What makes the iPhone so successful
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Steve Jobs may be an exacting tyrant bent on ruling his cult with single minded determination approaching hubris, but he makes sure to do it with sytle and with creative people. Differences in MS and Apple: Ballmer is crazy and could care less about his customers. He hates and mocks his competition. He uses his employees. Jobs is a tyrant and could care less about his employees. He mocks his competition. He loves his fans/customers(they keep him young because he bathes in ... wait KSS).
ragnaroknrol wrote:
they keep him young because he bathes in
Ketchup? Lemon flavored olive oil? Mango and Passion fruit Jello? Organic Peanut Butter?
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! Personal 3D projects Just Say No to Web 2 Point Blow
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It really is a joy to use ... plus the apps of course. Don't forget the apps! My current favourite is RedLaser, the barcode scanning app (it annoys the hell out of sales staff when you walk into a shop, scan a product and point out that it's cheaper on their web site!) I am still addicted to my iPhone 6 months later. Got the wife one for Christmas (which, sucker that I am, actually gave her weeks ago) and she loves it (and previously always bought Sony Ericsson phones.) I have a 16GB 3G model - not the 3GS - and my only complaint is I could do with more storage as I use the iPod feature *all the time*. My contract expires in September, so I'll no doubt upgrade like the fanboy I have become. Apple FTW!
Rob Caldecott wrote:
I have a 16GB 3G model - not the 3GS - and my only complaint is I could do with more storage as I use the iPod feature *all the time*.
I got the 8GB iPhone and use Simplyfy Media to stream the music, 200+ CDs collection, from my house to my iPhone that way I don't have to keep any music on the iPhone itself. If I ever go somewhere that doesn't have Edge/3G or WiFi, then I will load the music on the iPhone. Pandora is my 2nd favorite music app. C
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Yeah. Too bad it's overpriced and on the ATT network. :( /rant on ATT has got to be the crappiest excuse for a cell phone network I've ever had the misfortune of being acquainted with. You know that Verizon commercial "we've got a map for that"? Verizon isn't lying about ATT's 3G coverage. Their non-3g coverage ain't so hot either once you get outside of a large metropolitan area. Sorry, first and foremost, I need my phone to be, well, a phone. A phone that gets service everywhere I go. I can live without the iPhone until "there's a map for that". /rant off
-Sean ---- Fire Nuts
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To me it's responsiveness. I've been playing with one for a couple of days and I've been trying to nail down exactly what it is that makes it so easy to use. High on the list is the personality of the UI. It's friendly. It's familiar. A compass looks like a compass, the time looks like an old-fashioned timer and is designed to be spun using your fingers. This is huge. Then I started comparing my touch-screen notebook with the iPhone. Scrolling through a browser page is very jerky. Resizing a page shows jerks and flashes. The laptop is a tablet, so spinning the screen 90 degrees makes the whole screen go dark then redraw, window by painful window. The iPhone scrolls perfectly smoothly. When you change orientation it morphs beautifully from landscape to portrait. When I need to zoom there absolutely zero lag in redrawing. Compared to my Blackberry, or a Windows Mobile device the contrast is night and day. I think we as software developers, and Microsoft and RIM as the authors of OSs, need to go into the room of mirrors and have a good, long look at ourselves.
cheers, Chris Maunder The Code Project Co-founder Microsoft C++ MVP
Yeah, they seem pretty cool. But they've got a nailed down brand spankin new hardware setup to write code for. Not an api a kajillion layers up from hardware with a crapload of legacy apis. (I'm just guessin' here. But it's PRObably true.) But comparing to a blackberry IS fair game. And i still don't wanna lug around a cellular phonez... I'm a dad. I want peace. Leave me be.
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New Year's resolution is it there Chris? Is next year going to be the age of touchy-scrolly-feely-designy Code Project, where articles look like articles, posts look like like posts and small green aliens called bob look like small green aliens called bob? CP Apps - you publish an API and people write Apps for That! (actually, you should do an iPhone app, and since it was my idea I want a 20% cut). Yeah, Apple do design well. Graphic Design, though, is a completely different discipline, skill set and talent than software design that not everyone can do, and not that many of those that can do it well. Which, of course, means those resources have to be brought in and that costs money. Money that could be better spent on making sure the software actually works as it's supposed to rather than adding "visual clues" all over the place. On the other hand, I'm all for a nice combination of both.
martin_hughes wrote:
touchy-scrolly-feely-designy Code Project
We're all a bit sad we missed the metrosexual revolution on that one. Actually, no we're not.
cheers, Chris Maunder The Code Project Co-founder Microsoft C++ MVP
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ragnaroknrol wrote:
they keep him young because he bathes in
Ketchup? Lemon flavored olive oil? Mango and Passion fruit Jello? Organic Peanut Butter?
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! Personal 3D projects Just Say No to Web 2 Point Blow
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To me it's responsiveness. I've been playing with one for a couple of days and I've been trying to nail down exactly what it is that makes it so easy to use. High on the list is the personality of the UI. It's friendly. It's familiar. A compass looks like a compass, the time looks like an old-fashioned timer and is designed to be spun using your fingers. This is huge. Then I started comparing my touch-screen notebook with the iPhone. Scrolling through a browser page is very jerky. Resizing a page shows jerks and flashes. The laptop is a tablet, so spinning the screen 90 degrees makes the whole screen go dark then redraw, window by painful window. The iPhone scrolls perfectly smoothly. When you change orientation it morphs beautifully from landscape to portrait. When I need to zoom there absolutely zero lag in redrawing. Compared to my Blackberry, or a Windows Mobile device the contrast is night and day. I think we as software developers, and Microsoft and RIM as the authors of OSs, need to go into the room of mirrors and have a good, long look at ourselves.
cheers, Chris Maunder The Code Project Co-founder Microsoft C++ MVP
I'd say it's pure usability. Any non-compputer savvy moron (I say that in the nicest sense of the word!) can use one without too much trouble. Compare that to 90% of devices on the market
___________________________________________ .\\axxx (That's an 'M')
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To me it's responsiveness. I've been playing with one for a couple of days and I've been trying to nail down exactly what it is that makes it so easy to use. High on the list is the personality of the UI. It's friendly. It's familiar. A compass looks like a compass, the time looks like an old-fashioned timer and is designed to be spun using your fingers. This is huge. Then I started comparing my touch-screen notebook with the iPhone. Scrolling through a browser page is very jerky. Resizing a page shows jerks and flashes. The laptop is a tablet, so spinning the screen 90 degrees makes the whole screen go dark then redraw, window by painful window. The iPhone scrolls perfectly smoothly. When you change orientation it morphs beautifully from landscape to portrait. When I need to zoom there absolutely zero lag in redrawing. Compared to my Blackberry, or a Windows Mobile device the contrast is night and day. I think we as software developers, and Microsoft and RIM as the authors of OSs, need to go into the room of mirrors and have a good, long look at ourselves.
cheers, Chris Maunder The Code Project Co-founder Microsoft C++ MVP
Chris Maunder wrote:
The iPhone scrolls perfectly smoothly. When you change orientation it morphs beautifully from landscape to portrait. When I need to zoom there absolutely zero lag in redrawing.
You're almost describing World of Warcraft. You're comparing apples and pineapples here, keep in mind that Windows isn't meant as a platform for graphic-intense applications. We didn't rotate screens 90 degrees in Windows 3.1, simply because graphics weren't a sellingpoint. The demise of the ST and the Amiga confirm that. I also like to disagree on the point that Microsoft didn't spend any time on usability. They used to, and the ux_guide[^] is quite a handsome read. Apple's guidelines[^] are worth the read too, perhaps even moreso. (Why am I defending the desktop UI when it's not even under attack here?)
Chris Maunder wrote:
Compared to my Blackberry, or a Windows Mobile device the contrast is night and day.
Apple was building a phone, where Microsoft is pushing a platform that's not limited to phones. In the end Apple will be considered the pioneer, as usual, and Microsoft as the cheap all-round alternative, as usual.
Chris Maunder wrote:
I think we as software developers, and Microsoft and RIM as the authors of OSs, need to go into the room of mirrors and have a good, long look at ourselves.
Yeah, we should do hallway usability-testing, and we should poka-yoke the database, and create unit-tests with 100% coverage. We don't, simply because it makes us cheaper than the competition. Everyone has an Office-lint, and we now have one too. That can't be too far of the mark, can it? (My apologies for the sarcasm, and my apologies for being blunt)
I are Troll :suss:
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I don't know what actually goes on at Apple, but it *seems* (to me at least) that they are asking "what sucks here, and how can we fix it", they brainstorm some ideas, weed out the unworkable ones, preumably by actually performing user testing of some sort, and then deliver some sort of solution. The solution is by no means perfect, but it's a good start. Microsoft, and it seems a lot of the rest of the development community, asks "what's some cool new tech for me and/or my team to play with", and then proceed to come up with more tech-du-jour, which solves few existing problems, creates new problems, but does serve to entertain those who like to play with new tech. Again, while Apple's solutions are by no means perfect, while the rest of the development community is busy navel gazing, they end up walking away with all the accolades. The irony of this is that Apple is a horrible company to develop for, as a third party developer they could largely care less about you, or at least that's historically been true, perhaps with the opening up of the AppStore, that will slowly change, but I won't hold my breath.
¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! Personal 3D projects Just Say No to Web 2 Point Blow
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Steve Jobs may be an exacting tyrant bent on ruling his cult with single minded determination approaching hubris, but he makes sure to do it with sytle and with creative people. Differences in MS and Apple: Ballmer is crazy and could care less about his customers. He hates and mocks his competition. He uses his employees. Jobs is a tyrant and could care less about his employees. He mocks his competition. He loves his fans/customers(they keep him young because he bathes in ... wait KSS).
ragnaroknrol wrote:
Ballmer is crazy and could care less about his customers.
FFS, it's couldn't care less, as in he care so little for them it is impossible for him to care less than he does now. Can't anyone fucking speak english on here any more?
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
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New Year's resolution is it there Chris? Is next year going to be the age of touchy-scrolly-feely-designy Code Project, where articles look like articles, posts look like like posts and small green aliens called bob look like small green aliens called bob? CP Apps - you publish an API and people write Apps for That! (actually, you should do an iPhone app, and since it was my idea I want a 20% cut). Yeah, Apple do design well. Graphic Design, though, is a completely different discipline, skill set and talent than software design that not everyone can do, and not that many of those that can do it well. Which, of course, means those resources have to be brought in and that costs money. Money that could be better spent on making sure the software actually works as it's supposed to rather than adding "visual clues" all over the place. On the other hand, I'm all for a nice combination of both.
Then Martin spake thus : "<i>Graphic Design, though, is a completely different discipline, skill set and talent than software design that not everyone can do, and not that many of those that can do it well."</i> Hi Martin, I really like that statement, totally agree. I would take it one step further and say, using your own words, that within graphic design is another skill-set : <i>interaction-design for graphic user interfaces using non-keyboard input devices</i> requiring "completely different discipline, skill set and talent than ... that not everyone can do." And I think I'd add that <i>within software design</i> user interface design also "is a completely different discipline, skill set and talent than ... that not everyone can do." And so on. thanks, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accordingly." Ada, Countess Lovelace, 1844
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Steve Jobs may be an exacting tyrant bent on ruling his cult with single minded determination approaching hubris, but he makes sure to do it with sytle and with creative people. Differences in MS and Apple: Ballmer is crazy and could care less about his customers. He hates and mocks his competition. He uses his employees. Jobs is a tyrant and could care less about his employees. He mocks his competition. He loves his fans/customers(they keep him young because he bathes in ... wait KSS).
ragnaroknrol wrote: because he bathes in Hi Ragnaroknrol, No need to be ashamed, let's just say it : "money and power." best, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accordingly." Ada, Countess Lovelace, 1844
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Nobody looks at Chuck Norris.
.45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
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"The staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - J. Jystad, 2001John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote: Nobody looks at Chuck Norris. Because it's not Gay Pride week yet. best, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accordingly." Ada, Countess Lovelace, 1844
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Yeah, they seem pretty cool. But they've got a nailed down brand spankin new hardware setup to write code for. Not an api a kajillion layers up from hardware with a crapload of legacy apis. (I'm just guessin' here. But it's PRObably true.) But comparing to a blackberry IS fair game. And i still don't wanna lug around a cellular phonez... I'm a dad. I want peace. Leave me be.
stephen.hazel wrote: But they've got a nailed down brand spankin new hardware setup to write code for. Not an api a kajillion layers up from hardware with a crapload of legacy apis. (I'm just guessin' here. But it's PRObably true.) Hi Stephen, I wonder what you makes you think this "probably true." Are you claiming that Cocoa and the Apple development tools, layered atop OS#xx Predator-of-the_Year flavor, which is layered atop the ghost of Carnegie-Mellon flavor Unix, as passed through the evolutionary stage of NeXt, have any less inherent complexity and depth-of-layers than Windows # ? With both Apple and Windows machines running on Intel cpus, using gpus with the same hardware, etc., where's the "spankin new hardware setup" ? best, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accordingly." Ada, Countess Lovelace, 1844
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To me it's responsiveness. I've been playing with one for a couple of days and I've been trying to nail down exactly what it is that makes it so easy to use. High on the list is the personality of the UI. It's friendly. It's familiar. A compass looks like a compass, the time looks like an old-fashioned timer and is designed to be spun using your fingers. This is huge. Then I started comparing my touch-screen notebook with the iPhone. Scrolling through a browser page is very jerky. Resizing a page shows jerks and flashes. The laptop is a tablet, so spinning the screen 90 degrees makes the whole screen go dark then redraw, window by painful window. The iPhone scrolls perfectly smoothly. When you change orientation it morphs beautifully from landscape to portrait. When I need to zoom there absolutely zero lag in redrawing. Compared to my Blackberry, or a Windows Mobile device the contrast is night and day. I think we as software developers, and Microsoft and RIM as the authors of OSs, need to go into the room of mirrors and have a good, long look at ourselves.
cheers, Chris Maunder The Code Project Co-founder Microsoft C++ MVP
Hi Chris, I don't have an iPhone, don't need one, but I have friends, who are Windows programmers, that rave about them. I would not be willing to sacrifice "copy and paste," and running more than one application at a time (is that still true ?) for whatever the iPhone benefits are, but that's just a reflection of my lifestyle (I make almost no use of the telephone). And I'm just personally not into small devices : I want big screens, big keyboards, readability. Portability not important to me. Personal taste : perhaps related to age and eye-condition, as well as life-style ? I won't echo the other responses here I quite agree with, about "usability," etc., other than to say I think Marc Clifton (as usual) "nailed it" when he talked about "flow." The only thing I can add, that I think I haven't seen here yet on this thread, is the idea that the iPhone is a compelling, fascinating, as well as useful, toy ! It's power of "enchantment" seems, to me, to have spread beyond the usual circumference of the "Cult of Mac" in the way viruses spread. From my jaded perspective, the iPhone is the larval stage of much more interesting and useful devices to come. best, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accordingly." Ada, Countess Lovelace, 1844
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stephen.hazel wrote: But they've got a nailed down brand spankin new hardware setup to write code for. Not an api a kajillion layers up from hardware with a crapload of legacy apis. (I'm just guessin' here. But it's PRObably true.) Hi Stephen, I wonder what you makes you think this "probably true." Are you claiming that Cocoa and the Apple development tools, layered atop OS#xx Predator-of-the_Year flavor, which is layered atop the ghost of Carnegie-Mellon flavor Unix, as passed through the evolutionary stage of NeXt, have any less inherent complexity and depth-of-layers than Windows # ? With both Apple and Windows machines running on Intel cpus, using gpus with the same hardware, etc., where's the "spankin new hardware setup" ? best, Bill
"Many : not conversant with mathematical studies, imagine that because it [the Analytical Engine] is to give results in numerical notation, its processes must consequently be arithmetical, numerical, rather than algebraical and analytical. This is an error. The engine can arrange and combine numerical quantities as if they were letters or any other general symbols; and it fact it might bring out its results in algebraical notation, were provisions made accordingly." Ada, Countess Lovelace, 1844
well, i'm not gonna argue with ya. i've never written no code for an iphone. it does surprise me that they put the full mac os on the thing...?? that's crazy. it's also crazy that the iphone os should have to handle cpus and gpus not on the device...??
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To me it's responsiveness. I've been playing with one for a couple of days and I've been trying to nail down exactly what it is that makes it so easy to use. High on the list is the personality of the UI. It's friendly. It's familiar. A compass looks like a compass, the time looks like an old-fashioned timer and is designed to be spun using your fingers. This is huge. Then I started comparing my touch-screen notebook with the iPhone. Scrolling through a browser page is very jerky. Resizing a page shows jerks and flashes. The laptop is a tablet, so spinning the screen 90 degrees makes the whole screen go dark then redraw, window by painful window. The iPhone scrolls perfectly smoothly. When you change orientation it morphs beautifully from landscape to portrait. When I need to zoom there absolutely zero lag in redrawing. Compared to my Blackberry, or a Windows Mobile device the contrast is night and day. I think we as software developers, and Microsoft and RIM as the authors of OSs, need to go into the room of mirrors and have a good, long look at ourselves.
cheers, Chris Maunder The Code Project Co-founder Microsoft C++ MVP
Damn right, performance matters. I notice when my browser takes more than 60ms to open a new tab. I notice when launching an application doesn't provide me with at least some sort of feedback. And I damn well notice when opening an email doesn't immediately open that email. I've said this before, but MS dropped the ball with recommended UI practices, built Win32 to encourage a fundamentally flawed design, and we've all been paying for it since then: the primary job of any interactive application is to provide feedback for any and all user actions as quickly as possible, even if the action itself takes longer to complete. Just because you can let events pile up without responding to them doesn't mean you should ever do this intentionally...
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Christian Graus wrote:
You're claiming that Apple invented the only possible way to have a user friendly system ?
No. I'm claiming that other companies are running scared of the mighty Apple when it comes to ease of use apps.
"WPF has many lovers. It's a veritable porn star!" - Josh Smith
As Braveheart once said, "You can take our freedom but you'll never take our Hobnobs!" - Martin Hughes.
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ragnaroknrol wrote:
Ballmer is crazy and could care less about his customers.
FFS, it's couldn't care less, as in he care so little for them it is impossible for him to care less than he does now. Can't anyone fucking speak english on here any more?
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
Speaking of speaking English, I've just been watching season 2 of Underbelly and it's full of Kiwi's. They put on a het, they have dunner at sux o'clock. It's driving me nuts.
cheers, Chris Maunder The Code Project Co-founder Microsoft C++ MVP
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Chris Maunder wrote:
The iPhone scrolls perfectly smoothly. When you change orientation it morphs beautifully from landscape to portrait. When I need to zoom there absolutely zero lag in redrawing.
You're almost describing World of Warcraft. You're comparing apples and pineapples here, keep in mind that Windows isn't meant as a platform for graphic-intense applications. We didn't rotate screens 90 degrees in Windows 3.1, simply because graphics weren't a sellingpoint. The demise of the ST and the Amiga confirm that. I also like to disagree on the point that Microsoft didn't spend any time on usability. They used to, and the ux_guide[^] is quite a handsome read. Apple's guidelines[^] are worth the read too, perhaps even moreso. (Why am I defending the desktop UI when it's not even under attack here?)
Chris Maunder wrote:
Compared to my Blackberry, or a Windows Mobile device the contrast is night and day.
Apple was building a phone, where Microsoft is pushing a platform that's not limited to phones. In the end Apple will be considered the pioneer, as usual, and Microsoft as the cheap all-round alternative, as usual.
Chris Maunder wrote:
I think we as software developers, and Microsoft and RIM as the authors of OSs, need to go into the room of mirrors and have a good, long look at ourselves.
Yeah, we should do hallway usability-testing, and we should poka-yoke the database, and create unit-tests with 100% coverage. We don't, simply because it makes us cheaper than the competition. Everyone has an Office-lint, and we now have one too. That can't be too far of the mark, can it? (My apologies for the sarcasm, and my apologies for being blunt)
I are Troll :suss:
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
You're almost describing World of Warcraft
Game UIs have long been a good benchmark for desktop UIs. You can often force someone to learn an obtuse desktop UI simply because they need it to do their job, but a game is entertainment - screw up the UI, and you've lost a customer.
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
Windows isn't meant as a platform for graphic-intense applications.
It's been marketed as one for at least the past 14 years...
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
Microsoft is pushing a platform that's not limited to phones
And this is a problem. Remember, the iPhone OS is built on much of the same code as OS/X - but the UI was tailored to the task it was intended for. It's the difference between batting with a Louisville Slugger... and doing so with a fence post.
Eddy Vluggen wrote:
Yeah, we should do hallway usability-testing, and we should poka-yoke the database, and create unit-tests with 100% coverage.
None of that necessarily matters. 'Know how I recognize a bad UI, a really bad UI? When the person who wrote it can't make it work properly in a pinch. There's a lot of this going around... somewhere along the line, "dogfooding" morphed into "learning to avoid eating the poison bits".