Walk a Mile in my Shoes
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The inertia of the male "geek-dom" (nerd, computer sciences, engineering, ...) makes it hard for women to get on board.
Watched code never compiles.
I have to agree. I believe that the discrepancy in the number women developers is clear evidence that there is a problem in the industry. It's not a level playing field, and arguments that suggest that women should be treated equally is part of the reason why it has proven hard for women to find a foot hold. I'm all for affirmative action actually. Cheers, Daniel
Daniel Vaughan Twitter | Blog | Microsoft MVP | Projects: Calcium SDK, Clog | LinkedIn
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Here's one I know. ;)
Daniel Vaughan Twitter | Blog | Microsoft MVP | Projects: Calcium SDK, Clog | LinkedIn
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Ennis Ray Lynch, Jr. wrote:
All in all software development is taught via mentorship and camaraderie.
Well, that's an interesting take on it. I did have an amazing mentor (male) when I was 21 and fresh out of college and I soaked up all he had to teach me - he was close to retiring. But I think that I mostly learned by all the usual ways: experience, making mistakes, reading, trying things out and hard work. Also I love what I do and have a passion for it.
It’s not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it’s because we do not dare that things are difficult. ~Seneca
In my experience, the biggest difference (and, as I see it, the crucial one) is that the "budding" female coders I have met (that is, the ones starting out - don't you dare misinterpret, guys...) are much less prone to take chances and test stuff - they have an annoying (to me, anyway) tendency to throw their hands up in the air and say "I don't know how to do this!", to which I invariably respond "Neither did I - but I learned". Male coders, including the n00bs, seem to be more willing to "wing it", that is: They will try and (mostly) fail a couple of times but they will eventually learn - and at the same time they will find confidence in the fact that they CAN LEARN STUFF ALONG THE WAY, rather than finding confidence in that they KNOW STUFF ALREADY. I won't get into any discussion on how or why this is, or even if this is a common occurrence - I have only limited experience on the subject. It might as well be that my pond is too small, and all the other ducks are too much alike. A question for the masses, though, is: If I encounter a coworker (any profession, color, shape, form or persuasion) that seems to lack the confidence that he or she CAN LEARN STUFF ALONG THE WAY, how should I counter this? When I get the reaction "I don't know this!" what should I respond? How can I relate the fact that (most) failures are OK, as long as you learn enough from them not to repeat them?
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In my experience, the biggest difference (and, as I see it, the crucial one) is that the "budding" female coders I have met (that is, the ones starting out - don't you dare misinterpret, guys...) are much less prone to take chances and test stuff - they have an annoying (to me, anyway) tendency to throw their hands up in the air and say "I don't know how to do this!", to which I invariably respond "Neither did I - but I learned". Male coders, including the n00bs, seem to be more willing to "wing it", that is: They will try and (mostly) fail a couple of times but they will eventually learn - and at the same time they will find confidence in the fact that they CAN LEARN STUFF ALONG THE WAY, rather than finding confidence in that they KNOW STUFF ALREADY. I won't get into any discussion on how or why this is, or even if this is a common occurrence - I have only limited experience on the subject. It might as well be that my pond is too small, and all the other ducks are too much alike. A question for the masses, though, is: If I encounter a coworker (any profession, color, shape, form or persuasion) that seems to lack the confidence that he or she CAN LEARN STUFF ALONG THE WAY, how should I counter this? When I get the reaction "I don't know this!" what should I respond? How can I relate the fact that (most) failures are OK, as long as you learn enough from them not to repeat them?
@streamcap That's a really good question, and as far as I am concerned, this behaviour is directly related to what I like to refer to as "Residual Attitude Syndrome" (I just made that up). I have seen it in every workplace, in every role I have ever held, and it is the neck-breaker of many businesses; you can have a successful product and a heavily desired service, but when staff have the incorrect attitude to their work or co-workers, the entire thing can fall apart instantly. For example: Jenny, Jane and Julia are all employees at XYZ Pty Ltd. They all work in the same department, and have just welcomed a new staff member, Jessica. Jessica doesn't really know how to perform in her new role, so she watches the three girls and learns quickly, VERY QUICKLY! She learns that it is ok to take that extra ciggy break when the boss is not on site. She learns that it is expected that she joins in on the bitching sessions, lest she becomes the one bitched about. She learns that it's normal to just do as much as she needs to get by, and that leaving at 5pm, no matter the workload, is the way it works here. This situation can be scary, because if you repremand one person in the group, you risk alienating your staff from your managers even further, you risk isolating individual staff members from each other and you can watch as they tear each other apart passive agressively. All of this is extreme compared to your situation, but the fundamental solution is the same. You need to transform the attitude of your workplace to one of a respectful and harmonius nature. This doesn't mean painting the walls green and aligning furniture from north to south. No feng sheui needed! It is about these simple rules: 1. DO NOT EVER act condescending, or disrespectful to your co-workers, even if you are responding to the same behaviour from them. Reacting is NOT the way to move forward. Targeting someone will NOT fix the problem, it will drive you further from them. If you have to repremand someone for their behaviour or attitude, do it on the sly, away from others, and explain to them that this is not an attack on them alone. 2. Life feeds on life, as attitude feeds on attitude. This means that if the majority of the office is happy, the rest will soak this up. Attitude is completely contagious. 3. Don't be afraid to sever the troubled workers, even if it is your most important worker. If you have to fire the main instigator of negative behaviour, then DO IT! Just make sure they don't have an opportuni
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This was in the CP Newsletter today so most of you will have seen it. Women in Technology[^]
It’s not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it’s because we do not dare that things are difficult. ~Seneca
I generalise, but it shows my experience: I think the problem is that computing has been built by men with male-like thinking patterns, which is very different to female-like thinking patterns, and its very hard for female to enter such a strong male-like environment. I believe that if we get more female-like thinking into computing it would bring it closer to the users we are coding for... I have only worked with 1 female coder before, she had a lot of potential but was constrained by male-like thinking leadership, if she had more freedom I think she would have done better. Not that I blame the male-like leader, it is the norm... We need women to push into the computing field, even if it is a though push...
____________________________________________________________ Be brave little warrior, be VERY brave
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Here's one I know. ;)
Daniel Vaughan Twitter | Blog | Microsoft MVP | Projects: Calcium SDK, Clog | LinkedIn
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Part of mentorship is giving you tasks to help you gain experience, allowing you to make mistakes, giving you room to try things and work hard. Without a co-worker to vouch for you and giving you that leeway, you would have been fired the first week. Over the last year I have been a mentor to a male fresh college grad and female with 4 years experience. So far the male has outperformed the female. Over the past 20+ years I have worked with a number of females, some have done an excellent job and some haven't. If anything I have encouraged the females more because I recognize they are under-represented. Anyway, the ones that had the skills, the interest and the determination succeeded whether male or female.
SS => Qualified in Submarines "We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm". Winston Churchill "Real programmers can write FORTRAN in any language". Unknown
Sorry people, but youv'e got it all wrong about female coders. go back to to cave man days and think what male hunters needed to know. Fistly, they had to have a mental picture of their wide geographical surroundings so they could picture their journeys to and from the cave; this knowledge corresponds to the language reference manual. Secondly they need that male ability to think ahead to catch the wooly mamoth; this is the programmers ability to write code correctly nearlt every time by mentally saying "now what if I do this....". Meanwhile, back at the cave, Mrs Cave Woman is trying to keep the place clean and tidy, feeding the children wooly mamoth broth and having a sleep. She has no need of the fine qualities of Mr Cave Man. Thus over the next few hundred million years, men still retain their mental qualities and so make much better coders than girls.
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Sorry people, but youv'e got it all wrong about female coders. go back to to cave man days and think what male hunters needed to know. Fistly, they had to have a mental picture of their wide geographical surroundings so they could picture their journeys to and from the cave; this knowledge corresponds to the language reference manual. Secondly they need that male ability to think ahead to catch the wooly mamoth; this is the programmers ability to write code correctly nearlt every time by mentally saying "now what if I do this....". Meanwhile, back at the cave, Mrs Cave Woman is trying to keep the place clean and tidy, feeding the children wooly mamoth broth and having a sleep. She has no need of the fine qualities of Mr Cave Man. Thus over the next few hundred million years, men still retain their mental qualities and so make much better coders than girls.
I can't argue with your logic. And there are always outliers, those that don't fit the norm. I was just saying that the female types get some advantages; extra encouragement, scholarships to keep affirmative action types happy, etc., and they are still only represented by about 10% of the coder population. Same thing with pilots. There must be something different between typical men and women that causes them to be so under represented.
SS => Qualified in Submarines "We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm". Winston Churchill "Real programmers can write FORTRAN in any language". Unknown
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This was in the CP Newsletter today so most of you will have seen it. Women in Technology[^]
It’s not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it’s because we do not dare that things are difficult. ~Seneca
The following refers to the US, and may or may not correlate well to conditions in your part of the world. In the late 90's, the number of women in software programs was trending upward. This halted and even reversed in the early noughts. This coincides with 2 other trends: (a) outsourcing and (b) higher numbers of women college grads, more now than men and this trend continues. My theory is that women have recognized that the software field really is not much fun anymore, at least as practiced in the typical US business, is far less lucrative than it once was, and that there are now lots of other options for women in fields that used to be male-dominated but no longer are. I.e. we have found better things to do.
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The following refers to the US, and may or may not correlate well to conditions in your part of the world. In the late 90's, the number of women in software programs was trending upward. This halted and even reversed in the early noughts. This coincides with 2 other trends: (a) outsourcing and (b) higher numbers of women college grads, more now than men and this trend continues. My theory is that women have recognized that the software field really is not much fun anymore, at least as practiced in the typical US business, is far less lucrative than it once was, and that there are now lots of other options for women in fields that used to be male-dominated but no longer are. I.e. we have found better things to do.
I don't think it's much different in the UK. You would think that with more female college grads you would automatically get more women in the technology business - just keeping the percentage the same. It seems that the percentage is dropping fairly rapidly. And what about all the women who entered the field in the nineties - are they not still around? I've been in this business a lot longer than that! Thanks for your input.
It’s not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it’s because we do not dare that things are difficult. ~Seneca
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I am a big fan of more women in software development but there has to be more to the lack of women than subtle discrimination. The handful of women I have met that consider themselves programmers were not overly competent by any measure and all but one bore a chip on her shoulder that suggested, "No man will help me". All in all software development is taught via mentorship and camaraderie. If you want more good female developers then more women will have to be open to the concept that receiving help from a developer who just so happens to be a man is not discrimination or gender bias but the way that every man learned how to master the craft.
Need custom software developed? I do custom programming based primarily on MS tools with an emphasis on C# development and consulting. I also do Android Programming as I find it a refreshing break from the MS. "And they, since they Were not the one dead, turned to their affairs" -- Robert Frost