Speaking of socialists
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When the Bank of England says 'did not understand crisis'[^] then something is very wrong with the system - namely - how is was functioning. As such, "let those who make bad business decisions suffer the consequincies for it" clearly is not a policy that is working right. Those who made the bad business decisions are essentially still there and those paying the consequences are ordinary folk who now have additional millstones around their neck thanks to Governments having to bail-out those who have perpetrated this "fraud" Sorry Stan, but I believe you are wrong in your defence of unregulated financials.
Richard A. Abbott wrote:
Sorry Stan, but I believe you are wrong in your defence of unregulated financials.
I'm not saying unregulated, I'm saying minimal regulation. There should be laws governing finance just as there are laws governing every other sector of human activity. But government should not regulate or manage business itself. It should clearly define concepts such as 'fraud' and enforce laws pertaining to those concepts.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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Stan Shannon wrote:
Capitalistic system are characterized by completely natural cycles of boom and busts. Those cycles need to be left alone by government and allowed to play themselves out naturally.
Then we need a better system. Q.E.D.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
Oakman wrote:
Then we need a better system.
And God should have created a more perfect planet, but he didn't.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
Stan is a very small cog in a very big wheel.
I'm not even sure he can be classified as a cog at all. The guys I'm thinking of were certainly further up the food chain than he'll ever hope to be and I would call them very small cogs.
Richard A. Abbott wrote:
Thus my comment to Stan below
'Twas well said and well reasoned. Of course, Stan will never understand it, because he refuses to try.
Richard A. Abbott wrote:
The balance sheets and so forth told them. I rather think they knew exactly what they were doing.
I don't want to believe you, mostly because I suspect you are right. Certainly it has come to light that a number of people did know and spoke up about what was going on, only to be silenced by the poqwers-that-be.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
Oakman wrote:
silenced by the poqwers-that-be
Money talks, or is it the threat of a visit from a Hitman - after all, "accidents" do happen
Oakman wrote:
Of course, Stan will never understand it, because he refuses to try
No doubt in my mind that Stan will take some persuasion. [joke]Hitman anybody :laugh: [/joke]
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Oakman wrote:
destroying the standard of living in this country.
One of two things are going to inevitably happen. Either we are going to be drug down to the rest of the world's standard of living, or the rest of the world is going to rise up to our standard of living. There is no other possible long range scenario. The latter can only happen if the entire world adopts a free market, free trade economic system. Any effort to manage the process by anyone, the notion that one nation can exist in some kind of an independent economic bubble or that some sort of tightly controlled centralized authority has any hope of mananaging something as granular and complex as the international economy, will result inevitably in the former.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
Do you cut and paste things you wrote earlier or is there a site called capitalismfordunces.com that you get your answers from? Either way, desperately repeating the same mantra when reading the WSJ gives the lie to everything you write, seems, imho, to be a waste of your time.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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Oakman wrote:
Then we need a better system.
And God should have created a more perfect planet, but he didn't.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
Stan Shannon wrote:
And God should have created a more perfect planet, but he didn't.
God may or may not have invented the Earth, but, though I hate to destroy your illusions, God did not invent capitalism.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
Sorry Stan, but I believe you are wrong in your defence of unregulated financials.
I'm not saying unregulated, I'm saying minimal regulation. There should be laws governing finance just as there are laws governing every other sector of human activity. But government should not regulate or manage business itself. It should clearly define concepts such as 'fraud' and enforce laws pertaining to those concepts.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
Stan Shannon wrote:
I'm saying minimal regulation.
What are your thoughts about "a little bit pregnant?" How about a treatise on "almost a virgin?"
Stan Shannon wrote:
But government should not regulate or manage business itself.
Why not? As long as it it done by representatives of the peepul? You trust these self-same reprepresentatives to manage everyone's bedroom activity - why not their boardroom activity? Seems to me more people get fucked in the boardroom than in the bedroom . .
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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Oakman wrote:
silenced by the poqwers-that-be
Money talks, or is it the threat of a visit from a Hitman - after all, "accidents" do happen
Oakman wrote:
Of course, Stan will never understand it, because he refuses to try
No doubt in my mind that Stan will take some persuasion. [joke]Hitman anybody :laugh: [/joke]
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
No doubt in my mind that Stan will take some persuasion
You want I should talk to me brudder, Vito the Bonecrusher from New Joisey?
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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Stan Shannon wrote:
And God should have created a more perfect planet, but he didn't.
God may or may not have invented the Earth, but, though I hate to destroy your illusions, God did not invent capitalism.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
Sorry Stan, but I believe you are wrong in your defence of unregulated financials.
I'm not saying unregulated, I'm saying minimal regulation. There should be laws governing finance just as there are laws governing every other sector of human activity. But government should not regulate or manage business itself. It should clearly define concepts such as 'fraud' and enforce laws pertaining to those concepts.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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The Reckoning[^] In the past decade, China has invested upward of $1 trillion, mostly earnings from manufacturing exports, into American government bonds and government-backed mortgage debt. That has lowered interest rates and helped fuel a historic consumption binge and housing bubble in the United States. China, some economists say, lulled American consumers, and their leaders, into complacency about their spendthrift ways. Perhaps, Stan, this time it was the Marxists.
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Oakman wrote:
God did not invent capitalism
Have you told Ilion that :~ You'll upset him :laugh:
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Stan Shannon wrote:
But government should not regulate or manage business itself.
You want business to police itself. That's like asking prisoners to police themselves. Its an answer but, in my opinion, a non-working answer.
Richard A. Abbott wrote:
You want business to police itself.
I never said that. I said business decisions should be business decisions and not influenced in any way at all by political considerations. The government's only legitimate envolvment is when those decisions cross the line into actual criminal activity - thats policing. What you seem to want is not policing, it is fascism - that is, the corporation serving the interests of the state rather than its own business interests.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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Stan Shannon wrote:
I'm saying minimal regulation.
What are your thoughts about "a little bit pregnant?" How about a treatise on "almost a virgin?"
Stan Shannon wrote:
But government should not regulate or manage business itself.
Why not? As long as it it done by representatives of the peepul? You trust these self-same reprepresentatives to manage everyone's bedroom activity - why not their boardroom activity? Seems to me more people get fucked in the boardroom than in the bedroom . .
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
Oakman wrote:
Why not? As long as it it done by representatives of the peepul? You trust these self-same reprepresentatives to manage everyone's bedroom activity - why not their boardroom activity? Seems to me more people get f***ed in the boardroom than in the bedroom . .
You have everything just ass backwards, Jon. Society is inherently stable when economics is free and personal behavior is subject of rules and regulations.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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Stan Shannon wrote:
And God should have created a more perfect planet, but he didn't.
God may or may not have invented the Earth, but, though I hate to destroy your illusions, God did not invent capitalism.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
Oakman wrote:
God did not invent capitalism.
No, but just as with the natural world, it works best when left alone. You simply cannot improve upon it. It is as good as it gets.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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The Reckoning[^] In the past decade, China has invested upward of $1 trillion, mostly earnings from manufacturing exports, into American government bonds and government-backed mortgage debt. That has lowered interest rates and helped fuel a historic consumption binge and housing bubble in the United States. China, some economists say, lulled American consumers, and their leaders, into complacency about their spendthrift ways. Perhaps, Stan, this time it was the Marxists.
73Zeppelin wrote:
Perhaps, Stan, this time it was the Marxists.
More accurately the Maoists.
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
Think inside the box! ProActive Secure Systems
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
Do you cut and paste things you wrote earlier or is there a site called capitalismfordunces.com that you get your answers from? Either way, desperately repeating the same mantra when reading the WSJ gives the lie to everything you write, seems, imho, to be a waste of your time.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
Everything I write is completely valid, Jon. There is no way to isolate the American economy from the rest of the world. It is impossible. There is no way to do it. No one is wise enough to achieve it. Either we are all going to live in free market splendor or we are going to wallow in collectivist squalor. There are no other options.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
You want business to police itself.
I never said that. I said business decisions should be business decisions and not influenced in any way at all by political considerations. The government's only legitimate envolvment is when those decisions cross the line into actual criminal activity - thats policing. What you seem to want is not policing, it is fascism - that is, the corporation serving the interests of the state rather than its own business interests.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
Stan Shannon wrote:
that is, the corporation serving the interests of the state rather than its own business interests.
So what is wrong, exactly, with business serving the country rather than the country serving business?
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface
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73Zeppelin wrote:
Perhaps, Stan, this time it was the Marxists.
More accurately the Maoists.
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
Think inside the box! ProActive Secure Systems
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopesJimmyRopes wrote:
More accurately the Maoists.
Actually, I think the Chinese can, these days, be referred to as capitalists par extraordinaire. They are also a dictatorship, of course, and that they inherited from Mao (and a few thousand years of history.)
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface