UK Government To Install Surveillance Cameras In Private Homes (RF-Chippy) [modified]
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Where did the news article say anything about child abuse?
As Richard said, the story was written by someone with a tenuous grasp on the truth. Cameras will be installed in homes, if at all, because they are percieved as needed for child safety.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
How do we know that you don't abuse your children?
Well, because I have a job and pay taxes, I don't have any contact with welfare groups. Which means that the first line of defence is the schools. So long as the schools see well adjusted, confident kids who are obviously fed, clothed and not beaten, it will be assumed that I do not abuse them, but the truth is, you can't be certain.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
You have stated that child molestation is OK as long as it is mainstream and acceptable
No, you are an ignorant moron. On that front, someone actually stepped in to tell you that you were illiterate and obviously unable to understand what I was saying
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
, and you clearly believe that people should be sterilized at birth and have camera's in their homes to watch and listen to their every action.
Funny. This is the first time cameras have been discussed, and I did not say I wanted them. I've also never said people should be sterilized at birth . What you're doing to me is what you do to all news sources. Take what someone actually says, and twist it to fit your world view. That you do it to someone able to defend themselves here, only makes it more clear to others what a retard you are.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Perhaps you need one of those cameras.
To whatever degree it is true that this is happening in the UK, it wouldn't ever happen here, any more than it would in the US.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Where did the article say anything about stupid people?
I guess you have no grasp on reality. The people who are having kids, and failing to care for them, are overwhelmingly people on welfare who have kids so they can leave home and get their own welfare payment, instead of living off their mothers payments. You believe people are being chosen at random and having cameras installed in their homes ?
Christian Graus wrote:
To whatever degree it is true that this is happening in the UK, it wouldn't ever happen here, any more than it would in the US.
My recent sentiment includes this assertion. People in the UK are not less deserving of republican liberty than you in Australia, or those in the USA.
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Christian Graus wrote:
As Richard said, the story was written by someone with a tenuous grasp on the truth.
Well, he did not make it clear what was true and what wasn't. All he did was provide a little pamphlet full of broadly defined goals and double-think.
Christian Graus wrote:
Cameras will be installed in homes, if at all, because they are percieved as needed for child safety.
Did I say they wasn't? Everything is for the children right? They will get people to go along with anything if they say its for the children. What you will have though, is a bunch of pedophiles watching your children eat, sleep, run around, and they will watch the parents do whatever they do in their homes. Oh, and learn how to spell.
Christian Graus wrote:
Well, because I have a job and pay taxes
You sit at your computer all day, and as of now you have little work to do. Having a job and paying taxes has absolutely no significance in determining who abuses their children. Quite frankly I think you do abuse your children. I think you need checked by the authorities.
Christian Graus wrote:
This is the first time cameras have been discussed, and I did not say I wanted them.
You didn't say you wanted them, but your defending the UK government by stating why they say its necessary for them to install cameras in people's homes to monitor "bad behavior".
Christian Graus wrote:
Take what someone actually says, and twist it to fit your world view.
My world view is one where people shouldn't be stupid slaves to the government. You let the government dictate your world view.
Christian Graus wrote:
The people who are having kids, and failing to care for them, are overwhelmingly people on welfare who have kids so they can leave home and get their own welfare payment, instead of living off their mothers payments. You believe people are being chosen at random and having cameras installed in their homes ?
The UK is a socialist nation, everybody is on welfare in one form or another, and everyone is being made into a "bad person" through law. Its how they control them.
Christian Graus wrote:
In the real world, the pare
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
What you will have though, is a bunch of pedophiles watching your children eat, sleep, run around
Only after they achieve the age of 16, if they are capable of that.
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I've been looking for the proof they say doesn't exist. I won't tolerate them trying to discredit me and call me insane. At the most intensive level, families who require supervision and support on a 24 hour basis stay in a core residential unit. Upon satisfactory completion of a programme, the family can move into a managed property.[^]
Still you find no support in the journalists statement of [quote] The Children’s Secretary set out £400million plans to put 20,000 problem families under 24-hour CCTV super-vision in their own homes. They will be monitored to ensure that children attend school, go to bed on time and eat proper meals. [/quote] And no mentions whatsoever of this being done in "the home". IN FACT, you should read all the pages relevant here http://www.yjb.gov.uk/en-gb/yjs/SentencesOrdersandAgreements/IntensiveSupervisionAndSurveillanceProgramme/[^] then when you have done that, finding EXACTLY what is meant by "surveillance" then read this Management Guidance issued by the Youth Justice Board http://www.yjb.gov.uk/Publications/Resources/Downloads/ISSP%20Management%20Guidance%20Updated%200808.pdf[^]. Then you might be better informed than that political journalist.
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Christian Graus wrote:
'double-think' is what you call anything you're too dumb to understand.
Doublethink is the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them. To tell deliberate lies while genuinely believing in them, to forget any fact that has become inconvenient, and then, when it becomes necessary again, to draw it back from oblivion for just so long as it is needed, to deny the existence of objective reality and all the while to take account of the reality which one denies.
Christian Graus wrote:
The journalist is known to fabricate stuff, and no other source backs up her claims
Well, I can find 331 hits using Mr. Ball's quote. Quite frankly I am not going to waste my time searching through UK government documents just to prove a point. Its not my country and if they want to be spied on in their homes or out in the streets then let them do it. I think its disgusting though.
Christian Graus wrote:
I said if it's being done, it's for a reason. I was expecting the story to be an exaggeration, rather than a lie.
Well they already have millions of cameras all over cities and towns so it wouldn't surprise me one bit.
Christian Graus wrote:
I get it from being an adult who interacts with the world and knows how it works
You have little idea how it works. You refuse to learn how the international banking system works and how its used to gain political power. You don't even understand power. The Money Masters - How International Bankers Gained Control of America [^]
Christian Graus wrote:
This is just a pile of crap. Why would they want to do that ?
They are already setting it up. Just look at all the cameras in the UK. Its for power. Don't you understand that power is like a drug? They want more and more, they are a bunch of control freaks that cant get enough power.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Doublethink is the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them.
That makes me a SuperHero.
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Just establishing that you sit alone with your paranoia, with no human contact to temper it.
Christian Graus Driven to the arms of OSX by Vista. Read my blog to find out how I've worked around bugs in Microsoft tools and frameworks.
That is why solitary is so bad, compared to sharing a cell with Bubba. No reaffirmation. No consensus.
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Still you find no support in the journalists statement of [quote] The Children’s Secretary set out £400million plans to put 20,000 problem families under 24-hour CCTV super-vision in their own homes. They will be monitored to ensure that children attend school, go to bed on time and eat proper meals. [/quote] And no mentions whatsoever of this being done in "the home". IN FACT, you should read all the pages relevant here http://www.yjb.gov.uk/en-gb/yjs/SentencesOrdersandAgreements/IntensiveSupervisionAndSurveillanceProgramme/[^] then when you have done that, finding EXACTLY what is meant by "surveillance" then read this Management Guidance issued by the Youth Justice Board http://www.yjb.gov.uk/Publications/Resources/Downloads/ISSP%20Management%20Guidance%20Updated%200808.pdf[^]. Then you might be better informed than that political journalist.
Quite frankly no matter how you look at it, its disgusting. You can quibble about this and that, but its still fucked up. You people will tolerate anything as long as it is certified by the Home Office. :laugh:
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He's turning into Idíot. It's sad.
:~ Since when has this been news or concern to you?
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Yeah, I can see it now. Rather odd. If I can be bothered, I'll have a look. Having read some of this thread's comments, I'm not holding out much hope though - it seems fairly [rubbish|inaccurate|misleading]
Between the idea And the reality Between the motion And the act Falls the Shadow
Just because you're paranoid (and CSS) doesn't mean there isn't cause for concern.
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Still you find no support in the journalists statement of [quote] The Children’s Secretary set out £400million plans to put 20,000 problem families under 24-hour CCTV super-vision in their own homes. They will be monitored to ensure that children attend school, go to bed on time and eat proper meals. [/quote] And no mentions whatsoever of this being done in "the home". IN FACT, you should read all the pages relevant here http://www.yjb.gov.uk/en-gb/yjs/SentencesOrdersandAgreements/IntensiveSupervisionAndSurveillanceProgramme/[^] then when you have done that, finding EXACTLY what is meant by "surveillance" then read this Management Guidance issued by the Youth Justice Board http://www.yjb.gov.uk/Publications/Resources/Downloads/ISSP%20Management%20Guidance%20Updated%200808.pdf[^]. Then you might be better informed than that political journalist.
Richard A. Abbott wrote:
Still you find no support in the journalists statement of
You can't blame Josh for the journalist's breadth of reality.
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Alex hogarth wrote:
what would your answer be?
Well first off the UK government broadly defines anti-social behavior to include just about anything they dictate as inappropriate. Second, the authorities can come in and inspect the home of anyone who is ratted out, but this is normal for the UK. Even back in the 1700s King George III enforced the Stamp Act on the American colonies which required every piece of paper, pamphlet, poster, ANY PIECE OF PAPER REGARDLESS OF WHAT IT IS USED FOR, be stamped with the king's stamp. How did they enforce this? The king gave the right to authorities to write their own search warrants to inspect people's homes, which is what they are doing now but all they need is someone's word that a family is anti-social. If someone is truly abusive or neglecting his or her children, then they should go to jail for a while and the children can live with other family or a willing adopter family or a temporary intervention family.
Alex hogarth wrote:
or are you opposed to this as it would be difficult to give the kids porn
I never advocated giving kids porn. I said I was against state sex-ed because they do show inappropriate material to young kids. My little brother when he was 10 or 11 told me that the school was showing a video of a man ejaculating. I don't think that is necessary for such a young mind. I'd like you to quote me saying I advocate giving porn to kids. You can't because I didn't.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Second, the authorities can come in and inspect the home of anyone who is ratted out, but this is normal for the UK.
Crazy statement you make. NOBODY, repeat NOBODY can enter a private premises without 1. The owners permission 2. A Court Order 3. To prevent an on-going crime or 4. To prevent a disaster just a gas leak turning into a explosive situation.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
I'd like you to quote me saying I advocate giving porn to kids.
I wouldn't like to quote anything you spew. However, sex education of the right type delivered at the right time to the right people will help young people to better prepare themselves for the adult world they will be joining including all the unsavory aspects of unwanted pregnancies and sexually transmitted diseases.
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Richard A. Abbott wrote:
Still you find no support in the journalists statement of
You can't blame Josh for the journalist's breadth of reality.
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Just because you're paranoid (and CSS) doesn't mean there isn't cause for concern.
How on did you get paranoia from my post? I said that the momentary downtime of the link was odd, and that I might have a glance over it later. I also said that the rest of the comments indicated that the journalist was, among other things, misleading. Where did I seem paranoid, or are you against me too? ;)
Between the idea And the reality Between the motion And the act Falls the Shadow
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Alex hogarth wrote:
what would your answer be?
Well first off the UK government broadly defines anti-social behavior to include just about anything they dictate as inappropriate. Second, the authorities can come in and inspect the home of anyone who is ratted out, but this is normal for the UK. Even back in the 1700s King George III enforced the Stamp Act on the American colonies which required every piece of paper, pamphlet, poster, ANY PIECE OF PAPER REGARDLESS OF WHAT IT IS USED FOR, be stamped with the king's stamp. How did they enforce this? The king gave the right to authorities to write their own search warrants to inspect people's homes, which is what they are doing now but all they need is someone's word that a family is anti-social. If someone is truly abusive or neglecting his or her children, then they should go to jail for a while and the children can live with other family or a willing adopter family or a temporary intervention family.
Alex hogarth wrote:
or are you opposed to this as it would be difficult to give the kids porn
I never advocated giving kids porn. I said I was against state sex-ed because they do show inappropriate material to young kids. My little brother when he was 10 or 11 told me that the school was showing a video of a man ejaculating. I don't think that is necessary for such a young mind. I'd like you to quote me saying I advocate giving porn to kids. You can't because I didn't.
firstly you dont know what the Uk govenment classes as antisocial because you cannot do the research pure and simple, you take a rabbied columnist and take her words as gospel despite there not only being a lot of controdicting information available but posters her showing you where to look, you then say we are being brainwashed and cowtowed because we investigate the facts, when it is obviously you who is being conned, you take a single source as your "belief" despite the dubious orgins and your one track mind goes off on it merry way, this is a sure sign that you have been mind conrolleed by these people - a free man will instigate and understand and not just accept mindless drivel - in short YOU ARE THEN PEOPLE YOU CLAIM WE ARE BECOMING - a person who will accept anything that is fed you by a single source regardless of that source's motives re the stamp act The Act extended the British Stamp Act to America and taxed all newspapers, legal documents, licenses, dice, playing cards and official documents - not all bits of paper as you claim. this was introduced to pay for the ongoing was against the french, and america being a BRITISH colony (and a damn rich one) was expected to share its burden. the rights of kings were legion, if you were not born of nobel birth or rich or a member of parliment then you were a surf. it is of note that even after your little rebellion your citizens didnot have the right to refuse the entry of addmission to those in authority. and bear in mind the way you treated the NATIVE AMERICANS then i dont think you have a single argument as to how we Brits treated you. but you said give children porn clear as day you said it - I know it was conditionlised but as you have stated a hundred times to Christian Graus the fact that he conditionalised his view on comunism and child abuse didnot change your opinion that he supported both, so i applied the same logic to your statement ergo you support giving porn to children
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Doublethink is the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them.
That makes me a SuperHero.
Brady Kelly wrote:
That makes me a SuperHero.
Do you have a cape. :laugh:
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firstly you dont know what the Uk govenment classes as antisocial because you cannot do the research pure and simple, you take a rabbied columnist and take her words as gospel despite there not only being a lot of controdicting information available but posters her showing you where to look, you then say we are being brainwashed and cowtowed because we investigate the facts, when it is obviously you who is being conned, you take a single source as your "belief" despite the dubious orgins and your one track mind goes off on it merry way, this is a sure sign that you have been mind conrolleed by these people - a free man will instigate and understand and not just accept mindless drivel - in short YOU ARE THEN PEOPLE YOU CLAIM WE ARE BECOMING - a person who will accept anything that is fed you by a single source regardless of that source's motives re the stamp act The Act extended the British Stamp Act to America and taxed all newspapers, legal documents, licenses, dice, playing cards and official documents - not all bits of paper as you claim. this was introduced to pay for the ongoing was against the french, and america being a BRITISH colony (and a damn rich one) was expected to share its burden. the rights of kings were legion, if you were not born of nobel birth or rich or a member of parliment then you were a surf. it is of note that even after your little rebellion your citizens didnot have the right to refuse the entry of addmission to those in authority. and bear in mind the way you treated the NATIVE AMERICANS then i dont think you have a single argument as to how we Brits treated you. but you said give children porn clear as day you said it - I know it was conditionlised but as you have stated a hundred times to Christian Graus the fact that he conditionalised his view on comunism and child abuse didnot change your opinion that he supported both, so i applied the same logic to your statement ergo you support giving porn to children
:laugh: You are a stupid troll. Don't get your panties in a bunch before tea time. It wouldn't be proper, might even be anti-social behavior.
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CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
Second, the authorities can come in and inspect the home of anyone who is ratted out, but this is normal for the UK.
Crazy statement you make. NOBODY, repeat NOBODY can enter a private premises without 1. The owners permission 2. A Court Order 3. To prevent an on-going crime or 4. To prevent a disaster just a gas leak turning into a explosive situation.
CaptainSeeSharp wrote:
I'd like you to quote me saying I advocate giving porn to kids.
I wouldn't like to quote anything you spew. However, sex education of the right type delivered at the right time to the right people will help young people to better prepare themselves for the adult world they will be joining including all the unsavory aspects of unwanted pregnancies and sexually transmitted diseases.
Actually custom and excise can and always could enter without a warrant. but not social services which is the department involved here, and social seervices cannot obtain a warrant they need to approach the police to get it who then needs to put it before a judge.
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:laugh: You are a stupid troll. Don't get your panties in a bunch before tea time. It wouldn't be proper, might even be anti-social behavior.
go polish your gun it will relieve stress you seem to get upset when confronted by your own behaviour, I have applied the exact criteria to you as you applied to others and yet I am a troll? but surely that would mean that you are not only a troll but a self confessed one! I have a nice job, a loving wife, kids, house, car, bike and most of the toys I require, Iam reasonably well read, I have the ability to make my own mind up about the things I read, I rarely take any Internet source as being correct and will allways cross reference before making up my mind and most of all I dont think everyone is out to get me. What you seem to be looking for is some form of communism, or perhaps anachy and I wish you well because i would hate to live in either oh and i do hope that ypu bump into a like minded person (but hopefully he will have a bigger gun and you will cease to be a problem)
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OK, I type this again, after once being thwarted by the auth. Whatever the Cap'n's maladies, he has raised a valid point. The people of Britain stand a very, frightening risk of this kind of shit being pulled on them. Just ask Holland. This is not a figment, but a story', not imagined by the Cap'n, but actually constructed by deluded leftits the world around.
You are of course right to have concerns. There is a fine balancing act that needs constant monitoring to ensure the balance does not go too far one way or the other way. This is a problem that first past the post electoral democracies have to weigh. With a huge majority of one political party that forms the government could, and sometimes does, mean that unwelcome, unsavory, and often badly worded legislation can be forced through. With a hung or minority governing party, you are more likely to have consensus politics.
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Brady Kelly wrote:
That makes me a SuperHero.
Do you have a cape. :laugh:
Yes! :) Cape Town, in fact. :doh:
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Actually custom and excise can and always could enter without a warrant. but not social services which is the department involved here, and social seervices cannot obtain a warrant they need to approach the police to get it who then needs to put it before a judge.
Alex hogarth wrote:
Actually custom and excise can and always could enter without a warrant.
Nope, as far as I am aware, even they need to get a Court Order to enter, except to stop an on-going crime in which case the Constabulary will also be involved. (Police and Criminal Evidence Act is relevant). But that is besides the point. You are correct with regards to Social Services.
modified on Tuesday, August 4, 2009 9:36 AM