is under 30 and will work for minimum wage. I know this to be true after trolling through so many jobs adverts in the last four months. I have been turned down before interview for most for trivial reasons. What I think pissed me off the most is the reason I have been given for not getting the job more so than not getting the job itself. They knew I had no Java/e-Solution skills, they themselves said they didn't expect people to have this with the other stuff. It would be nice and if needed it would be taught. They also knew I didn't have much Unix Shell scripting, they obviously did as they didn't question me on any of this. So all I can really see is that they didn't believe I had the skills I claimed or at least not to the standards they want. If this is the case do one of the following
- Test me. During the interview or formally if you wish.
- Tell me I failed as I wasn't up to scratch. Don't tell me about matrices or hint about not having the skills that were Nice to have.
I'm a big boy, I have been in the workforce for 15 years, 12 of that programming. I can handle hearing not so nice things about me or my skills. If I don't get the truth as to why I didn't get the job how am I to improve? By this I mean improve my
- Interviewing technique
- Ability to express skills/achievements
- Selection of job to go for
Still fucking frustrated. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
You're not going to like this, but I should admit to it. I've done it. There are situations when you have a person in house who you want for a job, but company policy requires that all jobs be posted publicly and all respondents evaluated. A lot of large corps do this, and many small ones emulate them. As a hiring manager I had to write the job requirements directly from my chosen candidate's resume and submit it to HR. They, in turn, had to circulate the job and run all the applicants thru the hoops. Then I would interview the one I really wanted, and hire him/her. It sounds like you're a victim of this game, and I'm sorry to have been a part of it. The hiring manager is also a victim of this bullshirt created by HR people as a means of justifying their parasitic existence, and the practice makes everyone involved nauseous - but the game goes on... Any job description that looks too detailed is probably a setup, or written by an imbecile - most HR departments fit the latter description, as they lack even a minimal understanf=ding of the skills they're supposed to hire and so merely parrot whatever they read in the most recent trade mags they find lying around the lounge. Back when I was actually seeking work in my career of choice (two years, 200 resumes a month, one interview) I saw ads demanding five years' experience with products that had not yet been released. There's something wrong with this picture...
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David Cunningham wrote: I understand your pain, but let me give you an employer's take on this. When you're paying a placement firm 30% of the salary you're going to pay the hire, often $30,000+, you get pretty friggin picky about who you get. David, I appreciate this from the employers perspective, really I do. But to me it seems that I was rejected because I didn't have the skills they knew I didn't have before the interview. So why waste their time and interview me in the first place. If I failed because of something else then I think they need to tell me so I can get on with life and also improve my interview or job selection technique. They wasted their time and mine. David Cunningham wrote: Had you appeared on their doorstep w/o the middleman, likely they would have said "wow, this guy is fantastic" but with the big ticket price, they're going to be a great deal more picky about the little stuff. True, but how do I know they have a job available in the first place? Believe it or not the majority of companies in Australia seem to want to use Agencies as they have no time to prune down résumé to a short list and in a lot of cases don't have staff with the skill to do this. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
Maybe they interviewed you because of your headhunter. "This guy is superb. You really should give him a chance." Keep in mind your headhunter increases their chances of landing you a job for every interview.**
Todd Smith
CPUA 0x007 ... shaken not stirred
**
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Finally got my first interview yesterday for a Senior Consultant role after nearly 4 months. It wasn't a pure development role and I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway. I had most of the requested skills and was put forward to the interview. Skills found below- Required C++ - Yes Transact SQL - Yes Architecture Solutions - Yes Leading/Mentoring - Yes Evaluating Emerging Tech. - Yes Data Migration Experience - Yes Excellent Presentation - Yes Excellent Communications - Yes Unix Shell Scripting - Minimal Would Like Java - No e-Solution - No Now they knew all of this before I had the interview. I was only asked about skills with a Yes next to them. Went on for 1.5 hours, got a really good vibe from them. All the "What do you want in a..." type questions I answered truthfully and as it turned out was what they were providing. I got no questions that tested my technical knowledge of anything, I just had to justify anything I had said in my résumé or explain how I would do something like migrate data from one DB to another and how would I verify it. They were going to call the agent yesterday afternoon and she would then call me. I didn't get the call till this morning. They had spent well into the evening debating whether to take me on. Eventually this morning they ring the agent with a "He is a perfect fit for the team, but we feel we need someone who can hit the ground running as we are a small organisation". After probing the agent to determine what that meant as I thought maybe I had given a bad impression or hadn't gotten across to them my abilities in C++, SQL, Data migration, technical solutions etc. I get told, "No, they were impressed with what you had done and your performance in the interview. But when entering everything in the matrix you came up short. They wanted to find another position for you but none existed.". Still not satisfied I probe further (Cartman anal probe style) and finally get told they "Feel my lack of Java, Unix Shell and e-Solution skills would stop me from getting up to speed quick enough.". My problem with this is that they knew I had minimal Unix Shell but wanted to interview me anyway. The Java/e-Solution shit was a nice to have but fuck it we will teach you this and we are porting from C++ to Java in the near future. FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK,
I think they fooled you. I would say "verarschen" (german) it means to be: "you are a thumb ass". Knowing about this techniques to say: "this is nice to have" (BUT IF YOU DONT HAVE ANY CHANCE) I read some articles about this theme and say "minimal". PS: VS is right, so find peace:)
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They're going to end up with someone who lies their ass off and says Yes to everything.**
Todd Smith
CPUA 0x007 ... shaken not stirred
**
Todd Smith wrote: They're going to end up with someone who lies their ass off and says Yes to everything. With those qualifications, the person would make a good manager or sales puke. Michael :-)
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Michael Maybe what you should do infuture is to make sure that you are going to be interviewed by a company that actually does its major work in areas where you are good at. I mean if I saw an Ad for a JSP programmer I would not even go for the interview. Once I go I'd really have to take whatever shit they give me. Anyway cheer up. You are still a lot better off than most of us :-) Nish [Signature temporarily down]
Nish If you look at my original message you will see that I had 8 of the 11 requested skills. Of the other 3 only 2 were unknown to me and they were the ones listed as Nice to have but not required as we will teach them to you. There were others listed that where not worth listing here on a technical site but I had them covered and the company knew this. They were looking for an experienced Senior Technical Consultant to work for a vendor (them). My previous job was as an experienced Senior Technical Consultant working for a vendor. Seems to me that I had the runs on the board and could do the job. If there was one area that they could have rejected me on, it was that I hadn't done Transact SQL or data migration for a few years. But this isn't what was mentioned when told why I was rejected. Many hours later I am still pissed off and waiting for the anger to pass. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "Don't belong. Never join. Think for yourself. Peace" - Victor Stone
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Finally got my first interview yesterday for a Senior Consultant role after nearly 4 months. It wasn't a pure development role and I had been a Consultant for the last 3 years anyway. I had most of the requested skills and was put forward to the interview. Skills found below- Required C++ - Yes Transact SQL - Yes Architecture Solutions - Yes Leading/Mentoring - Yes Evaluating Emerging Tech. - Yes Data Migration Experience - Yes Excellent Presentation - Yes Excellent Communications - Yes Unix Shell Scripting - Minimal Would Like Java - No e-Solution - No Now they knew all of this before I had the interview. I was only asked about skills with a Yes next to them. Went on for 1.5 hours, got a really good vibe from them. All the "What do you want in a..." type questions I answered truthfully and as it turned out was what they were providing. I got no questions that tested my technical knowledge of anything, I just had to justify anything I had said in my résumé or explain how I would do something like migrate data from one DB to another and how would I verify it. They were going to call the agent yesterday afternoon and she would then call me. I didn't get the call till this morning. They had spent well into the evening debating whether to take me on. Eventually this morning they ring the agent with a "He is a perfect fit for the team, but we feel we need someone who can hit the ground running as we are a small organisation". After probing the agent to determine what that meant as I thought maybe I had given a bad impression or hadn't gotten across to them my abilities in C++, SQL, Data migration, technical solutions etc. I get told, "No, they were impressed with what you had done and your performance in the interview. But when entering everything in the matrix you came up short. They wanted to find another position for you but none existed.". Still not satisfied I probe further (Cartman anal probe style) and finally get told they "Feel my lack of Java, Unix Shell and e-Solution skills would stop me from getting up to speed quick enough.". My problem with this is that they knew I had minimal Unix Shell but wanted to interview me anyway. The Java/e-Solution shit was a nice to have but fuck it we will teach you this and we are porting from C++ to Java in the near future. FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK,
Bad luck :( , worst they make you waste your time, I hate when this happens. Also I don't like at all to called for jobs that i don't have the qualifications , one time i applyed for a c++ job(I had 1 year experience, they were expecting 2 ), i didn't get called for this, but i did get called to program in java and oracle,i did only have a 50 hour crash course on java, none professional experience and nil too on oracle, and they were interested in me :laugh: ,of course i refused . Damn morons :mad: Joao Vaz
