Average Speed Cameras
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Steve_Harris wrote:
In the UK the 10% leeway is in law
That's a myth - the 10% is discretionary, based on the ACPO prosecution criteria. From ACPO themselves: "The police service have published ACPO ‘bottom level’ thresholds below which prosecution should not be undertaken; this is 10%+2 mph at all speeds (except 20mph, where speed awareness will not be offered). Over time the police have agreed that the service will incrementally reduce enforcement levels toward the ACPO ‘bottom level’ thresholds, where the road conditions and other specific site conditions support enforcement."
"WPF has many lovers. It's a veritable porn star!" - Josh Smith
As Braveheart once said, "You can take our freedom but you'll never take our Hobnobs!" - Martin Hughes.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
That's a myth
You live and learn.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
except 20mph, where speed awareness will not be offered
Does that mean 21mph and you're nicked?
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
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A lot of people have gps which gives a much more accurate (and higher) reading than a car speedo and then use the margin of error that the police have to give on top of that. Also some people don't understand what average means, I've seen loads of people slamming on the anchors as they come up to the exit camera. That said I'd love to find a form of average that puts your speed under the limit but I guess plod wouldn't have found the idea of "Mean speed cameras" very appealing ;-) Quite a neat trick that I saw someone do was to fly down the outside lane and pull in just behind a transit when he was pulling up to the camera (obviously I wouldn't condone this behaviour, it's dangerous and illegal blah blah) Most of the average speed cameras are front facing so bikers clearly couldn't give a tinker's cuss about them
I have used the 'Overtaking a lorry at a speed camera' trick, and find it useful.
------------------------------------ "When Belly Full, Chin Hit Chest" Confucius 502BC
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There is also the case that the set speed of, say 50mph, means that the Prosecution Speed will be 58mph, ie Speed +10% +3mph. Then there is the case that speedometers are Conservative. Drive with a satnav at a speedo rating of 50mph and the satnav will show perhaps 47. So, drive through at 57 per the satnav and you do not get prosecuted. (UK anyways, how it is elsewhere I cannot comment).
------------------------------------ "When Belly Full, Chin Hit Chest" Confucius 502BC
10% + 2 in Somerset. I've had to attend the speeding workshop :doh:
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Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
That's a myth
You live and learn.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
except 20mph, where speed awareness will not be offered
Does that mean 21mph and you're nicked?
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
Steve_Harris wrote:
Does that mean 21mph and you're nicked?
Yup, because the line they take is that 20 MPH is what they call the school run limit, i.e. it's the limit outside schools.
"WPF has many lovers. It's a veritable porn star!" - Josh Smith
As Braveheart once said, "You can take our freedom but you'll never take our Hobnobs!" - Martin Hughes.
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This is a good one, the new EU-wide motorcycle test[^] includes elements at 32mph. As this is greater than the 30mph limit where most UK test centres are based, you would have to break the law while taking your test, which is an instant fail. :doh:
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
As I read that article, the "higher speed and braking manoeuvres" will be carried out on an off-road test track.
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Steve_Harris wrote:
Does that mean 21mph and you're nicked?
Yup, because the line they take is that 20 MPH is what they call the school run limit, i.e. it's the limit outside schools.
"WPF has many lovers. It's a veritable porn star!" - Josh Smith
As Braveheart once said, "You can take our freedom but you'll never take our Hobnobs!" - Martin Hughes.
Even outside term time? :) The schools I pass have such mountainous speed bumps that you're running the risk of severe damage if you do more that 20 anyway.
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
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As I read that article, the "higher speed and braking manoeuvres" will be carried out on an off-road test track.
Indeed, which the government is paying for out of our taxes. Specifying "50kph on the continent or 30mph in the UK" in the rules would have removed the need for these new test centres. Apparently proposed future changes to the motorcycle test will make the new test centres redundant again (if you believe Private Eye). :sigh:
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
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A lot of people have gps which gives a much more accurate (and higher) reading than a car speedo and then use the margin of error that the police have to give on top of that. Also some people don't understand what average means, I've seen loads of people slamming on the anchors as they come up to the exit camera. That said I'd love to find a form of average that puts your speed under the limit but I guess plod wouldn't have found the idea of "Mean speed cameras" very appealing ;-) Quite a neat trick that I saw someone do was to fly down the outside lane and pull in just behind a transit when he was pulling up to the camera (obviously I wouldn't condone this behaviour, it's dangerous and illegal blah blah) Most of the average speed cameras are front facing so bikers clearly couldn't give a tinker's cuss about them
GPS actually give a lower (more accurate) reading that speedos, which are designed to over-estimate.
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
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Hi people. Just been reading up on average speed cameras. What suprises me is the number of people I see fly past me on the motorway when we're in a area controlled by them when i'm doing dead on the speed limit. Is there something i'm missing, like does it take a snapshot at each camera and use those to compute the average snapshot speed? or are all these people waking up to nasty fines and points on their licences?
Going slightly off-topic here; I'm used to seeing the normal Gatso cameras with 10 yards or so of white markings on the road, but over the past year or so I see front facing cameras with 3 lines painted on the road covering about 1 foot. Are these actually speed cameras or are they ANPR checks for road tax etc??
It definitely isn't definatley
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GPS actually give a lower (more accurate) reading that speedos, which are designed to over-estimate.
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
Doh, That's what I meant to say :zzz: You go faster for the same indicated speed
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Going slightly off-topic here; I'm used to seeing the normal Gatso cameras with 10 yards or so of white markings on the road, but over the past year or so I see front facing cameras with 3 lines painted on the road covering about 1 foot. Are these actually speed cameras or are they ANPR checks for road tax etc??
It definitely isn't definatley
They're forward facing speed cameras I believe.
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Going slightly off-topic here; I'm used to seeing the normal Gatso cameras with 10 yards or so of white markings on the road, but over the past year or so I see front facing cameras with 3 lines painted on the road covering about 1 foot. Are these actually speed cameras or are they ANPR checks for road tax etc??
It definitely isn't definatley
Probably positioned so they can take a photo of the driver.
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
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Probably positioned so they can take a photo of the driver.
I hope you realise that hamsters are very creative when it comes to revenge. - Elaine
Which, under data protection law means they cannot be used in evidence. (In fact no camera evidience is admissible as it is digital, which is why you have to sign the back of the NIP form they send you, that is what they use to prosecute.) Strange thing law, especially when it is designed by unelected morons in foreign countries.
------------------------------------ "When Belly Full, Chin Hit Chest" Confucius 502BC
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Hi people. Just been reading up on average speed cameras. What suprises me is the number of people I see fly past me on the motorway when we're in a area controlled by them when i'm doing dead on the speed limit. Is there something i'm missing, like does it take a snapshot at each camera and use those to compute the average snapshot speed? or are all these people waking up to nasty fines and points on their licences?
Ones in the UK use number plate recognition and average over (I think) at least three cameras. This means it's no good switching lanes which some idiots try. I've seen average speed limits around roadworks which is a very good use of them BTW, over 100 motorway mantenance workers are killed every year by motorists. Elaine :rose:
Visit http://www.notreadytogiveup.com/[^] and do something special today.
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Here it depends on what car your driving ;P No not really, the fact is tho the newer the car the closer to your actual speed is displayed, my car has the 10% rule (it says I'm driving 50 while I'm actually doing 34 45). The camera's don't take that 10% into account, only the +3mph (or 5km/h), at least for as far as I know. I do know that some camera's (at intersections with lights) will only register when your driving thru a red light. Also if your speeding and the picture shows that your where breaking at the time (so your break lights are on) they will add 5km/h to the speed registered. (at least here they do) [edit] corrected typo [/edit]
modified on Monday, August 17, 2009 6:17 AM
You seem to know an awful lot about this subject... :^)
Luc Pattyn [Forum Guidelines] [My Articles]
The quality and detail of your question reflects on the effectiveness of the help you are likely to get. Show formatted code inside PRE tags, and give clear symptoms when describing a problem.
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Ones in the UK use number plate recognition and average over (I think) at least three cameras. This means it's no good switching lanes which some idiots try. I've seen average speed limits around roadworks which is a very good use of them BTW, over 100 motorway mantenance workers are killed every year by motorists. Elaine :rose:
Visit http://www.notreadytogiveup.com/[^] and do something special today.
Trollslayer wrote:
average over (I think) at least three cameras.
Surely more then 3 cameras give better accuracy? If averages are taken between pairs of cameras, and then an average of those values is taken again then you get a more accurate result as exact positioning of the cameras is less relevant. Where am I wrong?
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You seem to know an awful lot about this subject... :^)
Luc Pattyn [Forum Guidelines] [My Articles]
The quality and detail of your question reflects on the effectiveness of the help you are likely to get. Show formatted code inside PRE tags, and give clear symptoms when describing a problem.
Connections, connections ;P No I'v had 2 or 3 tickets so far ( only 1 for speeding tho). But half of my family works for different government agency's and a friend is a cop (o sorry police agent) so from time to time I hear some things. :)
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Trollslayer wrote:
average over (I think) at least three cameras.
Surely more then 3 cameras give better accuracy? If averages are taken between pairs of cameras, and then an average of those values is taken again then you get a more accurate result as exact positioning of the cameras is less relevant. Where am I wrong?
c2423 wrote:
Where am I wrong?
In your assumption that the law is interested in accuracy, instead of just having enough evidence - that you'd find it almost impossible to dispute - to take your money from you ;)
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c2423 wrote:
Where am I wrong?
In your assumption that the law is interested in accuracy, instead of just having enough evidence - that you'd find it almost impossible to dispute - to take your money from you ;)
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Going slightly off-topic here; I'm used to seeing the normal Gatso cameras with 10 yards or so of white markings on the road, but over the past year or so I see front facing cameras with 3 lines painted on the road covering about 1 foot. Are these actually speed cameras or are they ANPR checks for road tax etc??
It definitely isn't definatley