Irwin N. Graulich: The Gaza Strip-Tease

[Stan Shannon]

Richard A. Abbott wrote:

. What power do you think that American Governments have that Governments from Britain, France, Germany, Spain ... do not?

Well none, subsequent to our take over and occupation by european political tyranny. However, before that, the US governmetn had virtually no power to affect society or culture at all. That was all managed at the state and local levels of our society.

Richard A. Abbott wrote:

Is this the yardstick to measure that, or have you some other test that equates as a yardstick?

I have no idea what any of that means.

Richard A. Abbott wrote:

What should European Governments individually or collectively do to rectify such shortcomings?

Immdediately abandon all forms of collectivist government and reform your governments around Jeffersonian and free market, principles. In short, accept the fact that you have been wrong all along, the American model has always been superior. Once you have done that, maybe our occupiers will see the errors of their way and voluntarily release us from our bondage.

Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.

[Stan Shannon]

Oakman wrote:

Yep, Greece and Switzerland, Finland and Bosnia - all the same.

Pretty much.

Oakman wrote:

The small town I live in is filled with enlightened souls.

So is mine. We just happen to believe that enligtenment does not necessarily mean universal agreement.

Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.

[Tim Craig]

Oakman wrote:

Stan's, of course.

That's not a yardstick. That's not even the short end of a broken ruler.

"Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work and then they get elected and prove it." -- P.J. O'Rourke

[73Zeppelin]

Stan Shannon wrote:

Oakman wrote: Yep, Greece and Switzerland, Finland and Bosnia - all the same. Pretty much.

Yeah - "pretty much" not the same at all... You should get out more.

[Oakman]

Stan Shannon wrote:

Immdediately abandon all forms of collectivist government and reform your governments around Jeffersonian and free market, principles. In short, accept the fact that you have been wrong all along, the American model has always been superior. Once you have done that, maybe our occupiers will see the errors of their way and voluntarily release us from our bondage.

Thank you for making my day. I suppose it's cruel to laugh at insanity, but I can't help it.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface

[Oakman]

73Zeppelin wrote:

You should get out more.

He's far too terrified of the world to ever experience it.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface

[Lost User]

Not wishing to be rude, but you have not stated anything at all. Why? Well... You said, "Europeans did take away precisely the wrong lessons from WWII." then "The lesson that Europeans took away from WWII was that government did not have enough power" and now you say ...

Stan Shannon wrote:

Well none, subsequent to our take over and occupation by european political tyranny. However, before that, the US governmetn had virtually no power to affect society or culture at all. That was all managed at the state and local levels of our society.

then

Stan Shannon wrote:

I have no idea what any of that means.

Frankly Stan, I have not got a clue what your original criticism was as you answer clearly "Well none", so I assume you haven't got much of a clue neither.

[Oakman]

You should count casualties, not just deaths which are always skewed by the quality of medical care available. However, you seem not to grasp that when a soldier dies, a civilian family is affected. To imply that because the U.S. incurred almost exclusively military deaths, its civilian population remained untouched suggests a need for more thought. Most of Americans who died had been farmers, shopkeepers, mechanics, and teachers only months before. Those soldiers who survived still knew what it was like to see their best friends die in front of them and they did not forget when two years later they returned to their civilian careers. Nor do I mean to suggest that this was any less true for the Brits, Germans, or Russians.

Bob Emmett wrote:

Europe (both sides) learned what it was like to be on the receiving end of a war of attrition

In WWII, only the Russians fought a war of attrition and that only at the battle of Stalingrad. Both Blitzkrieg and its later adaptation by Patton with the Red Ball Express, and, to some extent, Montgomery, are the antithesis of a war of attrition.

Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface

[73Zeppelin]

Yes, that is quite evident to me.

[Lost User]

Oakman wrote:

You should count casualties,

Too many columns. :)

Oakman wrote:

However, you seem not to grasp that when a soldier dies, a civilian family is affected.

Why would I not grasp the "bleedin' obvious"? The family is affected whether the departed is blown apart in uniform or in bed.

Oakman wrote:

to see their best friends die in front of them

As did my father, 19 years old, as part of the BEF in 1940, on the beaches at Dunkirk. Then with the 8th Army in North Africa and Italy.

Oakman wrote:

Russians fought a war of attrition

Perhaps there are degrees of attrition, military and civilian. To me, bombing cities to wear down the population is attrition.

Bob Emmett