Windows Vista 32-bit vs 64-bit
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Since you mention 64-bit Vista and VPN, I have been having problems with this combination. I was earlier using 32-bit Vista on my laptop and had installed VPN to connect to my client network. No problems there. After I upgraded to 64-bit Vista, I've been having a lot of problems with VPN connectivity. So now, I'm using another box for the VPN software. It's probably something to do with me, but I couldn't fix it so far. So you can either do this or reinstall the computer with a 32 bit OS if your employer has a license for it. Otherwise 64-bit systems are great. You will not be able to run 16-bit programs though.
«_Superman_»
«_Superman_» wrote:
16-bit programs
what are these ?? :P
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
build your own machine. It'll be a better machine than anything you could buy that's pre-made, more readily upgradable, and most likely half the cost.
I tend to building my own machine, too. But I have seen prebuilt systems that were the same price as custom systems with the same components. Sometimes building your own is over rated.
I went from a Dual core/DDR to a Quad core/DDR2 for $450 this year (motherboard, CPU, RAM, XP-64 OEM). Building *my* own is never overrated. Beisdes that, I actually have the OS DVD if I need to reinstall.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 -
I went from a Dual core/DDR to a Quad core/DDR2 for $450 this year (motherboard, CPU, RAM, XP-64 OEM). Building *my* own is never overrated. Beisdes that, I actually have the OS DVD if I need to reinstall.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
Building *my* own is never overrated
Okay, okay ... ;) Actually I am talking about the PC I am going to buy for my mother. The low end 2 Gig systems from my local shop are the same price as if I would buy the components individually (and this shop has low prices). Back to the topic: If I don't want to or can't upgrade this machine to more than 2 Gigs (it's for internet and Word usage only), would you still recommend Vista 64? A friend told me that there might be some overhead compared to Vista 32.
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I just had a crappy experience at Best Buy. I choose to just buy a computer out of the box rather than mess with building one. I went to the store to see what was available for a new desktop and I could not find any 32-bit Vista machines by HP. I asked one of the sales people about it and he proceeded to let me know that I was silly for wanting 32-bit (he apparently has 2 64-bit systems at home) and that there are no compatibility issues to worry about and that they are awesome. Well I know for a fact that my employer will not allow 64-bit VPN software to be installed on a 64-bit system so that is a good reason not to go there. Will you please let me know what you think of the 2 systems and other than the obvious potential benefits over time is it work buying a 64-bit system now, today?
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
I noticed that 64-bit Video Card drivers sometimes get a delayed released compared to 32-bit ones. So if gaming is your deal, I wouldn't recommend it as you might not benefit from the most current video drivers. Aside from that, I haven't seen any issues with my XP 64-bit, Also didn't notice any real performance improvement.
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CleaKO wrote:
Well I know for a fact that my employer will not allow 64-bit VPN software to be installed on a 64-bit system
I don't understand that statement at all. In any case, if you want what you want, and nobody provides it, build your own machine. It'll be a better machine than anything you could buy that's pre-made, more readily upgradable, and most likely half the cost.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
build your own machine
Is there a cannonical guide to building your own machine? I would like something that addresses current technology without relying on availability of particular brands.
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CleaKO wrote:
I just had a crappy experience at Best Buy.
Why would you even consider buying a comp at BestBuy? I have been rockin' 64bit Vista for six months now. I use it for games and occasional development. I have the 64bit Zune software and MS Office. I have never had an issue with it. I don't know of any reason not to install the 64bit version of vista. I burn / rip all my DVDs / CDs with it and have never had an issue.
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
I am buying a computer from Best Buy because I have a Best Buy credit card. Believe me I dont like their sleeze but at least I can see the product in person before buying it.
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
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Since you mention 64-bit Vista and VPN, I have been having problems with this combination. I was earlier using 32-bit Vista on my laptop and had installed VPN to connect to my client network. No problems there. After I upgraded to 64-bit Vista, I've been having a lot of problems with VPN connectivity. So now, I'm using another box for the VPN software. It's probably something to do with me, but I couldn't fix it so far. So you can either do this or reinstall the computer with a 32 bit OS if your employer has a license for it. Otherwise 64-bit systems are great. You will not be able to run 16-bit programs though.
«_Superman_»
My work wont even allow a 64-bit VPN install/connection so I dont get the benefit of experiencing strange connection issues. I am torn here, if I decide to go with a 64-bit desktop then I will have to do all of my login from home work on the laptop. I guess I can then get a docking station and that would alleviate most of those issues :).
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
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It really depeneds on what you want, on my home pc I like to develop\ play games and do almost everthing, When I upgraded my PC I thought "Hey, why dont I just use 64bit XP", the first few weeks were good, but then I found that some of those little apps you have just dont want to work, ok, well lets see if there is a 64bit version, on dear there is not. I then came to install itunes, itunes would not install on 64bit XP. I just came to furstrated and ended up putting on 32bit XP, problems solved, and virtual pc installed. Maybe vista is different, but to be honest I would not touch vista with a 10FT pole, to many bad exp.
Yeah Vista can suck, I havent used it enough to find all of the bad parts. I use it on my laptop and so far havent had too many issues other than it running like it's on speed every once in a while which requires a shutdown and walk away method of fixing it. If I can go ahead and get a computer compatible with Vista I hope that it will then be compatible with Windows 7.
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
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Been running nothing but 64-bit on my desktop since Vista came out and while I initially had issues with drivers they've all been ironed out (while Vista was in beta). Recently just added another 4GB of RAM to it (to bring it to 6GB) and it absolutely flies along. Regarding program compatability here's a varied list of what runs quite happily: o All versions of GTA from I to IV o Crysis (actually uses all 6GB of RAM :omg: now that it's available) o Test Drive Unlimited o C&C3 o Project64 (N64 emulator) o Unreal3 o Unreal GOTY Edition o Office 2007 o Visual Studio 2008 o VMWare o Expression Suite o Adobe Fireworks, Photoshop, Acrobat o Mathematica o Xilix ISE o AutoCAD 2009 Seriously if the hardware has no issues then you shouldn't have a problem in that respect. Considering how well VMs run on mine have you contemplated installing say XP inside a VM for work and then installing the VPN stuff inside that? It does work (do it for Uni work).
I doubt it. If it isn't intuitive then we need to fix it. - Chris Maunder
Ed.Poore wrote:
Seriously if the hardware has no issues then you shouldn't have a problem in that respect. Considering how well VMs run on mine have you contemplated installing say XP inside a VM for work and then installing the VPN stuff inside that? It does work (do it for Uni work).
Well now that you actually make that suggestions, I didnt gather this from the earlier posts, then that is a true solution. Does VM cost money or just the version of XP that I install?
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
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CleaKO wrote:
Well I know for a fact that my employer will not allow 64-bit VPN software to be installed on a 64-bit system
I don't understand that statement at all. In any case, if you want what you want, and nobody provides it, build your own machine. It'll be a better machine than anything you could buy that's pre-made, more readily upgradable, and most likely half the cost.
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001I know that there is money to be saved by building my own but I dont actually have the cash :), and I dont want to deal with the hassle of learning which parts play well together. I guess there is probably a book or blog out there that explains what to do but my friends that have done this are really into it and are willing to get the part figure out it doesnt work and send it back and so on. I may need to break down and do this though because I do get sick of the way Best Buy sales people (who claim to non-commission) treat the customers. They are so full of themselves.
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
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I noticed that 64-bit Video Card drivers sometimes get a delayed released compared to 32-bit ones. So if gaming is your deal, I wouldn't recommend it as you might not benefit from the most current video drivers. Aside from that, I haven't seen any issues with my XP 64-bit, Also didn't notice any real performance improvement.
I run Vista Ultimate 64 on my office computer. I also have the beta of Windows 7 installed as a dual boot with the Vista drive. I have Virtual PC 64 installed with a host of operating systems including XP Pro, Win 2000 and 98. I have Visual Studios 2008 installed in Vista 64 and VS 6 installed in XP (VPC 64). All is good! My son has a brand new HP Vista Home Premium 64 system and has has compatibility issues with some of his games. I solved his problem by adding a second drive and installing the 32 bit Vista and he can boot into it when he wants to play the few games that wont function correctly on 64bit Vista. The only real draw back to this is that he loses half his system memory in 32 bit mode (8 gigs in 64bit).
Big Brother is watching!
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I run Vista Ultimate 64 on my office computer. I also have the beta of Windows 7 installed as a dual boot with the Vista drive. I have Virtual PC 64 installed with a host of operating systems including XP Pro, Win 2000 and 98. I have Visual Studios 2008 installed in Vista 64 and VS 6 installed in XP (VPC 64). All is good! My son has a brand new HP Vista Home Premium 64 system and has has compatibility issues with some of his games. I solved his problem by adding a second drive and installing the 32 bit Vista and he can boot into it when he wants to play the few games that wont function correctly on 64bit Vista. The only real draw back to this is that he loses half his system memory in 32 bit mode (8 gigs in 64bit).
Big Brother is watching!
Yes, compatibilty with games is a big drawback that I noticed in my XP 64. And yes, loosing 4 gigs of RAM sucks, good thing he's got another 4! My system got only 2gigs so it wouldn't bother me having only for 4gigs :wtf:
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I just had a crappy experience at Best Buy. I choose to just buy a computer out of the box rather than mess with building one. I went to the store to see what was available for a new desktop and I could not find any 32-bit Vista machines by HP. I asked one of the sales people about it and he proceeded to let me know that I was silly for wanting 32-bit (he apparently has 2 64-bit systems at home) and that there are no compatibility issues to worry about and that they are awesome. Well I know for a fact that my employer will not allow 64-bit VPN software to be installed on a 64-bit system so that is a good reason not to go there. Will you please let me know what you think of the 2 systems and other than the obvious potential benefits over time is it work buying a 64-bit system now, today?
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
I can't find 64-bit drivers for my printer (an older HP Deskjet), but other than that I haven't had many complaints. Although honestly, I run virtual machines on the Vista 64-bit host and tend to do all my work in the VMs.
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Ed.Poore wrote:
Seriously if the hardware has no issues then you shouldn't have a problem in that respect. Considering how well VMs run on mine have you contemplated installing say XP inside a VM for work and then installing the VPN stuff inside that? It does work (do it for Uni work).
Well now that you actually make that suggestions, I didnt gather this from the earlier posts, then that is a true solution. Does VM cost money or just the version of XP that I install?
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
CleaKO wrote:
Does VM cost money
Depends on what host you go for. Virtual PC doesn't VM does. I've only got experience with VMWare but it's just released a feature called Unity where the VM windows appear on your main desktop (with a small icon to show they're virtualised.
CleaKO wrote:
version of XP that I install?
Legally you're meant to have a license for whatever OS you install inside it. You'd also get all the perks of VM development (just based on CG's experience back up stuff), such as snapshots etc.
I doubt it. If it isn't intuitive then we need to fix it. - Chris Maunder
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Yes, compatibilty with games is a big drawback that I noticed in my XP 64. And yes, loosing 4 gigs of RAM sucks, good thing he's got another 4! My system got only 2gigs so it wouldn't bother me having only for 4gigs :wtf:
Yes, 8 gigs is cool. His system is a dual core Q6600 with the ATI 3650 512 meg video card. 650 gig HD and 21 inch HP monitor. My work computer is a custom built system with quad core Q9450 and 4 gigs of system memory and nVidia GF 9800 GTX+ 512 meg. I have solved all my compatibility issues with Virtual PC. Since I have to test all my software on everything from 2000 to Vista 64, VP is a god send to me. Before Virtual machines, I had to maintain separate systems to test my software on. :)
Big Brother is watching!
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Yes, 8 gigs is cool. His system is a dual core Q6600 with the ATI 3650 512 meg video card. 650 gig HD and 21 inch HP monitor. My work computer is a custom built system with quad core Q9450 and 4 gigs of system memory and nVidia GF 9800 GTX+ 512 meg. I have solved all my compatibility issues with Virtual PC. Since I have to test all my software on everything from 2000 to Vista 64, VP is a god send to me. Before Virtual machines, I had to maintain separate systems to test my software on. :)
Big Brother is watching!
Thanks for the tip, I should definitely try it. I don't know why I haven't done it yet.
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I can't find 64-bit drivers for my printer (an older HP Deskjet), but other than that I haven't had many complaints. Although honestly, I run virtual machines on the Vista 64-bit host and tend to do all my work in the VMs.
Drivers can be an issue for older hardware. I have found that VMs are good for most all of my needs. But for gaming, it is all but worthless since it has only basic support of DirectX and limited video hardware. :sigh: It would be great if Microsoft would give direct support of the native video card in VPC. Then we could run most all apps including games in the VPC. ;)
Big Brother is watching!
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I just had a crappy experience at Best Buy. I choose to just buy a computer out of the box rather than mess with building one. I went to the store to see what was available for a new desktop and I could not find any 32-bit Vista machines by HP. I asked one of the sales people about it and he proceeded to let me know that I was silly for wanting 32-bit (he apparently has 2 64-bit systems at home) and that there are no compatibility issues to worry about and that they are awesome. Well I know for a fact that my employer will not allow 64-bit VPN software to be installed on a 64-bit system so that is a good reason not to go there. Will you please let me know what you think of the 2 systems and other than the obvious potential benefits over time is it work buying a 64-bit system now, today?
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
Don't know about Vista, but XP64 did not give me any benefit. My tests on video processing on 32 vs 64 XP with vdub on dual code AMD made no difference. 64 bit apps are virtually do not exist. Unless something changed dramatically in last three years since I left ATI (other than company's name) video driver for 64 bit OS is _much_ worse than 32 bit one. Back in the days of 64 _server_ introduction, maintaining yet another major flavour of driver was clearly too much for the company (no blame assigned here, just too much that's it). What's left is ability to work with more than 4G of RAM. :doh:
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Do you play games and do all of the standard home user things like use Office, Quicken, photo editing etc.?
CleaKO
"Now, a man would have opened both gates, driven through and not bothered to close either gate." - Marc Clifton (The Lounge)
Same here! I have used the 64 bit version since the beta of Vista and do not have any serious problems. My old scanner will not work, but hey, the installation disk will not install on anything about Windows 98 so no biggy ;) As for compatibility, there is one game my wife played that would not install on it (cheesy game, one of those $5 jobs) and an install of Quicken when Vista first came out was an issue but had a workaround. Not problem now though. I also used VPN to do work for a company and had not issues there either. Vista 64 has been rock solid for quite some time and 64 bit is where everything is moving even if rather slowly.
Rocky <>< Recent Blog Post: Doughboy – R.I.P. Thinking about Silverlight? www.SilverlightCity.com
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CleaKO wrote:
Does VM cost money
Depends on what host you go for. Virtual PC doesn't VM does. I've only got experience with VMWare but it's just released a feature called Unity where the VM windows appear on your main desktop (with a small icon to show they're virtualised.
CleaKO wrote:
version of XP that I install?
Legally you're meant to have a license for whatever OS you install inside it. You'd also get all the perks of VM development (just based on CG's experience back up stuff), such as snapshots etc.
I doubt it. If it isn't intuitive then we need to fix it. - Chris Maunder
I've been doing this for a couple of months now and it works great. I have 32-bit XP installed in a VM. My dev tools and VPN software run fine. I'm using VirtualBox because it's free and the performance has been better for me than VMWare. My machine has 4GB of RAM and a 256 MB video card and I have no problems running the VM.