Source Control with Branching and VS support?
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We have used VSS for about 10 years - we had some horrible thing called PVCS before that. It has its quirks and it works better if the source database is regularly pruned, but for us - a dev team of 5 - it does the job. It got a whole lot easier when Visual Studio brought in the 'change source control' functionality (about 2003/2005, can't remember exactly). It was manual editing of the project file after a branch before that! I guess we really ought to investigate the alternatives, but we are fairly happy with what we have, and there are other priorities...
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Does anyone know of a good source control that has/is: >Branching and Merging >Shallow learning curve >speedy >Good windows tools OR a worthwhile VS plugin I'm looking at subversion (ok, but seems slow), Team foundation (too much - and HOW MUCH???) & Git, but i don't know enough! At the moment we are using the flagship of the microsoft line - SourceSafe! It's fine for most of our little one-man web projects, but for multi-dev use? erm..... No. We're currently working on a project that is different on production, staging and dev. Different bits are added at different times, some things are pushed to production, some things not.... blergh! So, i need a good, easy to use, source control with branching/merging. Over to you....
I'm in the process of switching from subversion to Mercurial (http://www.selenic.com/mercurial/wiki/) and am liking it quite a bit so far. Plus, the Tortoise client for Windows is almost exactly the same for both.
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Does anyone know of a good source control that has/is: >Branching and Merging >Shallow learning curve >speedy >Good windows tools OR a worthwhile VS plugin I'm looking at subversion (ok, but seems slow), Team foundation (too much - and HOW MUCH???) & Git, but i don't know enough! At the moment we are using the flagship of the microsoft line - SourceSafe! It's fine for most of our little one-man web projects, but for multi-dev use? erm..... No. We're currently working on a project that is different on production, staging and dev. Different bits are added at different times, some things are pushed to production, some things not.... blergh! So, i need a good, easy to use, source control with branching/merging. Over to you....
We are using Accurev - branching/merging are a piece of cake, and it works well with multiple devs. Pretty shallow learning curve for devs - a little more for Admin (some of the functions are tricky to find in the GUI).
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Does anyone know of a good source control that has/is: >Branching and Merging >Shallow learning curve >speedy >Good windows tools OR a worthwhile VS plugin I'm looking at subversion (ok, but seems slow), Team foundation (too much - and HOW MUCH???) & Git, but i don't know enough! At the moment we are using the flagship of the microsoft line - SourceSafe! It's fine for most of our little one-man web projects, but for multi-dev use? erm..... No. We're currently working on a project that is different on production, staging and dev. Different bits are added at different times, some things are pushed to production, some things not.... blergh! So, i need a good, easy to use, source control with branching/merging. Over to you....
I work at a 150+ devcount site; we use VSTS/TFS2008, a necessity given the volume of projects and developers. But ... we are also running into ceiling issues with branching/merging and need MS consultancy to repair. TFS is by far the most mature source control system, but is actually not mature enough yet for flagship enterprise usage. Undoubtedly will become so in Rosario++. If you use VSS now and are in a 10+ developer situation, I still would advise migrating to TFS. You will however need someone (+ backup) with more than just suferficial knowledge of the workings of merging and branching. Tips and tricks are required, e.g. when it comes to issues due to renames, deletions, moves, simultaneously in changesets, branching for overlapping release management, component version integration issues, etc. etc.
Regards, Arjan Keene
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Does anyone know of a good source control that has/is: >Branching and Merging >Shallow learning curve >speedy >Good windows tools OR a worthwhile VS plugin I'm looking at subversion (ok, but seems slow), Team foundation (too much - and HOW MUCH???) & Git, but i don't know enough! At the moment we are using the flagship of the microsoft line - SourceSafe! It's fine for most of our little one-man web projects, but for multi-dev use? erm..... No. We're currently working on a project that is different on production, staging and dev. Different bits are added at different times, some things are pushed to production, some things not.... blergh! So, i need a good, easy to use, source control with branching/merging. Over to you....
Well we use Surround from Seapine and it's an amazing tool much better then Source Safe. http://www.seapine.com/surroundscm.html regards, :-D
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Does anyone know of a good source control that has/is: >Branching and Merging >Shallow learning curve >speedy >Good windows tools OR a worthwhile VS plugin I'm looking at subversion (ok, but seems slow), Team foundation (too much - and HOW MUCH???) & Git, but i don't know enough! At the moment we are using the flagship of the microsoft line - SourceSafe! It's fine for most of our little one-man web projects, but for multi-dev use? erm..... No. We're currently working on a project that is different on production, staging and dev. Different bits are added at different times, some things are pushed to production, some things not.... blergh! So, i need a good, easy to use, source control with branching/merging. Over to you....
We're using Subversion with TortoiseSVN and VisualSVN for VS integration - we found that doing as much as possible from within Visual Studio (using VisualSVN) seems to be very intuitive and reduces the learning curve significantly - We haven't worked with branching/merging much, though... We have not noticed any speed issues, but we do have very good bandwidth on the local network...
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Does anyone know of a good source control that has/is: >Branching and Merging >Shallow learning curve >speedy >Good windows tools OR a worthwhile VS plugin I'm looking at subversion (ok, but seems slow), Team foundation (too much - and HOW MUCH???) & Git, but i don't know enough! At the moment we are using the flagship of the microsoft line - SourceSafe! It's fine for most of our little one-man web projects, but for multi-dev use? erm..... No. We're currently working on a project that is different on production, staging and dev. Different bits are added at different times, some things are pushed to production, some things not.... blergh! So, i need a good, easy to use, source control with branching/merging. Over to you....
I've never used it, but you could try 'Vault' (http://www.sourcegear.com) We used TFS, and it's pretty good... but then pricing wasn't an issue for us, and although its' good and a alot better than source safe, has some nice features etc. some of the implementation details still leave a lot to be desired.
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Does anyone know of a good source control that has/is: >Branching and Merging >Shallow learning curve >speedy >Good windows tools OR a worthwhile VS plugin I'm looking at subversion (ok, but seems slow), Team foundation (too much - and HOW MUCH???) & Git, but i don't know enough! At the moment we are using the flagship of the microsoft line - SourceSafe! It's fine for most of our little one-man web projects, but for multi-dev use? erm..... No. We're currently working on a project that is different on production, staging and dev. Different bits are added at different times, some things are pushed to production, some things not.... blergh! So, i need a good, easy to use, source control with branching/merging. Over to you....
Used SourceSafe for 8 dev team, back before MS acquired it. Good, but I also recall replicating the database to effect release "branches". Back then it used a binary gobblygook database format, that self-corrupted (!) over time. Wouldn't use it by choice ever again. Where I work now we use CVSnt backserver with WinCVS (v1.3 -- later clients are too confusing) as a windows client for a 16 dev team (12 Lin, 3 Win). Steep, and imperfect (lacks file rename/move and dir hierarchy versions), but OK (branch/merge good). CVS is RCS based, so checkin/label/branch are slow because entire repository file must be rewritten, but chechouts are fast. Any RCS-based control will suffer similarly (PVCS used to be RCS based, dunno what it is now). A big advantage of RCS is that data is kept in the clear, making recovery possible with a text editor worst case. Don't know about others, but I know you can run CVS through a ssh tunnel when away from the office. That's convenient when you're working code at home or on the road.
patbob
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Does anyone know of a good source control that has/is: >Branching and Merging >Shallow learning curve >speedy >Good windows tools OR a worthwhile VS plugin I'm looking at subversion (ok, but seems slow), Team foundation (too much - and HOW MUCH???) & Git, but i don't know enough! At the moment we are using the flagship of the microsoft line - SourceSafe! It's fine for most of our little one-man web projects, but for multi-dev use? erm..... No. We're currently working on a project that is different on production, staging and dev. Different bits are added at different times, some things are pushed to production, some things not.... blergh! So, i need a good, easy to use, source control with branching/merging. Over to you....
Definitely you should take a look at Perforce - it is absolutely the best (but costs rather hefty $). We are using Subversion now (people were recommending it, and we thought we will save some money by not using Perforce), and I cannot say that it is very bad, but at the same time I am not sure that I will use it in my next project - slow, big repository, rather rudimentary tools (TortoiseSVN is worse than ancient WinCVS, and not even comparable to Perforce), many small issues (especially with branching/merging/reintegration).
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After 8+ years of working with VSS this year I switched to Subversion, and now wonder why I ever put up with VSS at all. We also used SourceOffSite for external access, which was always a pain and a clunky way to access your data externally. If your head is stuck in VSS mode, then you need to step back a little to really appreciate SVN and how to use it properly, but it's a pretty low learning curve. Like many posts already, I'd advocate VisualSVN + TortoiseSVN for the VS and explorer integration, and VisualSVN Server running on the backend, mainly for its simplicity. Another plus, for me anyway, is that it's entirely cross-platform, with tools available for loads of different platforms. No brainer.
side lane digital development
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I've also heared about this new Shelving feature, and I see it's really something I would regulary use. But where is the difference between - Putting something "on shelve" - Putting it in an new branch. Is it just the benefit, nobody else sees my shelve ? Or minor adminstativ overhead?
From my understanding there really isn't any difference. TortoiseSVN does this naturally (unless you switch after branch) Subversion (by default) doesn't enforce any constraints on your repository structure, you find a convention that works for you. I like that flexibility. Of course you can use path-based authorisation or pre-commit hooks and to enforce rules if you really need them - we just use groups for authentication/authorisation, a pre-commit hook for enforcing log comments and a post-commit hook on some paths for email notifications.
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Can anyone suggest a good write-up/tutorial on SVN with VS? Cheers Terry
Yes, the TortoiseSVN manual!
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I work at a 150+ devcount site; we use VSTS/TFS2008, a necessity given the volume of projects and developers. But ... we are also running into ceiling issues with branching/merging and need MS consultancy to repair. TFS is by far the most mature source control system, but is actually not mature enough yet for flagship enterprise usage. Undoubtedly will become so in Rosario++. If you use VSS now and are in a 10+ developer situation, I still would advise migrating to TFS. You will however need someone (+ backup) with more than just suferficial knowledge of the workings of merging and branching. Tips and tricks are required, e.g. when it comes to issues due to renames, deletions, moves, simultaneously in changesets, branching for overlapping release management, component version integration issues, etc. etc.
Regards, Arjan Keene
"TFS is by far the most mature source control system" You're joking right? Not that maturity is any indication of quality *cough* VSS, but SVN is twice the age of TFS, Perforce, Mercurial, etc are all more mature VCS. "You will however need someone (+ backup) with more than just suferficial knowledge of the workings of merging and branching. Tips and tricks are required, e.g. when it comes to issues due to renames, deletions, moves, simultaneously in changesets, branching for overlapping release management, component version integration issues, etc. etc." Ah yes, I see that you are Joking :laugh:
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Here is a question that I could use some help with. What is better CVS or Subversion in terms of featuresa and ease of use. Is there a easy to use client for subversion such as WinCVS is for CVS Thanks, Vaibhav
Subversion was written as a replacement for CVS, and designed to address its short-fallings, hence subversion kind of supersedes CVS. As to a replacement for WinCVS, well I've not used it so I couldn't say, but there are plenty of good SVN tools out there. By far the most popular is TortoiseSVN which integrates with Windows Explorer, or if you want a standalone client try checking out Subcommander or SmartSVN http://tortoisesvn.tigris.org/[^] http://subcommander.tigris.org/[^] http://www.syntevo.com/smartsvn/[^]
side lane digital development
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A number of our developers were using PVCS. Now they've been pushed to use ClearCase. Most of them liked PVCS better -- although I think it's mostly that they were very used to it.
I second this comment about PVCS that was previously posted on codeproject PVCS even worse. Subversion is what I would recommend, just make sure you read the section on branching and merging in the docs before setting up your directory structure.
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I've also heared about this new Shelving feature, and I see it's really something I would regulary use. But where is the difference between - Putting something "on shelve" - Putting it in an new branch. Is it just the benefit, nobody else sees my shelve ? Or minor adminstativ overhead?
ghard68 wrote:
Is it just the benefit, nobody else sees my shelve ? Or minor adminstativ overhead?
Its both.
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