Global Warming
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Yeah, I spent the last 11 years in Maracaibo, where 40 C is normal and 50C happens at times. I think I recall that it got all the way down to 19 C once, maybe. Snow in Houston? I might need to think about going back down south!! :)
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Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
Laugh out loud, and I do have an opposition to silly abbreviations
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Dalek Dave wrote:
The point is that it IS in dispute.
I can see that they (the scientists) cannot get to agree on that point. I can also see that there are much more, uhm, drastic weather phenomena, such as many more storms, many more hottest-day-eva, many more no-rain-in-N-weeks summers, many more biggest-snowtime-eva than before, or at least so it seems according to older peers. Maybe the climate is not getting warmer. The average temperature is the same, but we're getting hotter summers and colder winters, which happens to be the worst case because we need more power both in summer (A/C) and winter. Assuming that we're the cause for the climate change, I'm quite sure that we cannot reverse it in reasonable time (e.g. a few decades). At any rate, reducing CO2 emissions means using less fossil fuels, thus our reserves will last longer. Also, recycling more waste is good also because, usually, it takes less energy and thus costs less than producing new materials. Moreover, if we can get to reduce the non-recyclable part of the waste, that's good because we need less incinerators or dumps.
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Dario Solera wrote:
Also, recycling more waste is good also because, usually, it takes less energy and thus costs less than producing new materials.
I'd love to see the data to back that statement up. It would mean that most all industries have been operating suboptimally and would provide an economic incentive to recycle.
Dario Solera wrote:
Moreover, if we can get to reduce the non-recyclable part of the waste, that's good because we need less incinerators or dumps.
Yeah, figuring out how to do it economically is the trick.
CQ de W5ALT
Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
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Well, as another indication of global warming, it is now snowing in Houston, Texas, USA on December 4th. Last year it snowed on December 10th. I believe this is the first time it has ever snowed 2 years in a row in Houston -- I know it is during my lifetime here. Ahh yes, global warming ...
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Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
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Isn't that why they now prefer the term "Climate Change"? That the climate changes is a fact that I don't believe anybody would dispute. Whether or not the changes are man-made or controllable is a matter for some debate.
Dan_Martin wrote:
Isn't that why they now prefer the term "Climate Change"?
In my day we referred to it as "weather".
Ennis Ray Lynch, Jr. wrote:
Unpaid overtime is slavery.
Trollslayer wrote:
Meetings - where minutes are taken and hours are lost.
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Dario Solera wrote:
Also, recycling more waste is good also because, usually, it takes less energy and thus costs less than producing new materials.
I'd love to see the data to back that statement up. It would mean that most all industries have been operating suboptimally and would provide an economic incentive to recycle.
Dario Solera wrote:
Moreover, if we can get to reduce the non-recyclable part of the waste, that's good because we need less incinerators or dumps.
Yeah, figuring out how to do it economically is the trick.
CQ de W5ALT
Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
Walt Fair, Jr. wrote:
I'd love to see the data to back that statement up. It would mean that most all industries have been operating suboptimally and would provide an economic incentive to recycle.
For Aluminum[^] the energy delta is ~20:1. Steel[^] returns 4:1 Glass[^] is only 3:2 Plastic (see previous link) can be as high as 10:1; but varies by type, is typically converted into non recyclable forms instead of back into plastic bottles, and being much less dense is more heavily affected by transportation costs. eg styrofoam is almost never recycled because the cost of driving a truck/rail car of it is more than the savings from recyling.
3x12=36 2x12=24 1x12=12 0x12=18
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Mother nature is just a complete skitzo now... Wednesday it felt like... I don't know, had to be maybe 35 degrees... Maybe colder. Yesterday it was 65 and my bosses were leaving work early to play golf. Today, it's heading back down, just below 50 at the moment. The only way it could be stranger would be if we had a blizzard tomorrow, and the snow melted just in time to hit the beach on Sunday.
Proud to have finally moved to the A-Ark. Which one are you in? Author of Guardians of Xen (Sci-Fi/Fantasy novel)
I agree with you 100%. On Sunday it was around 60F here then Monday it was snowing, now today's high is 23F. We have had it be warm then rain then snow all in one day around here before :wtf: The saying around here is wait 10 minutes and watch the weather change
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Walt Fair, Jr. wrote:
I'd love to see the data to back that statement up. It would mean that most all industries have been operating suboptimally and would provide an economic incentive to recycle.
For Aluminum[^] the energy delta is ~20:1. Steel[^] returns 4:1 Glass[^] is only 3:2 Plastic (see previous link) can be as high as 10:1; but varies by type, is typically converted into non recyclable forms instead of back into plastic bottles, and being much less dense is more heavily affected by transportation costs. eg styrofoam is almost never recycled because the cost of driving a truck/rail car of it is more than the savings from recyling.
3x12=36 2x12=24 1x12=12 0x12=18
And the cost delta? Most people consider cost rather than energy when purchasing and deciding to recycle.
CQ de W5ALT
Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
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And the cost delta? Most people consider cost rather than energy when purchasing and deciding to recycle.
CQ de W5ALT
Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
That's much harder to calculate because transportation costs are so much more variable. AFAIK though only steel and Aluminum have profit margins high enough to fund curbside collection. Both also have the virtue of being magnetically separable from everything else (Aluminum is paramagnetic and will respond to a strong field). Burning labels off during the melting process also helps here to keep costs down. Paper glass and plastic are separable from each other by weight; although the latter two need separated farther (color or type). The small size of the numbers on plastic makes them worse on this regard as does the need to remove plastic labels, cap rings, etc manually to avoid contamination. If you don't have a local recycling plant plastic or paper gets uneconomical fast due to the transport costs. Excepting stuff sold at a premium for smug points (tm) it doesn't affect the retail price in a consumer visible way. Materials are fungible and the market price doesn't depend on if they're recycled or virgin. If demand is high enough to push the price to $100/ton it'll all sell for about that regardless of if it cost $5/ton or $90/ton to produce.
3x12=36 2x12=24 1x12=12 0x12=18
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That's much harder to calculate because transportation costs are so much more variable. AFAIK though only steel and Aluminum have profit margins high enough to fund curbside collection. Both also have the virtue of being magnetically separable from everything else (Aluminum is paramagnetic and will respond to a strong field). Burning labels off during the melting process also helps here to keep costs down. Paper glass and plastic are separable from each other by weight; although the latter two need separated farther (color or type). The small size of the numbers on plastic makes them worse on this regard as does the need to remove plastic labels, cap rings, etc manually to avoid contamination. If you don't have a local recycling plant plastic or paper gets uneconomical fast due to the transport costs. Excepting stuff sold at a premium for smug points (tm) it doesn't affect the retail price in a consumer visible way. Materials are fungible and the market price doesn't depend on if they're recycled or virgin. If demand is high enough to push the price to $100/ton it'll all sell for about that regardless of if it cost $5/ton or $90/ton to produce.
3x12=36 2x12=24 1x12=12 0x12=18
Dan Neely wrote:
That's much harder to calculate because transportation costs are so much more variable.
Which implies, since transportation requires energy, that the estimates don't include total energy consumption.
Dan Neely wrote:
If you don't have a local recycling plant plastic or paper gets uneconomical fast due to the transport costs.
Actually if there is no government incentive (i.e. someone else pays for transportation) almost all recycling is uneconomical in the US. Last time I tried to start a recycling business and did the footwork, by the time someone goes around and collects things and takes them to a recycling center, they can't even earn minimum wage. The only way to make it work is to get someone else to do the collection for free. That was a few years back, but I doubt things have changed much. Hence, society, despite all the "green" banners, hasn't yet decided that recycling is worth the expense, except in isolated cases.
CQ de W5ALT
Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
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Well, as another indication of global warming, it is now snowing in Houston, Texas, USA on December 4th. Last year it snowed on December 10th. I believe this is the first time it has ever snowed 2 years in a row in Houston -- I know it is during my lifetime here. Ahh yes, global warming ...
CQ de W5ALT
Walt Fair, Jr., P. E. Comport Computing Specializing in Technical Engineering Software
It was reported on Sky News today that the United Nations, at a climate change meeting/boardroom or something, are investigating the claims at that British Scientists have manipulated the data about Global Warming... :wtf: :omg: So what are they on about? Coul it be really that the Earth is undergoing a natural cycle of erratic weather, before the next and upcoming Ice Age...hey is that what 2012 is all about? :rolleyes: Tom
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