What are your thoughts on VS 2005, 2008 and the coming VS 2010? What's good, bad? Discuss.
-
We've not finished exploring vs 2008 and they are talking abt 2010. I beleive its just a remodelling/repackaging of what we already have in 08. ________________________________________________________________________________________ Cheap Affordable Web Hosting & Design | Best PHP Linux Hosting | ASP.NET Windows Hosting
mbaocha wrote:
I beleive its just a remodelling/repackaging of what we already have in 08.
I find that very interesting. Could you elaborate on that a little bit? - Phil
-
What got fixed, what should have been fixed? What's great and what's a disaster? What's your favorite version of VS? Honestly curious to know -- will be visiting MSFT last week and would like to take along some feedback. Witticisms welcomed but thoughtful answers are more helpful. thanks jeff
It's a pain how in VS 2005 irrelevant windows (such as properties) sometimes shoot out of auto-hide mode at random times, and you have to wait for them to go away.
-
John M. Drescher wrote:
Intellisense is a nightmare on large solutions. I mean ones with 20 + projects and 500K lines
Yeah, I've got nothing that big - 18 projects and 100kloc is as big as I've got.
John M. Drescher wrote:
I wish I could completely remove it and use visualasssist
That I can agree with....
Java, Basic, who cares - it's all a bunch of tree-hugging hippy cr*p
Our solution has 38 projects mixed between C# and VB, no speed problem with Intellisense. VS2005. -CB
-
I skipped VS2005 completely and went from VS2003 to VS2008. I like 2008 better but it is dog slow to load.
That about sums up my experience. Except for more instability in 2008.
Henry Minute Do not read medical books! You could die of a misprint. - Mark Twain Girl: (staring) "Why do you need an icy cucumber?" “I want to report a fraud. The government is lying to us all.”
-
Microsoft has utterly deprecated C++ development since Visual Studio 2003, and the only positive thing of note in that version was improved language standard compliance. The C++ developer 'experience' has steadily gone downhill since VC6. Every version of Visual Studio since VC6 has advertised better C++ developer support, but it's always turned out to be a wretched lie, the cretins.
Software Zen:
delete this;
Fold With Us![^]Yes, they have definitely forgotten about C++ development. I think it was 2008 that was supposed to have been an answer to C++ concerns, but that version stinks, too: Nearly usless help, intermittent intellisense, no new support for C++/CLI, embarrassing "Class Wizard" dialog, etc. They definitely must have had a change in the Visual Studio team (maybe they outsourced it) because the quality has really suffered lately. Even C# stuff: The project properties dialog is laughable (I could draw it by hand faster) and why can't I redirect object file output? The dumbest thing they did, though, was not follow up with C++/CLI support. They finally had something that could let people ease into .Net and simplify their work by sticking with one language and they all but abandoned it. Try creating any new web service with C++. Or, if you have one, try debugging it - you can't because Visual Studio won't let you. My theory for what went wrong is that Microsoft decided to put Visual Studio under the control of whoever it was who thought it was a good idea (way back when) for Visual Basic to have no main client window. I think the price of getting him to finally make it work like a resonable editor was to give him control of the newer versions.
-
Douglas Troy wrote:
facial recognition and rental scan
I've never heard of that one! :omg: But I really feel with your post. It is essentially, less the details that I didn't know about, how I feel and I have become completely fed up with MS and their speed crap shoveling.
If the post was helpful, please vote! Current activities: Book: Foundation's Edge by Isaac Asimov Project: Hospital Automation, final stage Learning: Image analysis, LINQ Now and forever, defiant to the end. What is Multiple Sclerosis[^]?
Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
facial recognition and rental scan
hahaha ... it was late, I was tired and the dementia had firmly set in ... :-D
:..::. Douglas H. Troy ::..
Bad Astronomy |VCF|wxWidgets|WTL -
Wow. A minute? My web applications are not quite that big but that is just insane. I am using Vista Business with a 3.0Gzh dual core with 3 gigs of ram and pressing F5 does not take long at all. Do you use IIS for you project or the temporary web server thingy? I often have 3 or 4 instances of Visual Studio open and I can debug with no issues. Maybe you have some large fragmented files in your project or something.
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
Actually, given the size of stuff some folks here work on, I don't even consider these to be very big projects. Of course, everyone's heard me whining about this issue for a while now, and many have insinuated that I must have an inferior box / bad configuration / bad karma / whatever. In fact, the 2005 and 2008 projects are extremely similar in nature, so this is the perfect apples to apples comparison. I'm using both exactly the same way. 2005 works normally. 2008 is almost unusably slow. And yeah. A minute is just insane.
Christopher Duncan Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes www.PracticalUSA.com
-
What got fixed, what should have been fixed? What's great and what's a disaster? What's your favorite version of VS? Honestly curious to know -- will be visiting MSFT last week and would like to take along some feedback. Witticisms welcomed but thoughtful answers are more helpful. thanks jeff
Thanks, everyone. These are very helpful. I'm taking these to Redmond next week. If you think of any more, please don't hesitate to add! jeff
-
Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
facial recognition and rental scan
hahaha ... it was late, I was tired and the dementia had firmly set in ... :-D
:..::. Douglas H. Troy ::..
Bad Astronomy |VCF|wxWidgets|WTLI understand, it was all in good fun :) I was going to make a crack about how you must be working on the cutting edge of security, but I thought that that might be a bit overboard.
If the post was helpful, please vote! Current activities: Book: Foundation's Edge by Isaac Asimov Project: Hospital Automation, final stage Learning: Image analysis, LINQ Now and forever, defiant to the end. What is Multiple Sclerosis[^]?
-
What got fixed, what should have been fixed? What's great and what's a disaster? What's your favorite version of VS? Honestly curious to know -- will be visiting MSFT last week and would like to take along some feedback. Witticisms welcomed but thoughtful answers are more helpful. thanks jeff
Missing features in VS2010: * Team Foundation is not very good at replacing source code across multiple sights. * Team Foundation should allow back-end to be other source control systems such as ClearCase * Visual Studio Static Code Analysis should support data flow analysis similar to Klocwork's Insight product. * Visual Studio Static Code Analysis for C++ should support the creation of custom tools. * Visual Studio should have built in support for source-code review, similar to Code Collaborator
-
Thanks, everyone. These are very helpful. I'm taking these to Redmond next week. If you think of any more, please don't hesitate to add! jeff
And how much good do you think that's gonna do? All VS has been since 2000 is a way for them to spew "new technologies" at everyone that a) doesn't benefit the user, and b) they have no intention of supporting 100% with their dev tools. Yeah, I'm cynical...
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
-----
"...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 -
I understand, it was all in good fun :) I was going to make a crack about how you must be working on the cutting edge of security, but I thought that that might be a bit overboard.
If the post was helpful, please vote! Current activities: Book: Foundation's Edge by Isaac Asimov Project: Hospital Automation, final stage Learning: Image analysis, LINQ Now and forever, defiant to the end. What is Multiple Sclerosis[^]?
Mustafa Ismail Mustafa wrote:
I was going to make a crack about how you must be working on the cutting edge of security, but I thought that that might be a bit overboard.
hahahaha ... that actually would have been good last night, at the time, I was look over WCF security stuffs ... Rental Scans: verifies the UHaul you're driving doesn't contain more the the alloted explosives.
:..::. Douglas H. Troy ::..
Bad Astronomy |VCF|wxWidgets|WTL -
Missing features in VS2010: * Team Foundation is not very good at replacing source code across multiple sights. * Team Foundation should allow back-end to be other source control systems such as ClearCase * Visual Studio Static Code Analysis should support data flow analysis similar to Klocwork's Insight product. * Visual Studio Static Code Analysis for C++ should support the creation of custom tools. * Visual Studio should have built in support for source-code review, similar to Code Collaborator
Related to your second bullet. Make it easy to use different source control systems in different solutions instead of making it a global setting.
It is a truth universally acknowledged that a zombie in possession of brains must be in want of more brains. -- Pride and Prejudice and Zombies
-
Actually, given the size of stuff some folks here work on, I don't even consider these to be very big projects. Of course, everyone's heard me whining about this issue for a while now, and many have insinuated that I must have an inferior box / bad configuration / bad karma / whatever. In fact, the 2005 and 2008 projects are extremely similar in nature, so this is the perfect apples to apples comparison. I'm using both exactly the same way. 2005 works normally. 2008 is almost unusably slow. And yeah. A minute is just insane.
Christopher Duncan Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes www.PracticalUSA.com
Something has to be causing it to take so long... I don't think it behaves that way normally.
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
-
Something has to be causing it to take so long... I don't think it behaves that way normally.
I didn't get any requirements for the signature
Well, that's the consensus, but I've not treated it any differently than 2005 from the point of installation onward. Of course, I wouldn't mind spending weeks debugging the problem if MS would agree to my hourly rate. :)
Christopher Duncan Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes www.PracticalUSA.com
-
I'm still frustrated that clicking on properties for a project in the class view still randomly pulls up a dialog that states "there are no property pages for this section". Apparently at my clicking speed this happens 1 out of 4 times I do this and since I am in a debugging stage this happens several times a day. BTW, since 10 months ago I am using VS2005 every single day on C++ projects (no CLR) instead of 2003 which I used before that..
John
-
I don't know about C++ but in general there are too many inconsistencies in behaviour between C# and VB, especially in the editor. C# integration is much smoother.
Kevin
Certainly, according to what i've heard about that it seems that msft guys are trying to dumb down VB's editor in comparison with that of C#, perhaps, to further force us developers to prefer one lang. over the other. :(
-
What got fixed, what should have been fixed? What's great and what's a disaster? What's your favorite version of VS? Honestly curious to know -- will be visiting MSFT last week and would like to take along some feedback. Witticisms welcomed but thoughtful answers are more helpful. thanks jeff
VS2008 SP1 C++. Whats bad: 1- Hit a breakpoint, change some code, introduce a typo, re-compile. Output window says there is an error but no indication of what or where. Click edit to fix the error, error list is empty. I have to stop debugging and re-compile to see the error in the output window. 2- Try to add a breakpoint, IDE indicates the edit code is different to the compiled code, even though a re-build all took place. Have to context select 'location' and 'allow code to differ' 3- Multithreaded debugging -known issue with multiple patches, none of which work. see MSDN-Visual Studio 2008 SP1 Stepping and Breakpoint Issues Whats Good: better experience than VS2003 and VS2005 after moving from VS6. I continued using VS6 after trying VS2003 and VS2005. Steve
-
What got fixed, what should have been fixed? What's great and what's a disaster? What's your favorite version of VS? Honestly curious to know -- will be visiting MSFT last week and would like to take along some feedback. Witticisms welcomed but thoughtful answers are more helpful. thanks jeff
I've developed C++ in VS 2005 SP1 and now using VS 2008 SP1 .I can say that Visual Studio 2005 was clumsy and slow , VS 2008 is way too much worse than Vs 2005. In every new version nothing but bugs and instabilities injected into Visual Studio. And C++ developers use VS because it's the currently the best one in C++ development( 3rd party tool like Visual AssistX,Incredibuild, debugging and etc..).But this doesn't mean Visual Studio gives C++ developers an IDE that satisfies current development necessities of a project. I'm watching Eclipse CDT and with a new version i see better integration and further progress in IDE. So if it continues like that i can say that future of C++ development seems like CDT. Microsoft has only one chance to change this and it's VS 2010.In VS C++ blogs, they promise VS 2010 will be good. We'll wait and see what's going to happen
[AGP]
-
What got fixed, what should have been fixed? What's great and what's a disaster? What's your favorite version of VS? Honestly curious to know -- will be visiting MSFT last week and would like to take along some feedback. Witticisms welcomed but thoughtful answers are more helpful. thanks jeff
I find that debugging in TFS unit testing after running starting the main program is problematic. I find that I either have to close VS2008 down and start over or bring up task manger and remove VsTestHost.exe then restart debugging my TFS unit test. I just need to remember that before debugging my unit tests, I cannot press F5, F10, or F11. What happens is that the test host starts up and the test goes to the pending state, but not to the inprogress state. I need to kill the test host application and re-run/debug the unit test.