Has any programming language ever affected your thought process in real life?
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Hello, everybody: First of all, excuse me for this extremely weird thing I'm going to say. I have the following problem: My favorite programming language, C++, is affecting the way I think in real life. I tend to assume other people have the ability (not to mention the willingness) to make huge abstractions when I talk to them. I expect them to be able to distinguish between a thing being referred and the reference itself. My ability to communicate my thoughts to the people I live, work and am supposed to have fun with is severely impaired by the fact most of these thoughts are "constructed" using concepts understandable only to C++ lawyers. Has anybody experienced a similar thing (not necessarily with C++)? Do I have to go to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Is my problem beyond repair? Thanks in advance, Eduardo León
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
Ditto here too. Anyone else look at those communication failures as a problem with their own communication skills to be solved? I do, and apply.. you guessed it.. my abstraction and OO problem solving skills. Over the years, I've gotten fair to middling at communicating that sort of thinking to those non-programmers in my life :)
patbob
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That's 1 too many. ;P
Not total copy :) printf != Console.Writeline. Although they do the same thing.
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Hello, everybody: First of all, excuse me for this extremely weird thing I'm going to say. I have the following problem: My favorite programming language, C++, is affecting the way I think in real life. I tend to assume other people have the ability (not to mention the willingness) to make huge abstractions when I talk to them. I expect them to be able to distinguish between a thing being referred and the reference itself. My ability to communicate my thoughts to the people I live, work and am supposed to have fun with is severely impaired by the fact most of these thoughts are "constructed" using concepts understandable only to C++ lawyers. Has anybody experienced a similar thing (not necessarily with C++)? Do I have to go to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Is my problem beyond repair? Thanks in advance, Eduardo León
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
You need to start using Ruby.
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java also rots the pipes the internet runs through....
Opium is my business. The bridge mean more traffic. More traffic mean more money. More money mean more power. Speed is important in business. Time is money. You said opium was money. Money is Money. Well then, what is time again? icalburner.net
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Hello, everybody: First of all, excuse me for this extremely weird thing I'm going to say. I have the following problem: My favorite programming language, C++, is affecting the way I think in real life. I tend to assume other people have the ability (not to mention the willingness) to make huge abstractions when I talk to them. I expect them to be able to distinguish between a thing being referred and the reference itself. My ability to communicate my thoughts to the people I live, work and am supposed to have fun with is severely impaired by the fact most of these thoughts are "constructed" using concepts understandable only to C++ lawyers. Has anybody experienced a similar thing (not necessarily with C++)? Do I have to go to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Is my problem beyond repair? Thanks in advance, Eduardo León
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
Interesting question, I have to say that Object Oriented Programming paradigm have influence myself in the way I analyse and understand certain daily life activities. The language in particular is Smalltalk which was the one I used when I learn OOP.
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Teacher: Write "I will not make paper airplanes in the classroom" 50 times on the board. Student:
for(int counter = 0; counter <=50; counter++ )
{
Console.Writeline("I will not make paper airplanes in the classroom ");
}:) :)
why did the teacher had you write that on the board? lack of attention to detail?
Opium is my business. The bridge mean more traffic. More traffic mean more money. More money mean more power. Speed is important in business. Time is money. You said opium was money. Money is Money. Well then, what is time again? icalburner.net
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why did the teacher had you write that on the board? lack of attention to detail?
Opium is my business. The bridge mean more traffic. More traffic mean more money. More money mean more power. Speed is important in business. Time is money. You said opium was money. Money is Money. Well then, what is time again? icalburner.net
No, that was long time ago, before .NET
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Hello, everybody: First of all, excuse me for this extremely weird thing I'm going to say. I have the following problem: My favorite programming language, C++, is affecting the way I think in real life. I tend to assume other people have the ability (not to mention the willingness) to make huge abstractions when I talk to them. I expect them to be able to distinguish between a thing being referred and the reference itself. My ability to communicate my thoughts to the people I live, work and am supposed to have fun with is severely impaired by the fact most of these thoughts are "constructed" using concepts understandable only to C++ lawyers. Has anybody experienced a similar thing (not necessarily with C++)? Do I have to go to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Is my problem beyond repair? Thanks in advance, Eduardo León
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
For me it was definitely smalltalk back in 1994. I had been programming for about 15 years by then and thought I knew what object oriented programming was all about. Then I had the opportunity to use smalltalk combined with proper object oriented methodology training from some of the best people money could buy. The result was like a religious experience. The light just came on and "I got it". You can fake object oriented development in most languages, but not in smalltalk. There's a wonderful ecosystem of languages out there! Most of the good ones seem to be built around one or two central concepts. Learn the language and you master the salient concepts of that language. These are skills that can be transferred and used in other languages. Over the years I've been lucky work with something like 30-50 different languages / environments. Each one of these has made me a better thinker and developer; yes, even cobol. I think that the current VB/C#/Java monoculture may be harmful to the industry in the long term.
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Hello, everybody: First of all, excuse me for this extremely weird thing I'm going to say. I have the following problem: My favorite programming language, C++, is affecting the way I think in real life. I tend to assume other people have the ability (not to mention the willingness) to make huge abstractions when I talk to them. I expect them to be able to distinguish between a thing being referred and the reference itself. My ability to communicate my thoughts to the people I live, work and am supposed to have fun with is severely impaired by the fact most of these thoughts are "constructed" using concepts understandable only to C++ lawyers. Has anybody experienced a similar thing (not necessarily with C++)? Do I have to go to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Is my problem beyond repair? Thanks in advance, Eduardo León
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
It would be
!falsetoassert: you're an exception;trytothrowproblems ofthisclassout of your scope,otherwiseyour lifetime will beshort. -
For me it was definitely smalltalk back in 1994. I had been programming for about 15 years by then and thought I knew what object oriented programming was all about. Then I had the opportunity to use smalltalk combined with proper object oriented methodology training from some of the best people money could buy. The result was like a religious experience. The light just came on and "I got it". You can fake object oriented development in most languages, but not in smalltalk. There's a wonderful ecosystem of languages out there! Most of the good ones seem to be built around one or two central concepts. Learn the language and you master the salient concepts of that language. These are skills that can be transferred and used in other languages. Over the years I've been lucky work with something like 30-50 different languages / environments. Each one of these has made me a better thinker and developer; yes, even cobol. I think that the current VB/C#/Java monoculture may be harmful to the industry in the long term.
mutantdna wrote:
I think that the current VB/C#/Java monoculture may be harmful to the industry in the long term.
The fact the VB/C#/Java monoculture sucks is actually worse than the fact it's a monoculture. I hate their proponents' let's play safe, don't try to be too smart attitude.
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
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Interesting question, I have to say that Object Oriented Programming paradigm have influence myself in the way I analyse and understand certain daily life activities. The language in particular is Smalltalk which was the one I used when I learn OOP.
The only significative drawback that I have found in the way OOP makes me think is that all actions are expressed as having a single subject:
pSomeObj->SomeMethod();or no subject at all:CSomeClass.SomeStaticMethod();. There's no object-oriented way to say two objects are jointly performing an action.If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
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I've frequently reached for Ctrl+F while going through those endless classified lists for jobs :sigh:
Sure, I wish books/papers had Ctrl+F or life had Ctrl+Z, but that has nothing to do with programming languages.
Cheers, Vikram. (Cracked not one CCC, but two!)
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I've started driving towards Redmond several times with the intention of choking the living sh*t outa whoever is in charge of WPF, so yeah, I guess it has affected my thought process.
.45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"The staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - J. Jystad, 2001I haven't used WPF that much, so I can't say it's terrible, but I'm more used to the Win32 way of doing things. WinForms comes in handier when you're developing prototypes, though.
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
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The only significative drawback that I have found in the way OOP makes me think is that all actions are expressed as having a single subject:
pSomeObj->SomeMethod();or no subject at all:CSomeClass.SomeStaticMethod();. There's no object-oriented way to say two objects are jointly performing an action.If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
That can be done without a problem. Remember object-receptor -> message is the basic atomic level of operation in OO, that does not mean two objects could not interact together. You could have a third object representing the context action of both objects communicating together and the third object handling the interaction between both. You could have also two objects working on a same job concurrently. It will depend what you mean with "two objects jointly performing an action"
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For me it was definitely smalltalk back in 1994. I had been programming for about 15 years by then and thought I knew what object oriented programming was all about. Then I had the opportunity to use smalltalk combined with proper object oriented methodology training from some of the best people money could buy. The result was like a religious experience. The light just came on and "I got it". You can fake object oriented development in most languages, but not in smalltalk. There's a wonderful ecosystem of languages out there! Most of the good ones seem to be built around one or two central concepts. Learn the language and you master the salient concepts of that language. These are skills that can be transferred and used in other languages. Over the years I've been lucky work with something like 30-50 different languages / environments. Each one of these has made me a better thinker and developer; yes, even cobol. I think that the current VB/C#/Java monoculture may be harmful to the industry in the long term.
Smalltalk has to be the best language to learn and understand most Object Oriented concepts, combined with the easiest syntax for any language I have met and the most dynamic and powerful environment, is as you say, a religious experience :laugh:
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Hello, everybody: First of all, excuse me for this extremely weird thing I'm going to say. I have the following problem: My favorite programming language, C++, is affecting the way I think in real life. I tend to assume other people have the ability (not to mention the willingness) to make huge abstractions when I talk to them. I expect them to be able to distinguish between a thing being referred and the reference itself. My ability to communicate my thoughts to the people I live, work and am supposed to have fun with is severely impaired by the fact most of these thoughts are "constructed" using concepts understandable only to C++ lawyers. Has anybody experienced a similar thing (not necessarily with C++)? Do I have to go to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Is my problem beyond repair? Thanks in advance, Eduardo León
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
It seems the most common answer is that it's not a particular programming language that affects your thinking processes but doing programming itself. This is true for me too. On the communication side, you'll need to remember that others can't see the succession of thoughts you went through to reach a particular conclusion. So if you jump from point A to point Z, you will leave most people behind. Fill in enough of the blank spaces so that your audience can follow your thoughts and you'll have answered this problem. There's only one caveat to that statement - some people are just stupid and will never get it, even if you include every letter in the alphabet - avoid these kinds of people where possible. Don't go to a Psych*ist - they have the same problems as you do but with respect to their field of study. And as they haven't yet found a solution for themselves I don't think your wasting money on them will make your situation any better. What I would suggest is to learn ways in which to use your approach to understand the world to make things clearer for others. It's a very useful skill that people really appreciate (and pay a lot of money for).
I just love Koalas - they go great with Bacon.
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Not really any specific language in general, but rather the process of programming has done this to me. Once you learn programming you never look at the world, or a problem, the same way again. I tend to just think that everyone sees things the way I do now and it can be problematic.
:-D :thumbsup:
peace & serenity
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Hello, everybody: First of all, excuse me for this extremely weird thing I'm going to say. I have the following problem: My favorite programming language, C++, is affecting the way I think in real life. I tend to assume other people have the ability (not to mention the willingness) to make huge abstractions when I talk to them. I expect them to be able to distinguish between a thing being referred and the reference itself. My ability to communicate my thoughts to the people I live, work and am supposed to have fun with is severely impaired by the fact most of these thoughts are "constructed" using concepts understandable only to C++ lawyers. Has anybody experienced a similar thing (not necessarily with C++)? Do I have to go to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Is my problem beyond repair? Thanks in advance, Eduardo León
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
Oh yeah, I know what you're talking about. Everything I look has to have some logic. If I look at my desk I start thinking: if (weightOverDesk > deskSurfaceResistance) BreakDown(); For EVERYTHING, I think differently. If I don't think programming, I think physics. It is really wierd. It's very difficult to win a discussion against me if the person don't have strong and solid arguments. Everything I talk about (science, health, day-to-day, sports, etc) I tend to put logic in it. It's really weird sometimes. Maybe we all need shrinks.
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Hello, everybody: First of all, excuse me for this extremely weird thing I'm going to say. I have the following problem: My favorite programming language, C++, is affecting the way I think in real life. I tend to assume other people have the ability (not to mention the willingness) to make huge abstractions when I talk to them. I expect them to be able to distinguish between a thing being referred and the reference itself. My ability to communicate my thoughts to the people I live, work and am supposed to have fun with is severely impaired by the fact most of these thoughts are "constructed" using concepts understandable only to C++ lawyers. Has anybody experienced a similar thing (not necessarily with C++)? Do I have to go to a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Is my problem beyond repair? Thanks in advance, Eduardo León
If you can play The Dance of Eternity (Dream Theater), then we shall make a band.
People - abstractions - dumbing down? Welcome to my world. At this point, it's solid habit. I've come to observe that there is a (small) subset of humanity that is clearly more awake than the rest. They often (but not always) go into technical fields. I've even met a clergyman who's 'aware'. Nothing to worry about - as another responder noted, you get used to it all and adapt conversations automatically. Programming has done its damage on me (Answer a Yes/No question? true, false, don't-care states). Linear Algebra, too - and it did have one nice effect: accepting different philosophical views (for example) by assuming a different basis set. If the basis set is complete, then it describes everything - just in a different way. Also, a good way to approach problems. How often I get into trouble when I try to stop someone from explaining the obvious conclusion of their remarks - or worse - when they make a few simple statements and then feel the need to spell out to me the implications. Along with this comes the awareness that there are probably others further advanced in this (or some) direction coping with my state in much the same way.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"As far as we know, our computer has never had an undetected error." - Weisert"It's a sad state of affairs, indeed, when you start reading my tag lines for some sort of enlightenment. Sadder still, if that's where you need to find it." - Balboos HaGadol