Devastating.....:(
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Of course you would think so. All he did was contradict my statement and question my sources, without offering any argument or evidence himself.
Vincent Reynolds wrote:
Of course you would think so.
I'm not going to be suckered into this.
Vincent Reynolds wrote:
All he did was contradict my statement and question my sources, without offering any argument or evidence himself.
I read the thread. Jeremy Falcon
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Your bio says you made it to Major. Grats, I know that's not easily done. Jeremy Falcon
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Bravo. I am so proud of America, I wish I was american. -------- "I say no to drugs, but they don't listen." - Marilyn Manson
I'm glad you're not..... Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
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Of course you would think so. All he did was contradict my statement and question my sources, without offering any argument or evidence himself.
Besides the 12 months that I spent deployed in the war, which was at the start of the war, there is also the people that I encounter going and coming from Iraq, since I returned home. Now I did not conduct a survey, in fact I was quite upset about not finding WMD after missing so much of my child's life, but most of the soldiers I spoke with were glad to be helping to rebuild that nation. Most were disgusted by the lack of infra-structure in some parts of Iraq while Saddam had his palaces. Is everything in Iraq up to US quality of life standards. No way. But there are improvements and the opportunity for improvements that were never going to come under Saddam's rule, or that of his son's after Saddam. The feeling of making a difference is not unique to the American military. I met with most of the coalition forces in Iraq (representatives from each of the countries), and I know that they were also proud to be helping the Iraqis. Japan, went so far as to change their constitution so that they could go to Iraq. I was approached by an Iraqi woman and she thanked me for being there and felt bad that some Iraqi's were causing US casualties (refering to the roadside bombs). Just a little bit of evidence. Probably not credible enough for you since they can not be found in the papers/online.
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Your bio says you made it to Major. Grats, I know that's not easily done. Jeremy Falcon
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Bravo! Your Bush impression is quite good! Just throw in a couple of "In God we trust!", "Amen!", and paraphrase the gospels, as if you're Jesus, and the US is the promised holy land, and it'll be perfect. :)
I don't think the US is the only good place in the world. I do think, however, the US is one of the few countries that has the balls to stand up for what's right. Of course, that doesn't mean we are incapable of wrong, but when in doubt of its actions, etc. one has to lean towards tendencies of past actions until proven otherwise. And no, I don't expect many people to listen to that. Jeremy Falcon
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I stand corrected. I'm still hearing information counter to that from people inside the country. Maybe it depends where in the country you are? Are you posting from Iraq?
I am posting from home. I really do not think it was regionally based. I was fortunate to be assigned to Kuwait. I was heavily involved in supporting coalition (foreign) troop movements. That put me in a position to work with officers, soldiers, and politicians from over 35 countries in addition to all of the commands/staffs where those soldiers were going to be assigned (Always to a US or British command, with the exception of the Polish Division whom I worked with quite extensively). Things could have changed since I have left, but I still get to see soldiers coming and going, and for the most part moral is high.
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Bravo! Your Bush impression is quite good! Just throw in a couple of "In God we trust!", "Amen!", and paraphrase the gospels, as if you're Jesus, and the US is the promised holy land, and it'll be perfect. :)
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I'm glad you're not..... Uptight Ex-Military Republican married to a Commie Lib - How weird is that?
That was sarcasm, because I am glad I am not. When I travel the world, I am not ashamed of showing my Canadian passport, which is much more welcomed than the American one. -------- "I say no to drugs, but they don't listen." - Marilyn Manson
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Besides the 12 months that I spent deployed in the war, which was at the start of the war, there is also the people that I encounter going and coming from Iraq, since I returned home. Now I did not conduct a survey, in fact I was quite upset about not finding WMD after missing so much of my child's life, but most of the soldiers I spoke with were glad to be helping to rebuild that nation. Most were disgusted by the lack of infra-structure in some parts of Iraq while Saddam had his palaces. Is everything in Iraq up to US quality of life standards. No way. But there are improvements and the opportunity for improvements that were never going to come under Saddam's rule, or that of his son's after Saddam. The feeling of making a difference is not unique to the American military. I met with most of the coalition forces in Iraq (representatives from each of the countries), and I know that they were also proud to be helping the Iraqis. Japan, went so far as to change their constitution so that they could go to Iraq. I was approached by an Iraqi woman and she thanked me for being there and felt bad that some Iraqi's were causing US casualties (refering to the roadside bombs). Just a little bit of evidence. Probably not credible enough for you since they can not be found in the papers/online.
Credible enough. It actually does give me a little bit of hope that at least something good might come out of this in some parts of the country. I'm still not sure it's worth the price, but thanks for the information, and for your service, of course.
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I don't think the US is the only good place in the world. I do think, however, the US is one of the few countries that has the balls to stand up for what's right. Of course, that doesn't mean we are incapable of wrong, but when in doubt of its actions, etc. one has to lean towards tendencies of past actions until proven otherwise. And no, I don't expect many people to listen to that. Jeremy Falcon
Standing up for what is good is never wrong, as long as the motives are good. I don't think religion falls into that category. I understand that religion is not the isn't the main motive behind the retaliations against al-Qaeda - you can't bow down to terrorists. However, it seems to me, after hearing his speeches, that Bush's personal motive is highly religious. That's a scary thought - especially so considering that the desert nutcases are also driven by religious motives.
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Standing up for what is good is never wrong, as long as the motives are good. I don't think religion falls into that category. I understand that religion is not the isn't the main motive behind the retaliations against al-Qaeda - you can't bow down to terrorists. However, it seems to me, after hearing his speeches, that Bush's personal motive is highly religious. That's a scary thought - especially so considering that the desert nutcases are also driven by religious motives.
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
I don't think religion falls into that category.
Neither do I. But, you know who that goes. :sigh:
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
However, it seems to me, after hearing his speeches, that Bush's personal motive is highly religious.
I have no doubt he's highly religious. I however do think he has just standards. Most Christians (this day and age that is) don't believe in killing people just because. As silly as he may seem at times, I just don't see the guy being naive enough to start a war over nothing. It's giving him the benefit of the doubt. Jeremy Falcon
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Standing up for what is good is never wrong, as long as the motives are good. I don't think religion falls into that category. I understand that religion is not the isn't the main motive behind the retaliations against al-Qaeda - you can't bow down to terrorists. However, it seems to me, after hearing his speeches, that Bush's personal motive is highly religious. That's a scary thought - especially so considering that the desert nutcases are also driven by religious motives.
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
However, it seems to me, after hearing his speeches, that Bush's personal motive is highly religious.
That is because you misinterpret what you hear him say. It is his religion that provides him the personal strength to do what he already understands needs to be done. I'm relatively sure you won't understand. Mike "We ain't stuck on stupid." badass Lt. General Russel Honore **"Remember - live bunnies are a great source of nourishment"**silly-assed cartoon A vegan is someone who never heard a carrot cry!
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I am posting from home. I really do not think it was regionally based. I was fortunate to be assigned to Kuwait. I was heavily involved in supporting coalition (foreign) troop movements. That put me in a position to work with officers, soldiers, and politicians from over 35 countries in addition to all of the commands/staffs where those soldiers were going to be assigned (Always to a US or British command, with the exception of the Polish Division whom I worked with quite extensively). Things could have changed since I have left, but I still get to see soldiers coming and going, and for the most part moral is high.
Civilian sources (a playwright and two photographers I know) say things are not good at all. I'm hoping you're right, and thing haven't deteriorated. Just wish we had either not done it at all, or had the commitment from the top to do it right up front.
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Vincent Reynolds wrote:
The assertion is that the weapons were destroyed during and immediately after the first Gulf War. The Kurds were shelled before that.
Right, that is the assertion, but under the resolution passed by the UN serurity council, Saddam was to provide proof those weapons were destroyed. To this day he has not. My mom told me once that "while we all don't speak the same language, everyone in the world undestands an asskicking"
Yeah, and I guess now he never will.
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Credible enough. It actually does give me a little bit of hope that at least something good might come out of this in some parts of the country. I'm still not sure it's worth the price, but thanks for the information, and for your service, of course.
I agree with you. I am not a fan of putting American lives at risk for these other nations that do not stand up for themselves. I think Iraqi's should be doing so much more now to protect their own country. I would never have been in favor of going to war to rid Iraq of Saddam's regime. BUT I was in support of ridding Iraq's WMD stockpile. I was pretty upset when we declared that we did not find any and do not expect to find any. At that point, however, we had a responsibility to rebuild Iraq so that it could defend itself. And that is the mess we are stuck in now. I had no intention of voting for Bush until Kerry kept displaying that he had no position on the war. I think that would have been worse because he would have gone with the popular decision and pulled troops out such that things would be in chaos now (compared to what is is today). I just hope we can get a new president that has a plan to continue to fix the mess over there, but who can also bring international support to the table. I am geting tired of the US bashing in this forum.
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
However, it seems to me, after hearing his speeches, that Bush's personal motive is highly religious.
That is because you misinterpret what you hear him say. It is his religion that provides him the personal strength to do what he already understands needs to be done. I'm relatively sure you won't understand. Mike "We ain't stuck on stupid." badass Lt. General Russel Honore **"Remember - live bunnies are a great source of nourishment"**silly-assed cartoon A vegan is someone who never heard a carrot cry!
Mike Gaskey wrote:
That is because you misinterpret what you hear him say. It is his religion that provides him the personal strength to do what he already understands needs to be done.
I bet that's exactly how Osama is reasoning. It is not impossible to go against Osama without invoking some higher power. In fact, I can tell you right now that Osama needs to be hunted down and killed like a dog. You heard that from a border line atheist (agnostic, really, but that has little relevance here and now), and I can promise you that had I been the president of the united states of america, I would've done just that. I would have killed all his offspring too, just to be sure. All without a single invocation of God. All without using the medieval rhetoric.
Mike Gaskey wrote:
I'm relatively sure you won't understand.
Do I need to accept Christ first in order to understand?
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Civilian sources (a playwright and two photographers I know) say things are not good at all. I'm hoping you're right, and thing haven't deteriorated. Just wish we had either not done it at all, or had the commitment from the top to do it right up front.
Living conditions are bad for a lot of Iraqis. But that was the way of life before, with no hope of change. Now, there is at least hope, and in some cases change for the better. One thing I am confident of is that for those who are experiencing changes for the worse, it is not because of what Americans did, but because of what insurgents did to make the US look bad. We can be proud of the way our military behaves (although anomalies exist, we punish those people and it is not the way we operate). As for the politicians, that does need looking into in some cases.
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Mike Gaskey wrote:
That is because you misinterpret what you hear him say. It is his religion that provides him the personal strength to do what he already understands needs to be done.
I bet that's exactly how Osama is reasoning. It is not impossible to go against Osama without invoking some higher power. In fact, I can tell you right now that Osama needs to be hunted down and killed like a dog. You heard that from a border line atheist (agnostic, really, but that has little relevance here and now), and I can promise you that had I been the president of the united states of america, I would've done just that. I would have killed all his offspring too, just to be sure. All without a single invocation of God. All without using the medieval rhetoric.
Mike Gaskey wrote:
I'm relatively sure you won't understand.
Do I need to accept Christ first in order to understand?
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote:
Do I need to accept Christ first in order to understand?
you don't need to do anything, you made my point far better than I could have. Thanks! Mike "We ain't stuck on stupid." badass Lt. General Russel Honore **"Remember - live bunnies are a great source of nourishment"**silly-assed cartoon A vegan is someone who never heard a carrot cry!
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I agree with you. I am not a fan of putting American lives at risk for these other nations that do not stand up for themselves. I think Iraqi's should be doing so much more now to protect their own country. I would never have been in favor of going to war to rid Iraq of Saddam's regime. BUT I was in support of ridding Iraq's WMD stockpile. I was pretty upset when we declared that we did not find any and do not expect to find any. At that point, however, we had a responsibility to rebuild Iraq so that it could defend itself. And that is the mess we are stuck in now. I had no intention of voting for Bush until Kerry kept displaying that he had no position on the war. I think that would have been worse because he would have gone with the popular decision and pulled troops out such that things would be in chaos now (compared to what is is today). I just hope we can get a new president that has a plan to continue to fix the mess over there, but who can also bring international support to the table. I am geting tired of the US bashing in this forum.
Bob Flynn wrote:
I had no intention of voting for Bush until Kerry kept displaying that he had no position on the war.
Nor did he have any plans for the future. All he did was attack Bush, and that doesn't make a good leader IMO. Jeremy Falcon