The future of Passport
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I was just wondering how people feel about Passport as an authentication service. As far as I'm concerned it's a demographic harvesting service. The amount of information that is obtained from Passport for the various sign-ins between various websites is enormous. Well - it would be if it was pretty much only Microsoft that used it. To be fair I do love the idea. A single, automated sign-in method that stores all your preferences in one spot, and allows you to sign in to a site using the same familiar method using the one account and the one set of preferences. Great if you only actually want to use one account for different sites (which many people don't actually want to do) and great it you could actually store all your preferences for everything you'd ever need within your passport account (which often you can't). Even getting offers based on my behaviour is a Good Thing. I really don't want to hear about mortgages. Been there, done that. But gadgets and snowboards? Gimme! The thing that has got up my goat is that passport thinks I'm still in Australia. It's about to snow outside. I even took the laptop out on the balcony to prove to it I'm not in Oz anymore. So I dig around and find the preference page on passport and find that the only way I can update my preferences is if I tell it what province I'm in and what my postal code is. To me this says it in a nutshell. I don't want to tell it what province I'm in. I don't even know what postcode I'm in (I think it starts with M. Or K. Yeah - K sounds good). So we're in little standoff, Passport and I. I can enter my province and make up a useless postcode and give in, or I can not update my info and it can continue sending me Australian-only in the ad bar. Or I can uninstall MSN IM, move to trillian and use my now defunct Passport account for signing into Microsoft's sites. cheers, Chris Maunder
I'm strongly against using, or allowing anyone in any organization I'm involved with to use Passport. The idea of allowing any third party unlimited access to my personal information, however lofty their ideals, is abhorrent. The single logon concept is noble - I'm for it. But leave my information on my computer and find a smarter way to utilize it, preferably one that informs me when someone wants it and allows me to select what they will be allowed to see. By the way, Chris, Trillian is a far better IM than anything MSN has to offer... I recommend it:-) "Another day done; all targets met; all systems fully operational; all customers satisfied; all staff keen and well motivated; all pigs fed and ready to fly." - Jennie Agard, McGuckin Hardware Systems Manager
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Chris Maunder wrote: As far as I'm concerned it's a demographic harvesting service. I completely agree, sometimes I feel as if Microsoft is asking for a little too much information. Nick Parker
May your glass be ever full. May the roof over your head be always strong. And may you be in heaven half an hour before the devil knows you’re dead. - Irish Blessing
Nick Parker wrote: sometimes I feel as if Microsoft is asking for a little too much information. Only sometimes? "Another day done; all targets met; all systems fully operational; all customers satisfied; all staff keen and well motivated; all pigs fed and ready to fly." - Jennie Agard, McGuckin Hardware Systems Manager
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Trillian[^] is the way. Trillian[^] is Good. Come into the light. :cool: --Mike-- "I'd rather you just give me a fish today, because even if you teach me how to fish, I won't do it. I'm lazy." -- Nish Just released - 1ClickPicGrabber - Grab & organize pictures from your favorite web pages, with 1 click! My really out-of-date homepage Sonork-100.19012 Acid_Helm
I'll second that motion. No other IM product comes close, not even Sonork (sorry Bob). They all have nice features, but all fall short of the mark compared to Trillian. Not that Trillian couldn't use some improvement... But it does a fine job as it is.:) Of course, when they start charging for it for personal use, I'll drop it like something warm and steaming found on the lawn in the morning... "Another day done; all targets met; all systems fully operational; all customers satisfied; all staff keen and well motivated; all pigs fed and ready to fly." - Jennie Agard, McGuckin Hardware Systems Manager
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David Cunningham wrote: Just for consistency I always say I'm from Vancouver, BC, I'm born on January 1, 1955, etc. Funny you should mention Vancouver....That's where I'm from. Nice to see another Canadian on here :) -Sean
There are a several Canadians here. That and David C, Chris M, and the CP servers are here. So... all your CP are belong to us ... Muahhahahahaha!
I rolled my eyes so much that my vision is now 20/20 from the exercise. -John C. Dvorak
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Trillian[^] is the way. Trillian[^] is Good. Come into the light. :cool: --Mike-- "I'd rather you just give me a fish today, because even if you teach me how to fish, I won't do it. I'm lazy." -- Nish Just released - 1ClickPicGrabber - Grab & organize pictures from your favorite web pages, with 1 click! My really out-of-date homepage Sonork-100.19012 Acid_Helm
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Chris Maunder wrote: I was just wondering how people feel about Passport as an authentication service Badly. All MS-stick-poking aside I don't think Passport itself will ever really become what MS wants it to become. There is just too much distrust of MS (rational or irational.) Also Passport was such a half hearted affair. I mean come on! The possibilities of this identity type service are just mind boggling. Yet what is Passport actually? You have one account, which in many cases you have to re-fill for different sites. How many people actually know about the Passport site? Not many I would warrant. It asks questions which are beneficial to Passport and it's affiliates but not very beneficial to you, the user. Anyway bottom line for me is that Passport was a half hearted affair and barely scraped the surface of what can be done. This kind of service can never be succesful if done half heartedly. Someone (and Liberty Alliance is as much a joke) needs to come in with a full blown vision of what this service can do. For starters multiple accounts per person is vital. e.g. You can be Chris Maunder to your bank, but John Doe III to the pron shop. I can go on and on about this concept as I have spent the last year researching it for a client. He reckons unequivocal trust is the number one key in a service like this.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaRay Cassick wrote: Well I am not female, not gay and I am not Paul Watson
Paul Watson wrote: He reckons unequivocal trust is the number one key in a service like this. Exactly, and the chances of that happening are .. let me get my calculator .. uh, none to less than none.
I rolled my eyes so much that my vision is now 20/20 from the exercise. -John C. Dvorak
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I was just wondering how people feel about Passport as an authentication service. As far as I'm concerned it's a demographic harvesting service. The amount of information that is obtained from Passport for the various sign-ins between various websites is enormous. Well - it would be if it was pretty much only Microsoft that used it. To be fair I do love the idea. A single, automated sign-in method that stores all your preferences in one spot, and allows you to sign in to a site using the same familiar method using the one account and the one set of preferences. Great if you only actually want to use one account for different sites (which many people don't actually want to do) and great it you could actually store all your preferences for everything you'd ever need within your passport account (which often you can't). Even getting offers based on my behaviour is a Good Thing. I really don't want to hear about mortgages. Been there, done that. But gadgets and snowboards? Gimme! The thing that has got up my goat is that passport thinks I'm still in Australia. It's about to snow outside. I even took the laptop out on the balcony to prove to it I'm not in Oz anymore. So I dig around and find the preference page on passport and find that the only way I can update my preferences is if I tell it what province I'm in and what my postal code is. To me this says it in a nutshell. I don't want to tell it what province I'm in. I don't even know what postcode I'm in (I think it starts with M. Or K. Yeah - K sounds good). So we're in little standoff, Passport and I. I can enter my province and make up a useless postcode and give in, or I can not update my info and it can continue sending me Australian-only in the ad bar. Or I can uninstall MSN IM, move to trillian and use my now defunct Passport account for signing into Microsoft's sites. cheers, Chris Maunder
Maybe it is me being totally ignorant , but can anyone who gets into my hotmail account by any means , go on to use my passport , or even change the details ? Therefore is it only as safe as the hotmail sign on ? You can by hotmail names by the million , so you only have to guess the password . A lot of users do not practice safe user ids and passwords , they are used everywhere so it is a good guess that if you have a website that requires a name and password , and that person has a hotmail account , then it is not a bad guess that the same password would be used for both . Its obviously a bad idea , but that is the probable reality in a world where every website and their dog wants a password. So whilst passport is good in theory , in practice , for many users it is not that tight on security , but it does push responsibility for security back to the user . The only long term solution will be some sort of hardware ID device , a simple USB dongle is the obvious way , not to expensive. Am I the only one forever playing catch up with technology , while all the juicy opportunites keep rolling by ?
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Chris Maunder wrote: I was just wondering how people feel about Passport as an authentication service Badly. All MS-stick-poking aside I don't think Passport itself will ever really become what MS wants it to become. There is just too much distrust of MS (rational or irational.) Also Passport was such a half hearted affair. I mean come on! The possibilities of this identity type service are just mind boggling. Yet what is Passport actually? You have one account, which in many cases you have to re-fill for different sites. How many people actually know about the Passport site? Not many I would warrant. It asks questions which are beneficial to Passport and it's affiliates but not very beneficial to you, the user. Anyway bottom line for me is that Passport was a half hearted affair and barely scraped the surface of what can be done. This kind of service can never be succesful if done half heartedly. Someone (and Liberty Alliance is as much a joke) needs to come in with a full blown vision of what this service can do. For starters multiple accounts per person is vital. e.g. You can be Chris Maunder to your bank, but John Doe III to the pron shop. I can go on and on about this concept as I have spent the last year researching it for a client. He reckons unequivocal trust is the number one key in a service like this.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaRay Cassick wrote: Well I am not female, not gay and I am not Paul Watson
Paul Watson wrote: Badly. All MS-stick-poking aside I don't think Passport itself will ever really become what MS wants it to become. There is just too much distrust of MS (rational or irational.) Also Passport was such a half hearted affair. You wouldn't bet soon you'll be required an active passport to go through windows update, download the latest mandatory .NET run-time, and so on.
How low can you go ?
(MS rant) -
Paul Watson wrote: Badly. All MS-stick-poking aside I don't think Passport itself will ever really become what MS wants it to become. There is just too much distrust of MS (rational or irational.) Also Passport was such a half hearted affair. You wouldn't bet soon you'll be required an active passport to go through windows update, download the latest mandatory .NET run-time, and so on.
How low can you go ?
(MS rant).S.Rod. wrote: You wouldn't bet soon you'll be required an active passport to go through windows update, download the latest mandatory .NET run-time, and so on. *shrug* Even if they did that, what does it actually mean? Passport already has millions of accounts, but most of them are passive Hotmail accounts used by people who do not even realise they have a Passport. So adding Windows Update won't mean much. This whole concept has much profounder and interesting uses.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaRay Cassick wrote: Well I am not female, not gay and I am not Paul Watson
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.S.Rod. wrote: You wouldn't bet soon you'll be required an active passport to go through windows update, download the latest mandatory .NET run-time, and so on. *shrug* Even if they did that, what does it actually mean? Passport already has millions of accounts, but most of them are passive Hotmail accounts used by people who do not even realise they have a Passport. So adding Windows Update won't mean much. This whole concept has much profounder and interesting uses.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaRay Cassick wrote: Well I am not female, not gay and I am not Paul Watson
Paul Watson wrote: This whole concept has much profounder and interesting uses. Exactly : - mandatory end-user subscription and fee. - $qualified$ customer profiling (remember doubleshit + abacus ?)
How low can you go ?
(MS rant) -
Paul Watson wrote: He reckons unequivocal trust is the number one key in a service like this. Exactly, and the chances of that happening are .. let me get my calculator .. uh, none to less than none.
I rolled my eyes so much that my vision is now 20/20 from the exercise. -John C. Dvorak
Daniel Ferguson wrote: Exactly, and the chances of that happening are .. let me get my calculator .. uh, none to less than none Well, we will see :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaRay Cassick wrote: Well I am not female, not gay and I am not Paul Watson
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I was just wondering how people feel about Passport as an authentication service. As far as I'm concerned it's a demographic harvesting service. The amount of information that is obtained from Passport for the various sign-ins between various websites is enormous. Well - it would be if it was pretty much only Microsoft that used it. To be fair I do love the idea. A single, automated sign-in method that stores all your preferences in one spot, and allows you to sign in to a site using the same familiar method using the one account and the one set of preferences. Great if you only actually want to use one account for different sites (which many people don't actually want to do) and great it you could actually store all your preferences for everything you'd ever need within your passport account (which often you can't). Even getting offers based on my behaviour is a Good Thing. I really don't want to hear about mortgages. Been there, done that. But gadgets and snowboards? Gimme! The thing that has got up my goat is that passport thinks I'm still in Australia. It's about to snow outside. I even took the laptop out on the balcony to prove to it I'm not in Oz anymore. So I dig around and find the preference page on passport and find that the only way I can update my preferences is if I tell it what province I'm in and what my postal code is. To me this says it in a nutshell. I don't want to tell it what province I'm in. I don't even know what postcode I'm in (I think it starts with M. Or K. Yeah - K sounds good). So we're in little standoff, Passport and I. I can enter my province and make up a useless postcode and give in, or I can not update my info and it can continue sending me Australian-only in the ad bar. Or I can uninstall MSN IM, move to trillian and use my now defunct Passport account for signing into Microsoft's sites. cheers, Chris Maunder
Microsoft is hoping that everyone will be required to have a Passport ID in order to do ANYTHING. Not only is Passport a bad idea, but the people that invented it and anyone that wants to control it simply cannot be trusted. ------- signature starts "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001 Please review the Legal Disclaimer in my bio. ------- signature ends
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I was just wondering how people feel about Passport as an authentication service. As far as I'm concerned it's a demographic harvesting service. The amount of information that is obtained from Passport for the various sign-ins between various websites is enormous. Well - it would be if it was pretty much only Microsoft that used it. To be fair I do love the idea. A single, automated sign-in method that stores all your preferences in one spot, and allows you to sign in to a site using the same familiar method using the one account and the one set of preferences. Great if you only actually want to use one account for different sites (which many people don't actually want to do) and great it you could actually store all your preferences for everything you'd ever need within your passport account (which often you can't). Even getting offers based on my behaviour is a Good Thing. I really don't want to hear about mortgages. Been there, done that. But gadgets and snowboards? Gimme! The thing that has got up my goat is that passport thinks I'm still in Australia. It's about to snow outside. I even took the laptop out on the balcony to prove to it I'm not in Oz anymore. So I dig around and find the preference page on passport and find that the only way I can update my preferences is if I tell it what province I'm in and what my postal code is. To me this says it in a nutshell. I don't want to tell it what province I'm in. I don't even know what postcode I'm in (I think it starts with M. Or K. Yeah - K sounds good). So we're in little standoff, Passport and I. I can enter my province and make up a useless postcode and give in, or I can not update my info and it can continue sending me Australian-only in the ad bar. Or I can uninstall MSN IM, move to trillian and use my now defunct Passport account for signing into Microsoft's sites. cheers, Chris Maunder
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David Cunningham wrote: Just for consistency I always say I'm from Vancouver, BC, I'm born on January 1, 1955, etc. Funny you should mention Vancouver....That's where I'm from. Nice to see another Canadian on here :) -Sean
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There are a several Canadians here. That and David C, Chris M, and the CP servers are here. So... all your CP are belong to us ... Muahhahahahaha!
I rolled my eyes so much that my vision is now 20/20 from the exercise. -John C. Dvorak
Funny you should mention me as a Canadian. Have a read of this. :) cheers, Chris Maunder
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Funny you should mention me as a Canadian. Have a read of this. :) cheers, Chris Maunder
Chris Maunder wrote: Funny you should mention me as a Canadian. I meant that you're in Canada at the moment. Chris Maunder wrote: Have a read of this. :omg: Are you losing your Aussie accent? Do you add 'eh?' at the end of sentences? When you say 'about' does it sound like 'aboot'?
I rolled my eyes so much that my vision is now 20/20 from the exercise. -John C. Dvorak
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I was just wondering how people feel about Passport as an authentication service. As far as I'm concerned it's a demographic harvesting service. The amount of information that is obtained from Passport for the various sign-ins between various websites is enormous. Well - it would be if it was pretty much only Microsoft that used it. To be fair I do love the idea. A single, automated sign-in method that stores all your preferences in one spot, and allows you to sign in to a site using the same familiar method using the one account and the one set of preferences. Great if you only actually want to use one account for different sites (which many people don't actually want to do) and great it you could actually store all your preferences for everything you'd ever need within your passport account (which often you can't). Even getting offers based on my behaviour is a Good Thing. I really don't want to hear about mortgages. Been there, done that. But gadgets and snowboards? Gimme! The thing that has got up my goat is that passport thinks I'm still in Australia. It's about to snow outside. I even took the laptop out on the balcony to prove to it I'm not in Oz anymore. So I dig around and find the preference page on passport and find that the only way I can update my preferences is if I tell it what province I'm in and what my postal code is. To me this says it in a nutshell. I don't want to tell it what province I'm in. I don't even know what postcode I'm in (I think it starts with M. Or K. Yeah - K sounds good). So we're in little standoff, Passport and I. I can enter my province and make up a useless postcode and give in, or I can not update my info and it can continue sending me Australian-only in the ad bar. Or I can uninstall MSN IM, move to trillian and use my now defunct Passport account for signing into Microsoft's sites. cheers, Chris Maunder
I would like Passport to work. As has been observed, no sites support it. I have a list of 25 logins sitting next to my computer and I found out two days ago that the list isn't complete (even after half-dozen tries I couldn't remember my username, though I eventually found that I had the password right.) As for the complaints that Passport collects too much information, all I can say is "Huh?" It collected nothing that an average person couldn't figure out with a phonebook and ten minutes on the net. Seriously, do people still think their personal information is secure? Larry Ellison is an idiot, but he did say something very right a few years ago, "There is no privacy, get over it." Maybe a little extreme, but this fanciful notion that there is this massive cadre of information known only to myself is utter nonsense. Moreover, who cares? If someone knows all this "personal" information about my life what are they going to do with it? (In fact, given that I don't currently own a house, maybe, just maybe, that news would get out to the mortgage spammers. Maybe they'd also realize I'm not female, and don't want my breasts enlarged, regardless of my sex, and am satisifed with the size of my penis, though I don't recall ever filling out a form anywhere indicating my feelings about either subject one way or another.)
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:laugh: Yeah. But hey, I have to do something to get to Nish's level of posts. I mean come on, what do you expect me to do? Post things of actual substance? :rolleyes:
You will now find yourself in a wonderous, magical place, filled with talking gnomes, mythical squirrels, and, almost as an afterthought, your bookmarks -Shog9 teaching Mel Feik how to bookmark I don't know whether it's just the light but I swear the database server gives me dirty looks everytime I wander past. -Chris Maunder
David Stone wrote: Post things of actual substance? ROTFLMAO!!! Good One! :laugh: ;-) Regards, Brian Dela :-)
