Why are video games important?
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A minor point that the article missed: Because the main alternative is sitting watching a little box that displays either talentless idiots performing stupid stories written by other talentless idiots, or brainless people whose only interest in life is "being famous". At least when kids play computer games they're using their brains, and working at achieving things (IMO, even working on going up a level in a game is far better than sitting like a mindless vegetable watching cretinous garbage on TV).
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Not reading the original article... I'll say they have saved lives. My manager would come back from meetings at corporate headquarters and announce we were staying late to play DOOM on the corporate network because he needed to kill something and video game monsters were a better alternative to bringing a .45 to work and blasting away.
Psychosis at 10 Film at 11
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A minor point that the article missed: Because the main alternative is sitting watching a little box that displays either talentless idiots performing stupid stories written by other talentless idiots, or brainless people whose only interest in life is "being famous". At least when kids play computer games they're using their brains, and working at achieving things (IMO, even working on going up a level in a game is far better than sitting like a mindless vegetable watching cretinous garbage on TV).
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Not reading the original article... I'll say they have saved lives. My manager would come back from meetings at corporate headquarters and announce we were staying late to play DOOM on the corporate network because he needed to kill something and video game monsters were a better alternative to bringing a .45 to work and blasting away.
Psychosis at 10 Film at 11
I used to like playing DooM in co-operative mode, and using my shotgun to "nudge" the other guy out in front of the baddies.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Mark Wallace wrote:
How many under-twelves are interested in watching Horizon?
Me for one when I was young, but then I also used to watch OU stuff too. Computer games vary of course, from the inane crap, like platform games, to well, perhaps playing chess on a PC is the best example I have. Films too, from the inane crap produced by the US industry in bucketloads, to the really quite good stuff produced elsewhere, like France for example, where Film is considered and therefore used, like an art form. Comedy too, it varies. To write off TV sop completely like you did is just plain ignorant.
Morality is indistinguishable from social proscription
fat_boy wrote:
To write off TV sop completely like you did is just plain ignorant.
start rant TV Soaps are for those people whose life is so boring that they need to watch mindless drivel - as they are - to find some excitement. These programmes only promote promiscuity, violence, back stabbing and everything else that is wrong with society. They should be banned for contributing to the moral decline that they cause in those with no sense to watch something more interesting instead. end rant
No trees were harmed in the posting of this missive; however, a large number of quantum states were changed.
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A minor point that the article missed: Because the main alternative is sitting watching a little box that displays either talentless idiots performing stupid stories written by other talentless idiots, or brainless people whose only interest in life is "being famous". At least when kids play computer games they're using their brains, and working at achieving things (IMO, even working on going up a level in a game is far better than sitting like a mindless vegetable watching cretinous garbage on TV).
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
I don't see a link? My personal opinion is that computer games are a monstrous waste of time. You learn nothing from them. My son and I =used= to play em together when he was like 6. Now, he won't bother playing WITH me. He can't stand explaining stuff. Maybe his dislike for deadlines and learning complex tasks are just innate and not due to video games. But I highly suspect video games. We've done cub scouts, camping and hiking playing "bears" in the woods and the usual things boys do. But I've hated video games since they were born. Sure, I wasted my share of quarters. But it's not the quarters I wish I could get back. There's only so much time you're given in life. You should spend it LEARNING and MAKING things WITH people. There's more on TV than just American Idol. Get the Science Channel and Discovery Channel. You can learn about solar system formation and our deep past. There are some great astronomy shows on lately. There are plays to watch and mountains to hike on. Music to make and books to read. Getting to the next level is a serious waste of your life.
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Mark Wallace wrote:
At least when kids play computer games they're using their brains,
Barely.
Mark Wallace wrote:
and working at achieving things (IMO, even working on going up a level in a game is far better than sitting like a mindless vegetable watching cretinous garbage on TV).
Hardly an acchievement. Of course it depends what you watch on TV, but you cant dismiss it all. After all, film is an art form, and there is some good comedy, and some good documentaries on TV frequently.
Morality is indistinguishable from social proscription
Your last line "After all, film is an art form..." reminded me of a conversation I had with my wife in the car last night and a realization. Art, in any form is not just dumb and droll. It is a means of communicating ideas, thoughts, and feelings. As programmers, we communicate our ideas, thoughts, and sometimes feelings through our code and deliverables. If any of us are musicians, convey these items in our music. When we hear music, not matter what the flavor, see a painting or photograph, or even a television show (no matter how seeming stupid it is), there is something being communicated. We need to step back and discover it whether we like it or not (if we are up to it). We just need to set aside our prejudices.
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A minor point that the article missed: Because the main alternative is sitting watching a little box that displays either talentless idiots performing stupid stories written by other talentless idiots, or brainless people whose only interest in life is "being famous". At least when kids play computer games they're using their brains, and working at achieving things (IMO, even working on going up a level in a game is far better than sitting like a mindless vegetable watching cretinous garbage on TV).
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
I think that some of the same circuits that are in use as when one reads really good, engrossing, character invested fiction are exercised when one plays games. Some of the imagination pathways are not exercised as thoroughly, no doubt, but still there is an intense involvement, an assimilation of character and a suspension of disbelief, a stepping outside of oneself that is valuable. Additionally, the ability to try-try-again is inherent in every video game and the development of a can-do attitude can be encouraged there, without the bruising associated with the contact sports that you and I played, to a certain extent. I would not expect my children, if I had any living in this world today, to be able to have comparable experiences to mine. They need to be associated with today’s realities and constructs, not mine from yesterday. The shared nature of the experience, the commonality, is the greatest value of the video game. Blue Team Has The Flag!! Red Team, Flag Returned!! :)
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CPallini wrote:
At the moment, videogames represent the only activity I can cooperate profitably with my 4 years old son.
I think that's actually one of the most important things -- I gave my copy of Lego Batman to a pal at work, because he and his (also four-year-old) son had just finished Lego Star Wars, and were looking for other things to do together. It's gotta be more entertaining and educational than throwing a ball at each other!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Quality games - we have both of those (Star Wars is the Complete Saga) as well as both Lego Indiana Jones games... we're waiting for Lego Harry Potter (releasing 25th of this month in UK). My son and I spend hours of quality time together playing these.
Dave
If this helped, please vote & accept answer!
Binging is like googling, it just feels dirtier. (Pete O'Hanlon)
BTW, in software, hope and pray is not a viable strategy. (Luc Pattyn) -
I don't see a link? My personal opinion is that computer games are a monstrous waste of time. You learn nothing from them. My son and I =used= to play em together when he was like 6. Now, he won't bother playing WITH me. He can't stand explaining stuff. Maybe his dislike for deadlines and learning complex tasks are just innate and not due to video games. But I highly suspect video games. We've done cub scouts, camping and hiking playing "bears" in the woods and the usual things boys do. But I've hated video games since they were born. Sure, I wasted my share of quarters. But it's not the quarters I wish I could get back. There's only so much time you're given in life. You should spend it LEARNING and MAKING things WITH people. There's more on TV than just American Idol. Get the Science Channel and Discovery Channel. You can learn about solar system formation and our deep past. There are some great astronomy shows on lately. There are plays to watch and mountains to hike on. Music to make and books to read. Getting to the next level is a serious waste of your life.
stephen.hazel wrote:
Getting to the next level is a serious waste of your life.
Anything that becomes obsessive is a complete waste, but it's the obsessive or addictive behaviour that's the problem, not the medium used to express it. Being obsessed with movies, sports, pop music, etc. are just as wasteful and damaging, but they seem somehow more acceptable, because more people share the same obsessions. I.e. anything that becomes everything you do is a waste of your life -- ya need a bit of yang to go with the yin. People who can become obsessed with computer games (and indeed computer programming) tend to be those with high (but often unexercised) intelligence, and/or with extremely good visualisation and transposition abilities, which allow them to completely ignore the real world while they "live in" the world constructed within the game. The word "aspergers" often comes into play, but all that achieves is to give aspergers a bad name, by associating it with obsessional behaviour (which all humans can suffer from, even the stoopid ones), whereas aspergers is, if anything, an evolutionary advance. Your comment "He can't stand explaining stuff" is interesting, because that's often a sign that someone has a very quick mind, but hasn't (yet) applied it fully to the realm of social interaction, so doesn't (yet) see the advantages of social behaviour. So it sounds like he's smart as a whip, but hasn't yet fully learned how to "play nicely with the other kids". Hardly a problem -- smart kids hop from revelation to revelation; one of them is bound to be "Hey! Everything's easier if you work together with people!" It looks like you've already been through something like that, which has led you to want to disown your previous liking for computer games, but learning from mistakes is generally accepted as being the best (but perhaps hardest) way of learning something, so what counts is that you were smart enough to learn, and tough enough to change. It could be, given that your son has your (or the milkman's) genes, that he needs to learn the same lesson the same way -- by figuring it out for himself -- but you're certainly helping it along by getting him involved in co-operative activities. Kudos. My original point, though, was concerned with the fact that most people spend their TV time on complete drivel (especially teenagers, who seem to only need an MTV button on the remote). Given a choice between seeing a kid learning h
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"Reality" shows are nothing more than scripted sitcoms with "cheaper" talent for the studios. It's an easier way to make more money, and most people believe they are really seeing unscripted, reality based television....
EVERYTHING is scripted! Probably the only REAL shows are like "COPS" and then they probably have to film 40 hours to get five minutes of what they think is "Good TV".
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A minor point that the article missed: Because the main alternative is sitting watching a little box that displays either talentless idiots performing stupid stories written by other talentless idiots, or brainless people whose only interest in life is "being famous". At least when kids play computer games they're using their brains, and working at achieving things (IMO, even working on going up a level in a game is far better than sitting like a mindless vegetable watching cretinous garbage on TV).
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
Somewhere around 1st grade, I helped my eldest son playing Pokemon. He couldn't read well, so I was trying to play the game ahead of him to help, and was barely able to keep up. Something to note: video games are addictive and quite able to shut out other things in life. We had to set limits for my teenagers to avoid problems with school, etc.. We literally have to shove them out the door to play outside now and then. They'd rather play or watch videos that call or visit friends... :confused:
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stephen.hazel wrote:
Getting to the next level is a serious waste of your life.
Anything that becomes obsessive is a complete waste, but it's the obsessive or addictive behaviour that's the problem, not the medium used to express it. Being obsessed with movies, sports, pop music, etc. are just as wasteful and damaging, but they seem somehow more acceptable, because more people share the same obsessions. I.e. anything that becomes everything you do is a waste of your life -- ya need a bit of yang to go with the yin. People who can become obsessed with computer games (and indeed computer programming) tend to be those with high (but often unexercised) intelligence, and/or with extremely good visualisation and transposition abilities, which allow them to completely ignore the real world while they "live in" the world constructed within the game. The word "aspergers" often comes into play, but all that achieves is to give aspergers a bad name, by associating it with obsessional behaviour (which all humans can suffer from, even the stoopid ones), whereas aspergers is, if anything, an evolutionary advance. Your comment "He can't stand explaining stuff" is interesting, because that's often a sign that someone has a very quick mind, but hasn't (yet) applied it fully to the realm of social interaction, so doesn't (yet) see the advantages of social behaviour. So it sounds like he's smart as a whip, but hasn't yet fully learned how to "play nicely with the other kids". Hardly a problem -- smart kids hop from revelation to revelation; one of them is bound to be "Hey! Everything's easier if you work together with people!" It looks like you've already been through something like that, which has led you to want to disown your previous liking for computer games, but learning from mistakes is generally accepted as being the best (but perhaps hardest) way of learning something, so what counts is that you were smart enough to learn, and tough enough to change. It could be, given that your son has your (or the milkman's) genes, that he needs to learn the same lesson the same way -- by figuring it out for himself -- but you're certainly helping it along by getting him involved in co-operative activities. Kudos. My original point, though, was concerned with the fact that most people spend their TV time on complete drivel (especially teenagers, who seem to only need an MTV button on the remote). Given a choice between seeing a kid learning h
Well that was a very well thought out response. Thanks for that. Yeahhhhhhh, I'm hopin' he'll be developer material one day. I can't help it :) But, you're right about that "learning it the hard way on his own" thing. It sure can be tough to take a step back and go, "ya know, in the end, it'll work out." Man. I can't believe what mtv has devolved into - good god... X| However, seems to me that the whole point of most video games is obsession... I agree they're fine (awesome, even) in small doses. But when was the last time you saw ANYbody just want a small dose of video games? Oh man, I've been playing this thing for 2 hours. I think I'll save and quit immediately and make something of myself. Nope. It's usually, oh man, let me just get THIS part done and 4 hours later you finally quit not because you decided that was enough, but because you hit a really TOUGH part of the game and can't get past it without some quiet thinkin' about how the HECK to do it... There's nothin wrong with liking video games. How can you not? But I think we can all agree they SUCK time out of your life at firehose speeds. Well, hmm, i guess none of this is news to any of us :~ Sorry for runnin my mouth - that's the coffee kickin' in. The programmer's nectar, you know. Oh yeah, you know... :doh: