GM or Chrysler or Ford
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I own three vehicles: 2004 Cadillac CTS, 1998 Dodge Ram 3500 cargo van, 1994 Buick Roadmaster. Now that the government and the union will own both GM and Chrysler, it is a forgone conclusion (mine) that the vehicles of the future from these two organizations will be superior automobiles. The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks. They must be doing something right. I look forward to purchasing my next American car.
Ed Gadziemski wrote:
The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best most expensive fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks.
FTFY So, is your business a Union shop?
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I own three vehicles: 2004 Cadillac CTS, 1998 Dodge Ram 3500 cargo van, 1994 Buick Roadmaster. Now that the government and the union will own both GM and Chrysler, it is a forgone conclusion (mine) that the vehicles of the future from these two organizations will be superior automobiles. The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks. They must be doing something right. I look forward to purchasing my next American car.
Ed Gadziemski wrote:
The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks. They must be doing something right. I look forward to purchasing my next American car.
An interesting supposition. Of course the cynic in me remembers how long it has taken the Osprey to stop killing it's pilots and passengers. The Manufacturing Process Engineer in me wonders if you are comparing apples to apples here. The military platforms you mention certainly are not mass produced in the same scale as consumer automobiles nor do they have the burn in time/shakedown on the market the way military platforms do. Also these weapons platforms aren't expected to be issue free from day one the way a consumer car needs to be. My father in law is a retired Air force fighter crew chief / mechanic and he has told me many stories about when the F15 and F16 where rolled out. It wasn't unusual for 20% - 50% of the fighters on base to be down with mechanical issues during the first 1 to 2 years of their roll out. Now days, they are bragging that only 15% of the Raptor fleet is grounded due to mechanical and design issues.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --Ralph Charell
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Ed Gadziemski wrote:
The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best most expensive fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks.
FTFY So, is your business a Union shop?
Arizona where I think Ed has said he now lives is a right to work state.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --Ralph Charell
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I own three vehicles: 2004 Cadillac CTS, 1998 Dodge Ram 3500 cargo van, 1994 Buick Roadmaster. Now that the government and the union will own both GM and Chrysler, it is a forgone conclusion (mine) that the vehicles of the future from these two organizations will be superior automobiles. The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks. They must be doing something right. I look forward to purchasing my next American car.
please give me the name and cell number for your dealer.
Mike - typical white guy. The USA does have universal healthcare, but you have to pay for it. D'oh. Thomas Mann - "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." The NYT - my leftist brochure. Calling an illegal alien an “undocumented immigrant” is like calling a drug dealer an “unlicensed pharmacist”. God doesn't believe in atheists, therefore they don't exist.
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I own three vehicles: 2004 Cadillac CTS, 1998 Dodge Ram 3500 cargo van, 1994 Buick Roadmaster. Now that the government and the union will own both GM and Chrysler, it is a forgone conclusion (mine) that the vehicles of the future from these two organizations will be superior automobiles. The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks. They must be doing something right. I look forward to purchasing my next American car.
Ed Gadziemski wrote:
I look forward
That's definitely the right direction, Ed. Otherwise, you'll trip yourself. We used to build the best fighter jets, but Obama cancelled the contract a couple of weeks ago. No more F-22s. We used to build the best tanks in the world, but the Pentagon has recently recommended sticking with the aging Abrams rather that moving ahead on the M1202 Mounted Combat System. The Abrams is already outclassed by the German Leopard and the British Challenger II. Hard to tell with Submarines, but the Russian Oscar is 30 meters longer than the Ohio class; I'd be willing to bet that the additional space is devoted to more weapons, not nicer crew quarters. Best ship is pretty much a non-question. We've got a lot more carriers and a great deal more missle-carryin destroyers and cruisers, and all other things being equal, more outweighs better.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Both democrats and republicans are playing for the same team and it's not us. - Chris Austin
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Ed Gadziemski wrote:
I look forward
That's definitely the right direction, Ed. Otherwise, you'll trip yourself. We used to build the best fighter jets, but Obama cancelled the contract a couple of weeks ago. No more F-22s. We used to build the best tanks in the world, but the Pentagon has recently recommended sticking with the aging Abrams rather that moving ahead on the M1202 Mounted Combat System. The Abrams is already outclassed by the German Leopard and the British Challenger II. Hard to tell with Submarines, but the Russian Oscar is 30 meters longer than the Ohio class; I'd be willing to bet that the additional space is devoted to more weapons, not nicer crew quarters. Best ship is pretty much a non-question. We've got a lot more carriers and a great deal more missle-carryin destroyers and cruisers, and all other things being equal, more outweighs better.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Both democrats and republicans are playing for the same team and it's not us. - Chris Austin
Oakman wrote:
We've got a lot more carriers
We need to figure out how to defend them from ballistic missiles. I have to applaud China for their innovation there. Rather than playing catchup with expensive carriers and their support operations they took proven ballistic missile technology and adapted it to the problem of well defended carrier groups. Not that this gives them the ability to project force but it does give them one hell of a advantage in "their" waters.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --Ralph Charell
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I own three vehicles: 2004 Cadillac CTS, 1998 Dodge Ram 3500 cargo van, 1994 Buick Roadmaster. Now that the government and the union will own both GM and Chrysler, it is a forgone conclusion (mine) that the vehicles of the future from these two organizations will be superior automobiles. The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks. They must be doing something right. I look forward to purchasing my next American car.
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Oakman wrote:
We've got a lot more carriers
We need to figure out how to defend them from ballistic missiles. I have to applaud China for their innovation there. Rather than playing catchup with expensive carriers and their support operations they took proven ballistic missile technology and adapted it to the problem of well defended carrier groups. Not that this gives them the ability to project force but it does give them one hell of a advantage in "their" waters.
Sovereign ingredient for a happy marriage: Pay cash or do without. Interest charges not only eat up a household budget; awareness of debt eats up domestic felicity. --Lazarus Long Avoid the crowd. Do your own thinking independently. Be the chess player, not the chess piece. --Ralph Charell
Chris Austin wrote:
We need to figure out how to defend them from ballistic missiles
Easy: turn them into submarines. ;) I suspect our abms will continue to get more sophisticated and hopefully cheaper, because we need some kind of a shield - either thousands of abms or a forcefield. Either that or missile cruisers become the queen of the seas.
Jon Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface Both democrats and republicans are playing for the same team and it's not us. - Chris Austin
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Sounds like nothing more than a complex way of increasing taxation on gasoline.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
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Sounds like nothing more than a complex way of increasing taxation on gasoline.
Chaining ourselves to the moral high ground does not make us good guys. Aside from making us easy targets, it merely makes us idiotic prisoners of our own self loathing.
Stan Shannon wrote:
Sounds like nothing more than a complex way of increasing taxation on gasoline.
Its to make up for lost revenue of the gas tax. The most important fact about it is that it can be used to track your movements. Also its a stupid tax that no one should ever pay.
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Ed Gadziemski wrote:
The government specs and builds, with union help, the world's best most expensive fighter jets, submarines, ships and tanks.
FTFY So, is your business a Union shop?
Rob Graham wrote:
is your business a Union shop?
Naw, Arizona is "right to work". I don't like unions. I grew up in Michigan and while my family belonged to unions, I never did and never wanted to.
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Stan Shannon wrote:
Sounds like nothing more than a complex way of increasing taxation on gasoline.
Its to make up for lost revenue of the gas tax. The most important fact about it is that it can be used to track your movements. Also its a stupid tax that no one should ever pay.
How is that really any different from a gas tax? The more miles I drive, the more gas I use and it is certainly easy for my movement to be tracked without any device on my vehicle at all.
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How is that really any different from a gas tax? The more miles I drive, the more gas I use and it is certainly easy for my movement to be tracked without any device on my vehicle at all.
Stan Shannon wrote:
The more miles I drive, the more gas I use
But you just bought a more efficient car and the government can't trust you to increase your miles per week to offset their expected revenue loss - or, heaven forbid, you might buy a diesel that runs on used cooking oil and not pay them anything! :omg: The idea gained currency when gas prices dove for the bottom. All the states that had pre-spent all their windfall taxes from $4.00 @ gallan gas, suddenly needed to replace what they saw as "lost" revenue.
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Stan Shannon wrote:
The more miles I drive, the more gas I use
But you just bought a more efficient car and the government can't trust you to increase your miles per week to offset their expected revenue loss - or, heaven forbid, you might buy a diesel that runs on used cooking oil and not pay them anything! :omg: The idea gained currency when gas prices dove for the bottom. All the states that had pre-spent all their windfall taxes from $4.00 @ gallan gas, suddenly needed to replace what they saw as "lost" revenue.
Still, what difference should it make to me if I'm paying the tax when I buy gas or turning it over at some kind of toll booth? Either way, I can reduce the amount I pay by driving less.
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How is that really any different from a gas tax? The more miles I drive, the more gas I use and it is certainly easy for my movement to be tracked without any device on my vehicle at all.
Stan Shannon wrote:
it is certainly easy for my movement to be tracked without any device on my vehicle at all.
and how is that done? I've studiously avoided: OnStar (or its equivalent) as well as vehicles with a built in "black box". so ... ?
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Still, what difference should it make to me if I'm paying the tax when I buy gas or turning it over at some kind of toll booth? Either way, I can reduce the amount I pay by driving less.
Stan Shannon wrote:
Either way, I can reduce the amount I pay by driving less.
Your gas tax is a function of the price you pay for gas. Both the pretax price of the gas and the efficiency of your engine come into play as well as how far you drive. You certainly don't expect the average state bureacrat to handle three variables at once, do you?
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Stan Shannon wrote:
it is certainly easy for my movement to be tracked without any device on my vehicle at all.
and how is that done? I've studiously avoided: OnStar (or its equivalent) as well as vehicles with a built in "black box". so ... ?
Even assuming I pay in cash so that my credit card numbers can't be tracked, they could still put camaras in the service stations that don't already have them which could easily identify and track vehicles.
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Rob Graham wrote:
is your business a Union shop?
Naw, Arizona is "right to work". I don't like unions. I grew up in Michigan and while my family belonged to unions, I never did and never wanted to.
Ed Gadziemski wrote:
Naw, Arizona is "right to work".
I am amused by that phrase every time I hear it, since it has nothing to do with what it purports... (being really the right to hire and fire at will). I guess I missed the sarcasm in the original post... :-\
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Even assuming I pay in cash so that my credit card numbers can't be tracked, they could still put camaras in the service stations that don't already have them which could easily identify and track vehicles.
Stan Shannon wrote:
they could still put camaras in the service stations that don't already have them which could easily identify and track vehicles.
certainly. but with an embedded GPS they could stream to a db and literally track you real time. not something I'm willing to support, the ramifications are chilling.
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Stan Shannon wrote:
Either way, I can reduce the amount I pay by driving less.
Your gas tax is a function of the price you pay for gas. Both the pretax price of the gas and the efficiency of your engine come into play as well as how far you drive. You certainly don't expect the average state bureacrat to handle three variables at once, do you?
I suppose. Still, I still don't see this as any thing other than an unnecessarily complex consumption tax. Hell, wouldn't increasing taxes on tires be the same thing? The more miles you drive, the more you wear out your tires.