Opera 9.5 [modified]

[grgran]

I do not even notice the message types before :-( I be a bad programmer and get no doughnut

[tschettler]

I've found only one obscure issue with Opera 9.5 that will cause it to crash; other than that it works perfectly. The Opera servers have been bogged down lately, but that's to be expected with a new major release. I actually like the new default skin, but that's up to the user anyways. One new feature that really wow'd me was Opera Link[^], giving you the ability to synchronize bookmarks, Speed Dial entries, etc between Opera browsers on different PCs and platforms. The Quick Find feature is a great addition as well, not to mention Dragonfly[^] - although it is somewhat hidden in the Tools menu. All in all, I'm thoroughly impressed with this release. :-D Oh yeah, the central location for "add-ins" (widgets) can be found here[^].

[code frog 0]

Yes I do have hardware virtualization on the host server. My opinion on that is that either the product or the hardware has yet to figure out what to do with the other. The only benefit I got was that I could create 64bit VMs. That I can tell anyway...

[Jon Rista]

I've been using Opera for years as my primary browser...since late version 6.0. Opera is a GREAT browser that is SADLY misunderstood and quite often specifically broken by certain organizations with bad javascript and css (AHEM MICROSOFT!!! >.<). Opera is a stable, VERY fast, fully standards compliant browser that has a severe lack of respect in the community for no good reason. Opera is also probably the most compatible browser I've ever used, if not neccesarily by default for every site. Opera has the ability to mask itself as IE or FireFox, allowing it to work perfectly with sites that will initially not work if it is identified as Opera. (This is a good indication of people either not checking their "standards compliant" code in Opera, or specifically nerfing it so it won't work...try comparing the JS and CSS you get for most microsoft sites from both IE and Opera...you'll see the differences and why its a purposeful nerf). Once you configure a site to be masked as IE or FF, it stays that way for subsequent visits, so its a minor tweak you only have to do on the first visit. Some of the great things about Opera: 1) First browser to perfectly pass ACID 2 (yes, even before Safari did...) 2) Currently has the highest score for the ACID 3 test (Opera 9.5 passes at 80/100 vs. FF 70/100 and IE7 12/100) 3) Fully standards compliant for all CSS 2.1, and supports a significant subset of CSS 3 features. 4) Fully XHTML 1.1 and DOM compliant, including proper event models etc. 5) Its faster and has a much smaller memory footprint than any version of FireFox. 6) Was the first browser to have tabs (yes, even before FireFox) 7) Was the first browser to natively integrate mouse gestures. 8) Was the first browser to include a closed page trash can, so if you accidentally close a page, you can quickly recover it. 9) Was the first browser to automatically reopen all tabs when starting up after a previous close or crash. 10) Was the first (maybe only?) browser to support full page zoom, both above and below 100%. Also supports integrated small form factor/fit width view and inline print preview (which fully supports print media CSS styles). 11) Is the first (and only?) browser to support integrated and customizable address-bar search (type in g <something> to search google, y <something> to search yahoo, or add a custom one like d <word> to look up a word on dictionary.com). 12) Provides a feature called web panels, which appear on the left side of the browser and provide quick access to si

[Joe Woodbury]

I have used opera on several computers for quite a while and found it to be poorly designed and implemented. I have not found it markedly faster than Firefox. It also crashes more than Firefox or IE. It locks up more than Firefox and IE. In some cases, the internal data structures tracking links gets corrupt and every tab adopts the same link. It deals with image tags inconsistently. Every now and then, I run across web sites that give Opera and Firefox fits. IE never has a problem with these sites. It does run on systems with low memory better than the other browsers, but I'd never use it as my first choice on any other system. My own experience has the been the opposite of yours; the more I've used Opera, the more I disliked it. The only reason I keep it installed on various systems is for testing purposes.

Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke

[Joe Woodbury]

Nope. Tried it on a VM with a clean XP install on a very fast system and it had the same problems I reported. I stand by my statements.

Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke

[Jon Rista]

Having used Opera on over 20 systems for over 5 years, and never having any problems with it (I don't think its ever crashed on its own once...only time it crashes is when the entire system crashes in my experience). I also don't think that FireFox or IE really ever crash on my systems unless there is some other, fundamental reason for it. In a well-maintained system, software can run perfectly for an indefinite amount of time. I think there might be some other reason for your experiences (especially if you have enough crashes in all three browsers to be able to tell that any one of them crashes more often than the other). There are numerous reasons why applications can become unstable...one of the most common but least understood being poor power signal or insufficient power, with too much heat comming in second. Granted, severe bugs can cause an application to crash, but once an application has reached its third generation or so, especially applications that get regular updates pushed the moment they are made, crashes should be very infrequent. Frequent crashes of any application are usually a sign of some external influence or interference with normal operation...might want to check into it. All that aside, even if you just plain and simply don't like Opera even if you find some other cause for it crashing, there is no reason to go on a hostile crusade against it. There are plenty of alternatives, and its largely due to individuals such as yourself that Opera has an unwarranted bad rap. Its a solid, stable, fast, efficient browser that sports twice as many features and integrated tools as any other browser, and has sported them since long before any other browser "innovated" them into their own feature set.

[Kevin McFarlane]

Jon Rista wrote:

I highly recommend Opera, for web developers and normal users

Two things to consider: 1. Almost all normal users will never see a reason to use anything other than the browser that comes with their OS - for 95% or whatever of users that's IE. 2. Most techies will never see a reason to use anything other than the browser that comes with their OS. 3. Re: standards, devs are interested in standards. End users just want to be able to browse. If a browser is standards compliant but too many pages don't display properly they'll just stick with a non-standards compliant browser that will display the pages properly. Even if the standards compliant browser can be tweaked to display non-compliant pages that will be too much effort for the average user. Re: 2, I'm a techie and I use Firefox as my primary browser (I do have Opera installed and keep it up to date as well). However, most of my fellow techies who use IE (and even more so since IE 7) see not the slightest reason to try Firefox yet alone Opera. Most of them see Firefox and Opera as just about tabbed browsing. IE 7 has tabs. Ergo, no reason to try anything else. You will find such opinions expressed on CP as well. So your interesting description of Opera is, well, interesting and that's it.

Kevin

[Kevin McFarlane]

Joe Woodbury wrote:

I have not found it markedly faster than Firefox.

Whenever any of the browsers have claimed to be faster than their competitors I've never notice a difference worth caring about. It won't matter until network latency becomes a vanishingly small percentage of the page request-display cycle. I switch between browsers purely based on functionality. At various times I have a reason to prefer IE or Firefox or Opera. I've not experienced the problems you've had with Opera but OTOH I don't use it in anger that often - though I do keep it up-to-date. Opera's UI is a bit idiosyncratic compared to IE and Firefox. But OTOH it's always had some good features and it's been the pioneer of most of the best browser innovations.

Kevin

[Kevin McFarlane]

Jon Rista wrote:

sports twice as many features and integrated tools as any other browser, and has sported them since long before any other browser "innovated" them into their own feature set.

That's true. But it's not in itself a reason to prefer a product. What matters is not which was fisrt but which provides the best experience now. It's actually quite common for a pioneer to languish and for the second or third product to have the mass market success, e.g., MS Windows. I don't actually trash Opera. I've had it installed for years - since before Firefox emerged. But today - for numerous reasons - I prefer Firefox. OTOH, I don't think it's possible to persuade people to other choices. It's somewhat subjective and most people need to have a pressing reason to try something different. Even techies are fairly conservative in my opinion. Occasionally, I show other techies the various Firefox extensions I use. Virtually all of them react with complete indifference. And they will remain so until they run into the particular problem that a specific extension is designed to solve and feel the problem is sufficiently irksome.

Kevin

[mmwlada]

I was using 9.27 too, before 9.5 But it works great for me. :)

There can be only one.

[mrdgreen]

Discounting the colour scheme stuff -- wow -- Opera sounds just as crap as IE, VS, etc :wtf: !? I rarely respond to these comments, as they seem to drol and immature, but I am not perfect -- as you obviously are not either! :wtf:

Interested in answers.