John Lenon...
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I think Marc's point is valid. John Lennon was a guy you never met. You liked his music, fine. I don't mind it myself. But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. It's a bit like when Di died. Honestly, she was a media creation, do people have so little meaning in their own lives ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
He certainly has a point, but John did have a lot of fans who idolised him. I think it was the 'grow up' comment that provoked me to reply.
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
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He certainly has a point, but John did have a lot of fans who idolised him. I think it was the 'grow up' comment that provoked me to reply.
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
Fair enough, I probably would not have worded it that strongly either. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
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Marc Clifton wrote: Grow up, people So John doesn't have the right to have people mourn him? His fans everywhere should 'grow up' because they wish he were still alive today? Ok, so some people do tend to make him out to be a genius of sorts, but your attitude shocks me.
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
So John doesn't have the right to have people mourn him? I'm saying that there seems to be a dicotomy in how people react when someone they know hardly at all on a personal level dies vs. someone that they do know. And please, don't give me the "but these people feel like they know him..." line. It works on an emotional level, and that's about it. This all seems more like a mass hysteria reaction. When someone dies that we are very close to on a personal level, most of us don't know what to do (at least in this culture). So oddly, the "safety" that is achieved by the impersonal relationship let's us go hysterical. There's a lot of reasons for this, one of which is that none of us had to face his direct family and friends, which are the people truly impacted by his death, and which are the hardest to face. And the other thing that gets me is that people react this way because the media has brought this person into our lives, in such a way that we feel "connected" to him. Unfortunately, this is not the case for the thousands of children and adults that die each year as a result of, say, drunk driving. If we all expressed the same shock and horror and outrage, and with the same mass hysteria, when we hear a news report about someone who we truly don't know dying because some drunk mowed him over with his car, then I wouldn't be standing on this soapbox. And probably less people would die of drunk driving accidents. your attitude shocks me Yes, I imagine so. Sorry. I had this reaction 22 years ago, and I haven't changed in my thinking about it. Do you think my points are truly off base? Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus -
He certainly has a point, but John did have a lot of fans who idolised him. I think it was the 'grow up' comment that provoked me to reply.
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
Yes, the "grow up" comment was uncalled for. My apologies. Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus -
Yes, the "grow up" comment was uncalled for. My apologies. Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian GrausMarc Clifton wrote: Yes, the "grow up" comment was uncalled for. My apologies. No need to apologise. When you feel strongly about something you sometimes need to use strong words/phrases to get your view across. :)
Simon Walton
Sonork: 10024P
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You know, I have a friend who's 10 year old son died from falling out of a tree. That was personal, it affected the entire community, and it was a tragic thing. It was also very private. This, I don't know what to call it, emotional schmaltz around John Lennon's death disgusts me. Grow up, people. Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Grausto remain schmaltzy, he refused to take the sword, but died by it anyway. That makes his death kinda tragic. And he has been an icon for a generation, just as much as Britnay Spears will never be.
If I could find a souvenir / just to prove the world was here [sighist]
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to remain schmaltzy, he refused to take the sword, but died by it anyway. That makes his death kinda tragic. And he has been an icon for a generation, just as much as Britnay Spears will never be.
If I could find a souvenir / just to prove the world was here [sighist]
That makes his death kinda tragic. Yes, his death was tragic. Marc Help! I'm an AI running around in someone's f*cked up universe simulator.
sensitivity and ethnic diversity means celebrating difference, not hiding from it. - Christian Graus -
I think Marc's point is valid. John Lennon was a guy you never met. You liked his music, fine. I don't mind it myself. But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. It's a bit like when Di died. Honestly, she was a media creation, do people have so little meaning in their own lives ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
Christian Graus wrote: John Lennon was a guy you never met. You liked his music, fine. I don't mind it myself. But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. It's a bit like when Di died. Honestly, she was a media creation, do people have so little meaning in their own lives ? So what would constitute a person you would mourn after 22 years? If people want to mourn his death and they have attached significance to him, then let them. Maybe some peoples lives where honestly changed by him in which case that lives on for the rest of that persons life and mourning/celebrating him seems perfectly fine to me.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChristopher Duncan wrote: Which explains why when Santa asked, "And what do you want for Christmas, little boy?" I said, "A life." (Accesories sold separately)
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Christian Graus wrote: John Lennon was a guy you never met. You liked his music, fine. I don't mind it myself. But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. It's a bit like when Di died. Honestly, she was a media creation, do people have so little meaning in their own lives ? So what would constitute a person you would mourn after 22 years? If people want to mourn his death and they have attached significance to him, then let them. Maybe some peoples lives where honestly changed by him in which case that lives on for the rest of that persons life and mourning/celebrating him seems perfectly fine to me.
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChristopher Duncan wrote: Which explains why when Santa asked, "And what do you want for Christmas, little boy?" I said, "A life." (Accesories sold separately)
Paul Watson wrote: So what would constitute a person you would mourn after 22 years? Someone you knew, perhaps ? Paul Watson wrote: If people want to mourn his death and they have attached significance to him, then let them. People are free to do what they want, I would not deny them that right, just exercising my right to have an opinion. Paul Watson wrote: Maybe some peoples lives where honestly changed by him I guess that is possible. From my perspective it makes for a pretty strange life where your most significant ties are to people you have never met, and in all probability did not exist in the terms you think of them. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
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Today is his 22nd Death anniversary. http://www.jlsc.com/ [^] http://www.bagism.com/ [^] http://triumphpc.com/john-lennon-project/index.shtml [^] http://www.legend-johnlennon.com/ [^] http://www.workingclasshero.com/biography.shtml [^] Kant Sonork-100.28114
Imagine there's no countries...... Peace John :rose: Would you like to meet my teddy bear ?
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I think Marc's point is valid. John Lennon was a guy you never met. You liked his music, fine. I don't mind it myself. But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. It's a bit like when Di died. Honestly, she was a media creation, do people have so little meaning in their own lives ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
I don't make him out to be a saint' but he did stand up for what he believed, and was for making things better and bringing people together rather than putting people down. Listen to the words of 'Imagine' and tell me that isn't worth remembering. Would you like to meet my teddy bear ?
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I don't make him out to be a saint' but he did stand up for what he believed, and was for making things better and bringing people together rather than putting people down. Listen to the words of 'Imagine' and tell me that isn't worth remembering. Would you like to meet my teddy bear ?
Trollslayer wrote: Listen to the words of 'Imagine' and tell me that isn't worth remembering. OK. Here's a thought - why do more people remember what someone like John Lennon talked about, than what someone like Gandhi actually did ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
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to remain schmaltzy, he refused to take the sword, but died by it anyway. That makes his death kinda tragic. And he has been an icon for a generation, just as much as Britnay Spears will never be.
If I could find a souvenir / just to prove the world was here [sighist]
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I think Marc's point is valid. John Lennon was a guy you never met. You liked his music, fine. I don't mind it myself. But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. It's a bit like when Di died. Honestly, she was a media creation, do people have so little meaning in their own lives ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
Christian Graus wrote: But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. What about people mourning a guy after 1968 (and a half years )approx ? Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
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Christian Graus wrote: But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. What about people mourning a guy after 1968 (and a half years )approx ? Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
Well, they just miss the point entirely. Imagine a world where Jesus didn't die and rise again ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
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Well, they just miss the point entirely. Imagine a world where Jesus didn't die and rise again ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
Ok :-) Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
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Trollslayer wrote: Listen to the words of 'Imagine' and tell me that isn't worth remembering. OK. Here's a thought - why do more people remember what someone like John Lennon talked about, than what someone like Gandhi actually did ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
Christian Graus wrote: Here's a thought - why do more people remember what someone like John Lennon talked about, than what someone like Gandhi actually did ? You got to hear Lennon's ideals in his music and also got to hear about his actions and beliefs TV/Radio/Newspaper articles. Ghandi you had to read about in books that most people wouldn't run into in their everyday lives. Michael Martin Australia mjm68@tpg.com.au "I personally love it because I can get as down and dirty as I want on the backend, while also being able to dabble with fun scripting and presentation games on the front end." - Chris Maunder 15/07/2002
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Christian Graus wrote: But there is something strange about people who did not remotely know the man mourning him after 22 years. What about people mourning a guy after 1968 (and a half years )approx ? Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
You are the intrepid one, always willing to leap into the fray! A serious character flaw, I might add, but entertaining. Said by Roger Wright about me.
You don't mourn a life that never ended. Seriously, we don't mourn for Jesus on Easter sunday.
Jason Henderson
start page ; articles henderson is coming henderson is an opponent's worst nightmare * googlism * -
Trollslayer wrote: Listen to the words of 'Imagine' and tell me that isn't worth remembering. OK. Here's a thought - why do more people remember what someone like John Lennon talked about, than what someone like Gandhi actually did ? Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002
Christian Graus wrote: why do more people remember what someone like John Lennon talked about, than what someone like Gandhi actually did ? Over our entire planet, I would warrant far more people know of and respect Gandhi than Lennon. India has 1.1 billion people, if even only half respect Gandhi then that is more than North America, Tazmania, Australia and most of Europe put together. And that is just including Gandhi followers in India, there are many more millions around the world. The reason why Lennon may seem more prevalent is simply mass media and the fact you and I live in a western, not an eastern, culture. Also Lennnon is easier to sell than Gandhi. Figurines of Lennon are quickly snapped up while figurines of Gandhi sit next to last years pop sensations CDs, never selling. We forget that us westerners are a major minority on this planet :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChristopher Duncan wrote: Which explains why when Santa asked, "And what do you want for Christmas, little boy?" I said, "A life." (Accesories sold separately)
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Christian Graus wrote: why do more people remember what someone like John Lennon talked about, than what someone like Gandhi actually did ? Over our entire planet, I would warrant far more people know of and respect Gandhi than Lennon. India has 1.1 billion people, if even only half respect Gandhi then that is more than North America, Tazmania, Australia and most of Europe put together. And that is just including Gandhi followers in India, there are many more millions around the world. The reason why Lennon may seem more prevalent is simply mass media and the fact you and I live in a western, not an eastern, culture. Also Lennnon is easier to sell than Gandhi. Figurines of Lennon are quickly snapped up while figurines of Gandhi sit next to last years pop sensations CDs, never selling. We forget that us westerners are a major minority on this planet :)
Paul Watson
Bluegrass
Cape Town, South AfricaChristopher Duncan wrote: Which explains why when Santa asked, "And what do you want for Christmas, little boy?" I said, "A life." (Accesories sold separately)
Paul Watson wrote: Tazmania It's Tasmania, and it's part of Australia..... Paul Watson wrote: The reason why Lennon may seem more prevalent is simply mass media Thank you, that is the point I have been trying to make. Christian No offense, but I don't really want to encourage the creation of another VB developer. - Larry Antram 22 Oct 2002 C# will attract all comers, where VB is for IT Journalists and managers - Michael P Butler 05-12-2002 Again, you can screw up a C/C++ program just as easily as a VB program. OK, maybe not as easily, but it's certainly doable. - Jamie Nordmeyer - 15-Nov-2002