Another reason why i hate XP...
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Ed.Poore wrote:
Shouldn't you be able to hold it down.
Ed.Poore wrote:
Idiot-proof it, you'd have to do this in hardware to bypass the hold down button functionality.
Ed.Poore wrote:
You can tell the PC to ignore the power button altogether when XP is running. At least on mine you can, or you could password protect the screen saver, even if it's something obvious, then at least it won't shutdown (I think).
Well, what i did was go into Display properties, then Screensaver, then Power Schemes, where it lets you set what the power button does when pressed within windows. I set it to do nothing...problem solved, well the "involuntary" shutdown was... and so it did like intended, or at least when i held it down the system didn't respond...but it did shut down in 10 minutes when the battery ran out...
Ed.Poore wrote:
Well who's fault is that? Ever heard of "Save" ?
I should've been clearer...it was mostly internet research that i lost, and about 15 minutes of work...i'm pretty good at saving, having for a long time worked on Macs which had a mind of their own when it came to Photoshop bugs:rolleyes: Roswell
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CA -
Dario Solera wrote:
So, you cause the problem. It's like trying to move a 20-ton block of rock with a car.
I should've been clearer here as well...the taskman problem happened on a fairly new (only a year old) sony laptop, which runs XP and isn't mine but i have a copy of VS05 on it for when i use it... my scrap machines are just my personal "herd" that's not work related, though two of them have enough power to get the job done...all running 98...which i only brought up in this discussion because they did, and i had to use the taskman a few times
Dario Solera wrote:
You cannot kill "System". It's like trying to remove the engine of a car while driving. In my opinion, you don't understand what computers are for.
I'm fairly new to the NT branch of windows, but no, i'm not surprised i couldn't kill system...explorer, yes...done so may times, so i was half hoping that if System crashes it will reload itself, but i haven't dealt with it in practice...but i was almost expecting the "engine" analogy, since the name says it anyway... Roswell
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CARoswellNX wrote:
I'm fairly new to the NT branch of windows
He he! You're about 10 years out-of-date. :-D
________________________________________________ Personal Blog [ITA] - Tech Blog [ENG] - My Photos Developing ScrewTurn Wiki 2.0 (2.0 Beta is out)
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The taskman, which is supposed bail you out when ever you are stuck (i.e. a program running an endless loop) has to perform a stack walk too! Kinda self defeating, don't you think?:mad: I remember how it was in windows 98 (still use it btw...no vista for me). /* Everyone seems to remember 98 for the blue screen (they don't know how to use it), but not me...in fact it was nice and light-weight...can't anyone put out an o/s with a small footprint anymore? Processors get faster and faster, and the o/s gets fatter and fatter, and give you roughly the same system usability...but where's the gain? */ But the way it used to be was that on Alt+Ctrl+Del, boom there it was. Thanks to the infailability of the keyboard driver (i'm assuming 98 had something like the tty driver is in unix), it would always catch the key sequence. Sure, you'll have a memory leak if you do kill the offending program (and will have to reboot in the next hour or so or risk worse hangups, typical for 98's memory management), but you can rely on it to sandwitch itself as the very 1st thing in line and displace whatever is taking up all the CPU cycles. If the stack itself (processor cache?...i'm no expert at this, but i'd seen enough it to make sense of what i saw) filled up completely you'd get a blue screen instead, but all you'd have to do is press enter and try again as it clears. I'm used to this as i always force the scrap machines (reclaimed parts, mix & match of whatever's most compatible) to do more than they were intended. But under XP, the whole process is turned on its head. On an average day if i need to deal with something, it's a 30 second to a minute wait, which is okay, but coupled with the taskman itself responding slowly, only functioning when an extra two cpu cycles are available, it's a bit of a pain. If you are used to 98, then it's completely backwards. Couldn't they have thought of something better? Whoever Microsoft assigned must have had his a** and spleen work on the code, while the guy himself was reading The Onion all day!:wtf: However this time it took about 2 hours for the taskman to come up, with "System" having choked and taking up all the CPU cycles. Once every 5 seconds the taskman would be functional, but even then it seems like "System" was protected and i couldn't kill it. I tried to power down or go into standby to hopefully have the process crash and restart but no, doesn't take it. No way to scram it, it just keeps going snails pace, 2 minute old tooltips and gui hi-lights :sigh: Had to pull the p
RoswellNX wrote:
But the way it used to be was that on Alt+Ctrl+Del, boom there it was. Thanks to the infailability of the keyboard driver (i'm assuming 98 had something like the tty driver is in unix), it would always catch the key sequence.
As former Win98SE victim I can tell that this is blatant nonsense!
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Dario Solera wrote:
So, you cause the problem. It's like trying to move a 20-ton block of rock with a car.
I should've been clearer here as well...the taskman problem happened on a fairly new (only a year old) sony laptop, which runs XP and isn't mine but i have a copy of VS05 on it for when i use it... my scrap machines are just my personal "herd" that's not work related, though two of them have enough power to get the job done...all running 98...which i only brought up in this discussion because they did, and i had to use the taskman a few times
Dario Solera wrote:
You cannot kill "System". It's like trying to remove the engine of a car while driving. In my opinion, you don't understand what computers are for.
I'm fairly new to the NT branch of windows, but no, i'm not surprised i couldn't kill system...explorer, yes...done so may times, so i was half hoping that if System crashes it will reload itself, but i haven't dealt with it in practice...but i was almost expecting the "engine" analogy, since the name says it anyway... Roswell
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CA"System" isn't a true process. It's where the kernel's worker threads live. Probably a high-priority driver thread had gone into an infinite loop, or a piece of hardware had been constantly generating interrupts, its driver not acknowledging them properly. As such, user-mode processes weren't getting any CPU time (or were getting very little), so Task Manager would take a very long time to come up.
Stability. What an interesting concept. -- Chris Maunder
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The taskman, which is supposed bail you out when ever you are stuck (i.e. a program running an endless loop) has to perform a stack walk too! Kinda self defeating, don't you think?:mad: I remember how it was in windows 98 (still use it btw...no vista for me). /* Everyone seems to remember 98 for the blue screen (they don't know how to use it), but not me...in fact it was nice and light-weight...can't anyone put out an o/s with a small footprint anymore? Processors get faster and faster, and the o/s gets fatter and fatter, and give you roughly the same system usability...but where's the gain? */ But the way it used to be was that on Alt+Ctrl+Del, boom there it was. Thanks to the infailability of the keyboard driver (i'm assuming 98 had something like the tty driver is in unix), it would always catch the key sequence. Sure, you'll have a memory leak if you do kill the offending program (and will have to reboot in the next hour or so or risk worse hangups, typical for 98's memory management), but you can rely on it to sandwitch itself as the very 1st thing in line and displace whatever is taking up all the CPU cycles. If the stack itself (processor cache?...i'm no expert at this, but i'd seen enough it to make sense of what i saw) filled up completely you'd get a blue screen instead, but all you'd have to do is press enter and try again as it clears. I'm used to this as i always force the scrap machines (reclaimed parts, mix & match of whatever's most compatible) to do more than they were intended. But under XP, the whole process is turned on its head. On an average day if i need to deal with something, it's a 30 second to a minute wait, which is okay, but coupled with the taskman itself responding slowly, only functioning when an extra two cpu cycles are available, it's a bit of a pain. If you are used to 98, then it's completely backwards. Couldn't they have thought of something better? Whoever Microsoft assigned must have had his a** and spleen work on the code, while the guy himself was reading The Onion all day!:wtf: However this time it took about 2 hours for the taskman to come up, with "System" having choked and taking up all the CPU cycles. Once every 5 seconds the taskman would be functional, but even then it seems like "System" was protected and i couldn't kill it. I tried to power down or go into standby to hopefully have the process crash and restart but no, doesn't take it. No way to scram it, it just keeps going snails pace, 2 minute old tooltips and gui hi-lights :sigh: Had to pull the p
RoswellNX wrote:
The taskman, which is supposed bail you out when ever you are stuck (i.e. a program running an endless loop) has to perform a stack walk too!
Please, never more use Taskman: SysInternals Process Explorer[^] ;)
:sigh: Still searching for a good resource to LEARN English grammar ...
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.(John 3:16) :badger: -
RoswellNX wrote:
I remember how it was in windows 98 (still use it btw...no vista for me).
I got this far and gave up. Anyone defending 98 as a better alternative to XP loses all credibility, IMHO. Win98 was a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a gaping flesh wound. In '98, a single process could take down the machine with no effort whatsoever. I could write you a one line program that would do it instantly. XP has a million things wrong with it, and I was kind of looking forward to reading this post, but dude, you're out in lala land if you want to go back to the Win98 way of doing things.
Faith is a fine invention For gentlemen who see; But microscopes are prudent In an emergency! -Emily Dickinson
David Kentley wrote:
I got this far and gave up. Anyone defending 98 as a better alternative to XP loses all credibility, IMHO. Win98 was a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a gaping flesh wound. In '98, a single process could take down the machine with no effort whatsoever. I could write you a one line program that would do it instantly. XP has a million things wrong with it, and I was kind of looking forward to reading this post, but dude, you're out in lala land if you want to go back to the Win98 way of doing things.
I actually agree with you, but none of us are on the same page...i was simply bothered by how cumbersome XP is in practice. It's like comparing a honda civic and a sherman tank. I prefer to have a tin can of an o/s, just as long as it's fast and still has the Win32 libraries and wouldn't have compatibility issues(as opposed to switching to linux and trying to get it to work with WinE) when i run the software i use. Look, i'm a cheapskate, i admit it. XP may be superior in the ways that Titanic was, pretty bulletproof...right? But not much use in a muddy lake. There you'd at best need an inflatable rubber boat :laugh: It's not that serious of an issue, vote me down again if you like...we are just looking at different things here :-O. Roswell :)
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CA -
RoswellNX wrote:
I remember how it was in windows 98 (still use it btw...no vista for me).
I got this far and gave up. Anyone defending 98 as a better alternative to XP loses all credibility, IMHO. Win98 was a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a band-aid on top of a gaping flesh wound. In '98, a single process could take down the machine with no effort whatsoever. I could write you a one line program that would do it instantly. XP has a million things wrong with it, and I was kind of looking forward to reading this post, but dude, you're out in lala land if you want to go back to the Win98 way of doing things.
Faith is a fine invention For gentlemen who see; But microscopes are prudent In an emergency! -Emily Dickinson
David Kentley wrote:
Anyone defending 98 as a better alternative to XP loses all credibility
Amen to that, brother! As an example of a professionally written operating system, Windows 98 was a pretty piss-poor example.
0 bottles of beer on the wall, 0 bottles of beer, you take 1 down, pass it around, 4294967295 bottles of beer on the wall. Awasu 2.2.4 [^]: A free RSS/Atom feed reader with support for Code Project.
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"System" isn't a true process. It's where the kernel's worker threads live. Probably a high-priority driver thread had gone into an infinite loop, or a piece of hardware had been constantly generating interrupts, its driver not acknowledging them properly. As such, user-mode processes weren't getting any CPU time (or were getting very little), so Task Manager would take a very long time to come up.
Stability. What an interesting concept. -- Chris Maunder
Mike Dimmick wrote:
"System" isn't a true process. It's where the kernel's worker threads live. Probably a high-priority driver thread had gone into an infinite loop, or a piece of hardware had been constantly generating interrupts, its driver not acknowledging them properly. As such, user-mode processes weren't getting any CPU time (or were getting very little), so Task Manager would take a very long time to come up.
Thanks for not going into the ridicule mode unlike everyone else. :cool: I actually thought so myself, i just haven't taken the time to write it all out and kill the dial-up users with the long post:laugh: Although it's not exactly something i can talk about with much experience, i figured that the System process would be pretty much equal to the Unix kernel, with all the underlying daemons. The fact that it runs under "system" rather than "user" gives it away. The infinite loop was actually either started by the 2nd monitor being unplugged at the time the machine came back out of standby, or a driver conflict with the wireless card on/off switch. I kinda wish there was a way to knock out the driver thread separately and restart it though windows doesn't exactly allow for that as far as i know. My rant was more than anything about taskman not being the same way it was in 98, but it's understandable that in a multi-user environment it would be a security liability if it ran as system... Roswell:)
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CA -
RoswellNX wrote:
But the way it used to be was that on Alt+Ctrl+Del, boom there it was. Thanks to the infailability of the keyboard driver (i'm assuming 98 had something like the tty driver is in unix), it would always catch the key sequence.
As former Win98SE victim I can tell that this is blatant nonsense!
Sceptic Mole wrote:
As former Win98SE victim I can tell that this is blatant nonsense!
it is...i was being half sarcastic, but at the same time i give it credibility as being more comfortable/usable in the situations i were in :) Roswell
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CA -
The taskman, which is supposed bail you out when ever you are stuck (i.e. a program running an endless loop) has to perform a stack walk too! Kinda self defeating, don't you think?:mad: I remember how it was in windows 98 (still use it btw...no vista for me). /* Everyone seems to remember 98 for the blue screen (they don't know how to use it), but not me...in fact it was nice and light-weight...can't anyone put out an o/s with a small footprint anymore? Processors get faster and faster, and the o/s gets fatter and fatter, and give you roughly the same system usability...but where's the gain? */ But the way it used to be was that on Alt+Ctrl+Del, boom there it was. Thanks to the infailability of the keyboard driver (i'm assuming 98 had something like the tty driver is in unix), it would always catch the key sequence. Sure, you'll have a memory leak if you do kill the offending program (and will have to reboot in the next hour or so or risk worse hangups, typical for 98's memory management), but you can rely on it to sandwitch itself as the very 1st thing in line and displace whatever is taking up all the CPU cycles. If the stack itself (processor cache?...i'm no expert at this, but i'd seen enough it to make sense of what i saw) filled up completely you'd get a blue screen instead, but all you'd have to do is press enter and try again as it clears. I'm used to this as i always force the scrap machines (reclaimed parts, mix & match of whatever's most compatible) to do more than they were intended. But under XP, the whole process is turned on its head. On an average day if i need to deal with something, it's a 30 second to a minute wait, which is okay, but coupled with the taskman itself responding slowly, only functioning when an extra two cpu cycles are available, it's a bit of a pain. If you are used to 98, then it's completely backwards. Couldn't they have thought of something better? Whoever Microsoft assigned must have had his a** and spleen work on the code, while the guy himself was reading The Onion all day!:wtf: However this time it took about 2 hours for the taskman to come up, with "System" having choked and taking up all the CPU cycles. Once every 5 seconds the taskman would be functional, but even then it seems like "System" was protected and i couldn't kill it. I tried to power down or go into standby to hopefully have the process crash and restart but no, doesn't take it. No way to scram it, it just keeps going snails pace, 2 minute old tooltips and gui hi-lights :sigh: Had to pull the p
Once upon a time I wrote a simple application in C/C++ (don't recall where it is, quite handy though) that had one goal in life. Run at a very elevated level of permissions. If process ran at 100% start ticking, look for special keypress from me. If keypress, kill 100% process. The WINAPI made this trivial and it *always* worked. Why don't you just bail yourself out and write one of those? It's cake you don't need a UI, just a few API's that you hook and that's about it.
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RoswellNX wrote:
The taskman, which is supposed bail you out when ever you are stuck (i.e. a program running an endless loop) has to perform a stack walk too!
Please, never more use Taskman: SysInternals Process Explorer[^] ;)
:sigh: Still searching for a good resource to LEARN English grammar ...
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.(John 3:16) :badger: -
Once upon a time I wrote a simple application in C/C++ (don't recall where it is, quite handy though) that had one goal in life. Run at a very elevated level of permissions. If process ran at 100% start ticking, look for special keypress from me. If keypress, kill 100% process. The WINAPI made this trivial and it *always* worked. Why don't you just bail yourself out and write one of those? It's cake you don't need a UI, just a few API's that you hook and that's about it.
code-frog wrote:
Once upon a time I wrote a simple application in C/C++ (don't recall where it is, quite handy though) that had one goal in life. Run at a very elevated level of permissions. If process ran at 100% start ticking, look for special keypress from me. If keypress, kill 100% process. The WINAPI made this trivial and it *always* worked. Why don't you just bail yourself out and write one of those? It's cake you don't need a UI, just a few API's that you hook and that's about it.
Thanks for being one of the nice people here, even as i've been a bit inarticulate in my rant:-O Perhaps i should just start a thread and say a bit about who i am (and ask that others provide a brief description of themselves as well), because i'll probably find that even here i'm the odd man out :laugh: Being a graphic designer i only go into programming as far as server-side scripting and applications, a pretty sandboxed environment, (in which i don't happen to interact with the host's o/s, and thus not knowing much about it). I don't exactly fit the CP community per se, but with so many people working on web-based applications, every day is a learning experience. As also a helpdesk(though i'm not certified), i have a bit of an "outside" knowledge of windows and mac os(both kinds of mac os), but writing an application would be a bit over my head :-O, though i can probably start reading on the windows API little by little. Roswell
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CA -
Once upon a time I wrote a simple application in C/C++ (don't recall where it is, quite handy though) that had one goal in life. Run at a very elevated level of permissions. If process ran at 100% start ticking, look for special keypress from me. If keypress, kill 100% process. The WINAPI made this trivial and it *always* worked. Why don't you just bail yourself out and write one of those? It's cake you don't need a UI, just a few API's that you hook and that's about it.
Sounds like an article to me.:-D
the last thing I want to see is some pasty-faced geek with skin so pale that it's almost translucent trying to bump parts with a partner - John Simmons / outlaw programmer
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before. -
code-frog wrote:
Once upon a time I wrote a simple application in C/C++ (don't recall where it is, quite handy though) that had one goal in life. Run at a very elevated level of permissions. If process ran at 100% start ticking, look for special keypress from me. If keypress, kill 100% process. The WINAPI made this trivial and it *always* worked. Why don't you just bail yourself out and write one of those? It's cake you don't need a UI, just a few API's that you hook and that's about it.
Thanks for being one of the nice people here, even as i've been a bit inarticulate in my rant:-O Perhaps i should just start a thread and say a bit about who i am (and ask that others provide a brief description of themselves as well), because i'll probably find that even here i'm the odd man out :laugh: Being a graphic designer i only go into programming as far as server-side scripting and applications, a pretty sandboxed environment, (in which i don't happen to interact with the host's o/s, and thus not knowing much about it). I don't exactly fit the CP community per se, but with so many people working on web-based applications, every day is a learning experience. As also a helpdesk(though i'm not certified), i have a bit of an "outside" knowledge of windows and mac os(both kinds of mac os), but writing an application would be a bit over my head :-O, though i can probably start reading on the windows API little by little. Roswell
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CAI definitely think the abuse you have taken SUCKS and is totally inappropriate. A lot of people here act like children which makes me want to spank them like I would a spoiled child. But here's what I really think. If you feel like the "odd man out" here or anywhere then that's a good thing. It means your not some simple-minded, feeble, intimidated dweeb that can be cowed by the ignorance of others. It means you have self-confidence are deliberate in each thing you do and have well formed ideas and opinions that are exclusively yours. If you take a beating here then it's probably not bad. It looks like the morons turned out in force for your thread here but aside from that nice job. I'm actually an independent thinker as well (that's why I'm self-employed making 4 to 6 times what I used to make) and appreciate your comments. There were definitely things about 98 to like. It was very fast and nimble. If they ever took the time to rewrite 98 as 'Windows Gamer Edition' and keep much of it the same (kernel, etc) and improve the things we can now do without making the footprint monolithic I'm quite convinced it would outsell Vista in it's first month. I just found out your are a chick last night. Congrats on that! Please stay here and keep your thoughts and opinions churning. We need more girls here and we especially need girls like you and Leckey who are not intimidated by the moronic masses here.:-D I often forget about Trollslayer and Anna who have been bedrock establishments for a long time.:rose:
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The taskman, which is supposed bail you out when ever you are stuck (i.e. a program running an endless loop) has to perform a stack walk too! Kinda self defeating, don't you think?:mad: I remember how it was in windows 98 (still use it btw...no vista for me). /* Everyone seems to remember 98 for the blue screen (they don't know how to use it), but not me...in fact it was nice and light-weight...can't anyone put out an o/s with a small footprint anymore? Processors get faster and faster, and the o/s gets fatter and fatter, and give you roughly the same system usability...but where's the gain? */ But the way it used to be was that on Alt+Ctrl+Del, boom there it was. Thanks to the infailability of the keyboard driver (i'm assuming 98 had something like the tty driver is in unix), it would always catch the key sequence. Sure, you'll have a memory leak if you do kill the offending program (and will have to reboot in the next hour or so or risk worse hangups, typical for 98's memory management), but you can rely on it to sandwitch itself as the very 1st thing in line and displace whatever is taking up all the CPU cycles. If the stack itself (processor cache?...i'm no expert at this, but i'd seen enough it to make sense of what i saw) filled up completely you'd get a blue screen instead, but all you'd have to do is press enter and try again as it clears. I'm used to this as i always force the scrap machines (reclaimed parts, mix & match of whatever's most compatible) to do more than they were intended. But under XP, the whole process is turned on its head. On an average day if i need to deal with something, it's a 30 second to a minute wait, which is okay, but coupled with the taskman itself responding slowly, only functioning when an extra two cpu cycles are available, it's a bit of a pain. If you are used to 98, then it's completely backwards. Couldn't they have thought of something better? Whoever Microsoft assigned must have had his a** and spleen work on the code, while the guy himself was reading The Onion all day!:wtf: However this time it took about 2 hours for the taskman to come up, with "System" having choked and taking up all the CPU cycles. Once every 5 seconds the taskman would be functional, but even then it seems like "System" was protected and i couldn't kill it. I tried to power down or go into standby to hopefully have the process crash and restart but no, doesn't take it. No way to scram it, it just keeps going snails pace, 2 minute old tooltips and gui hi-lights :sigh: Had to pull the p
RoswellNX wrote:
However this time it took about 2 hours for the taskman to come up, with "System" having choked and taking up all the CPU cycles.
I've seen this behaviour recently on a Laptop, its fine in safe mode, or if you remove the battery and run only on Mains power... But with the battery in, the system task locks up the machine completely...
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I definitely think the abuse you have taken SUCKS and is totally inappropriate. A lot of people here act like children which makes me want to spank them like I would a spoiled child. But here's what I really think. If you feel like the "odd man out" here or anywhere then that's a good thing. It means your not some simple-minded, feeble, intimidated dweeb that can be cowed by the ignorance of others. It means you have self-confidence are deliberate in each thing you do and have well formed ideas and opinions that are exclusively yours. If you take a beating here then it's probably not bad. It looks like the morons turned out in force for your thread here but aside from that nice job. I'm actually an independent thinker as well (that's why I'm self-employed making 4 to 6 times what I used to make) and appreciate your comments. There were definitely things about 98 to like. It was very fast and nimble. If they ever took the time to rewrite 98 as 'Windows Gamer Edition' and keep much of it the same (kernel, etc) and improve the things we can now do without making the footprint monolithic I'm quite convinced it would outsell Vista in it's first month. I just found out your are a chick last night. Congrats on that! Please stay here and keep your thoughts and opinions churning. We need more girls here and we especially need girls like you and Leckey who are not intimidated by the moronic masses here.:-D I often forget about Trollslayer and Anna who have been bedrock establishments for a long time.:rose:
code-frog wrote:
We need more girls here and we especially need girls like you and Leckey who are not intimidated by the moronic masses here.
...and who post pictures. Girls who post pictures rock. :rolleyes: [edit: 17?! Gosh, now i feel old. And scuzzy. :doh: ]
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The taskman, which is supposed bail you out when ever you are stuck (i.e. a program running an endless loop) has to perform a stack walk too! Kinda self defeating, don't you think?:mad: I remember how it was in windows 98 (still use it btw...no vista for me). /* Everyone seems to remember 98 for the blue screen (they don't know how to use it), but not me...in fact it was nice and light-weight...can't anyone put out an o/s with a small footprint anymore? Processors get faster and faster, and the o/s gets fatter and fatter, and give you roughly the same system usability...but where's the gain? */ But the way it used to be was that on Alt+Ctrl+Del, boom there it was. Thanks to the infailability of the keyboard driver (i'm assuming 98 had something like the tty driver is in unix), it would always catch the key sequence. Sure, you'll have a memory leak if you do kill the offending program (and will have to reboot in the next hour or so or risk worse hangups, typical for 98's memory management), but you can rely on it to sandwitch itself as the very 1st thing in line and displace whatever is taking up all the CPU cycles. If the stack itself (processor cache?...i'm no expert at this, but i'd seen enough it to make sense of what i saw) filled up completely you'd get a blue screen instead, but all you'd have to do is press enter and try again as it clears. I'm used to this as i always force the scrap machines (reclaimed parts, mix & match of whatever's most compatible) to do more than they were intended. But under XP, the whole process is turned on its head. On an average day if i need to deal with something, it's a 30 second to a minute wait, which is okay, but coupled with the taskman itself responding slowly, only functioning when an extra two cpu cycles are available, it's a bit of a pain. If you are used to 98, then it's completely backwards. Couldn't they have thought of something better? Whoever Microsoft assigned must have had his a** and spleen work on the code, while the guy himself was reading The Onion all day!:wtf: However this time it took about 2 hours for the taskman to come up, with "System" having choked and taking up all the CPU cycles. Once every 5 seconds the taskman would be functional, but even then it seems like "System" was protected and i couldn't kill it. I tried to power down or go into standby to hopefully have the process crash and restart but no, doesn't take it. No way to scram it, it just keeps going snails pace, 2 minute old tooltips and gui hi-lights :sigh: Had to pull the p
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The taskman, which is supposed bail you out when ever you are stuck (i.e. a program running an endless loop) has to perform a stack walk too! Kinda self defeating, don't you think?:mad: I remember how it was in windows 98 (still use it btw...no vista for me). /* Everyone seems to remember 98 for the blue screen (they don't know how to use it), but not me...in fact it was nice and light-weight...can't anyone put out an o/s with a small footprint anymore? Processors get faster and faster, and the o/s gets fatter and fatter, and give you roughly the same system usability...but where's the gain? */ But the way it used to be was that on Alt+Ctrl+Del, boom there it was. Thanks to the infailability of the keyboard driver (i'm assuming 98 had something like the tty driver is in unix), it would always catch the key sequence. Sure, you'll have a memory leak if you do kill the offending program (and will have to reboot in the next hour or so or risk worse hangups, typical for 98's memory management), but you can rely on it to sandwitch itself as the very 1st thing in line and displace whatever is taking up all the CPU cycles. If the stack itself (processor cache?...i'm no expert at this, but i'd seen enough it to make sense of what i saw) filled up completely you'd get a blue screen instead, but all you'd have to do is press enter and try again as it clears. I'm used to this as i always force the scrap machines (reclaimed parts, mix & match of whatever's most compatible) to do more than they were intended. But under XP, the whole process is turned on its head. On an average day if i need to deal with something, it's a 30 second to a minute wait, which is okay, but coupled with the taskman itself responding slowly, only functioning when an extra two cpu cycles are available, it's a bit of a pain. If you are used to 98, then it's completely backwards. Couldn't they have thought of something better? Whoever Microsoft assigned must have had his a** and spleen work on the code, while the guy himself was reading The Onion all day!:wtf: However this time it took about 2 hours for the taskman to come up, with "System" having choked and taking up all the CPU cycles. Once every 5 seconds the taskman would be functional, but even then it seems like "System" was protected and i couldn't kill it. I tried to power down or go into standby to hopefully have the process crash and restart but no, doesn't take it. No way to scram it, it just keeps going snails pace, 2 minute old tooltips and gui hi-lights :sigh: Had to pull the p
I agree that applications (and the OS) have become too bloated. OK - while I was never the biggest fan of 98, it did go some way towards being a more consumer friendly version of Windows. I like some of the things that MS did with XP, but I can't help thinking that it was rushed out of the door in the end just to shut people up. For instance, features like the IMDB (In Memory Data Base) were dropped because they were taking too long. Now, if MS had been committed to a full-feature OS this is a decision that they would have had to work very hard to justify. Part of the problem with Windows is that it is a victim of it's own success. It is designed to work "out of the box", which means that it must be capable of supporting just about any hardware that you throw at it, and it must be able to cope with applications that aren't always written that well. This takes code, and the code takes space. Plus, people expect each version to be "prettier" and more stable than the predecessor, which again takes code (and thus resources). One question though - why 10 instances of Notepad?:-D
the last thing I want to see is some pasty-faced geek with skin so pale that it's almost translucent trying to bump parts with a partner - John Simmons / outlaw programmer
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before. -
So now wait a second, you are born in 1990, in times of Win 98 you were, say 8-10 years old !? And you knew how to use the task manager ?! :omg:
My kid brother was 10 when the family PC was upgraded from dos/win3.1 to winMe, and the task mangler was one of the first things I taught him how to use. Here's your mallet go smash stuff. :-D Worked quite well, and he quickly figured out what stuff shouldn't be end tasked as well.
-- Rules of thumb should not be taken for the whole hand.
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I agree that applications (and the OS) have become too bloated. OK - while I was never the biggest fan of 98, it did go some way towards being a more consumer friendly version of Windows. I like some of the things that MS did with XP, but I can't help thinking that it was rushed out of the door in the end just to shut people up. For instance, features like the IMDB (In Memory Data Base) were dropped because they were taking too long. Now, if MS had been committed to a full-feature OS this is a decision that they would have had to work very hard to justify. Part of the problem with Windows is that it is a victim of it's own success. It is designed to work "out of the box", which means that it must be capable of supporting just about any hardware that you throw at it, and it must be able to cope with applications that aren't always written that well. This takes code, and the code takes space. Plus, people expect each version to be "prettier" and more stable than the predecessor, which again takes code (and thus resources). One question though - why 10 instances of Notepad?:-D
the last thing I want to see is some pasty-faced geek with skin so pale that it's almost translucent trying to bump parts with a partner - John Simmons / outlaw programmer
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.Pete O`Hanlon wrote:
One question though - why 10 instances of Notepad?:-D
I use it as a "clipboard". I paste loose bits of code or text onto it, before i get a chance to copy something again, accidentally clearing whatever i just had there. It's also taking up a two inch strip of screen space just above the VS window(which is also downsized, not to overlap notepad space, which i use to put up code examples and rather than paste them in and then try to work them into the existing code(with a avalanche of changes you are bound to miss bugs), i just look at them every once in a while and implement the changes by hand, which is more precise. Roswell :)
"Angelinos -- excuse me. There will be civility today."
Antonio VillaRaigosa
City Mayor, Los Angeles, CA