Fight Club
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Steve Hazel wrote:
In every fight there has to be a loser. That'd usually be me. I don't embrace that aspect of "male"-ness.
I think the point was to fight in the first place, not the winning or losing.
Steve Hazel wrote:
And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness.
Actually, there have been more than a few but they aren't the sort of movies most guys enjoy. I think we'll see more in future.
Steve Hazel wrote:
And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win.
Of course because the key to that whole thing is that men think of it in terms of winning and losing and women usually don't which is one of the fundamental reasons why men always think they don't understand women.
Steve Hazel wrote:
Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise.
Many may seem that way but usually how it transpires is that the man is roped into taking a side on something that he normally wouldn't give a crap about and because men are competitive by nature rather than just saying they don't care and having over with it they will start to argue about it and then it spirals out of control. These are the sorts of problems that we get into as a society when we ignore our basic differences and try to be something we aren't. If men stuck to their domain of responsibility (i.e. stuff they really actually truly care about) and women stuck to theirs (i.e. stuff they actually truly care about, anything really as long as it's something they truly care about) the world would be a much better place. Next time a women asks you about something you don't care about, be honest, say "I don't care at all about it, why don't you tell me what you've decided", keep at it and when it's something you truly care about chances are the women doesn't and will have no problem with your opinion on the subject given that you've stayed out of her domain. Sometimes domains overlap, my wife and I both care about landscaping around the house, we both have ideas, but because we both truly care about it we never argue about it. The best idea always wins.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
John C wrote:
I think the point was to fight in the first place, not the winning or losing.
I get that. My point is that I am male and I don't think that fighting is a key characteristic of being male. In fact, I don't think it's something to be embracing at all. I don't think that war was one of man's better ideas. Hunting? Good idea. Caring for kids? Good idea. Punching people in the face or worse? No so good. I don't think I lose if I compromise. I think I'm the better, umm, person. ...SteveH
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Well, that was my initial impression of the movie, too. This is deeper than a stupid fight film. But, after thinking about the thing a while... The movie grosses me out... I mean, If i were that Ed Norton character, I'd be getting pretty sick of getting beat up all the time... Is the guy into S&M or somethin??? In every fight there has to be a loser. That'd usually be me. I don't embrace that aspect of "male"-ness. I see it's attraction to some. But, well, it ain't for me. I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme... I don't think we have to fight to be male. Hunt maybe. That's pretty necessary on a desert island... I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness. And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win. Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise. (At least, often they are, you know... just like guys are dorks...) You want a relationship? Somebody has to compromise. Men can. You know the old red-green line! "I'm a man. But I can change. If I have to. I GUESS." Ok, that was all pretty sexist what i said there, wasn't it... Oh well. That's life... It's sexist... It distinguishes between em... so do i... ...SteveH http://shazware.com
Steve Hazel wrote:
I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme...
It does... i guess... until you realize that both characters are the same person. When you're standing in a basement punching your own face into a bloody mess, who's the loser? You. In love with an inflated image of yourself, looking for realization while ignoring reality. The movie is deeper than a lot of people give it credit for. It sets up a false ideal of machismo, strength, revolution against the emasculating system... and then shows how that, too, is meaningless and humiliating.
Steve Hazel wrote:
I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness.
They do though. They're not good. Avoid "Lifetime".
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Not tryin to be a jerk, but are ya married? You gotta compromise if you wanna stay that way :) Nobody's gonna go along with EVERYthing about another person. Anyways, it ain't depressing. Marriage is wonderful. Just because you go along with something doesn't mean you have to admit defeat. Ain't nothin wrong bout compromising. It usually takes the better man to compromise :) Ok, I'll shut up. I'm startin' to get preachy. Sorry. ...SteveH http://shazware.com
Nope, marriage isn't for me. Much to the dismay of my girlfriend. I guess it come down to what your compromising. Stuff like where to eat dinner, or what side of the room the couch goes on, no problem. Things like: I don't want you to see friend X, we should go to yard sales on Sunday instead of watching football, let's raise the kids Klingon... Compromise on things like these are more or less attempts of your partner to change you. The you they supposedly love in the first place. If the person your with doesn't like who you currently are, i think you/they need to seek the exits. i'll get off the soap box now
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Steve Hazel wrote:
I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme...
It does... i guess... until you realize that both characters are the same person. When you're standing in a basement punching your own face into a bloody mess, who's the loser? You. In love with an inflated image of yourself, looking for realization while ignoring reality. The movie is deeper than a lot of people give it credit for. It sets up a false ideal of machismo, strength, revolution against the emasculating system... and then shows how that, too, is meaningless and humiliating.
Steve Hazel wrote:
I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness.
They do though. They're not good. Avoid "Lifetime".
Shog9 wrote:
until you realize that both characters are the same person
They are??? Hmmm, I didn't catch that... I guess I don't pay attention very well... Like most SORRY... Ah yes, I've taken lifetime off the channels to surf. I'd almost forgotten it UNTIL NOW...X| I can handle a 2 vote as long as I can hear Shog9 weigh in on the subject...:cool: (sorry bout butchering the name there)
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Shog9 wrote:
until you realize that both characters are the same person
They are??? Hmmm, I didn't catch that... I guess I don't pay attention very well... Like most SORRY... Ah yes, I've taken lifetime off the channels to surf. I'd almost forgotten it UNTIL NOW...X| I can handle a 2 vote as long as I can hear Shog9 weigh in on the subject...:cool: (sorry bout butchering the name there)
Steve Hazel wrote:
Hmmm, I didn't catch that... I guess I don't pay attention very well... Like most SORRY...
Heh, if you get the chance to watch it again, just bear with it - the first half makes a lot more sense after you've seen the second half a few times. Like most movies, a beer or six doesn't hurt either. ;)
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Nope, marriage isn't for me. Much to the dismay of my girlfriend. I guess it come down to what your compromising. Stuff like where to eat dinner, or what side of the room the couch goes on, no problem. Things like: I don't want you to see friend X, we should go to yard sales on Sunday instead of watching football, let's raise the kids Klingon... Compromise on things like these are more or less attempts of your partner to change you. The you they supposedly love in the first place. If the person your with doesn't like who you currently are, i think you/they need to seek the exits. i'll get off the soap box now
Absolutely. Although you gotta go in knowing there are going to be conflicts and you have to be able to resolve every single one of the serious ones... You also gotta go in knowing it ain't right to try to change someone. Ever.
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You know how you see a new movie come along and the advertising for it makes it look like something you won't like, then years later on a whim you rent the movie and discover all the advertising when it came out was completely and utterly misleading? I remember seeing the ads for Fight Club and getting the impression it was a stupid, shallow movie about underground fist fighting with no purpose other than to separate 17 - 30 year old men from their money. After watching it I discovered nothing could be further from the truth. It's a very deep and thought provoking movie and the marketing at the time must have brought in droves of people who absolutely hated it. It seems like the marketing department for most movies works off a one sentence description of the movie and invents the rest to target it to the demographic they are after with no realtion to the actual movie whatsoever. It's funny reading the reviews and discussion of Fight Club online. A lot of people apparently don't take any time at all to really think about the movies they watch, or perhaps you have to have been a 30 something north american male at the time the movie came out then aged a few years to really get the deeper themes of the movie. Anyway, it's highly worth seeing if you haven't yet. It's violent but very deep and interesting on many levels. Clearly a masterpiece of the 20th century.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
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Yeah, it was a good movie. However, the depth of the movie is like Rage Against The Machine lyrics. People are unaware of the messages. Most people hardly ever think about anything... even smart computer programmers.
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
ToddHileHoffer wrote:
However, the depth of the movie is like Rage Against The Machine lyrics. People are unaware of the messages.
I thought the message in "F**k you I won't do what you tell me" was pretty transparent...
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To watch that movie because I abhor unnecessary violence especially in the form of combat for pride. {Lump me into where you were.} I haven't even seen all the Lord of the Rings films or all the Star Wars films or 30 other films I really wanted to see "Tears in the Sun" being one of them (what can I say I like Willis, he was brilliant in Over the Hedge). Since I'll never see this show. My wife won't even watch Gladiator which in my opinion carries some really deep meanings as well (it is also a film I had zero intention of ever watching) and is one of my all-time FAVORITE-FAVORITE-FAVORITE flicks! So what's the deeper meaning? Now that you guys are stepping out about it I'm thinking it has to do with the "trapped" feelings many of us have and the deeper desire to "bust out" every now and then. But that seems ignorant and shallow not having seen the flick or knowing anything about it... Someone loop me in. I'd lay 1000000000000000000000000000000:1 odds that I will ever get to see it. Movies and T.V. just don't really happen in our house.
code-frog wrote:
I abhor unnecessary violence
Well so do I, but the violence in Lord of the Rings was necessary violence: kill the bad guys and make massive personal sacrifices or evil overruns the Earth and rules it for ever.
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You know how you see a new movie come along and the advertising for it makes it look like something you won't like, then years later on a whim you rent the movie and discover all the advertising when it came out was completely and utterly misleading? I remember seeing the ads for Fight Club and getting the impression it was a stupid, shallow movie about underground fist fighting with no purpose other than to separate 17 - 30 year old men from their money. After watching it I discovered nothing could be further from the truth. It's a very deep and thought provoking movie and the marketing at the time must have brought in droves of people who absolutely hated it. It seems like the marketing department for most movies works off a one sentence description of the movie and invents the rest to target it to the demographic they are after with no realtion to the actual movie whatsoever. It's funny reading the reviews and discussion of Fight Club online. A lot of people apparently don't take any time at all to really think about the movies they watch, or perhaps you have to have been a 30 something north american male at the time the movie came out then aged a few years to really get the deeper themes of the movie. Anyway, it's highly worth seeing if you haven't yet. It's violent but very deep and interesting on many levels. Clearly a masterpiece of the 20th century.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
It's quite possibly my favorite film of all time. I remember hearing about it and thinking exactly the same thing "why would I want to watch a film about a boxing club". I really envy you being able to watch it for the first time and discover all the twists and suprises, I wish I could od that again ... but make sure you rewatch it a few times you'll discover so much now you know what to look for ;)
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Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
John C wrote: the progressive trend of men being emasculated in popular culture and society Too true. That's the province of wives.
No, the province of wives is to try and it's in the province of men to fiercely resist with pride but to accept when they are just plain being silly. There are not a lot of women in my estimation that truly in their hearts want a lapdog for a husband.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
Peeing standing up. That's all we've got left - and once the women figure out how to do that without dribbling, well it's curtains for male kind.
They already have, there's this disposable cardboard funnel type thing I saw once. Dont' get me wrong, I don't think men or women should adhere to any particular gender role, I think that's long out the window, but the concept of maleness and femaleness and the attitudes that go with them are good things in my opinion no matter who or what sex chooses to live them. Vive le difference! :)
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
a few years ago someone else posted a howto guide without using tools in this sort of discussion on a different site. No I didn't bookmark it.
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