Bug hunting
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
Yep. But more often, it seems, and in the environment I work, I find bugs months after the app has been in production...and the users never mentioned it. Or they DO suddenly start to complain about it as if I did something to break it after all these months...when the code hasn't been touched since the release. Some, I can't see how the app even worked at all, ever. Sure do wish I worked somewhere where the testers actually test the program, instead of just signing off on it to get it out of their queue.
..and water fell from the sky like rain.
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Yep. But more often, it seems, and in the environment I work, I find bugs months after the app has been in production...and the users never mentioned it. Or they DO suddenly start to complain about it as if I did something to break it after all these months...when the code hasn't been touched since the release. Some, I can't see how the app even worked at all, ever. Sure do wish I worked somewhere where the testers actually test the program, instead of just signing off on it to get it out of their queue.
..and water fell from the sky like rain.
One of my clients has a policy of assigning developers to work in QA for a week, usually several times a year. I'm told that some developers even ask to be transferred to the QA department, because they like it better.
Best wishes, Hans
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That happens to me a lot, or while I'm on the can. Both are not optimal to transferring my ideas to a suitable media.
Me too! In fact, I went through a variety of tests to try out things I could use to write in the shower. Nothing really worked. Some things washed off too easily, some things left marks, some colored the grout, and others melted in hot water. Though I haven't tried a grease pen yet. If somebody invents a practical way to take notes in the shower, I would be all over that action.
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Me too! In fact, I went through a variety of tests to try out things I could use to write in the shower. Nothing really worked. Some things washed off too easily, some things left marks, some colored the grout, and others melted in hot water. Though I haven't tried a grease pen yet. If somebody invents a practical way to take notes in the shower, I would be all over that action.
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
Yup. I run at lunchtime three days a week. If I've got a bug pending before I go out, I'll often think of the solution while I'm running. The combination of the break in attention, relaxation, and the endorphins seem to help.
Software Zen:
delete this; -
Great idea! But I prefer to write things. Still, that's probably more workable than anything I've come up with.
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
That's quite normal, at first it's hard to see your own mistakes. Whatever you had in mind when you wrote your code, you first keep repeating it and this let's you go in circles. If you let it go and do something else for a while, you are forced to analyze it again. Then chances are much better that you see where you went wrong instead of just seeing what you originally intended.
"I have what could be described as the most wide-open sense of humor on the site, and if I don't think something is funny, then it really isn't." - JSOC, 2011 -----
"Friar Modest never was a prior" - Italian proverb -
Yes, all of the time. I remember having read some scientific studies showing that walking away of a problem - i.e. taking a break or going out for a cigar - it's the most succesfully approach to a problem, as our consciuous leaves the problem, we relay it to our subconnsciuos, which usually starts linking our ideas and previous knowledge that we don't consciously remember at the moment. On the other hand and probably related, I think that's why techniques like Pomodoro Technique have such good references, I have tried it a couple of times and can't complain! :-D
The subconcious part exists, but is hard to get hold of. For no apparent reason the answer just comes to your mind. It's like your own mind started a thread to search for the answer and you don't realize it until it returns its results.
"I have what could be described as the most wide-open sense of humor on the site, and if I don't think something is funny, then it really isn't." - JSOC, 2011 -----
"Friar Modest never was a prior" - Italian proverb -
I read about a study done of people having brainstorms in the shower. I can't remember if it reached any conclusions.
Best wishes, Hans
It's not the shower. It's more about getting some distance to the problem and looking at it from another angle. Sleeping a night over it may accomplish the same thing, just as a million other things.
"I have what could be described as the most wide-open sense of humor on the site, and if I don't think something is funny, then it really isn't." - JSOC, 2011 -----
"Friar Modest never was a prior" - Italian proverb -
Yep. But more often, it seems, and in the environment I work, I find bugs months after the app has been in production...and the users never mentioned it. Or they DO suddenly start to complain about it as if I did something to break it after all these months...when the code hasn't been touched since the release. Some, I can't see how the app even worked at all, ever. Sure do wish I worked somewhere where the testers actually test the program, instead of just signing off on it to get it out of their queue.
..and water fell from the sky like rain.
I think that's a different story. A few months ago a really bad application was replaced by one of mine. The old one could completely have been posted in the Code Horrors section, so I had to start completely from scratch. While I rewrote the entire thing, I was always surprised by the lethargy of the users. The old application failed every single day, as my improvised logging showed, but there were almost no support requests. I think the users simply took it as it was and lived with whatever they did or did not get. With the new one I keep getting support requests, even if not a single job has failed up to today. There are some things which had to be done differently in order to get them working and some of the users did not quite get it. Usually the answer is a polite version of RTFM. But everything is well. They have woken up, they actually use the application, they get what they were looking for and they ask questions. Only once in a while there seem to be users, who appear to want the awful old application back. It may have been bad, but they had gotton used to it. Now everything is new and that makes them uncertain. I guess, in time they will get over it.
"I have what could be described as the most wide-open sense of humor on the site, and if I don't think something is funny, then it really isn't." - JSOC, 2011 -----
"Friar Modest never was a prior" - Italian proverb -
In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
Hans Dietrich wrote:
Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
I tend to take a break during the day and go for a walk. The brain can find associations when not actively working on the problem, that's why/how people can "dream up" solutions. Talking out loud to yourself helps too :)
I are Troll :suss:
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
More times than not.
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
Yep, I get that a lot. Sometimes when I leave the problem alone I suddenly realize how stupid I am. Sometimes the problem is so ridiculous, that I wonder how I had not seen it. Now, on real difficult problems, I usually go outside, fire up a cigarret and usually I come up with a solution before it ends. (Disclaimer: This is the most stupid thing to get addicted to, so pleas don't, it won't make you smarter, just dumber. This was a bad choice of my younger days I'm trying to correct).
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Great idea! But I prefer to write things. Still, that's probably more workable than anything I've come up with.
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
For me, the solution is to take a nap. This applies to program development as well. After a nap, all the what-ifs, maybes, and could-bes get swept away and the important stuff resurfaces. I wish I could depend on it at all times, but more often than not, I'll wake up and a solution or another avenue of approach will appear in my mind.
Psychosis at 10 Film at 11
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
More often than not! A beer or two often helps.
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In tracking down the bug I just mentioned below, I decided to put it aside and work on something else. When I came back to it the next day, I thought of obvious, simple way to find it - and it worked! Has anyone else had the experience of walking away from difficult problem, only to think of some simple solution when you come back to it later?
Best wishes, Hans
Walking away for a short brake helps alot... I usually think of what the problem could be on my little brake. It helps getting out of the office and going outside, even if for a ciggie. To go get some inspiration from nature. My brother is also a developer and he solves his problems in his sleep. I've heard in talking in his sleep about programming problems on numerous occasions. So I suppose everyone has there own way. ;)
"Program testing can be used to show the presence of bugs, but never to show their absence." << please vote!! >>