Credit card fraud
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I don't know the details, but I think Visa has recently begun some service such that a vendor site using Visa for transactions can link directly to Visa for all the credit card processing functions related to the transaction. What this does for the customer is that they feel more secure knowing that some vendor is no longer in possesion of their card number and for the vendor, it eliminates still having to transact with Visa. Additionally I think Visa accepts responsibility for ensuring that credit card fraud is not taking place. The hassle with it is that as a vendor, you can only deal with Visa customers who have registered for this service. At a couple of sites now, when I make a purchase and use my credit card, for the credit card processing I'm taken to a Visa site where I login and will be prompted with a random series of question to verify that I am the registered card holder of the credit card number. When I get home tonight, I'll see if I can find some more links to these. Chris Meech I am Canadian. [heard in a local bar] The America I believe in has always understood that natural harmony is only one meal away from monkey burgers. [Stan Shannon] GOOD DAY FOR: Bean counters, as the Australian Taxation Office said that prostitutes and strippers could claim tax deductions for adult toys and sexy lingerie. [Associated Press]
Thanks, man, any info is appreciated. I do hate the thought of shifting the burden to the consumer, though. I'm old school in that I still have "The customer is always right." hanging on my wall. Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
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i let another company handle the CC transactions, for a fee. all the CC risk is on them. Cleek | Image Toolkits | Thumbnail maker
Probably smart of you, frankly. For me, though, that horse has already left the barn. Or is it that Elvis has left the building? I can never tell... Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
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I run www.kungfumovies.net. We get orders all over the world. Good countries besides US and Canada are Australia, Germany, England, Holland, Norway, Denmark, Japan, France, Spain Italy. Absolutely do not take anything from Indonesia, Nigeria, Ghana. There are many tricks crooks will try. You must always be aware. We shipped a $700 order to Canada once , months later we lost the money and product because it was a stolen card. This is a tough business to be in.
Thanks, man, I really appreciate the advice. I'm with you on the tricky crooks thing. I have a suite of security features available, and it's always a dance between covering my posterior and providing a good customer experience. www.KungFuMovies.net[^] - what a great site! In my opinion, you can never have too many kung fu flicks! :-D Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
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In responding to a post on another forum I frequent, I got to thinking that maybe some of you have fought this battle and would have suggestions... My latest little venture is an entertainment oriented site, www.DownloadAClue.com[^]. Although it's not greeting cards, it basically follows the business model of the e-card sites. Let people do the basics for free, and if they like it & want better stuff they pay $12 a year for membership. The person I was corresponding with was venting his frustration that he couldn't do credit card business with a lot of sites because he lived in a part of the world where fraud is high and many sites won't accept credit cards from high risk regions. I told him that my own online store was limited to the US and Canada, primarily because sending my books overseas would cost customers an obscene amount in shipping and I just ain't gonna charge them that kind of money. However, there’s another reason as well. Even though you can always refund a payment if it turns out to be a stolen card, as a credit card merchant, if you start getting a lot of fraud related transactions (or even a lot of charge backs for that matter), you run the risk of them dropping you, and good luck getting someone else to take you after that. For those of us who depend on credit card transactions, such a loss would be a disaster. Since this new venture is just an online service and there’s nothing to ship, that removes one reason to limit transactions to the US and Canada. However, and here’s where I could use some advice from those with experience, I still want to minimize the risk of bogus credit cards as much as humanly possible. The service is entertaining to the entire English speaking world and I’d love to access that large of a market, but there’s a significant risk / reward consideration here. For those of you who do credit card processing on the web, which countries do you allow transactions from, and how did you determine the best path? Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit
We just let someone else do the processing for us. In our case, it is Shareit. We looked into signing up as a merchant, but exactly for the reasons you describe canned the idea. It seems like in your case you can just restrict to EU/USA/Canada/Australia/NZ, the risk of fraud is low and you can address most of your target market.
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In responding to a post on another forum I frequent, I got to thinking that maybe some of you have fought this battle and would have suggestions... My latest little venture is an entertainment oriented site, www.DownloadAClue.com[^]. Although it's not greeting cards, it basically follows the business model of the e-card sites. Let people do the basics for free, and if they like it & want better stuff they pay $12 a year for membership. The person I was corresponding with was venting his frustration that he couldn't do credit card business with a lot of sites because he lived in a part of the world where fraud is high and many sites won't accept credit cards from high risk regions. I told him that my own online store was limited to the US and Canada, primarily because sending my books overseas would cost customers an obscene amount in shipping and I just ain't gonna charge them that kind of money. However, there’s another reason as well. Even though you can always refund a payment if it turns out to be a stolen card, as a credit card merchant, if you start getting a lot of fraud related transactions (or even a lot of charge backs for that matter), you run the risk of them dropping you, and good luck getting someone else to take you after that. For those of us who depend on credit card transactions, such a loss would be a disaster. Since this new venture is just an online service and there’s nothing to ship, that removes one reason to limit transactions to the US and Canada. However, and here’s where I could use some advice from those with experience, I still want to minimize the risk of bogus credit cards as much as humanly possible. The service is entertaining to the entire English speaking world and I’d love to access that large of a market, but there’s a significant risk / reward consideration here. For those of you who do credit card processing on the web, which countries do you allow transactions from, and how did you determine the best path? Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit
Just a quick comment on the greeting card business: I typically (except for your card ;)) never, ever open them, click on them or visit their site because to me, greeting cards are just one more way for spammers to verify my email address. As someone famous or something once said: A few bad apples have spoiled it for the rest of us. cheers, Chris Maunder
CodeProject.com : C++ MVP
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In responding to a post on another forum I frequent, I got to thinking that maybe some of you have fought this battle and would have suggestions... My latest little venture is an entertainment oriented site, www.DownloadAClue.com[^]. Although it's not greeting cards, it basically follows the business model of the e-card sites. Let people do the basics for free, and if they like it & want better stuff they pay $12 a year for membership. The person I was corresponding with was venting his frustration that he couldn't do credit card business with a lot of sites because he lived in a part of the world where fraud is high and many sites won't accept credit cards from high risk regions. I told him that my own online store was limited to the US and Canada, primarily because sending my books overseas would cost customers an obscene amount in shipping and I just ain't gonna charge them that kind of money. However, there’s another reason as well. Even though you can always refund a payment if it turns out to be a stolen card, as a credit card merchant, if you start getting a lot of fraud related transactions (or even a lot of charge backs for that matter), you run the risk of them dropping you, and good luck getting someone else to take you after that. For those of us who depend on credit card transactions, such a loss would be a disaster. Since this new venture is just an online service and there’s nothing to ship, that removes one reason to limit transactions to the US and Canada. However, and here’s where I could use some advice from those with experience, I still want to minimize the risk of bogus credit cards as much as humanly possible. The service is entertaining to the entire English speaking world and I’d love to access that large of a market, but there’s a significant risk / reward consideration here. For those of you who do credit card processing on the web, which countries do you allow transactions from, and how did you determine the best path? Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit
I accept CC's for my business www.glacialcomponents.com[^] and I'll tell you that over %60 of my business is international. I do however limit many countries specifically from being able to purchase my wares. Some countries that you would worry about though have turned into really good customers. I get a lot of sales to India even though I've heard in the past that that can be a bad region for CC fraud. So far I've had very little fraud to deal with. My advice to you would be to add a few countries at a time and see what happens.
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We just let someone else do the processing for us. In our case, it is Shareit. We looked into signing up as a merchant, but exactly for the reasons you describe canned the idea. It seems like in your case you can just restrict to EU/USA/Canada/Australia/NZ, the risk of fraud is low and you can address most of your target market.
I used to use shareit for our payment processing and I found them to be a very good company to deal with. The only real gripe I had with them was that it takes forever (it seems like) for them to get your money to you. and since they are based in germany, any time you send in tech support email, you have to wait a while for them to respond.
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In responding to a post on another forum I frequent, I got to thinking that maybe some of you have fought this battle and would have suggestions... My latest little venture is an entertainment oriented site, www.DownloadAClue.com[^]. Although it's not greeting cards, it basically follows the business model of the e-card sites. Let people do the basics for free, and if they like it & want better stuff they pay $12 a year for membership. The person I was corresponding with was venting his frustration that he couldn't do credit card business with a lot of sites because he lived in a part of the world where fraud is high and many sites won't accept credit cards from high risk regions. I told him that my own online store was limited to the US and Canada, primarily because sending my books overseas would cost customers an obscene amount in shipping and I just ain't gonna charge them that kind of money. However, there’s another reason as well. Even though you can always refund a payment if it turns out to be a stolen card, as a credit card merchant, if you start getting a lot of fraud related transactions (or even a lot of charge backs for that matter), you run the risk of them dropping you, and good luck getting someone else to take you after that. For those of us who depend on credit card transactions, such a loss would be a disaster. Since this new venture is just an online service and there’s nothing to ship, that removes one reason to limit transactions to the US and Canada. However, and here’s where I could use some advice from those with experience, I still want to minimize the risk of bogus credit cards as much as humanly possible. The service is entertaining to the entire English speaking world and I’d love to access that large of a market, but there’s a significant risk / reward consideration here. For those of you who do credit card processing on the web, which countries do you allow transactions from, and how did you determine the best path? Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit
Would you believe it? Seconds after I finished reading your post, we got a charge-back from a bank. Some jerk had used a stolen credit card to buy an Ultimate Combo license from us. His address was bogus - and he had used a Gmail account. :sigh: Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. -
Just a quick comment on the greeting card business: I typically (except for your card ;)) never, ever open them, click on them or visit their site because to me, greeting cards are just one more way for spammers to verify my email address. As someone famous or something once said: A few bad apples have spoiled it for the rest of us. cheers, Chris Maunder
CodeProject.com : C++ MVP
Well, so much for the educated consumer market. :laugh: There's always the AOL crowd... :rolleyes: I've got this one set up to send Clues both as attached pdf files (higher virus paranoia, zero spammer risk) and also include a link to view it on the site (lower virus paranoia, higher spammer anxiety). Even so, I expect I'll miss a lot of folks for this very reason. For example, after having sent one to a programmer friend of mine (used to work with me & Archer on gigs), I got a phone call from him that some virus on my machine had "emailed him a Clue." It never even occurred to him to check the web site, at which point he would have seen my fingerprints all over it (like "download a clue" wasn't a pretty good indication already?) - at any rate, I think I'll see how long it takes him to get a Clue and figure out that it's me. :-D Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
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Would you believe it? Seconds after I finished reading your post, we got a charge-back from a bank. Some jerk had used a stolen credit card to buy an Ultimate Combo license from us. His address was bogus - and he had used a Gmail account. :sigh: Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications.Yeah, this is what I'm talking about. The guy on the other forum who was upset that people wouldn't take his credit card doesn't see this end of things. Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
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Well, so much for the educated consumer market. :laugh: There's always the AOL crowd... :rolleyes: I've got this one set up to send Clues both as attached pdf files (higher virus paranoia, zero spammer risk) and also include a link to view it on the site (lower virus paranoia, higher spammer anxiety). Even so, I expect I'll miss a lot of folks for this very reason. For example, after having sent one to a programmer friend of mine (used to work with me & Archer on gigs), I got a phone call from him that some virus on my machine had "emailed him a Clue." It never even occurred to him to check the web site, at which point he would have seen my fingerprints all over it (like "download a clue" wasn't a pretty good indication already?) - at any rate, I think I'll see how long it takes him to get a Clue and figure out that it's me. :-D Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
But their membership is going down instead of up. FWIW, I don't open greeting cards at all. My mom has been senind me cards a couple of times a year for the last 10 years, and I've never opened one up. I even told her to stop, and why to stop, but she still sends 'em.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 -
But their membership is going down instead of up. FWIW, I don't open greeting cards at all. My mom has been senind me cards a couple of times a year for the last 10 years, and I've never opened one up. I even told her to stop, and why to stop, but she still sends 'em.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001Yeah, I know what you mean. Fortunately, my target audience for this isn't techies, but rather mere mortals. They don't know any better. However, fortunately for them, I'm not the sort to screw them. Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
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Would you believe it? Seconds after I finished reading your post, we got a charge-back from a bank. Some jerk had used a stolen credit card to buy an Ultimate Combo license from us. His address was bogus - and he had used a Gmail account. :sigh: Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications.what is the rate of CC fraud you guys see?
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what is the rate of CC fraud you guys see?
Allen Anderson wrote:
what is the rate of CC fraud you guys see?
Every month there are 5-6 attempted frauds - where they use what's a valid Visa or MasterCard number (except it was auto-generated by some tool). But these don't work as the card is rejected. So no damage there - just some annoyance and a couple of wasted hours. This is the first charge-back I have seen since I moved to Toronto in September. This is where we actually lose money (or at least a wasted license). But the accounting people may know about more such occurrences - I knew about this today coincidentally, there may have been others I didn't know about. Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. -
Would you believe it? Seconds after I finished reading your post, we got a charge-back from a bank. Some jerk had used a stolen credit card to buy an Ultimate Combo license from us. His address was bogus - and he had used a Gmail account. :sigh: Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications.How about you don't 'ship your product' until a time limit has expired that would account for any charge-back from the bank? The time-limit could vary depending upon the coutry of origin as well. Chris Meech I am Canadian. [heard in a local bar] The America I believe in has always understood that natural harmony is only one meal away from monkey burgers. [Stan Shannon] GOOD DAY FOR: Bean counters, as the Australian Taxation Office said that prostitutes and strippers could claim tax deductions for adult toys and sexy lingerie. [Associated Press]
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Just a quick comment on the greeting card business: I typically (except for your card ;)) never, ever open them, click on them or visit their site because to me, greeting cards are just one more way for spammers to verify my email address. As someone famous or something once said: A few bad apples have spoiled it for the rest of us. cheers, Chris Maunder
CodeProject.com : C++ MVP
I wonder why there is so much fuzz about verified e-mail adresses. I understand that a list of verified e-mails gets a betetr price, but OTOH: A spammer doesn't care if the spam e-mail matches it's target hit ratio is maybe 1:1000 or 1:10.000 8at least I *hope* that most people aren't that stupid) so with every second addy being "wrong", you bring the ratio down to 1:2000, doesn't seem to be such a bad deal if you want to avoid the hassle of verification. And who *really* trusts a spam e-mail vendor if he says "yes, these adresses are all verified!!"? Just a thought.
Some of us walk the memory lane, others plummet into a rabbit hole
Tree in C# || Fold With Us! || sighist -
Allen Anderson wrote:
what is the rate of CC fraud you guys see?
Every month there are 5-6 attempted frauds - where they use what's a valid Visa or MasterCard number (except it was auto-generated by some tool). But these don't work as the card is rejected. So no damage there - just some annoyance and a couple of wasted hours. This is the first charge-back I have seen since I moved to Toronto in September. This is where we actually lose money (or at least a wasted license). But the accounting people may know about more such occurrences - I knew about this today coincidentally, there may have been others I didn't know about. Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications.yea, the thing I hate about chargebacks (only had 2 since I've been in business) is that they cost a lot of money to the merchant. Even doing a refund costs a lot of $.
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Probably smart of you, frankly. For me, though, that horse has already left the barn. Or is it that Elvis has left the building? I can never tell... Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
Ach, just buy yourself a race horse, call him Elvis, problem sorted. Glad to help. ;) Jon
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In responding to a post on another forum I frequent, I got to thinking that maybe some of you have fought this battle and would have suggestions... My latest little venture is an entertainment oriented site, www.DownloadAClue.com[^]. Although it's not greeting cards, it basically follows the business model of the e-card sites. Let people do the basics for free, and if they like it & want better stuff they pay $12 a year for membership. The person I was corresponding with was venting his frustration that he couldn't do credit card business with a lot of sites because he lived in a part of the world where fraud is high and many sites won't accept credit cards from high risk regions. I told him that my own online store was limited to the US and Canada, primarily because sending my books overseas would cost customers an obscene amount in shipping and I just ain't gonna charge them that kind of money. However, there’s another reason as well. Even though you can always refund a payment if it turns out to be a stolen card, as a credit card merchant, if you start getting a lot of fraud related transactions (or even a lot of charge backs for that matter), you run the risk of them dropping you, and good luck getting someone else to take you after that. For those of us who depend on credit card transactions, such a loss would be a disaster. Since this new venture is just an online service and there’s nothing to ship, that removes one reason to limit transactions to the US and Canada. However, and here’s where I could use some advice from those with experience, I still want to minimize the risk of bogus credit cards as much as humanly possible. The service is entertaining to the entire English speaking world and I’d love to access that large of a market, but there’s a significant risk / reward consideration here. For those of you who do credit card processing on the web, which countries do you allow transactions from, and how did you determine the best path? Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit
We are open to every country on earth with the exception of those that are trade embargoed by the U.S. (which applies to us even though we're Canadian because of the 3rd party components from U.S. publishers that we use). I've never seen this as a big issue with our business, last time I looked we've sold licenses in over 40 countries. Of course we sell semi specialized business software, but even our old general purpose address book software didn't see much fraud. We've had so few since 1999 I remember them all. Chargebacks though are natural and though not nearly as rare as outright fraud they do happen. Not a thing on earth you can do about it and I'm very surprised anyone would have a problem with their banker over it. Maybe they are doing their own processing which might be a problem, we go through ShareIT who specialize in payment processing. I doubt we've ever had a chargeback from any country other than the U.S. though, if we have I don't recall it at all.
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Thanks, man, any info is appreciated. I do hate the thought of shifting the burden to the consumer, though. I'm old school in that I still have "The customer is always right." hanging on my wall. Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes Know someone who desperately needs to get a clue? Visit www.DownloadAClue.com and send them one!
I was partly wrong in suggesting it was a Visa thing. :-O It is a service that my bank (CIBC) is setting up. So it may not be available in the US yet. Chris Meech I am Canadian. [heard in a local bar] The America I believe in has always understood that natural harmony is only one meal away from monkey burgers. [Stan Shannon] GOOD DAY FOR: Bean counters, as the Australian Taxation Office said that prostitutes and strippers could claim tax deductions for adult toys and sexy lingerie. [Associated Press]
