Developer's Age !
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Hello, Just wanted to know if there are people out there willing to complete their lives in programming, in other words, how do you plan your career vs. your age, I have seen developers aged at 40s and 50s, do you think that the one should quit development at a certain age and shift to technical consultations or project management, and if you are old, and still into code, does this make you small or big ( I think it varies from one country to another ) ? Please share your experience here !
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
Just about to hit my big 40 :sigh: Started coding professionally after leaving college and, with a short few years outside the trade, have never stopped. I've had jobs where the coding is the primary task and others where it's just a bit of scripting for a one-off task. I still get a buzz out of learning a new way of getting the code to do what I want and I get a great deal of satisfaction out of completed project, either a small application for myself at home or a larger job for work. My Mrs has asked me several times why I haven't gone for management positions. I know that the job satisfaction just will not be there.
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Well, at 53, I may not be "old" by your standard for this question, but I certainly have opinions. I've been programming for 37 years. During that time I have been "Just Another Programmer", a consultant, a technical manager, a partner in a 100+ person consulting firm, a co-founder of a software/hardware dev firm, a VP of engineering in another 100+ person company. I keep coming back to programming. My wife doesn't quite get that I have no interest in becoming a manager at my current company. "Wouldn't you make more money?" Sure, and I could make more money as a CPA, or a surgeon, but I wouldn't have the same challenge that comes from finding an elusive multi-threading race condition that causes a weirded out system crash once every 3-5 weeks. I see myself as a programmer until retirement. My ambition will continue to drive me to greater degrees of technical depth and breadth, but it will never let me stray too far from the programming challenges that still float my boat. Later... Tim
-------------------------------------------------- Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. -- George Carlin
I'm really amazed Tim, I thought programming is a young people's job, and after getting somehow old the one starts to stop being a coder, looking for some specialty by adopting one product and being a consultant, but BTW, most of developers I worked with, are not willing to complete their lives as developers, I think also you still code because you have passion to code, it's in your gens as I commented before, programming is a hobby before it's a profession, I guess this is the reason!
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
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Well, at 53, I may not be "old" by your standard for this question, but I certainly have opinions. I've been programming for 37 years. During that time I have been "Just Another Programmer", a consultant, a technical manager, a partner in a 100+ person consulting firm, a co-founder of a software/hardware dev firm, a VP of engineering in another 100+ person company. I keep coming back to programming. My wife doesn't quite get that I have no interest in becoming a manager at my current company. "Wouldn't you make more money?" Sure, and I could make more money as a CPA, or a surgeon, but I wouldn't have the same challenge that comes from finding an elusive multi-threading race condition that causes a weirded out system crash once every 3-5 weeks. I see myself as a programmer until retirement. My ambition will continue to drive me to greater degrees of technical depth and breadth, but it will never let me stray too far from the programming challenges that still float my boat. Later... Tim
-------------------------------------------------- Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. -- George Carlin
Very nice , this give me a hope to continue my programming life :) Ahmed A> Korany
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Bruce Yes experience is a valuable tool and yes it is harder to keep enthusiasm level up but when you do some awesome things can be done! I've heard the joke before but still a good one! Mike
Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. "George Carlin"
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Hello, Just wanted to know if there are people out there willing to complete their lives in programming, in other words, how do you plan your career vs. your age, I have seen developers aged at 40s and 50s, do you think that the one should quit development at a certain age and shift to technical consultations or project management, and if you are old, and still into code, does this make you small or big ( I think it varies from one country to another ) ? Please share your experience here !
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
Fellas, I think 20 years ago, development and software as an industry was not as mature as it's now, so I believe that we're a new generation for software development, development can be a lifetime job, because IT is booming, it's the new cutting edge technology, we're in the information era, so we as Developers are valuable and very important to this era, any comments !!
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
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Well, I'm 66, and yes, once programming gets into your blood, it stays there. BUT, age is definitely not only a state of mind. My body says otherwise! The nice thing is, though, when I'm immersed in a programming challenge, the aches and pains seem to disappear. Also, after 20 or so years in the programming chair, you've pretty much made all the mistakes that can be made, so I find that my coding doesn't need a lot of tuning. Cheers, Phil
Ven. Phil
That's really interesting, Thanks for your post, I hope that programming takes all my pains away :), when I get to such an age.
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
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I don't think age is a real issue. Once programming is in your blood you will do for your entire life, whether as a career or hobby!
Kareem Shaker wrote:
and if you are somehow old, let's say 35,
Age is just a state of mind! Mike @ 58
Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. "George Carlin"
I wish I could say that age wasn't an issue. I am only 37 and have been in 2 different jobs as a professional developer that I was considered, and even called once, the "OLD GUY". At one miserable position in Charlotte, NC, I was actually older than my team lead, the group Manager, AND even the Sr. Manager. I caught alot of flack because I was older. The average age there was only 24 or so. The manager, who taught himself VB.NET (poorly might I add) was only 26 and an arrogant little pr!ck. Needless to say, I didn't stay there long! Now, please excuse me while I go take my geritol and my early-mid-morning nap. :laugh:
JamminJimE Microsoft Certified Application Developer
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Hello, Just wanted to know if there are people out there willing to complete their lives in programming, in other words, how do you plan your career vs. your age, I have seen developers aged at 40s and 50s, do you think that the one should quit development at a certain age and shift to technical consultations or project management, and if you are old, and still into code, does this make you small or big ( I think it varies from one country to another ) ? Please share your experience here !
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
I've been programming for a living since 1974 (Yes, punched cards & Fortran) on all kinds of equipment from TRS-80 to CRAY & NEC supercomputers. When I retired in 1995, I continued to program on PC's. I like to think I'm current; I use C# and C++, XP and Linux. I'm now 64 :zzz: but hey! I'm reading this stuff!
73
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I've been programming for a living since 1974 (Yes, punched cards & Fortran) on all kinds of equipment from TRS-80 to CRAY & NEC supercomputers. When I retired in 1995, I continued to program on PC's. I like to think I'm current; I use C# and C++, XP and Linux. I'm now 64 :zzz: but hey! I'm reading this stuff!
73
One Day we'll find people saying " I have worked on Windows Vista, and also I used .NET framework ", I salute buddy, programming is a hobby more than being a profession!:laugh:
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
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Hello, Just wanted to know if there are people out there willing to complete their lives in programming, in other words, how do you plan your career vs. your age, I have seen developers aged at 40s and 50s, do you think that the one should quit development at a certain age and shift to technical consultations or project management, and if you are old, and still into code, does this make you small or big ( I think it varies from one country to another ) ? Please share your experience here !
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
I don't think age matters. I'm a couple of weeks away from being 48 and I'm still a developer. I haven't sold my soul to the company so I can't be management. One thing I've noticed is that the young developers know a wide range of knowlege and have lots of (what they think) are new ideas. They seem to think if they haven't thought of it before, then it's a new idea when some of us have already tried things...in assembly language. The older developers have experiance in the real world. Together, young and older, can make a dynamite team as long as we listen to each other. Have a great day Joe Q
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Hello, Just wanted to know if there are people out there willing to complete their lives in programming, in other words, how do you plan your career vs. your age, I have seen developers aged at 40s and 50s, do you think that the one should quit development at a certain age and shift to technical consultations or project management, and if you are old, and still into code, does this make you small or big ( I think it varies from one country to another ) ? Please share your experience here !
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
I'm 36 and making dev. I've even started a business for it recently. A friend of mine is 60+, but still writing code for both profession and for hobby. Of course, if you want to make some progress in your career and get paid more, you'll propably have to quit coding and become a project manager or some kind of tech. manager to draw the big lines. But as long as you can still learn to use the newest technology and tricks, there is no reason to give up coding. :)
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It's not the age of the developer that matters, it is the enthusiasm level that counts. Question is not how old are you, it is how enthusiastic you are! Problem : as you get older, keeping your enthusiasm up is more challenging. But it brings in mind an old joke: There is an old bull and a young bull in the top paddock. The farmer accidentally leaves the gate open between the bulls and the cows paddock. The young bull sees this and gets very excited. He hops around and says to the old bull 'Let's run down there and have ourselves a cow!'. The old bull finishes munching his grass, looks up and says 'No, lets walk down there and have the lot!' Age and experience will win over youth and exuberance any day :-)
Bruce Chapman iFinity.com.au - Websites and Software Development Plithy remark available in Beta 2
I will be 61 in a few days and have gone a complete cycle. I programmed, was technical lead, systems advisor, project manager, consultant, teacher and am a Systems Engineer/Architect that programs. The whole time I programmed to one degree or another. Experience both in programming and life is a good thing. Keeping a good attitude becomes a life outlook. It is your choice. :)
Len
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Hello, Just wanted to know if there are people out there willing to complete their lives in programming, in other words, how do you plan your career vs. your age, I have seen developers aged at 40s and 50s, do you think that the one should quit development at a certain age and shift to technical consultations or project management, and if you are old, and still into code, does this make you small or big ( I think it varies from one country to another ) ? Please share your experience here !
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
I am in my 50's and still write programs but no longer full time. After doing it for 25 years I was made redundant but at the same time had probably had a belly full of programming. Now I am no longer doing it as a profession I do it as a hobby for a few hours a week. It keeps my hand in and keeps the grey matter working.
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Hello, Just wanted to know if there are people out there willing to complete their lives in programming, in other words, how do you plan your career vs. your age, I have seen developers aged at 40s and 50s, do you think that the one should quit development at a certain age and shift to technical consultations or project management, and if you are old, and still into code, does this make you small or big ( I think it varies from one country to another ) ? Please share your experience here !
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
Why give up the fun? I left programming becuase of health problems (try programming with migraines - ugh) but then they cleared up, I went back to school to get the latest C# & .NET. Just like back at the begining, all bright shiny new tools except that I know what to do with them this time around. Who wants to sit a desk and supervise a bunch of primadonnas, check their work and never play with the pretty tools? Lets face it the best programmers usually lack people skills needed to manage a team. I can do, I have done it when needed but why do it when there is more fun work around? The only problem I had was persuading employers that a fifty something woman was as good if not better then then some fast talking young bull. So I dyed my hair purple. One thing about being older is you don't swallow the sh*t about work having to be WORK and hard and depressing or that you have to be clawing your way up the carreer ladder doing jobs you hate. Who basically cares what people think about your choices as long as they pay you for the work you do? Lena
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I don't think age matters. I'm a couple of weeks away from being 48 and I'm still a developer. I haven't sold my soul to the company so I can't be management. One thing I've noticed is that the young developers know a wide range of knowlege and have lots of (what they think) are new ideas. They seem to think if they haven't thought of it before, then it's a new idea when some of us have already tried things...in assembly language. The older developers have experiance in the real world. Together, young and older, can make a dynamite team as long as we listen to each other. Have a great day Joe Q
Yes I believe in what you've said, the thing is that most of people lack active listening they just want to impose their ideas to be the best developers :), however what you've said I like so much, I hope most of people thinks the way you think.
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
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Hello, Just wanted to know if there are people out there willing to complete their lives in programming, in other words, how do you plan your career vs. your age, I have seen developers aged at 40s and 50s, do you think that the one should quit development at a certain age and shift to technical consultations or project management, and if you are old, and still into code, does this make you small or big ( I think it varies from one country to another ) ? Please share your experience here !
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
I did some consulting for a high-tech placement firm based in London (writing their candidate placement system). They told me that they wouldn't even look at trying to place a developer over 40 years old.
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It's not the age of the developer that matters, it is the enthusiasm level that counts. Question is not how old are you, it is how enthusiastic you are! Problem : as you get older, keeping your enthusiasm up is more challenging. But it brings in mind an old joke: There is an old bull and a young bull in the top paddock. The farmer accidentally leaves the gate open between the bulls and the cows paddock. The young bull sees this and gets very excited. He hops around and says to the old bull 'Let's run down there and have ourselves a cow!'. The old bull finishes munching his grass, looks up and says 'No, lets walk down there and have the lot!' Age and experience will win over youth and exuberance any day :-)
Bruce Chapman iFinity.com.au - Websites and Software Development Plithy remark available in Beta 2
I agree. As you get older, it becomes more difficult to keep up the enthusiasm required for learning new technologies, enduring tough deadlines, dealing with late night debugging sessions and all the other stresses related to development. Generally speaking, development is a young persons job. The more experienced (read older) professionals move towards architecture, project management and team leads. In these roles, some of the stresses of day-to-day development are reduced and a greater emphasis is placed on experience, design and human interaction. I still know a lot of older developers but they are the exception, not the rule.
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I don't think age is a real issue. Once programming is in your blood you will do for your entire life, whether as a career or hobby!
Kareem Shaker wrote:
and if you are somehow old, let's say 35,
Age is just a state of mind! Mike @ 58
Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. "George Carlin"
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I did some consulting for a high-tech placement firm based in London (writing their candidate placement system). They told me that they wouldn't even look at trying to place a developer over 40 years old.
Oh, so some companies care about age, and I think this is practical!
Kareem Shaker http://cairocafe.blogspot.com
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I don't think age is a real issue. Once programming is in your blood you will do for your entire life, whether as a career or hobby!
Kareem Shaker wrote:
and if you are somehow old, let's say 35,
Age is just a state of mind! Mike @ 58
Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. "George Carlin"
I am 52 and have been programming for just short of 40 years. I started in high school, and that was WAY before high schoolers were doing programming. I have spent most of my life/career on mainframes, gradually moving over to MS (VB, VB.NET, C#, etc.) starting about 4-5 years ago, partly because of learning something new, partly because I was pretty sure there weren't going to be any more jobs in the mainframe arena. I do have a lot of enthusiasm - the reason why I was hired where I am now - not for what I knew or did, but because I was willing to learn and tackle a miriad of projects. The biggest problem IS my age - all the people are hiring are younger than my children; and I KNOW that for a number of openings, it was blatant age discrimination. Also, w/ the youngsters, there seems to be a big thing about terminology - though I had worked w/ SQL, I couldn't remember the formal definition of Inner vs. Outer join - and that was the reason I was given as not being hired. So, stick in there - you're right, it IS in our genes - but expect to be discriminated against, laughed at, and ignored.