Because we've always done it this way...
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Got this clip forwarded to me... --------------------- Have you heard the line " We've always done it that way " The US standard rail guage is 4 foot 8.5 inches ( the distance between the rails ) An odd number . Why was this spacing used ? Because that was the way they built them in England , and English expatriots built the US tracks . Why did the English build them that way ? Because they were built by the same people who built the pre-railway tramways and that was the guage that they used . And why did " they " build them like that ? because they used the same tools and guages as the people who built wagons in the old days . Okay ! Why were wagons built with that spacing ? Because if they didn't , then the wagons would get broken wheels because they would not fit in the ruts in the road . So . Who built the old rutted roads ? The Imperial Romans built roads all over Europe ( and England ) to move their Legions on and the roads were used ever since . And the ruts in the road , where did they come from ? The Roman chariots made the ruts and everyone since had to build their wagons to that wheel spacing so as not to break their wheels by not following the ruts . The chariots were all built in Imperial Rome and all had the same wheel spacing . So the US rails are spaced at 4 foot 8.5 inches because of chariots in ancient Rome and the bureaucracy lives on . The next time you are handed a specification an wonder what horses ass came up with it . You may be right . Because the chariots were made in Imperial Rome and made just wide enough for two war horses rear ends . ----------------------------------- I dont know how true this story is but I found it amusing. It also sure sounds similar to some of the software projects I've done (and heard of) over the years. Projects with old requirements, laced with spaghetti code that is left untouched for fear of the breaking the application. "I dont know how it works... but it does... so dont touch it... Anybody else relate to this? Cheers, David
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Got this clip forwarded to me... --------------------- Have you heard the line " We've always done it that way " The US standard rail guage is 4 foot 8.5 inches ( the distance between the rails ) An odd number . Why was this spacing used ? Because that was the way they built them in England , and English expatriots built the US tracks . Why did the English build them that way ? Because they were built by the same people who built the pre-railway tramways and that was the guage that they used . And why did " they " build them like that ? because they used the same tools and guages as the people who built wagons in the old days . Okay ! Why were wagons built with that spacing ? Because if they didn't , then the wagons would get broken wheels because they would not fit in the ruts in the road . So . Who built the old rutted roads ? The Imperial Romans built roads all over Europe ( and England ) to move their Legions on and the roads were used ever since . And the ruts in the road , where did they come from ? The Roman chariots made the ruts and everyone since had to build their wagons to that wheel spacing so as not to break their wheels by not following the ruts . The chariots were all built in Imperial Rome and all had the same wheel spacing . So the US rails are spaced at 4 foot 8.5 inches because of chariots in ancient Rome and the bureaucracy lives on . The next time you are handed a specification an wonder what horses ass came up with it . You may be right . Because the chariots were made in Imperial Rome and made just wide enough for two war horses rear ends . ----------------------------------- I dont know how true this story is but I found it amusing. It also sure sounds similar to some of the software projects I've done (and heard of) over the years. Projects with old requirements, laced with spaghetti code that is left untouched for fear of the breaking the application. "I dont know how it works... but it does... so dont touch it... Anybody else relate to this? Cheers, David
Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did. Some archiological research in England somewhere uncovered that fact. Most of Europe changed over to the right only in the last few centuries. (I think Sweden changed over only as recently as the '60s) India and Australia drive on the left because of the influcences of the British Empire. Apparently in France the railway system is left based becuase originally it was British Engineers that helped them get started. As is the Madrid Metro.
* Developer Day Scotland: are you interested in speaking or attending? My: Website | Blog
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Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did. Some archiological research in England somewhere uncovered that fact. Most of Europe changed over to the right only in the last few centuries. (I think Sweden changed over only as recently as the '60s) India and Australia drive on the left because of the influcences of the British Empire. Apparently in France the railway system is left based becuase originally it was British Engineers that helped them get started. As is the Madrid Metro.
* Developer Day Scotland: are you interested in speaking or attending? My: Website | Blog
Colin Angus Mackay wrote:
India and Australia drive on the left because of the influcences of the British Empire.
And with all my US travel, I still find myself turning corners and trying to remember which side I need to pull in to.
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ Metal Musings - Rex and my new metal blog
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Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did. Some archiological research in England somewhere uncovered that fact. Most of Europe changed over to the right only in the last few centuries. (I think Sweden changed over only as recently as the '60s) India and Australia drive on the left because of the influcences of the British Empire. Apparently in France the railway system is left based becuase originally it was British Engineers that helped them get started. As is the Madrid Metro.
* Developer Day Scotland: are you interested in speaking or attending? My: Website | Blog
Colin Angus Mackay wrote:
Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did.
Cecil says otherwise.
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Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did. Some archiological research in England somewhere uncovered that fact. Most of Europe changed over to the right only in the last few centuries. (I think Sweden changed over only as recently as the '60s) India and Australia drive on the left because of the influcences of the British Empire. Apparently in France the railway system is left based becuase originally it was British Engineers that helped them get started. As is the Madrid Metro.
* Developer Day Scotland: are you interested in speaking or attending? My: Website | Blog
Colin Angus Mackay wrote:
India and Australia drive on the left
... and NZ and Japan...
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Colin Angus Mackay wrote:
Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did.
Cecil says otherwise.
Chris Losinger wrote:
Cecil says otherwise.
Cecil doesn't go back in history far enough! This suggests that it was the romans[^] and that the pope's ruling (which is where "Cecil" starts) was already the general custom, he just made it official.
* Developer Day Scotland: are you interested in speaking or attending? My: Website | Blog
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Got this clip forwarded to me... --------------------- Have you heard the line " We've always done it that way " The US standard rail guage is 4 foot 8.5 inches ( the distance between the rails ) An odd number . Why was this spacing used ? Because that was the way they built them in England , and English expatriots built the US tracks . Why did the English build them that way ? Because they were built by the same people who built the pre-railway tramways and that was the guage that they used . And why did " they " build them like that ? because they used the same tools and guages as the people who built wagons in the old days . Okay ! Why were wagons built with that spacing ? Because if they didn't , then the wagons would get broken wheels because they would not fit in the ruts in the road . So . Who built the old rutted roads ? The Imperial Romans built roads all over Europe ( and England ) to move their Legions on and the roads were used ever since . And the ruts in the road , where did they come from ? The Roman chariots made the ruts and everyone since had to build their wagons to that wheel spacing so as not to break their wheels by not following the ruts . The chariots were all built in Imperial Rome and all had the same wheel spacing . So the US rails are spaced at 4 foot 8.5 inches because of chariots in ancient Rome and the bureaucracy lives on . The next time you are handed a specification an wonder what horses ass came up with it . You may be right . Because the chariots were made in Imperial Rome and made just wide enough for two war horses rear ends . ----------------------------------- I dont know how true this story is but I found it amusing. It also sure sounds similar to some of the software projects I've done (and heard of) over the years. Projects with old requirements, laced with spaghetti code that is left untouched for fear of the breaking the application. "I dont know how it works... but it does... so dont touch it... Anybody else relate to this? Cheers, David
Except it's not true. Originally the US built railroads will a wide variety of gauges. As trade grew after the American Civil War, this differences in gauges caused serious problems. Eventually the standard gauge was adopted. The standard gauge was originally pushed by Stephenson in England because many of the original horse and mule drawn rails already used that gauge. That gauge was most likely the result of the width of two hourses in harness, thus the similarity. The outside width of a standard rail is an even five feet (gauge being the measurment between rails) which likely accounts for the exact, though seemingly arbitrary, 4'-8.5". (Interestingly, over the decades, testing shows that for most railways if you go much wider or much skinnier, you end up with all sorts of stability problems.) --------------- Applying this to software, it actually argues that standardization is essential for broad successs, that there is no reason to change something just for the sake of doing so and that there is often a very valid underlying reason for designing something a certain way, even if such reasons are somewhat lost in the mysts of time. See the book "The Design of Everyday Things" for other examples.
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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Except it's not true. Originally the US built railroads will a wide variety of gauges. As trade grew after the American Civil War, this differences in gauges caused serious problems. Eventually the standard gauge was adopted. The standard gauge was originally pushed by Stephenson in England because many of the original horse and mule drawn rails already used that gauge. That gauge was most likely the result of the width of two hourses in harness, thus the similarity. The outside width of a standard rail is an even five feet (gauge being the measurment between rails) which likely accounts for the exact, though seemingly arbitrary, 4'-8.5". (Interestingly, over the decades, testing shows that for most railways if you go much wider or much skinnier, you end up with all sorts of stability problems.) --------------- Applying this to software, it actually argues that standardization is essential for broad successs, that there is no reason to change something just for the sake of doing so and that there is often a very valid underlying reason for designing something a certain way, even if such reasons are somewhat lost in the mysts of time. See the book "The Design of Everyday Things" for other examples.
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
Very interesting. great post. The rail gauges were also a major issue during WWII on the eastern front when the Russians used a diferent gauge than Western Europe and both sides were constantly reconstructing the rails as the fronts shifted. I imagine it is standardized today but perhaps not. Anyone know offhand? David
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Got this clip forwarded to me... --------------------- Have you heard the line " We've always done it that way " The US standard rail guage is 4 foot 8.5 inches ( the distance between the rails ) An odd number . Why was this spacing used ? Because that was the way they built them in England , and English expatriots built the US tracks . Why did the English build them that way ? Because they were built by the same people who built the pre-railway tramways and that was the guage that they used . And why did " they " build them like that ? because they used the same tools and guages as the people who built wagons in the old days . Okay ! Why were wagons built with that spacing ? Because if they didn't , then the wagons would get broken wheels because they would not fit in the ruts in the road . So . Who built the old rutted roads ? The Imperial Romans built roads all over Europe ( and England ) to move their Legions on and the roads were used ever since . And the ruts in the road , where did they come from ? The Roman chariots made the ruts and everyone since had to build their wagons to that wheel spacing so as not to break their wheels by not following the ruts . The chariots were all built in Imperial Rome and all had the same wheel spacing . So the US rails are spaced at 4 foot 8.5 inches because of chariots in ancient Rome and the bureaucracy lives on . The next time you are handed a specification an wonder what horses ass came up with it . You may be right . Because the chariots were made in Imperial Rome and made just wide enough for two war horses rear ends . ----------------------------------- I dont know how true this story is but I found it amusing. It also sure sounds similar to some of the software projects I've done (and heard of) over the years. Projects with old requirements, laced with spaghetti code that is left untouched for fear of the breaking the application. "I dont know how it works... but it does... so dont touch it... Anybody else relate to this? Cheers, David
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Got this clip forwarded to me... --------------------- Have you heard the line " We've always done it that way " The US standard rail guage is 4 foot 8.5 inches ( the distance between the rails ) An odd number . Why was this spacing used ? Because that was the way they built them in England , and English expatriots built the US tracks . Why did the English build them that way ? Because they were built by the same people who built the pre-railway tramways and that was the guage that they used . And why did " they " build them like that ? because they used the same tools and guages as the people who built wagons in the old days . Okay ! Why were wagons built with that spacing ? Because if they didn't , then the wagons would get broken wheels because they would not fit in the ruts in the road . So . Who built the old rutted roads ? The Imperial Romans built roads all over Europe ( and England ) to move their Legions on and the roads were used ever since . And the ruts in the road , where did they come from ? The Roman chariots made the ruts and everyone since had to build their wagons to that wheel spacing so as not to break their wheels by not following the ruts . The chariots were all built in Imperial Rome and all had the same wheel spacing . So the US rails are spaced at 4 foot 8.5 inches because of chariots in ancient Rome and the bureaucracy lives on . The next time you are handed a specification an wonder what horses ass came up with it . You may be right . Because the chariots were made in Imperial Rome and made just wide enough for two war horses rear ends . ----------------------------------- I dont know how true this story is but I found it amusing. It also sure sounds similar to some of the software projects I've done (and heard of) over the years. Projects with old requirements, laced with spaghetti code that is left untouched for fear of the breaking the application. "I dont know how it works... but it does... so dont touch it... Anybody else relate to this? Cheers, David
I like what snopes[^] had to say about it. :)
Origins: This is one of those items that -- although wrong in many of its details — isn't exactly false in an overall sense and is perhaps more fairly labelled as "True, but for trivial and unremarkable reasons." Marvelling that the width of modern roadways is similar to the width of ancient roadways is sort of like getting excited over a notion such as "modern clothes sizes are based upon standards developed by medieval tailors."_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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Except it's not true. Originally the US built railroads will a wide variety of gauges. As trade grew after the American Civil War, this differences in gauges caused serious problems. Eventually the standard gauge was adopted. The standard gauge was originally pushed by Stephenson in England because many of the original horse and mule drawn rails already used that gauge. That gauge was most likely the result of the width of two hourses in harness, thus the similarity. The outside width of a standard rail is an even five feet (gauge being the measurment between rails) which likely accounts for the exact, though seemingly arbitrary, 4'-8.5". (Interestingly, over the decades, testing shows that for most railways if you go much wider or much skinnier, you end up with all sorts of stability problems.) --------------- Applying this to software, it actually argues that standardization is essential for broad successs, that there is no reason to change something just for the sake of doing so and that there is often a very valid underlying reason for designing something a certain way, even if such reasons are somewhat lost in the mysts of time. See the book "The Design of Everyday Things" for other examples.
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
I thought Abe Lincoln picked the gauge between two competing types.
E=mc2 -> BOOM
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I thought Abe Lincoln picked the gauge between two competing types.
E=mc2 -> BOOM
No
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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Except it's not true. Originally the US built railroads will a wide variety of gauges. As trade grew after the American Civil War, this differences in gauges caused serious problems. Eventually the standard gauge was adopted. The standard gauge was originally pushed by Stephenson in England because many of the original horse and mule drawn rails already used that gauge. That gauge was most likely the result of the width of two hourses in harness, thus the similarity. The outside width of a standard rail is an even five feet (gauge being the measurment between rails) which likely accounts for the exact, though seemingly arbitrary, 4'-8.5". (Interestingly, over the decades, testing shows that for most railways if you go much wider or much skinnier, you end up with all sorts of stability problems.) --------------- Applying this to software, it actually argues that standardization is essential for broad successs, that there is no reason to change something just for the sake of doing so and that there is often a very valid underlying reason for designing something a certain way, even if such reasons are somewhat lost in the mysts of time. See the book "The Design of Everyday Things" for other examples.
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
Joe Woodbury wrote:
Except it's not true.
I wonder how many claim to have come up with the idea. Some attribute teh idea to Babbage http://ei.cs.vt.edu/~history/Babbage.html[^]
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Very interesting. great post. The rail gauges were also a major issue during WWII on the eastern front when the Russians used a diferent gauge than Western Europe and both sides were constantly reconstructing the rails as the fronts shifted. I imagine it is standardized today but perhaps not. Anyone know offhand? David
Orcrist wrote:
I imagine it is standardized today but perhaps not. Anyone know offhand?
Russian railways (and other parts of former USSR) have still wider gauges. Meeting of the two worlds between Slovakia and Ukraine.[^] Standard gauge is the left one.
Pavel
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Joe Woodbury wrote:
Except it's not true.
I wonder how many claim to have come up with the idea. Some attribute teh idea to Babbage http://ei.cs.vt.edu/~history/Babbage.html[^]
Michael A. Barnhart wrote:
Some attribute teh idea to Babbage
When in doubt, and it happened in England in early 19th century, attribute to Babbage.:) We know for sure that George Stephenson came up with the number which was later standardized in 1846 by an act of British parliament. (While checking the date, I found a reference that Stephenson first used 5'8" and later added half an inch for technical reasons--I'd guess due to widening the flanges on the wheels.)
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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Orcrist wrote:
I imagine it is standardized today but perhaps not. Anyone know offhand?
Russian railways (and other parts of former USSR) have still wider gauges. Meeting of the two worlds between Slovakia and Ukraine.[^] Standard gauge is the left one.
Pavel
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Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did. Some archiological research in England somewhere uncovered that fact. Most of Europe changed over to the right only in the last few centuries. (I think Sweden changed over only as recently as the '60s) India and Australia drive on the left because of the influcences of the British Empire. Apparently in France the railway system is left based becuase originally it was British Engineers that helped them get started. As is the Madrid Metro.
* Developer Day Scotland: are you interested in speaking or attending? My: Website | Blog
Colin Angus Mackay wrote:
ForumThe Lounge Subject:Re: Because we've always done it this way... Sender:Colin Angus Mackay Date:17:55 9 Aug '06 Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did.
The story I've heard is that the reason for driving on the left is for having the right hand (the one that used the whip) on the middle of the road and avoid whiping the people that were walking. And similarly, the story I've heard about the change to the right is because of Napoleon, who hated the British and ordered all his domains (basically all Europe except the Brits) to change to driving on the right. Of course, this is a story a heard when I was a kid and, to be honest, I haven't bothered to check if it may be true or not. But I think it's funny anyway.
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Very interesting. great post. The rail gauges were also a major issue during WWII on the eastern front when the Russians used a diferent gauge than Western Europe and both sides were constantly reconstructing the rails as the fronts shifted. I imagine it is standardized today but perhaps not. Anyone know offhand? David
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Same reason why many countries that drive on the left do so - Because the Romans did. Some archiological research in England somewhere uncovered that fact. Most of Europe changed over to the right only in the last few centuries. (I think Sweden changed over only as recently as the '60s) India and Australia drive on the left because of the influcences of the British Empire. Apparently in France the railway system is left based becuase originally it was British Engineers that helped them get started. As is the Madrid Metro.
* Developer Day Scotland: are you interested in speaking or attending? My: Website | Blog
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Got this clip forwarded to me... --------------------- Have you heard the line " We've always done it that way " The US standard rail guage is 4 foot 8.5 inches ( the distance between the rails ) An odd number . Why was this spacing used ? Because that was the way they built them in England , and English expatriots built the US tracks . Why did the English build them that way ? Because they were built by the same people who built the pre-railway tramways and that was the guage that they used . And why did " they " build them like that ? because they used the same tools and guages as the people who built wagons in the old days . Okay ! Why were wagons built with that spacing ? Because if they didn't , then the wagons would get broken wheels because they would not fit in the ruts in the road . So . Who built the old rutted roads ? The Imperial Romans built roads all over Europe ( and England ) to move their Legions on and the roads were used ever since . And the ruts in the road , where did they come from ? The Roman chariots made the ruts and everyone since had to build their wagons to that wheel spacing so as not to break their wheels by not following the ruts . The chariots were all built in Imperial Rome and all had the same wheel spacing . So the US rails are spaced at 4 foot 8.5 inches because of chariots in ancient Rome and the bureaucracy lives on . The next time you are handed a specification an wonder what horses ass came up with it . You may be right . Because the chariots were made in Imperial Rome and made just wide enough for two war horses rear ends . ----------------------------------- I dont know how true this story is but I found it amusing. It also sure sounds similar to some of the software projects I've done (and heard of) over the years. Projects with old requirements, laced with spaghetti code that is left untouched for fear of the breaking the application. "I dont know how it works... but it does... so dont touch it... Anybody else relate to this? Cheers, David
Orcrist wrote:
because they used the same tools and guages as the people who built wagons in the old days
But they managed to make new tools and gauges for railways they built in India (Broad Gauge, 5' 6" wide and Metre Gauge, 1 meter wide) in addition to several narrow-gauge lines. In fact, even within Britain, they built a line in Wales that was 7' wide. So this is most likely just somebody's imagination run riot.