WWII....
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There were no innocent germans. You should be ashame of yourself. I'd advice you to watch quite a bit of history channel and you will be convinced. When you think about what the germans were up to, it horrofies me. If these people thougth that if you didn't have green eyes blonde hair you were inferior and shold die, imagine what would have happended once they conquered the world. I am sure they would have started having people in places like africa and asia as meat for dinner.Do u know about medical experiments of unimaginable cruelty? You try and get yourself informed before u refer to germans as innocent. I personally am still suspicious of them.
Edd wrote: There were no innocent germans. Of course not. You only have to watch a few John Wayne movies to know that. Edd wrote: I'd advice you to watch quite a bit of history channel and you will be convinced. Yeah, I'm sure they will be objective. Any historical resource will give you a PERSPECTIVE on what happened. Edd wrote: If these people thougth that if you didn't have green eyes blonde hair you were inferior and shold die, imagine what would have happended once they conquered the world. I think you mean blue eyes. You are wrong to assume that people being either ignorant or scared to speak up equates to all Germans thinking this way. The roots of WWII were sown in the peace terms of WWI. The Nazis took advantage of a downtrodden people and made them think they could be great. Social psychology is full of experiments that show that we are all capable of group behaviour that we would personally find unacceptable. Edd wrote: You try and get yourself informed before u refer to germans as innocent. My grandparents are German. How many direct resources do you have from which to judge if all German people are by nature power hungry racists ? Edd wrote: I personally am still suspicious of them. Then you are no better than they. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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There were no innocent germans. You should be ashame of yourself. I'd advice you to watch quite a bit of history channel and you will be convinced. When you think about what the germans were up to, it horrofies me. If these people thougth that if you didn't have green eyes blonde hair you were inferior and shold die, imagine what would have happended once they conquered the world. I am sure they would have started having people in places like africa and asia as meat for dinner.Do u know about medical experiments of unimaginable cruelty? You try and get yourself informed before u refer to germans as innocent. I personally am still suspicious of them.
Edd wrote: I am sure they would have started having people in places like africa and asia as meat for dinner.Do u know about medical experiments of unimaginable cruelty? You try and get yourself informed before u refer to germans as innocent. I personally am still suspicious of them. That is all just so much xenophobic bullshit. Do you get all your education from the National Enquirer?
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Edd wrote: I am sure they would have started having people in places like africa and asia as meat for dinner.Do u know about medical experiments of unimaginable cruelty? You try and get yourself informed before u refer to germans as innocent. I personally am still suspicious of them. That is all just so much xenophobic bullshit. Do you get all your education from the National Enquirer?
paulb wrote: That is all just so much xenophobic bullshit. Do you get all your education from the National Enquirer? ROTFL !!! It's Friday afternoon here, and this thread feels to me like an end of week troll. No-one is this ignorant, surely ? Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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Christian Graus wrote: cooee of the barbarity shown by the US in killing innocent women and children in two non-military areas for the sole purpose of testing two different types of bomb. Those bombs were already tested in Nevada. What the US did was humane. We knew that the Japanese citizens would fight to the death, women and children, Vietnam style if we did a Normady type invasion. The general consensus was that we would be fighting for 2 more years if we hadn't used those bombs. Also, it took 2 bombs before the Japenese gave up!!! Christian Graus wrote: but killing some innocent Germans as well. The bombs weren't ready then. By the time we had them developed, Germany was already defeated. The Battle of the Bulge was Hitler's last stand.
Martin Marvinski wrote: Those bombs were already tested in Nevada. Oh. How many US citizens contributed to a test of their effect on human beings ? Martin Marvinski wrote: What the US did was humane. You are a fool for thinking so. Bombing the leaders who refused to surrender would be OK. Killing women and children who were stuck with being born there was not. Martin Marvinski wrote: The general consensus was that we would be fighting for 2 more years if we hadn't used those bombs. I see - we took a vote. How many innocent Japanese got to vote ? Martin Marvinski wrote: The bombs weren't ready then. By the time we had them developed, Germany was already defeated. The Battle of the Bulge was Hitler's last stand. I know that, the point is that is what the original poster wishes could have happened. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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Mike Mullikin wrote: Aww Geez! And I wonder why Americans get a bad name here at CP??!! Well, the Japanese started it. If they were good global citizens, then none of this would have happened. Rememeber they tortured and beheaded American POWs. Anyone who fights for this country has my respect, and I'm not going to second guess them 57 years later.
...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Vietnam? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in WWII? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Korea? One thing you have conveniently forgotten is that soldiers from *all* sides did evil things. Not all soldiers were Audi Murphy or John Wayne, standing in a heroic pose with a perfect smile, and a beautiful woman by their side. All war makes monsters out of some people, regardless of which side they are on. The only difference in the reporting of these atrocities is that history is written by the victor.
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There were no innocent germans. You should be ashame of yourself. I'd advice you to watch quite a bit of history channel and you will be convinced. When you think about what the germans were up to, it horrofies me. If these people thougth that if you didn't have green eyes blonde hair you were inferior and shold die, imagine what would have happended once they conquered the world. I am sure they would have started having people in places like africa and asia as meat for dinner.Do u know about medical experiments of unimaginable cruelty? You try and get yourself informed before u refer to germans as innocent. I personally am still suspicious of them.
So those people in Dresden... The farmers, the paperboys, the schoolgirls, the housewives, the Jews hiding from the Nazis, the soldier conscripted against his will, the 3 day old babies. None of them were innocent? Why because their government was bad? So that means you are guilty of corruption every time one of your government officials takes a bribe. That means you are guilty of manslaughter when government incompetence causes a death. Come on. Get real!
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I don't mean to offend anyone,but i think the allies in wwII should have delayed the war for the couple months needed to finish the 'A' bomb?. I think if there was ever any nation that deserved the atomic bomb, Germany was the one. The Japanese got what they deserved,but those Nazi loving germans should have gotten it too. People who forget their history are doomed to repeat it.
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Martin Marvinski wrote: Those bombs were already tested in Nevada. Oh. How many US citizens contributed to a test of their effect on human beings ? Martin Marvinski wrote: What the US did was humane. You are a fool for thinking so. Bombing the leaders who refused to surrender would be OK. Killing women and children who were stuck with being born there was not. Martin Marvinski wrote: The general consensus was that we would be fighting for 2 more years if we hadn't used those bombs. I see - we took a vote. How many innocent Japanese got to vote ? Martin Marvinski wrote: The bombs weren't ready then. By the time we had them developed, Germany was already defeated. The Battle of the Bulge was Hitler's last stand. I know that, the point is that is what the original poster wishes could have happened. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
Christian Graus wrote: Oh. How many US citizens contributed to a test of their effect on human beings ? Actually, alot. I bet you've seen photos of US Troops dug in trenches while an Atom bomb went off. They also tested the hydrogen bombs off of Bikini Atoll on abandoned war ships. The reason they didn't do the tests the first time was because it was top secret and they only had three bombs. 1 to test, and the other other one to use, and the last one as back up in case the first didn't go off.
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I think Cristian is very ignorant of these fact. There are films of japanese civilians jumping from cliffs instead of living under occupation. But I doubt the bombs weren't ready when the war in europe was over. I think it was a delebrate effort on the part of the allies not to drop the bomb on germans, cause they were europians(prejudise of the worst kind).I still recent them for that. And still hate germans.
Edd wrote: I think it was a delebrate effort on the part of the allies not to drop the bomb on germans, cause they were europians(prejudise of the worst kind). More like basic geography. If they had them, it would have been hard to limit their effect to Germany. Edd wrote: prejudise of the worst kind).I still recent them for that. And still hate germans. You 'recent' them ? I think that apart from prejudise(sic), you are showing hypocrisy of the worst kind to call someone else prejudiced and then announce your own racism as a matter of course. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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Christian Graus wrote: Oh. How many US citizens contributed to a test of their effect on human beings ? Actually, alot. I bet you've seen photos of US Troops dug in trenches while an Atom bomb went off. They also tested the hydrogen bombs off of Bikini Atoll on abandoned war ships. The reason they didn't do the tests the first time was because it was top secret and they only had three bombs. 1 to test, and the other other one to use, and the last one as back up in case the first didn't go off.
I've seen them. At least you guys did it to yourselves - the Brits used Aussie troops to perform similar tests, on OUR soil. But it's not the same as dropping it on a city, to see how many you can kill and the long term effects on those who live. If the US wasn't performing science as diabolical as anything the Nazis did, why were the two bombs they used not the same type ? Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Vietnam? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in WWII? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Korea? One thing you have conveniently forgotten is that soldiers from *all* sides did evil things. Not all soldiers were Audi Murphy or John Wayne, standing in a heroic pose with a perfect smile, and a beautiful woman by their side. All war makes monsters out of some people, regardless of which side they are on. The only difference in the reporting of these atrocities is that history is written by the victor.
Mr Morden wrote: ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Vietnam? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in WWII? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Korea? One thing you have conveniently forgotten is that soldiers from *all* sides did evil things. Not all soldiers were Audi Murphy or John Wayne, standing in a heroic pose with a perfect smile, and a beautiful woman by their side. Here is a question for you. Of all the countries in the world, which one would you rather be a POW (Prisoner of War) in? My first choise is the US!!! Look at Guantanamo Bay! The terrorists get prayer mats, the best medical attention, three meals a day, excersize, and much more. If Americans blew up any other country such as Saudi Arabia, the Americans would be beheaded.
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...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Vietnam? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in WWII? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Korea? One thing you have conveniently forgotten is that soldiers from *all* sides did evil things. Not all soldiers were Audi Murphy or John Wayne, standing in a heroic pose with a perfect smile, and a beautiful woman by their side. All war makes monsters out of some people, regardless of which side they are on. The only difference in the reporting of these atrocities is that history is written by the victor.
Mr Morden wrote: history is written by the victor. Amen. It's funny how we presume the good guys always won, instead of simply being able to tell us they were the good guys, by virtue of winning. Don't get me wrong, Nazism was an incredible evil, but in general, history is written by the winners. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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I think Cristian is very ignorant of these fact. There are films of japanese civilians jumping from cliffs instead of living under occupation. But I doubt the bombs weren't ready when the war in europe was over. I think it was a delebrate effort on the part of the allies not to drop the bomb on germans, cause they were europians(prejudise of the worst kind).I still recent them for that. And still hate germans.
Edd wrote: I still recent them for that. And still hate germans Wow, this is what I call tolerant and very permissive... I' am 28 years old, so why do you blame me for all that. Don't get me wrong, to forget and to ignore the cruel and abnormal things the Nazis did, is the worst thing anyone could do: We should not forget, but: I tell you once again: Don't blame people who weren't born at that time. And by the way: What about the racism in the US ?? isn't it allways a problem for a lot of people in the US to accept collered people ??? My 2 cent for your stupid words, and make your homework !
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I've seen them. At least you guys did it to yourselves - the Brits used Aussie troops to perform similar tests, on OUR soil. But it's not the same as dropping it on a city, to see how many you can kill and the long term effects on those who live. If the US wasn't performing science as diabolical as anything the Nazis did, why were the two bombs they used not the same type ? Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
Christian Graus wrote: But it's not the same as dropping it on a city, to see how many you can kill and the long term effects on those who live. Truman gave the Japanese a warning before we dropped the first bomb. We told them something terrible was going to happen. And anyway would it have been better for us to fight for anouther 3 years in guerilla warfare against those same women, and childern who were being prepared to fight against us? I bet you didn't know that, but the Japanese were training women and childern to fight Americans!! By dropping the bomb, we saved many more lives.
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Mr Morden wrote: ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Vietnam? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in WWII? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Korea? One thing you have conveniently forgotten is that soldiers from *all* sides did evil things. Not all soldiers were Audi Murphy or John Wayne, standing in a heroic pose with a perfect smile, and a beautiful woman by their side. Here is a question for you. Of all the countries in the world, which one would you rather be a POW (Prisoner of War) in? My first choise is the US!!! Look at Guantanamo Bay! The terrorists get prayer mats, the best medical attention, three meals a day, excersize, and much more. If Americans blew up any other country such as Saudi Arabia, the Americans would be beheaded.
And my first choice would be Australia. I don't think anyone is denying how the Japanese treated POW's in the war, my point was that this was ALMOST as barbarous as Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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Edd wrote: There were no innocent germans. Of course not. You only have to watch a few John Wayne movies to know that. Edd wrote: I'd advice you to watch quite a bit of history channel and you will be convinced. Yeah, I'm sure they will be objective. Any historical resource will give you a PERSPECTIVE on what happened. Edd wrote: If these people thougth that if you didn't have green eyes blonde hair you were inferior and shold die, imagine what would have happended once they conquered the world. I think you mean blue eyes. You are wrong to assume that people being either ignorant or scared to speak up equates to all Germans thinking this way. The roots of WWII were sown in the peace terms of WWI. The Nazis took advantage of a downtrodden people and made them think they could be great. Social psychology is full of experiments that show that we are all capable of group behaviour that we would personally find unacceptable. Edd wrote: You try and get yourself informed before u refer to germans as innocent. My grandparents are German. How many direct resources do you have from which to judge if all German people are by nature power hungry racists ? Edd wrote: I personally am still suspicious of them. Then you are no better than they. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
Christian Graus wrote: My grandparents are German. Hmmm. Not a true Aussie then :omg: Did they get bannished to Austrailia for what they did in Germany?
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Christian Graus wrote: But it's not the same as dropping it on a city, to see how many you can kill and the long term effects on those who live. Truman gave the Japanese a warning before we dropped the first bomb. We told them something terrible was going to happen. And anyway would it have been better for us to fight for anouther 3 years in guerilla warfare against those same women, and childern who were being prepared to fight against us? I bet you didn't know that, but the Japanese were training women and childern to fight Americans!! By dropping the bomb, we saved many more lives.
Martin Marvinski wrote: I bet you didn't know that, but the Japanese were training women and childern to fight Americans!! Yes, I did. Martin Marvinski wrote: By dropping the bomb, we saved many more lives. Why not drop the first in an area that would kill less people, or kill soldiers ? Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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Christian Graus wrote: My grandparents are German. Hmmm. Not a true Aussie then :omg: Did they get bannished to Austrailia for what they did in Germany?
Martin Marvinski wrote: Not a true Aussie then Locally made from imported ingredients. Therefore a local according to current labelling laws. Martin Marvinski wrote: Did they get bannished to Austrailia for what they did in Germany? Like a lot of people who found themselves in the middle of the war through no fault of their own, they came here looking for a better life. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
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Mr Morden wrote: ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Vietnam? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in WWII? ...and the US soldiers who committed atrocities in Korea? One thing you have conveniently forgotten is that soldiers from *all* sides did evil things. Not all soldiers were Audi Murphy or John Wayne, standing in a heroic pose with a perfect smile, and a beautiful woman by their side. Here is a question for you. Of all the countries in the world, which one would you rather be a POW (Prisoner of War) in? My first choise is the US!!! Look at Guantanamo Bay! The terrorists get prayer mats, the best medical attention, three meals a day, excersize, and much more. If Americans blew up any other country such as Saudi Arabia, the Americans would be beheaded.
Apples and Oranges. You are comparing conditions today to conditions 50 years which was the original topic. Bearing in mind that we in Australia mistreated Japanese POWs in WWII. We interned Australian Citizens who happened to be of German ancestry, just as the US interned its citizens who happened to be Japanese. Your own citizens had their constitutional rights violated. This means that in any time of emergency your own government can suspend your rights and treat you *any* way they want. Now to answer your question. Yes, I would prefer to be in a US POW camp, for the simple reason that the US has signed a number of international treaties that obligate it to treat prisoners well. Some of these other countries havent.
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And my first choice would be Australia. I don't think anyone is denying how the Japanese treated POW's in the war, my point was that this was ALMOST as barbarous as Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Christian I am completely intolerant of stupidity. Stupidity is, of course, anything that doesn't conform to my way of thinking. - Jamie Hale - 29/05/2002 Half the reason people switch away from VB is to find out what actually goes on.. and then like me they find out that they weren't quite as good as they thought - they've been nannied. - Alex, 13 June 2002
Christian Graus wrote: And my first choice would be Australia Alrighty mate, lets feed him to the crocodiles. Whoa look at him' go. Seriously though, why Australia? Is it just because you were born there or is it because they are the most humane?