Aspergers, population in CP?
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I was wondering how many in here have Aspergers to one extent or another. I have it, (I don't say I suffer from it, as it isn't something that you suffer from, merely something you have to live your life with). In general it is about 1% of the population that have some form of the condition, but I suspect it may well be much higher in here. For those unaware of it... Link to Aspergers Society[^] I find it funny it is called the Aspergers Society, for obvious and humerous reasons!:-D
------------------------------------ Happy Primes Lead to Happy Memories. Don't Google FGI
Well no I don't have it. But my wife is a special eduction teacher and in grad school for special ed. She talks alot about one of her student's who has it. Do you have a tick? If so, what is it?
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
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Do you do the "Single Goal" thing? That is whatever your target is to reach, all else is subsumed until that target or goal is achieved, then you move to the next item. Regardless of what else is happening. (It is exampled by the fact that the house could burn down around you, but you just have to finish re-arranging your books in topic/author surname in alphabetical order before running from the flames!)
------------------------------------ Happy Primes Lead to Happy Memories. Don't Google FGI
Dalek Dave wrote:
That is whatever your target is to reach, all else is subsumed until that target or goal is achieved, then you move to the next item. Regardless of what else is happening.
I tend to do this a lot. I do multi-task, but it is a forced thing. My over-all tendancy is to loose focus on all else, there is more than a chance I wouldn't notice the house was burning until I was done. Time and people disappear. I struggle very hard to have a forced focus around me. I have heard of Aspergers in passing, but never knew what it was until today. I was just reading. That is a tough one. Certainly some of the items are true, but some are not. I have no difficulty with metaphore, but sarcasm is lost on me unless it is exagerated or otherwise made deliberately obvious. I have always just considered myself a socially inept geek, I wonder where that line is between the social ineptness of a life-long nerd and aspergers? For instance: "having a limited range of imaginative activities, which can be pursued rigidly and repetitively eg lining up toys or collecting and organising things related to his or her interest." This definately applies, but I always blamed it on upbringing. With an older brother who believed he was God's Gift to everyone and thus deserving of everything, I would loose a lot. So you tend not have lots of interests, your interests are generally chosen as anything "not" interested by your brother, and then throw yourself in such an interest as if it will be taken away tomorrow -- which it very well could. You compulsively hide things that are special to you, and keep them deliberately few so as not to attract attention. These are definitely learned issues. But I have never been good at reading body language, or voice clues. Even though my ears are sensitive enough to catch the wings of a bird in flight, if I focus on it. On the other hand, I could miss an earthquake if I am not deliberately "open" to something happening. I have missed fire drills at work even though the air-raid siren of the 50's/60's is used and it is never what you could consider "quiet" by any means. In elementary school I was spock-like by reputation, even self-assessment I felt more alien than human. I didn't belong anywhere, and certainly didn't want to belong at home. But how does one separate life-long learned response from a poor home-life and something like aspergers?
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga
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I'll chime in. Both my sons are on the autism spectrum, and my older one has been diagnosed with Aspergers (which I tease my wife by calling it ass-burgers), as well as PDD, ODD, and probably a whole bunch of other DD's. I've also been told that I would probably qualify as having Aspergers as well. Scott
It's known as Asparagus in my family, as in "David's having one of his Asparagus moments!"
------------------------------------ Happy Primes Lead to Happy Memories. Don't Google FGI
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It's known as Asparagus in my family, as in "David's having one of his Asparagus moments!"
------------------------------------ Happy Primes Lead to Happy Memories. Don't Google FGI
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It could be an urban myth but that's what I've heard many times over many years. They have only accurate technical terms for the parts and items often used in the west as swear words and no concept of swear words or taboo words except as and where adopted from the west. If anyone knows better feel free to post and educate.:)
Nothing is exactly what it seems but everything with seems can be unpicked.
Matthew Faithfull wrote:
They have only accurate technical terms for the parts and items often used in the west as swear words and no concept of swear words or taboo words except as and where adopted from the west.
I think some of this is lost in cultural differences. It is true there is a lack of privacy, but since the evaluation of the Japanese language and official translation (this word means this) came originaly through church translators.... you have a distinct problem with the person who equated 5 words for the human behind as "technical" was being far too efficient in cataloging the language differences and ignoring which were swear words because the society is very serious and respectful, even when insulting you up down and left and right. A traditional japanese man could insult you 10 different ways in the same sentence and have you thanking him for it lacking the cultural influences to recognize what just happened. Think of it as the matrix quote about swearing in French. Modern influences have changed some things in Japanese culture to be more "western" but that is a cultural interpretation. There have always been loud emotional tirades by Japanese spokesmen, from as far back as written history, and although "official" translation may be technical, blame the fact that the language was translated in a highly technical way by someone who never used cuss words. :-D Just as an example, imagine explaining your emotional tirade to the pope as he visited your area and overheard you talking. Assuming you cussed to make a sailor blush and he understood nothing about what you just said, how would you explain it to him? :-D
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
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Dalek Dave wrote:
That is whatever your target is to reach, all else is subsumed until that target or goal is achieved, then you move to the next item. Regardless of what else is happening.
I tend to do this a lot. I do multi-task, but it is a forced thing. My over-all tendancy is to loose focus on all else, there is more than a chance I wouldn't notice the house was burning until I was done. Time and people disappear. I struggle very hard to have a forced focus around me. I have heard of Aspergers in passing, but never knew what it was until today. I was just reading. That is a tough one. Certainly some of the items are true, but some are not. I have no difficulty with metaphore, but sarcasm is lost on me unless it is exagerated or otherwise made deliberately obvious. I have always just considered myself a socially inept geek, I wonder where that line is between the social ineptness of a life-long nerd and aspergers? For instance: "having a limited range of imaginative activities, which can be pursued rigidly and repetitively eg lining up toys or collecting and organising things related to his or her interest." This definately applies, but I always blamed it on upbringing. With an older brother who believed he was God's Gift to everyone and thus deserving of everything, I would loose a lot. So you tend not have lots of interests, your interests are generally chosen as anything "not" interested by your brother, and then throw yourself in such an interest as if it will be taken away tomorrow -- which it very well could. You compulsively hide things that are special to you, and keep them deliberately few so as not to attract attention. These are definitely learned issues. But I have never been good at reading body language, or voice clues. Even though my ears are sensitive enough to catch the wings of a bird in flight, if I focus on it. On the other hand, I could miss an earthquake if I am not deliberately "open" to something happening. I have missed fire drills at work even though the air-raid siren of the 50's/60's is used and it is never what you could consider "quiet" by any means. In elementary school I was spock-like by reputation, even self-assessment I felt more alien than human. I didn't belong anywhere, and certainly didn't want to belong at home. But how does one separate life-long learned response from a poor home-life and something like aspergers?
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga
I would say that the overriding difference I've noticed in my bro, who is quite severe, is a lack of empathy with things. He finds it difficult to understand why people do the things they do, which to me is all part of the human condition, and the reason that they do it troubles him more than the effect of whatever they do. He also has no "off switch". Once you get him going on something, he doesn't know how to gauge when another person has had enough of an argument. He quite often reduces people to tears, and then he feels terrible about it, but he doesn't know how to not do it again. I guess it comes down to the reason you feel the way you do. My brother doesn't just obsess about stuff and write out mathematical problems and re-read books that he likes a gazillion times and take apart electronic equipment just to put it back together again because he's "geeking out" or because it satisfies him; it's the only thing he really understands. He isn't awkward in a social situation because he's "shy" or because he was different at school; he just doesn't know what to do. More than that, he doesn't understand why or how other people do. Witty repartee and rapier wit doesn't register with him, but present him with a quirk of logic or a silly road sign and he'll be in stitches, because he gets why it's incongruous.
Smokie, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules.
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Matthew Faithfull wrote:
They have only accurate technical terms for the parts and items often used in the west as swear words and no concept of swear words or taboo words except as and where adopted from the west.
I think some of this is lost in cultural differences. It is true there is a lack of privacy, but since the evaluation of the Japanese language and official translation (this word means this) came originaly through church translators.... you have a distinct problem with the person who equated 5 words for the human behind as "technical" was being far too efficient in cataloging the language differences and ignoring which were swear words because the society is very serious and respectful, even when insulting you up down and left and right. A traditional japanese man could insult you 10 different ways in the same sentence and have you thanking him for it lacking the cultural influences to recognize what just happened. Think of it as the matrix quote about swearing in French. Modern influences have changed some things in Japanese culture to be more "western" but that is a cultural interpretation. There have always been loud emotional tirades by Japanese spokesmen, from as far back as written history, and although "official" translation may be technical, blame the fact that the language was translated in a highly technical way by someone who never used cuss words. :-D Just as an example, imagine explaining your emotional tirade to the pope as he visited your area and overheard you talking. Assuming you cussed to make a sailor blush and he understood nothing about what you just said, how would you explain it to him? :-D
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
A facinating insight into cultural linguistic dislocation, thanks El, especially interesting as my maternal great, great, great grandfather was an early missionary who helped translate parts of the bible into Mandarin. :)
Nothing is exactly what it seems but everything with seems can be unpicked.
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I used to think so, but then I realised that I could read people exceptionally well, and that my bedroom is a dump, and numerous other things. My behaviours that coincided with Asperger's I realised could be attributed to other things, namely IQ difference, HSP, INTJ, and neurotic perfectionism, amongst other things. I know, I spend WAY too much time delving into myself. ;P
Fold a towel lobster[^] while (procrastinating) { minesweeper(); } Oh my god, it's so CUTE!!!
Not surprised to see you're an INTJ. Used to be one myself, though now I'm an ENTJ.
Cheers, विक्रम
"If a trend is truly global, then that trend ought to be visible across ANY subset of that data" - fat_boy
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I would say that the overriding difference I've noticed in my bro, who is quite severe, is a lack of empathy with things. He finds it difficult to understand why people do the things they do, which to me is all part of the human condition, and the reason that they do it troubles him more than the effect of whatever they do. He also has no "off switch". Once you get him going on something, he doesn't know how to gauge when another person has had enough of an argument. He quite often reduces people to tears, and then he feels terrible about it, but he doesn't know how to not do it again. I guess it comes down to the reason you feel the way you do. My brother doesn't just obsess about stuff and write out mathematical problems and re-read books that he likes a gazillion times and take apart electronic equipment just to put it back together again because he's "geeking out" or because it satisfies him; it's the only thing he really understands. He isn't awkward in a social situation because he's "shy" or because he was different at school; he just doesn't know what to do. More than that, he doesn't understand why or how other people do. Witty repartee and rapier wit doesn't register with him, but present him with a quirk of logic or a silly road sign and he'll be in stitches, because he gets why it's incongruous.
Smokie, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules.
melchizidech wrote:
He finds it difficult to understand why people do the things they do, which to me is all part of the human condition
But see, I do the same thing. But it is hard to say in my case what is normal and what is influence of upbringing. My brother and I are very, VERY different though we shared the same home, for obvious reasons... Neither of us was ever equal by any shape of the imagination. I am lousy at judging people, I always assume the best, and get walked over regularly. I trust and get my hopes dashed. I do not breaking into arguments as your brother, but that is specifically because of my upbringing. I do not have an off-switch either, I never know when I have said enough, I always talk too much and over-do what I am trying to do. I am a living run-on sentance. But the only reason I don't reduce someone to tears (usually) is because you cannot get me angry. It is impossible, because of my home environment was so filled with anger, I get ill instead. I reread books that I like a hundred times, but it is more than just enjoyment also. It is more than escapism. When I find something I enjoy, it is as you said, what I understand. I am a geek because my behavior fits well in that area of society. I am overjoyed at taking something apart and successfully putting it back together, and feel like a complete failure when it doesn't go back together right because I forgot something. I avoid basic human interaction because I don't know what to say, what to talk about, and never understand first aquaintance social graces. All these things still apply to me, but I know beyond knowing that I had a difficult past. I will always have the social grace of a baboon. That's life. I have my moments when I do something really, really right, and I haven't a clue how to repeat it. But again, because am and have always been the social outcast am I this way because I am the social outcast, or was I the social outcast because I am this way? In my case, the case would be impossible to settle. I can see why your brother having, I assume, a far more normal upbringing would be easier to figure as aspergers. In my case you could make a case either way and spend a lifetime trying to figure it out. I could tell you matter-of-factly horror stories from my childhood that would make you cringe or gasp, I would look at you oddly as if trying to figure out what it was that made you stop. I can see the body language change, if I am paying close attention, but usu
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I was wondering how many in here have Aspergers to one extent or another. I have it, (I don't say I suffer from it, as it isn't something that you suffer from, merely something you have to live your life with). In general it is about 1% of the population that have some form of the condition, but I suspect it may well be much higher in here. For those unaware of it... Link to Aspergers Society[^] I find it funny it is called the Aspergers Society, for obvious and humerous reasons!:-D
------------------------------------ Happy Primes Lead to Happy Memories. Don't Google FGI
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I am become Death The Destroyer Of Worlds The Dark Lord of the Underworld I am Sutekh, Sett and Satan I am the B@$t@rd who leaves chewing gum under desks and the toilet seat up. I am he that crunches popcorn behind you in the cinema, especially in the quiet bits. It is I that leaves only 3 sheets on a toilet roll. That hums a tuneless mid eighties popette song that will snag in your brain for the rest of the day. And on whom you can always count on for knowing the capital of Abyssinia when on the opposing team of a pub quiz! :)
------------------------------------ Happy Primes Lead to Happy Memories. Don't Google FGI
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I agree. The social skills thing is the most salient aspect of Aspergers and the one which causes most damage. I mean, I'm obsessive-compulsive and totally insufferable about some things, but I think that this line of work draws that kind of mindset, even exacerbates it to a point. And it pales in comparison to the experience of my brother. My bro is Aspergers and he's a good developer, but his condition has hampered the course of his life to the degree that is hard for me to watch. For starters, his work interaction is for sh*t, which has led to a situation whereby I earn about a third on top of what he does, despite the fact that a) I consider myself a good intermediate-level developer, and I'm not crazy workaholic about it like some people, and b) I've been in this game for a total of 7 years on and off, with a 2-year gap in between to take drugs and play in a rock band, compared to my bro's lifelong obsession with computers and programming them, and the fact that he's 8 years older. Also, in private life, he is totally impossible to watch. one minute, he will let people walk all over him, because he just can't bring himself to care about the things he should. Then, you cross wires on some insignificant little thing, and he will actually blow up in front of your eyes. I'm the only one in the family who can talk him down, and it takes on average about 20-30 minutes. I once watched him punch a hole in a door because he got into a philosophical argument with my sister about whether or not he should apply for a job that he wanted but felt underqualified for. Her attitude was, why count yourself out at the get-go, when if you throw your hat in, so to speak, you just might get it? And his attitude was why apply for a job when you're not a perfect fit. He breaks my friggin' heart to be honest.
Smokie, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules.
Yeah, that must be really hard to deal with. That's why I said I don't know, I'm nothing like that, and no-one suggests I am, they suggest I could be on the mild end of the spectrum. It's good that your brother has family who understands and can be with him. I'm sure there are people who do a lot worse without that sort of support.
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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Dalek Dave wrote:
That is whatever your target is to reach, all else is subsumed until that target or goal is achieved, then you move to the next item. Regardless of what else is happening.
I tend to do this a lot. I do multi-task, but it is a forced thing. My over-all tendancy is to loose focus on all else, there is more than a chance I wouldn't notice the house was burning until I was done. Time and people disappear. I struggle very hard to have a forced focus around me. I have heard of Aspergers in passing, but never knew what it was until today. I was just reading. That is a tough one. Certainly some of the items are true, but some are not. I have no difficulty with metaphore, but sarcasm is lost on me unless it is exagerated or otherwise made deliberately obvious. I have always just considered myself a socially inept geek, I wonder where that line is between the social ineptness of a life-long nerd and aspergers? For instance: "having a limited range of imaginative activities, which can be pursued rigidly and repetitively eg lining up toys or collecting and organising things related to his or her interest." This definately applies, but I always blamed it on upbringing. With an older brother who believed he was God's Gift to everyone and thus deserving of everything, I would loose a lot. So you tend not have lots of interests, your interests are generally chosen as anything "not" interested by your brother, and then throw yourself in such an interest as if it will be taken away tomorrow -- which it very well could. You compulsively hide things that are special to you, and keep them deliberately few so as not to attract attention. These are definitely learned issues. But I have never been good at reading body language, or voice clues. Even though my ears are sensitive enough to catch the wings of a bird in flight, if I focus on it. On the other hand, I could miss an earthquake if I am not deliberately "open" to something happening. I have missed fire drills at work even though the air-raid siren of the 50's/60's is used and it is never what you could consider "quiet" by any means. In elementary school I was spock-like by reputation, even self-assessment I felt more alien than human. I didn't belong anywhere, and certainly didn't want to belong at home. But how does one separate life-long learned response from a poor home-life and something like aspergers?
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga
El Corazon wrote:
I wonder where that line is between the social ineptness of a life-long nerd and aspergers?
I'm somewhat dubious, but my wife's boss suggests that they are the same things, but one is further along the same spectrum.
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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El Corazon wrote:
I wonder where that line is between the social ineptness of a life-long nerd and aspergers?
I'm somewhat dubious, but my wife's boss suggests that they are the same things, but one is further along the same spectrum.
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
Christian Graus wrote:
I'm somewhat dubious, but my wife's boss suggests that they are the same things, but one is further along the same spectrum.
I would agree to a point. I think I would rephrase it as saying, the difference is irrelevant and can be treated as a difference on the same spectrum. I survive by rehearsal, telling myself what I should say, and how I should say it. I don't like surprises, surprises cannot be rehearsed. But in math, science, programming, I love surprises, I solve surprises, I find creative solutions.... but I can't do that with life. I think and overthink every response. I don't mind the label of geek, I wear it like a crown, and most people excuse my differences. Not sure I would take the crown of aspergers, I doubt it, but in the end, I would say the difference is irrelevent, the solution is to find the ways to help the person interact to the best of their abilities, and that is that. :-D And I don't stutter on message boards like I do in real life, so hey, computers ain't so bad either!
_________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)
