Question to ask an interviewee
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Hi all, What would you consider a good question to ask to a potential programmer to see whether he/she is worth their salt? Thanks in advance for any suggestions Regards,
The only programmers that are better that C programmers are those who code in 1's and 0's :bob: :)Programm3r My Blog: ^_^
Programm3r wrote:
What would you consider a good question to ask to a potential programmer to see whether he/she is worth their salt?
Some of common Microsoft interview questions[^] are pretty good.
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Not knowing the answer (0 or 1) even though I have 11 years of experience and I have written > 500K lines of C++ code I would have to answer that this is bad code and the coder should be shot on the spot.
John
John M. Drescher wrote:
would have to answer that this is bad code and the coder should be shot on the spot.
Good answer!
Recent blog posts: * Introduction to LINQ to XML (Part 1) - (Part 2) - (part 3) My website | Blog
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I wouldn't ask them anything. Sit them down in front of pc with VS and sql server. Ask them to create a simple web page (if it is asp.net) or winform (if a windows job) using the pubs database that has a drop down list with authors and grid populated with books by each author. If they can make it work under the pressure of the interview then hire them. If not, don't.
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
That is very similar to what we do. It works very well.
Recent blog posts: * Introduction to LINQ to XML (Part 1) - (Part 2) - (part 3) My website | Blog
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SK Genius wrote:
For some crazy reason 0
It's not a crazy reason, it's a very logical reason. But, hey, you got it. :rose:
Reading the thread, I was rather saddened that I came up with 1 instead of 0. What's come over me? I still didn't get it. Then I did the experiments (VS2008):
C#: result is 0, as noted.
C++: result is 1, as I thought.Although it was cited as 'a very logical reason' that the value was set back, it would seem to conflict with the logic that is supposed to define the post-increment operator. Certainly the logic that has defined it heretofore! I'd love, therefore, to know what that 'a very logical reason' it's set back to 0 in c#. An Aside: If it's to appease the memory management . . . that's not a good reason. It's an unpleasant artifact that needs to be addressed and corrected.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"How do you find out if you're unwanted if everyone you try to ask tells you to go away?" - Balboos HaGadol -
Hi all, What would you consider a good question to ask to a potential programmer to see whether he/she is worth their salt? Thanks in advance for any suggestions Regards,
The only programmers that are better that C programmers are those who code in 1's and 0's :bob: :)Programm3r My Blog: ^_^
Give them the fizz-buzz problem in the language you are hiring for. If you don't know what that is, Scott Hanselman explains in his podcast and has some links on his blog: http://www.hanselman.com/blog/HanselminutesPodcast53HiringAndInterviewingEngineers.aspx[^] I also have an implementation in LINQ: http://blog.colinmackay.net/archive/2008/04/16/2251.aspx[^]
Recent blog posts: * Introduction to LINQ to XML (Part 1) - (Part 2) - (part 3) My website | Blog
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Reading the thread, I was rather saddened that I came up with 1 instead of 0. What's come over me? I still didn't get it. Then I did the experiments (VS2008):
C#: result is 0, as noted.
C++: result is 1, as I thought.Although it was cited as 'a very logical reason' that the value was set back, it would seem to conflict with the logic that is supposed to define the post-increment operator. Certainly the logic that has defined it heretofore! I'd love, therefore, to know what that 'a very logical reason' it's set back to 0 in c#. An Aside: If it's to appease the memory management . . . that's not a good reason. It's an unpleasant artifact that needs to be addressed and corrected.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"How do you find out if you're unwanted if everyone you try to ask tells you to go away?" - Balboos HaGadolRHS expression is evaluated to 0, then i is incremented, but the RHS expression value is assigned back to i.
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int i = 0;
i = i++;What is the value of i after executing these statements.
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I wouldn't ask them anything. Sit them down in front of pc with VS and sql server. Ask them to create a simple web page (if it is asp.net) or winform (if a windows job) using the pubs database that has a drop down list with authors and grid populated with books by each author. If they can make it work under the pressure of the interview then hire them. If not, don't.
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
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Hi all, What would you consider a good question to ask to a potential programmer to see whether he/she is worth their salt? Thanks in advance for any suggestions Regards,
The only programmers that are better that C programmers are those who code in 1's and 0's :bob: :)Programm3r My Blog: ^_^
I had an interviewer ask me one time if I could write a program to do some fairly simple task (don't remember what it was) and have my program compile without any errors. I said, "probably not." I got the job. Guess he liked my honesty.
Gary Kirkham Forever Forgiven and Alive in the Spirit For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. Me blog, You read
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That is very similar to what we do. It works very well.
Recent blog posts: * Introduction to LINQ to XML (Part 1) - (Part 2) - (part 3) My website | Blog
I had to do that at my last job. I passed and then got to test new candidates. When were interviewing for a "Senior" level asp.net position and a lot of candidates couldn't make a simple web page. We even wrote the stored procs for them and told them that they could code it however they wanted. All they had to do was make it work. Over 50% of them failed. But they could talk on and on about all the object oriented stuff like inheritance, abstraction and encapsulation. Theory is one thing, programming in real life is something else.
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
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A bit harsh but very good.
Visit http://www.notreadytogiveup.com/[^] and do something special today.
Trollslayer wrote:
A bit harsh
You mean coding in Visual Studio during an interview? :~ Try a whiteboard :)
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http://www.newinterviewquestions.com/list.htm[^] This may help according to a job category.
Regards, Mushq
If the "approval" for answers and the english correction for the whole site is the same as in this question[^] I wouldn't trust on it. What is a "arithematic progression" and a "gemotric mean". I know about "arithmetic progression" and "geometric mean". BTW... even the "typos" how can be the therms in an arithmetic progression bigger than the result as they are in the "approved" answer? And another jewel... see[^]
Greetings. -------- M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you “The First Rule of Program Optimization: Don't do it. The Second Rule of Program Optimization (for experts only!): Don't do it yet.” - Michael A. Jackson Rating helpfull answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
modified on Friday, May 23, 2008 12:41 PM
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RHS expression is evaluated to 0, then i is incremented, but the RHS expression value is assigned back to i.
The question I meant was not what it does (I saw that for myself), but why it does it. The 'definition' of the post-increment operator is to use it's current value and then increment it. 1) The RHS is copied to the LHS. - They are now both the same value. 2) The RHS is incremented. There is no concieveable reason why it should have anything more to do with the LHS (as I see it), since the data mapping for the LHS is complete. The RHS is incremented and that should be the last step. In C and C++, it is. It's C#'s behaviour that makes no sense. My thought that it has to do with the )&)^()&)& managed memory for even simple types may be the problem in that it inserted another step (I guess): It did it's arithmetic in some other place in memory and then, after the increment, it decided all it needs to do with the statement has been done. It then copies the value it stored (in an address other than that of i into i. If I'm correct, this behavior is an artifact of the managed memory - and is incorrect according to how the code was written. I will say this - it's very interesting and (to me) a sound warning that C#'s behaviour can be (apparently) unpredictable.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"How do you find out if you're unwanted if everyone you try to ask tells you to go away?" - Balboos HaGadol -
Hi all, What would you consider a good question to ask to a potential programmer to see whether he/she is worth their salt? Thanks in advance for any suggestions Regards,
The only programmers that are better that C programmers are those who code in 1's and 0's :bob: :)Programm3r My Blog: ^_^
My lead and I always ask "how would you send data between two processes?" For us, if you don't know Win32 and multi-threading, we don't want to waste out time. My broader point is to ask questions directly related to why you need this person. Ask for specific examples of them solving the same types of problems you need solved. Pay attention to the basic vocabulary, not necessarily the solution itself (which may have caveats that don't apply to your situation.) (When I am the one being interviewed, if they don't ask targeted questions like this, I question whether they know why their hiring someone. Several times, it's become apparent that they wanted someone with a different skill set, but were desperate, clueless or both.)
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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Programm3r wrote:
What would you consider a good question to ask to a potential programmer to see whether he/she is worth their salt?
Some of common Microsoft interview questions[^] are pretty good.
I disagree. I find those questions pointless. They tell you nothing, but we all pretend they do. (One reason they drive me nuts is that for whatever reason, I need to be using a computer for my mind to get into the right flow of programming. I've always been that way--I just don't write good code on paper/whiteboard [note that I said code, not algorithms; just occurred to me that asking the person to outline the algorithm for a task is much more useful.])
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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The question I meant was not what it does (I saw that for myself), but why it does it. The 'definition' of the post-increment operator is to use it's current value and then increment it. 1) The RHS is copied to the LHS. - They are now both the same value. 2) The RHS is incremented. There is no concieveable reason why it should have anything more to do with the LHS (as I see it), since the data mapping for the LHS is complete. The RHS is incremented and that should be the last step. In C and C++, it is. It's C#'s behaviour that makes no sense. My thought that it has to do with the )&)^()&)& managed memory for even simple types may be the problem in that it inserted another step (I guess): It did it's arithmetic in some other place in memory and then, after the increment, it decided all it needs to do with the statement has been done. It then copies the value it stored (in an address other than that of i into i. If I'm correct, this behavior is an artifact of the managed memory - and is incorrect according to how the code was written. I will say this - it's very interesting and (to me) a sound warning that C#'s behaviour can be (apparently) unpredictable.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"How do you find out if you're unwanted if everyone you try to ask tells you to go away?" - Balboos HaGadolBalboos wrote:
I will say this - it's very interesting and (to me) a sound warning that C#'s behaviour can be (apparently) unpredictable.
It's hardly unpredictable if it's specified:
14.5.9 Postfix increment and decrement operators
…
The run-time processing of a postfix increment or decrement operation of the form x++ or x-- consists of
the following steps:
If x is classified as a variable:
a) x is evaluated to produce the variable.
b) The value of x is saved.
c) The saved value of x is converted to the operand type of the selected operator and the operator is invoked with this value as its argument.
d) The value returned by the operator is converted to the type of x and stored in the location given by the evaluation of x.
e) The saved value of x becomes the result of the operation. -
Hi all, What would you consider a good question to ask to a potential programmer to see whether he/she is worth their salt? Thanks in advance for any suggestions Regards,
The only programmers that are better that C programmers are those who code in 1's and 0's :bob: :)Programm3r My Blog: ^_^
My favorite interview moment. I was with a bunch of random developers at Citrix Draper. One guy asked, "Show me how you would reverse a string in C++." I stood, went to the white board and wrote "strrev(pStr);" To this day, I not only think it's the right answer, but it's the answer I want to see since it shows common sense. (In the end, I wrote a silly version of string reverse.) Annoying interview moment: I was asked wrote some code. I did. I made an error. The interviewer corrected my error, but in doing so, made an even worse error.
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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If the "approval" for answers and the english correction for the whole site is the same as in this question[^] I wouldn't trust on it. What is a "arithematic progression" and a "gemotric mean". I know about "arithmetic progression" and "geometric mean". BTW... even the "typos" how can be the therms in an arithmetic progression bigger than the result as they are in the "approved" answer? And another jewel... see[^]
Greetings. -------- M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you “The First Rule of Program Optimization: Don't do it. The Second Rule of Program Optimization (for experts only!): Don't do it yet.” - Michael A. Jackson Rating helpfull answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
modified on Friday, May 23, 2008 12:41 PM
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Hi all, What would you consider a good question to ask to a potential programmer to see whether he/she is worth their salt? Thanks in advance for any suggestions Regards,
The only programmers that are better that C programmers are those who code in 1's and 0's :bob: :)Programm3r My Blog: ^_^
My favourite exercise for a programmer is to write code to calculate a (ten-pin) bowling score from a sequence. E.g. 91XX729-81XX9-91XX Demonstrates to me a number of things: - understanding a moderately complex, but well defined, algorithm - need to backtrack - coding style - ability to optimize - error checking of data If they get stuck, the input format can be made a bit clearer: E.g. 9 1 X X 7 2 9 0 8 1 X X 9 0 9 1 X X It's slightly amazing to me that some people, who claim to understand the rules (and can talk through it) can't even start to implement this in code! Bonus points for someone who writes unit-tests, a quick and dirty "GUI" (even if it's through the console). More bonus points if they can implement an interactive version that can compute the "best now attainable" score. I tend to time limit the task, but that is long enough to be an insightful period! I just wish I could get my company to formally adopt "testing" in _all_ interviews for programming positions - I'm sick of programmers employed by others getting drafted into my project that wouldn't have made my cut!
Regards, Ray
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Balboos wrote:
I will say this - it's very interesting and (to me) a sound warning that C#'s behaviour can be (apparently) unpredictable.
It's hardly unpredictable if it's specified:
14.5.9 Postfix increment and decrement operators
…
The run-time processing of a postfix increment or decrement operation of the form x++ or x-- consists of
the following steps:
If x is classified as a variable:
a) x is evaluated to produce the variable.
b) The value of x is saved.
c) The saved value of x is converted to the operand type of the selected operator and the operator is invoked with this value as its argument.
d) The value returned by the operator is converted to the type of x and stored in the location given by the evaluation of x.
e) The saved value of x becomes the result of the operation.Brady Kelly wrote:
The saved value of x becomes the result of the operation.
Except, apparently, in C# under the condition of evaluating: i = i++; The description, above, describes what it should do. The value saved (b) is, as I understand it, replaced by (d) via (e). That's why i's final value evaluates to 1 in C++ ; - and - why I hypothesize that the as the entire statement is evaluated, its value is stored in a scratch area. This is restored just before execution of the next statement. In the case of that rather odd code example, it overwrites the (currently) correct value with old data. Then LHS is updated with dated data after its business should already be complete and is (potentially) incorrect. This begs another question - is giving a potential employee a trick question, where the 'correct' answer varies by language, and in C#, is arguably wrong - a good question? while(weekend) enjoy++;
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"How do you find out if you're unwanted if everyone you try to ask tells you to go away?" - Balboos HaGadol